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RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/13/2007 2:10:02 PM

addicted2it

Posts: 322
Joined: 5/31/2004
From: California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Laura

Not so much a question as an observation looking for feedback. I've been on CM for a few years, talked to lots of guys, met a couple.

I began talking to a new guy and until a few days ago I was thinking things were going along well enough for a beginning. But, now I am just tired of the whole thing as I feel I am just a figurehead to him.

He keeps telling me how he will serve me and tries to tell me what I think and feel. At first he seemed to be listening to me but now I realize he was only listening as long as I agreed (or came close to agreeing) with him. I am a figurehead for his fantasies of being owned.

In our conversations he plunges ahead like an over excited dog on a leash. He doesn't see how I am there still holding the leash having my arm pulled out of it's socket. I am kind of angry and yet... this is just so typical of all my other encounters with male subs. I just didn't see it at first.

Has any one ever found a real male sub? Not a professional relationship, something personal where he actually knows you and responds to you and does not try to lead you to serve him.

To me, the term "figurehead domme" conjures up a picture of someone who is being objectified. If you are a domme, allowing yourself to be the object of someone else's fantasies seems very demeaning and out of character -- and actually more within the realm of what a submissive desires.

Perhaps you are looking in the wrong kennel. The puppies belong on one side, and the adults on the other. But seriously, it sounds as though these "subs" that you are talking with do not have much experience, or that they even know what they want.

BDSM and D/s is a wonderful fantasy, but aren't we looking for real people with real expectations?

-arf, arf!

_____________________________

"What I lack in wisdom and intelligence, I more than make up or with age."

(in reply to Laura)

Post #: 21

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/13/2007 2:56:05 PM

GoddessDustyGold

Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Curiously, this thread implies that men are dogs, albeit for not the usual reason.

For the record, I more consider myself a cat.

*Laughing* Yes, you are an independant little cuss, aren't you?
Here kitty, kitty, kitty!

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 22

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/13/2007 8:16:43 PM

MsCfromMelbourne

Posts: 777
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Curiously, this thread implies that men are dogs, albeit for not the usual reason.

And there aint nothing more humilating to any woman than having a "hard dog to keep on the porch"

_____________________________

<----- Corset, mask and collar designed and manufactured by metalsmith Karl H, chromed and lined in black suede. Masks and collars available from http://www.lucreziadesade.com.au/default.html. Corsets custom made only

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 23

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/16/2007 4:19:09 PM

MistressDolly

Posts: 917
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Laura

Not so much a question as an observation looking for feedback. I've been on CM for a few years, talked to lots of guys, met a couple.

I began talking to a new guy and until a few days ago I was thinking things were going along well enough for a beginning. But, now I am just tired of the whole thing as I feel I am just a figurehead to him.

He keeps telling me how he will serve me and tries to tell me what I think and feel. At first he seemed to be listening to me but now I realize he was only listening as long as I agreed (or came close to agreeing) with him. I am a figurehead for his fantasies of being owned.

In our conversations he plunges ahead like an over excited dog on a leash. He doesn't see how I am there still holding the leash having my arm pulled out of it's socket. I am kind of angry and yet... this is just so typical of all my other encounters with male subs. I just didn't see it at first.

Has any one ever found a real male sub? Not a professional relationship, something personal where he actually knows you and responds to you and does not try to lead you to serve him.

Communication is imperative - - it could get difficult when one person is a bedroom-only submissive (bottom) and the other is more than a bedroom-only domme, i.e., top servicer, etc. But to answer your question directly: Yes, there are submissive men out there with whom submission does extend beyond sex and/or sexual play. From my experience, they tend not to be threatened nor repelled by female dominance both in and out of the bedroom. On the contrary, they admire and welcome female dominance in all aspects of their lives. They highly regard your opinions, trust in your inflexible firmness and feel comfortable following your lead because they know your virtue is of the purest shade. It really does take a lot of trust and faith to follow the lead of a female dominant but they do because they know you really do have their best interests at heart, both in and out of the bedroom. While it is important to be very select in who you decide to invest your time, if you feel there's potential, I wouldn't give up just yet. Good luck.

(in reply to Laura)

Post #: 24

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/16/2007 4:50:32 PM

BeachMystress

Posts: 2156
Joined: 4/3/2004
From: Naples Island- Long Beach CA - Southern California
Status: offline

This is VERY common. I call it "being life support for a whip/strap-on/their favorite fantasy." They aren't interested in you as a person, but rather in what you represent.. aka Dominance. You could be Jane Doe; it just doesn't matter as long as you are Dominant. Many who call themselves submissive do this. Unless the male is interested in you as a person as well as in what you bring via Dominance, he isn't worth your time. He's stuck in the fantasy version of the lifestyle.

