RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (Full Version)

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AquaticSub -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 8:45:51 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
Having switch tendencies doesn't mean you will be owned though. You can get topped at a play party to help "Get your fix" or just ignore it all together. I assume it's rather like being bisexual. Yes it's all very nice but you don't have to have both when you have one.



But conversely, it can mean that you will be owned - I know plenty of owned switches and I also know plenty of sadomasochistic switches.  It really does run the gamut.



Well of course. But it doesn't mean you will be. Which is all the point I was making.

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quote:


So, does it matter to you if they are pure dom but submitted in the past?


It depends - if my owner did it in some misguided concept that it would help him become a better dominant but he didn't enjoy it then it wouldn't matter much to me though I'd wonder a little bit about his ability to not fall into "party line thinking."  If my owner did it because he thought it would help him become a better dominant and enjoyed submitting then I'd prolly want to know if he was still a switch and if he wasn't still a switch what exactly changed for him that he no longer had those tendencies.  As I mentioned before I'd also wonder why it took him nine years to mention this all to me.

If he submitted in the past because he wanted to and enjoyed it then similarly we'd have to have a disucssion about whether he still had switch tendencies and whether he wanted to pursue submission going towards the future.  For the reasons I outlined before (his time, tangible objects, intangible objects, sexuality, etc no longer being under his authority but under someone elses) if he wanted to pursue submission in the future I'd probably with a huge amount of difficultly ask for release.  I'd ask for release because beyond those practical things about him being under someone elses authority given that we've been together for a significant amount of time and he never ever mentioned it before would be a serious trust issue and also would mean that many things that he told me and many of the philosophies he has are just flat out lies.

C~



At least you aren't being entirely close-minded though I would take issue with one thing you said...

There isn't a right way or a wrong way to learn how to be a dominant. But the way of submitting first to learn how to dominate certainly shouldn't be called misguided. I've seen in work in real time experience with other dominants and I've found that some of the people with best skill with a flogger are actually subs.




AquaticSub -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 8:49:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: petstorm

Because BDSM IS about sex, where D/s is all the many factors of life that go with any relationship. i hate how the two are smudged into one lump title. *smirk*


Actually terms are used fairly interchangeably in this lifestyle. The term "BDSM lifestyle" is common and d/s (meaning only the bedroom) is also common, though I believe less so. There is a difference between lifestyle and bedroom kink of course, but that is the best separation of the terms in my opinion.




porthuronsub -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 9:26:03 AM)

My Mistress told me that she had subbed before, and it helped her to know what I am going through with her.  Had she not told me I wouldn't care.  There are many things people don't get told when they enter a relationship, some of it you don't need or really want to know. 
I don't know how I would feel if she were a switch now.  I guess I would view her differnetly, I don't know if I could still respect her.




juliaoceania -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 9:39:01 AM)

quote:

Many people, especially many of my male friends, operate on a "need to know basis". They do not tell their female S.O. alot of things. More than you would imagine actually. Why? Not because they wish to be secretive but because they do not want to deal with the backlash from divulging the information.


You know, it is a wonderful feeling to be so open to someone that they do not need to fear that. It is a gift to accept another to the point they feel they can tell you everything





Wildfleurs -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 9:42:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

At least you aren't being entirely close-minded though I would take issue with one thing you said...



I always find it strange how disagreeing can very quickly be morphed into close minded or the use of the J-word (judgemental).

quote:


There isn't a right way or a wrong way to learn how to be a dominant. But the way of submitting first to learn how to dominate certainly shouldn't be called misguided. I've seen in work in real time experience with other dominants and I've found that some of the people with best skill with a flogger are actually subs.


I believe its misguided to think that bottoming or submitting will give you insight into another person.  I don't believe that bottoming or submitting is a generic or universal experience where I would have more insight into you because we are both on the submissive side of the slash (unless you think I have some special insight into you?). 

So yes, I absolutely think its misguided.  I've dated switches and I've also dated/played with a dominant who did the whole bottoming to gain more insight into submission and I have to say their techniques were not any better than the dominants/tops I played with who didn't bottom or switch.

