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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 6:17:14 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline 		     Let's just handle this the easy way, Julia (I think it's the right way too.)  My OP last night sucked.  I blew it.  It wound up on the screen easily taken the way it was.  I apologize to anyone who may have been offended.

    So, do we achieve conformity on the "1984" model, or the "Brave New World" paradigm?  I'm not liking those choices.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 6:35:58 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

.  If your analysis of the situation is correct though, then the solution would be that people must be forced to conform.  That I'm going to have a problem with.  The kind of problem where I go join somebody's Army of Resistance and bring my own ammo.

    There is a quote from H.L. Mencken in that same preface.  "The whole drift of law is toward the absolute prohibition of all ideas that that diverge in the slightest from the accepted platitudes, and behind the drift of that law is the far more potent force of growing custom, and under the that custom there is a national philosophy which erects conformity into the noblest of virtues and the free functioning of the personality into a capital crime against society."   (I hated reading Mencken, every sentence two or three times, but he was worth it.)


You started out this thread with a hint of contrition....Now it's about how you will have to conform your thinking to that of the masses.....WTF!!!

What you need to start doing is realizing that we don't all conform to a set of beliefs and that not all Muslims are terrorists. That people no matter where or who they are don't all speak a unified tongue or share a common belief or voice...that would be a first step in the right direction for you and it would be incredibly refreshing!




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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 6:39:27 PM   
SusanofO


Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
Status: offline 		Well WyrdRich, probably just about anywhere but here at CM (or another bdsm meeting site) you probably couldn't hint or ever state out-right any thoughts along the line of: "A woman's place is in the home", or refer to her a anything akin to "the little woman" without getting your head bitten off. If you state it here, even, better hope you're talking to a female submissive who feels the same. LOL!!

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 2/15/2007 6:41:04 PM >

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 6:43:48 PM   
sensualmagirl


Posts: 1065
Joined: 7/4/2006
From: Boston, MA
Status: offline 		I appreciate the fact that you are trying to clarify last night, especially since any statement or sentiment that would equate "all muslims = terrorists" is one that personally offends me tremendously due to my own life and loved-ones.

I think the problem is, and always wil be, using any and all broad generalizing statement to describe a group... do that, and that is going to flare some emotions. 

It really is not about discussing whether or not said religion, race, gender has X, Y, Z problems or not. It is the simple idea that all (meaning present and past) members of a religion or group fall in line with that statement. Generalizing is just not a good idea... and we should probably do our best as decent human beings in this world, not to make such statements.

Look at the terrorists, they make sweeping generalizations and assume that all Americans are the quote/unquote "problem"... where did that lead them? Tuesday, September 11th, that's where. I don't know about you, but for me, I don't want to end up spending my life in that narrow-minded and hate-filled mind-set.

My 2 cents.

edited to say: discussing problems of the group is not the problem... there are things that need to be discussed and examined, because it is there... We are not blind to the problems in any and all groups.  It's just assuming that because someone is one group (muslim, african american, hispanic, etc, etc) is the only reason for their actions, is faulty.

< Message edited by sensualmagirl -- 2/15/2007 6:47:23 PM >

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 6:47:14 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline 		   LOL!  Absolutely right, Susan.  What do you think they'd do to me if I suggested a nice hogtie?

    I think we're getting someplace with the links to previous events.  The Holocaust taboo is right in line with the Never Again stance.  There was a good reference to the historical stereotypes that rationalized slavery as well.

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 6:49:21 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

  No, you didn't offer a solution.  It was inaccurate of me to say otherwise. 



As you stated, self-recognition is the first step.

quote:



If your analysis of the situation is correct though, then the solution would be that people must be forced to conform. 



Nowhere in my post did I make any mention of conformity, so I would have to indicate this is something you
are reading in to my words.

I simply pointed out the way adrenalin changes the way a person reacts.

The point of my post was that people allow themselves to be adrenalized by words they read on a message board, and they react in a specific manner based on the way their personal experiences have organized themselves in their limbic system.  This was in response to your post stating that people seem to get reactive about things they read on a message board.

I am not sure how more concisely and succinctly I can agree with, and offer a possible causal relationship to, your original post.

Just me, etc.

Sinergy

edited because I missed a ] 

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Profile   Post #: 26
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:00:44 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

    Let's just handle this the easy way, Julia (I think it's the right way too.)  My OP last night sucked.  I blew it.  It wound up on the screen easily taken the way it was.  I apologize to anyone who may have been offended.

   So, do we achieve conformity on the "1984" model, or the "Brave New World" paradigm?  I'm not liking those choices.