The men who are interested in women as people ARE out there. Unfortunately, most of them are taken already, because they are rare and valuable. My personal feeling is that subs that a 24/7 Domme actually would want to spend her life with are as rare as Domme as a whole. I was also very discouraged after years of looking. I finally found my subhub at the grand opening of a dungeon. He'd been in the lifestyle all of three months. In that amount of time he'd managed to serve 12 Domme.. we were part of Club FEm and he is cute. Everyone wanted to play with him. Luckily, until he and I played, he'd not been interested in a relationship. Otherwise I suspect he'd have already been taken. I was willing to wait for him to realize that what he and I had was special. (I knew it was from the first time we played.) Before we'd met, he'd set up being part of an auction for charity. He was purchased by two Domme there, and came home realizing exactly what I wanted him to.. that what we had was different that what he'd have with any other Domme. Eight months later we were married. We are now at our second collaring anniversary (May 10th) and will be at our second wedding anniversary soon (June 7th.)

Sometimes you do have to be patient with the perfect sub. As I type this, hubby is cleaning the living room, then will run to the grocery store, come home and put in laundry and then make dinner. He will rub my back until I go to sleep at bedtime. If I'd not been able to see his potential through his newness, someone else would own this awesome man. You may be able to break through this sub's case of "sub frenzy" and force him to see you as an individual, but I suspect it would be more work than it is worth. Move on. You're hunting for a four leaf clover. They exist, just are rare and require a lot of looking.

< Message edited by BeachMystress -- 4/16/2007 5:32:35 PM >

_____________________________

Beach Mystress
*Do not threaten the weak. Intimidate the strong. ~ Stevenson*
http://beachmystress.jigsy.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/beachmystress/

(in reply to Laura)

Post #: 25

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/16/2007 9:06:51 PM

Laura

Posts: 573
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

I'm not dedicated to astrology. I like it as a general guide. However serious you take it, it is right about personalities under each sign enough times that I avoid certain signs from past experience. I married a Leo who didn't have room for me in his life. I began to care for a Virgo who was really intelligent but kept his passion buried too deep. I'm Sagitarrius and being told what to do and confined really do make me bonkers. :)

_____________________________

Bait & Switch - Adult column

(in reply to MisPandora)

Post #: 26

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/16/2007 9:23:21 PM

Laura

Posts: 573
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

As a partial update. I've been offline over the weekend and though he could have sent me an email he did not. We had been talking on an IM each evening for over a week. This was not my favourite option as I did my time in the cyberworld when it was new and still something interesting. I don't like online Domination now, it's just too phoney and one way. Anyway, he had said he would like to be Dominated online. I never agreed to do so. I did arrange to meet him but had to cancel as I had the flu this past week. Anyway, it's been four days since I had contact with him and I have heard nothing. Maybe he is waiting for me to appear on the IM but I don't care for them and have managed well without turning one on for years. I have not missed him during this time and it does not seem he has missed me or been concerned by my absense.

Maybe this could have worked out. We had some things in common. He seemed to be looking for the same kind of relationship I am. But... I'm just really burnt out from trying to meet sub men and at least half of me feels relieved not to have to push him to change. I don't really want to spend time changing someone only to have them resent me and take off later.

Someone wrote that I am angry at myself. I'm not. I was frustrated. But I hadn't made a real investment of myself in this so far. This one won't even leave a scar.

_____________________________

Bait & Switch - Adult column

(in reply to pixelslave)

Post #: 27

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/24/2007 3:22:29 AM

JustAslave2007

Posts: 11
Joined: 2/10/2007
Status: offline

i believe that the majority of male subs online have a much greater interest in expieriencing their sexual fantasies than in actual service to a Domina. This is fine as long as they are honest and tell the Dommeand She knows their motivations. This type of "sub" will likely engage the service a pro-Domme.
i believe for any relationship to work one must not take without giving nor give without taking.
It is not impossible to find a slave who is more concerned with pleasing a Domina than he is with pleasing himself.
However , i believe, they are rare very and finding one may take a good deal of time and effort.

just my thoughts

(in reply to addicted2it)

Post #: 28

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/24/2007 4:00:44 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: VeryMercurial

Many online are living in fantasy land and do seek a mythical Dominant.
Thus the increasing proliferation of the professional Dominants.
The professional Dominants deliver the fantasy and dreams, for a tribute.
Most of the clueless submissves don't realize we are real women, with real
lives and real problems.
Many desire the professional Dominant in latex and leather, swinging a whip in
6 inch heels, but don't want to pay for those services.