C~




agirl -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 10:53:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Just a quick note regarding telling all.

I think you will find very different points of view on this subject. As agirl has already stated, for many people it is not something needed or perhaps even wanted. There are many things that may be in someone's past I do not feel I need to know. However, if they feel they need to tell me everything I am always open to listen.

I think the key on this particular subject is communicating your specific needs. If you need to know everything about a person to have a trusting relationship, it is your responsibility to explain that.

Many people, especially many of my male friends, operate on a "need to know basis". They do not tell their female S.O. alot of things. More than you would imagine actually. Why? Not because they wish to be secretive but because they do not want to deal with the backlash from divulging the information.



Knowing someone, doesn't mean knowing their entire history.  There's still plenty of *stuff* that I don't know about M. None of it can possibly be relevant to the relationship after so many years.

I don't know the way he votes, I don't know his favourite colour, I don't know his favourite fruit. I don't know if he's ever written a cheque, let alone if one has bounced. I don't know if he likes blue eyes or brown, his favourite author, or actor or how many women he's fucked. Yet we speak everyday, even after all this time, for hours and are never bored.

I don't have a destination, so maybe I simply don't need to know the names of the stations I pass.

agirl












porthuronsub -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 11:22:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Just a quick note regarding telling all.

I think you will find very different points of view on this subject. As agirl has already stated, for many people it is not something needed or perhaps even wanted. There are many things that may be in someone's past I do not feel I need to know. However, if they feel they need to tell me everything I am always open to listen.

I think the key on this particular subject is communicating your specific needs. If you need to know everything about a person to have a trusting relationship, it is your responsibility to explain that.

Many people, especially many of my male friends, operate on a "need to know basis". They do not tell their female S.O. alot of things. More than you would imagine actually. Why? Not because they wish to be secretive but because they do not want to deal with the backlash from divulging the information.



Knowing someone, doesn't mean knowing their entire history.  There's still plenty of *stuff* that I don't know about M. None of it can possibly be relevant to the relationship after so many years.

I don't know the way he votes, I don't know his favourite colour, I don't know his favourite fruit. I don't know if he's ever written a cheque, let alone if one has bounced. I don't know if he likes blue eyes or brown, his favourite author, or actor or how many women he's fucked. Yet we speak everyday, even after all this time, for hours and are never bored.

I don't have a destination, so maybe I simply don't need to know the names of the stations I pass.

agirl



I have found that divulging too much information tends to cause insecurities in my SO.  I live in a relatively small town and everyone seems to have some connection to everyone else (kinda like the kevin bacon game) so I tend to keep most of my past to myself.  If asked a specific question I answer it honestly, I just don't get involved in detailing my past.  I also don't want to know everyone my SO has been with, what she has done and why.  Of course I want to know if she had sex with someone of the same sex, even if it was for her Dom.....ohh  thats another thread......




LaTigresse -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 11:33:48 AM)

agirl, I just have to say that I find so much of what you write about your personal situation absolutely intriquing. It seems very different than what others have, but it seems to be working so very well for you that no one could possibly argue it's value. Thank your for your insight.




agirl -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 2:40:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

agirl, I just have to say that I find so much of what you write about your personal situation absolutely intriquing. It seems very different than what others have, but it seems to be working so very well for you that no one could possibly argue it's value. Thank your for your insight.


It was a really interesting topic, LaTigresse. It gave M a chuckle too. I read my post with the quick listing of *things I don't know about him*, over the phone and he said ...* Do they matter?*.........and off we launched, chatting for an age .........and .....I STILL am no closer to knowing ...LOL

agirl




AquaticSub -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 3:06:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

I always find it strange how disagreeing can very quickly be morphed into close minded or the use of the J-word (judgemental).