So what you are saying is because I do not agree with your post that I am the "thought police". Um, ok, I think that is rather odd because I often disagree with what you post, but I have never said you should not be free to post it.

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:09:19 PM   
WyrdRich


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

   Let's just handle this the easy way, Julia (I think it's the right way too.)  My OP last night sucked.  I blew it.  It wound up on the screen easily taken the way it was.  I apologize to anyone who may have been offended.

  So, do we achieve conformity on the "1984" model, or the "Brave New World" paradigm?  I'm not liking those choices.


So what you are saying is because I do not agree with your post that I am the "thought police". Um, ok, I think that is rather odd because I often disagree with what you post, but I have never said you should not be free to post it.



       Oops, I forgot, I'm a conservative so my apology can't just be accepted  "It was the booze!  I'm going to rehab!"  (That's a comment on society, not an attack)

    My last line was meant lightheartedly to steer this back towards the topic.  I know you've read at least one of those books.

    You're in college presently, what are the topics that just can't come up in a class?

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Profile   Post #: 28
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:16:43 PM   
Arpig


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quote:

In my opinion because topics such as 6)  A link between Islam and violence. are blatant racism they get peoples backs up.

Islam is a religion, with followers of every racial subgroup existant, so how is it racist to equate Islam with anything, violence or not. Now however much it may be non-PC to say so, It has been a while since I saw any religious zealots killing on the scale which Islamic zealots are doing so. Before anybody pulls out the Inquisition and Albigensian Crusade, remember these thinga happened at a time when Christaianity was 1200-1400 years old. Islam is approaching 1400 years old. Perhaps there is something to this coincidence, perhaps it is a natural part of the development of any religion that around the 1200-1500 year there arises a violent fundamentalism, it happened with Buddhism as well, so there might just be something to this idea. Keep in mind that the Islamic fundamentalist's most hated foe is not actually the west, or Israel, but the rival Islamic sects (Shi'a/Sunni). My thesis is that Islam is no more inherently violent than any other religion, it is just the religion which is at the stage of development where violence and fundamentalism merge. I am not entirely sure if I even buy this idea, but it is worth pondering.

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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:20:43 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

  Let's just handle this the easy way, Julia (I think it's the right way too.)  My OP last night sucked.  I blew it.  It wound up on the screen easily taken the way it was.  I apologize to anyone who may have been offended.

So, do we achieve conformity on the "1984" model, or the "Brave New World" paradigm?  I'm not liking those choices.


So what you are saying is because I do not agree with your post that I am the "thought police". Um, ok, I think that is rather odd because I often disagree with what you post, but I have never said you should not be free to post it.



      Oops, I forgot, I'm a conservative so my apology can't just be accepted  "It was the booze!  I'm going to rehab!"  (That's a comment on society, not an attack)

   My last line was meant lightheartedly to steer this back towards the topic.  I know you've read at least one of those books.

   You're in college presently, what are the topics that just can't come up in a class?


Your apology assumes juliaoceania was offended, WyrdRich. 

She was not.  She was simply offering a scholarly opinion on the subject.

You know what happens when you assume...

Sinergy

p.s. She is not currently in graduate school.

p.p.s. Going back to your original post, people read things which cause an emotional reaction in them, adrenalin
takes over, and they lose control of higher reasoning skills.  There are any number of ways to counter-act adrenalin, including breathing, drinking lots of water, taking a walk, etc.

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David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:24:16 PM   
dcnovice


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quote:

Before anybody pulls out the Inquisition and Albigensian Crusade, remember these thinga happened at a time when Christaianity was 1200-1400 years old. Islam is approaching 1400 years old. Perhaps there is something to this coincidence, perhaps it is a natural part of the development of any religion that around the 1200-1500 year there arises a violent fundamentalism, it happened with Buddhism as well, so there might just be something to this idea.


I think you're on to something. A priest friend made a similar point, which is that Islam is a fairly young religion. Maybe some of what we've seen is its troubled adolescence. I shudder to imagine what would have happened if the crusaders had had automatic weapons.

All that said, one does need to remember that there have been more recent examples of Christian violence, such as the troubles in Northern Ireland and abortion clinic bombings.

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:25:47 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline 		      Thanks, Arpig.  That's a theory I hadn't heard before.  (Maybe because we aren't supposed to talk about it?)  Maybe there is hope on other side of the "current unpleasantness" after all.

     You made a second great point too.  'Rascist' is word that has nothing to do with a predjudice against a religion.  Is there a word that particularly descibes a bias against members of a particular faith?  'Bigot' is just way too broad.  I can't believe Academia is letting us down like this!

