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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 3/31/2007 11:28:59 PM

juliaoceania

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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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Legally speaking oral sex is called oral copulation

Anal sex is called sodomy

Sex is called sexual intercourse.

Clinton was right, oral ain't really sex... just isn't. I consider it a form of sex to me personally, but I understand there are different ways of looking at it. I have seen people label this as a form of "miscommunication", perhaps, but I find it hard to believe that if he is an infamous and experienced dominant that he would take it forgranted that you knew exactly what he meant. Isn't the first sign of a good and experienced dominant one that communicates expectations and negotiates scenes thoroughly before embarking on them? It seems his reputation is a bit inflated because in my opinion this is a no brainer thing to negotiate with a play partner

But that is just what my opinion is, and since I do not play casually, and a dom of this type would probably turn me off (I do not like the idea of playing with people that play with lots of other people, experience does not wow me). You should feel very proud of yourself that you would not compromise who you are to play with anyone.

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 12:13:06 AM

crouchingtigress

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for him to cut off all contact with you at your rebuff made him look like a horn dog. there are thousand more tactful and elegant ways a gentleman could handle himself in that situation.

is a bj sex....yeah to me it is....and its the men that seem to stand on the "its not sex" thing...i have never heard a woman say it...its almost like if they say it often enough and loud enough they might make it true.

i steer clear of guys that are that emotionally unavailable and disconnected with themselves as to say that a BJ is not sex.....

< Message edited by crouchingtigress -- 4/1/2007 12:16:47 AM >

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 12:44:19 AM

FelinePersuasion

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be glad he made his priorities clear from the start and you didn't find out much later when things were already vested.

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 2:03:35 AM

Amaros

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FelinePersuasion

be glad he made his priorities clear from the start and you didn't find out much later when things were already vested.

Spendid observation - the guy like blow jobs, nobody's perfect.

Technicalities aside, it's all sex, as they say in airframes, and the stakes increase with any exchange of bodily fluids, another point to consider: his risk of contracting an STD is very low on the reciving end, and thus, decreases the risks on the part of the servicer - somethng to consider if, as you say, he is a very popular player.

So, on one hand, it could be a very calculating move on his part, - he get a steady supply of BJ's from a variety of women, not a bad position, but on the other he may well be taking the hit in order to decrease overall risk factors and increase group fitness - and still get get some action. In any case, it would appear to work this way, and his motives are incidental - does it work for you or not becomes the question, which you've already answered.

Bottom line is, assess your risk factors - the rest is sex - or not - as you prefer, and on a discretionary basis.

To go any deeper into this would require an entire assessment of "what women want" as opposed to "what men want", i.e., sexual politics - simple risk assesment is the objective factor here.

< Message edited by Amaros -- 4/1/2007 2:05:46 AM >

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 2:12:46 AM

Sasy

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I remember a time when learning about a dominant ......... I was told how good he was in the public play arena....... Well he beat me so bad in a weeks time that it took two weeks to get back on my feet and a tattoo to cover up scars he left... He told me he wasnt sadist ... the people that knew him from his local scene said he wasnt sadistic........ * shudders* funny how people see things diferently. I am sorry tho that things turned out as they did ..... yes I to think Oral in any form is sexual

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 3:33:30 AM

Kendra

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smiles quietly to herself
Rock Star Doms,,
met a few of those...
oxygen thieves most of them,
too ready to believe their own media than to sit down and discuss the best merits of one technique VS another
and all of them,, and i do mean all of them
simply would not accept that any way other than their way was the 'right' way ,,
Better u find someone who is more concerned with the ''realities' and less concerned with who blows and who swallows?
in Australia we would simply call the man a wanker and move on..

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 4:14:37 AM

ExSteelAgain

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The problem with all this is that we know there are players who don’t get into anything sexual and he came on at first as such a Dom. Many submissives, such as yourself, feel more comfortable in a no sex arrangement. The folks who don’t mix in sex may play in clubs or in private settings and the practice is well known. He begins as such a Dom, but confuses the issue when he suddenly brings in any type sex.