Please note that I didn't use judgemental. I think it's close-minded to assume that just because someone was a sub they would be a bad dom. You can disagree with me all you like.

quote:


I believe its misguided to think that bottoming or submitting will give you insight into another person.  I don't believe that bottoming or submitting is a generic or universal experience where I would have more insight into you because we are both on the submissive side of the slash (unless you think I have some special insight into you?). 



That only talks about people. Yes, being dommed will not give you insight about others. However for many people it makes them better at activites like flogging, spanking and so on. And, more important then insight into you or anyone else, it will give them insight about themselves.

quote:


So yes, I absolutely think its misguided.  I've dated switches and I've also dated/played with a dominant who did the whole bottoming to gain more insight into submission and I have to say their techniques were not any better than the dominants/tops I played with who didn't bottom or switch.

C~



Well, that is your experience and it's entirely contrary to my own. C'est le vive.




chrissyslave -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 5:12:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl


Knowing someone, doesn't mean knowing their entire history.  There's still plenty of *stuff* that I don't know about M. None of it can possibly be relevant to the relationship after so many years.

I don't know the way he votes, I don't know his favourite colour, I don't know his favourite fruit....Yet we speak everyday, even after all this time, for hours and are never bored.

I don't have a destination, so maybe I simply don't need to know the names of the stations I pass.

agirl



    I tend to have much of agirl's viewpoints as my own.  Although my relationship is more 90% on-line poly M/s it is more business like (maybe this suits my business training/experience?), and although I have nevered pursued chit-chat, and probing with Sir, as I think it would seem less relevant in our situation and perhaps more a distraction to my present focus, especially so early on.  He has his more personal life having a r-l committed relationship and this relationship with myself is more about further expressing his strong Dominant personality.  If instead it was r-t 24/7 I would want to know more about his personal like and dislikes as I would want to consider those in my actitivities to please him.  As it is, what he wants is my deeper submission that will much benefit me (my mental sense of self and fulfillment...as a sub/slave) and by doing so meets more of his Dom needs, which includes my future possible expressions of appreciation. 

    However, if it were r-t 24/7 I believe I would trust him to tell me what was significant about his past that might be a current influence.  Anything more might be just curious inquires, rather than seeking aspects to "qualify himself" as my One.  So what I instead would do focus more on is the here and now.   Probing about his past not only would seems misfocused, but lacking trust, and putting myself up to judge him as a form of topping from the bottom, or more a kind of vanilla influence.

    I believe that history is very often just that...history...and the more we dwell upon it the more we are likely to repeat it, and in part we are assuming others also might repeat theirs.  I prefer to focus on my today, so that my tomorrow will be greater than my past.  Although he fully probes my past, in order to guide my path and future that is to me properly reflects his position and abilitities.  For me is is just baggage, and he is the baggage handler..or perhaps more my baggage disposer as he causes them to drop away.

    I am not perfect in my acceptance perhaps, as if he would have a criminal past, or was a drug dealer or whatever then those would more concern me, but I would not rule out that those too are just past factors.  BTW, those Doms that contact me where their main mode of transportation is a harley, have multiple tattoos, long hair and a beard give me cause for concern, and reason for disconsideration (however a harley along side a Mercedes is cool!), even though for others their style is often attractive.

    With regards to what LA said about different types of relationships and allowance for switching, as a sub/slave my mentor/sir  would not want me to be shared with outside others, but would appreciate some interaction with his other slave, though pehaps not in terms of full switching, but more in BDSM play aspects perhaps at some point, but that is all yet to be determinined being my addition is new and am only in consideration at this point . 

    However, if I were to discover/confirm I have switch tendencies I might have some problem maintaining my proper submissive mindset, and then this relationship might not fully work for my own needs. Time will tell.

chrisssyslave




slavemaia -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/27/2007 7:43:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Okay, based upon another thread in another zone. I am asking a question.

To all the submissives and slaves (why did I just hear a Julio Iglesias song in my head....to all the girls I've loved befoooooorrrrrrre.....)anyway back to the topic at hand.