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Profile   Post #: 32
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:32:10 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

    Let's just handle this the easy way, Julia (I think it's the right way too.)  My OP last night sucked.  I blew it.  It wound up on the screen easily taken the way it was.  I apologize to anyone who may have been offended.

   So, do we achieve conformity on the "1984" model, or the "Brave New World" paradigm?  I'm not liking those choices.
[/quote

Wyrdrich, the last time I checked it wasn't illegal to "offend "people.
I have no problem dropping an "Aids Bomb" on the enemy as long as the scientists could speed it up to like them having full blown aids in a week.
But why bother when we can use things like Sarin that work in minutes?
Who'd want to screw with us then?
Don't they execute homosexuals in Muslim countries?
Like it or not that's islam for you.
But, then there was Tomas de Torquemada and the Spanish inquistions on the catholic side.
I don't know what religions they have in China but they're always killing their own people.
Maybe we should outlaw religions?
I don't engage in all that anal-retentive political correctness.
If anyone is "offended" by anything I say then they can go and fuck themselves.
I'm real big on the First Amendment.
The others are pretty cool too.

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:38:42 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline
quote:

Is there a word that particularly descibes a bias against members of a particular faith? 

I would suggest "Adherant" or "Believer", because if one follows a particular religion, one is sort of by definition biased against followers of all other religions.

Myself, I am sort of biased against any organized religion, not sure what term applies to me...maybe "Opinionated Jerk"?


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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:47:43 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

Let's just handle this the easy way, Julia (I think it's the right way too.)  My OP last night sucked.  I blew it.  It wound up on the screen easily taken the way it was.  I apologize to anyone who may have been offended.

So, do we achieve conformity on the "1984" model, or the "Brave New World" paradigm?  I'm not liking those choices.


So what you are saying is because I do not agree with your post that I am the "thought police". Um, ok, I think that is rather odd because I often disagree with what you post, but I have never said you should not be free to post it.



     Oops, I forgot, I'm a conservative so my apology can't just be accepted  "It was the booze!  I'm going to rehab!"  (That's a comment on society, not an attack)

  My last line was meant lightheartedly to steer this back towards the topic.  I know you've read at least one of those books.

  You're in college presently, what are the topics that just can't come up in a class?


Your apology assumes juliaoceania was offended, WyrdRich. 

She was not.  She was simply offering a scholarly opinion on the subject.

You know what happens when you assume...

Sinergy

p.s. She is not currently in graduate school.

p.p.s. Going back to your original post, people read things which cause an emotional reaction in them, adrenalin
takes over, and they lose control of higher reasoning skills.  There are any number of ways to counter-act adrenalin, including breathing, drinking lots of water, taking a walk, etc.



     Julia raised the other thread, my apology was general. 

     She has often referenced her education.  I'm working (God, so slowly) towards a BS, but my courses are mostly math and science and I look for instructors who avoid discussion of social issues.  I had a math class with an adjunct who spent better than half the time trash-talking Bush and the waste of time and MY money infuriated me.  On a Humanities track, I imagine social discussions would be more common and appropriate and sought her perspective. 

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 7:50:24 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Myself, I am sort of biased against any organized religion, not sure what term applies to me...maybe "Opinionated Jerk"?




       Still too broad I'm afraid, and not nearly insulting enough.  Hell, I sometimes introduce myself that way

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 8:00:08 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

    Julia raised the other thread, my apology was general. 



I apologize.  It appeared that you were trying to apologize to her (you did reference her post) but I stand
corrected.

Im trying to figure out how Dominant it will appear to be introduced at school functions as Dr. and Mr. Sinergy.

Bitch.

I would be in graduate school but I have to work 4 days a week to finish my probationary period in the union .

One more year...

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 8:14:26 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline 		       JMO, but I've always felt that being a 'kept man' was an expression of a high order of dominance, indeed.

     A BS will be more than sufficient to insure I spend the rest of my working years yelling at the guys who get dirty, instead of gettig dirty myself.  I was making excellent progress with a 2-day a week work schedule but the prevailing wage laws were altered after our recall of Davis and my expenses didn't drop by 60% when my pay did.

  Bitch

     I went out knocking on doors for Schwarzenegger, knowing it would probably happen.  Davis had to go.  Greater good and all that shit.

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RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 8:24:13 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		Rich, I like to read what you write, even though you suffer from that disease called conservatism

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: How to get called names - 2/15/2007 8:28:31 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Rich, I like to read what you write, even though you suffer from that disease called conservatism



    Wanna hear the scary part, Mia?  Within my immediate family, in the local area, I'm the liberal one.

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Profile   Post #: 40
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