In his very public capacity he has come across many submissives in a frenzy for whatever reason. They will accept this blurring of the original agreement. He wanted to be in charge, setting the rules that he wouldn’t have sex with you, but you would do everything else he wanted. So it wasn’t a nice little mutual checklist arrangement of neither of you performing sexual acts after all. It was more of you do what I want, but I won’t have sex with you….right now.

Let me ask you this, if you started to play with him and he had you flying physically and emotionally after a few times and decided he wanted you to perform oral sex or any other kind of sex, don’t you think you would have been helpless to resist?

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 8:25:43 AM

StellaByStarlite

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quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

wildfleursss, agirl and missturbation - i agree, lack of communication is the key here. The definition of sex is different to everyone. my real issue is with how he handled it. He could have still made his point and not been rude about it. Especially when most of his advice is about wanna be doms and how subs should avoid them and about communication being key - he would have been the first to tell a sub that any dom who treated a sub in such a way is not taking responsibility as a dominant.

Hello, velvetears. =)

Yeah, the first thing in your post that screamed " Asshole!!" to me was the fact he cut off all communication with you. What, he got offended because you wouldn't give him head? lol. He can't remain friends with you now? That is just so childish and egotistical. Just be thankful you found out now rather then later. =)

Stella

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RE: A Difference of Expectations - 4/1/2007 10:28:01 AM

velvetears

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juliaoceania - i don't think he took for granted i knew - i just think it's a matter of "i am so popular i don't care what you know this is how it is if you wanna play with me" i had no idea "who he was" as i did not meet him in a public setting... he lives very close to me and we met in a site much like CM. His popularity didn't score any points with me. i would rather meet genuine, grounded people who aren't so caught up on their image or popularity.

crouchingtigress - i think it is a gender difference in belief - more then likely because during oral a woman is penetrated. You made a good point about being emotionally unavailable and disconnected with himself, i want no part of that kind of arrangement either.

FelinePersuation - i am glad he was upfront from the start as well, some playing would have been fun but not on his terms only

Amaros - Thats how i felt - just uncomfortable putting myself in a position of doing something risky for me, while he sat in a position of taking almost no risk - i still think men should be careful though as woman can pass an STD to them orally.

Sasy - i am sorry for your experience, how awful! i hope he got in trouble for what he did - at the very least i hope that the group supported you and penalized him in some fashion. The sad thing about it is you probably felt safe with him because of his position in the play arena.

Kendra - absolutely - and the point i find ironic as hell is when i read his advice column he goes on and on about a sub having her needs met and selfish doms are wannabes and how protective he comes off for newbies not being taken advantage of etc... He should actually read and take his own advice!

ExSteel - Interesting question you asked - this actually happened - the first time we actually met we had lunch and i ended up going over to his house - i didn't expect to play at all but he tried a few items he had on me, which i consented to, he knew i was consentually reluctant lol. i enjoyed the different sensations and while i wasn't exactly flying i definately had a buzz on from the experience - He did actually suggest i show my gratitude by giving him a bj and i declined. i didn't feel bad either because he knew i was reluctant to play in the first place (he said he just wanted to show me a few things) and to assume because i consented to that i would end up doing that was to me asuming a lot on his end.

StellaByStarlight - i felt disappointed we couldn't remain friends. He was so close and quite a likeable guy, i looked forward to going to some clubs and events with him - as he suggested we could do seeing we live 10 minutes apart. We did become friends and i actually worked for him - paid work during tax season, i thought we had a good rapport. It never even occured to me to discuss the "no sex" clause untill he repeatedly kept reiterating he doesn't have sex with his subs - i mean more then 10 times, thats what got me to take real notice of it - so i wrote him an email and after that he blocked me and never asnwered his phone. C'est la vie...

Thanks all for the replies - i have learned from your responses :-)

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