What would you do/think/say IF you found out that your dominant/master/mistress had neglected to inform you that they had been submissive/slave in the past? Would it matter if it was more of a scene/bottoming thing versus a relationship? Why? Or, would you view it as a learning experience?

AND to add an extra kink in the chain.....what if you found out they still had switch tendencies and had not told you about it?



This is an achilles heal for me as i much prefer someone knowing who and what they are and being straightforward. i had one experience where a "dom" turned out to be a sub - OY. my solution? i topped him at his request and beat the heck out of him. i was really pissed that he had deceived me - at least that's how i felt. i figured oh you want to be a sub eh? Well let me show you the meaning of pain. ha ha ha. i had fun but it's not my schtick. The feeling of betrayal was pretty bad. i sensed something was up with him but didn't know what it was. When he finally came clean, it explained what i was feeling, but i just felt so deceived. Turns out he had 2 profiles and was playing both sides of the fence and not telling anyone anything. Personally i think it stinks.
 




Wildfleurs -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/28/2007 7:01:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
Please note that I didn't use judgemental. I think it's close-minded to assume that just because someone was a sub they would be a bad dom. You can disagree with me all you like.


Just to be clear - I never said that or had that line or arguement.

C~




gypsygrl -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/28/2007 7:38:19 AM)

I've never been all that taken by the idea of finding some superdom who emerged from his momma's womb in full dom mode, flogger in hand.  Finding out someone who I was involved with had bottomed or submitted in the past wouldn't phase me nor would finding out that they had urges to switch in the present.  I don't expect anyone to tell me everything about themselves from the get go and do think getting to know someone is a slow process that happens over the course of a relationship and only ends when the relationship ends.  If they didn't tell me about something because they weren't comfortable early on, to me it would mean that there wasn't enough trust to share that kind of information and I wouldn't assume that they were trying to deceive me, though the thought might cross my mind and I might worry about it.

As far as finding out someone had urges to switch in the present, my response would depend on the situation.  Personally, I get switchy moods every now and again, and think it would be cool to learn how to use a flogger though I don't consider myself a switch.  I know how to dominate a situation and have done that sort of thing successfully, but it doesn't get me off the way submitting does. Given this,  I don't see why I should take issue if a Dominant I was involved with felt the urge to switch and wanted to act on that urge.  Hell, I would probabaly do some short term, limited domming if they wanted me to so long as the basic relationship was secure.




AquaticSub -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/28/2007 10:18:11 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

Just to be clear - I never said that or had that line or arguement.

C~



No but you did say...

quote:


I always find it strange how disagreeing can very quickly be morphed into close minded or the use of the J-word (judgemental).




grlneedstolearn -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/28/2007 11:31:11 AM)

i honestly would not mind




sweetsubie -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/28/2007 12:50:32 PM)

My Dom and i are new to each other so its not exaclty answering your question, but after a week or two he told me the same. There was a WTF? moment but to be honest i was thrilled i think i find it some what reasuring to know that a Master has once been sub and well to find out that he had swtich tendensies was fantastic too because he made me realise that i had similar switch urges that the pair of us are now exploring.




bacchas -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (2/28/2007 7:56:03 PM)

It's not that big of deal to me. Most of the people I get to top me are switches anyway.




apettiger -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (3/1/2007 7:58:47 AM)

the knowlege that He had been sub to Another in the past i would find beneficial. a learning experience.
the knowlege that He still desired to sub on occassion, i would have a propblem with. mainly because i need Someone who will ALWAYS be in control.
the knowlege that He negelected to inform me of this in the beginning would be a deal breaker for me. in every relationship there has to be honesty and especially so in a BDSM one.
if He has withheld this info from me, what else is He hiding from me?




liks2plzlf -> RE: OMG You did what?!?!?! (3/1/2007 11:09:03 AM)

Although I have limited experience, many of the dominant women I have met, or talked to, were subs at first. I believe that would be a good thing, since she knows exactly what her sub is experiencing, or more importantly, what they would like to experience. I would be happy I finally met someone to serve. People do change, and who they were, doesn't mean thay can't be who they are now.




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