True enough

I just wandered into the professional services area; it seems the "view" rate for the ads there is around 250-300 per week, which says a lot.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to VeryMercurial)

Post #: 29

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/24/2007 11:43:31 PM

acquiesce93

Posts: 23
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline

Met a real male sub? Yes, many.
Met a real male sub from CM? Well, I've only had profile and pictures actively up for 2 months but I've met two wonderful friends and one male sub who was in person, from a very unsexy planet.
I think that when you restrict your play and talking to online, what you've described is going to happen much more because lots of people just see CM as a way of instant gratification, or just pure fantasy.

(in reply to Laura)

Post #: 30

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/25/2007 1:14:11 AM

TheDiva

Posts: 129
Joined: 6/21/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: acquiesce93
... I've met two wonderful friends and one male sub who was in person, from a very unsexy planet.
I think that when you restrict your play and talking to online, what you've described is going to happen much more because lots of people just see CM as a way of instant gratification, or just pure fantasy.

From a very unsexy planet? That is hilarious, yet actually a semi-kind way of putting it.

I can relate to the feeling that sometimes a sub will seem like he just wants a Domme, not necessarily me in particular. It's as emotionally unappealing as a woman who is determined to marry the first person who will ask.

I don't play online, but I will insist on chatting with a person online before I will go to phone. If/when I feel comfortable, we can have a voice conversation. It works out well for me because I weed out most of the wankers, weirdos, and wanna-be's after seeing what kind of topics we can communicate about.

(in reply to acquiesce93)

Post #: 31

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/25/2007 7:34:46 AM

addicted2it

Posts: 322
Joined: 5/31/2004
From: California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheDiva

quote:

I can relate to the feeling that sometimes a sub will seem like he just wants a Domme, not necessarily me in particular. It's as emotionally unappealing as a woman who is determined to marry the first person who will ask.

As a submissive ISO a Domme, it is very difficult to actually know if this is someone who might turn out to be a wonderful connection or just a bad hair day. Most the personal ads do not contain very much information to go on. This is particularly true when the Domme will not even provide a general location (for instance, California and not northern, central, or southern California). I have personally found that, even when pressed to give a location, the Domme is either offended or just chooses not to respond. After all, it's just coffee, and not a marriage proposal.

I think there might be an expectation from some Dommes, at least, that the submissive be willing to give it all up even before he or she knows who this person really is.

I cannot stress stress strongly enough the need for a long and proper "courtship." But in many cases, one often cannot get past the first red light.

_____________________________

"What I lack in wisdom and intelligence, I more than make up or with age."

(in reply to TheDiva)

Post #: 32

RE: Figurehead Domme - 4/26/2007 6:34:18 PM

GuidingLite

Posts: 233
Joined: 12/10/2006
Status: offline

helping you there aintgonna happen but for women: yes they turnout to be veryobedient subbies.

(in reply to Laura)

Post #: 33

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/3/2007 8:44:31 PM

smilinguy

Posts: 9
Joined: 3/29/2005
Status: offline

Hi!

Submissive men who listen to their partners and dance the duet of BDSM do exist. We have our needs just like dominants do, we're human like the rest, but with trust and communication the dance can be fulfilling for both people.

It does appear that the Internet brings about people with a lack of social skills. That's unfortunate. A good avenue to find the kind of submissives you're looking for is to get involved with your local leather community.

-mikey :)

(in reply to pixelslave)

Post #: 34

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/3/2007 10:16:23 PM

MaamJay

Posts: 2101
Joined: 9/2/2005
Status: offline

Laura, I can empathise. Before Easter, I was in touch with a boy who appeared to have the right ideas about being My slave, but who then got very pushy and tried to manipulate Me into having him move straight into My home here with Master. I posted here about it. That was a No Go Zone as far as We were concerned and We stuck to it. Subsequently W/we spoke again (on phone) and he had calmed down considerably and reconsidered his position. But I still had some thoughts that maybe he was treating Me a bit as a figurehead, he wanted A Domme rather than Me. I was prepared to continue the talks, but then he disappeared for 2 weeks. I just about wrote him off as a runaway pup (in My May roll call entry that's what I said), when, to My surprise, he called again. It seems he had lost both mobile phone and wallet on public transport, and, being only a recent immigrant to this country (and not currently living anywhere near Me), it took him some time to organise replacements. he'd also lost My phone number with the phone, but finally re-found the scrap of paper he'd written it on in the first place. he was greatly fearing My dismissal of him, and that crossed My mind too ... but I heard him out. It took courage for him to phone Me again, and I appreciated that. Have had 2 long talks with him now, and he's a changed puppy! No longer straining at the leash, no more interrupting Me, no longer putting on the puppy cuteness to try to sway Me to his line of thinking. he has really reassessed things and realises the error of his former ways, apologising sincerely for his earlier behaviour, knowing that it came from a sense of desperation to serve. he has shown that he is taking considerable interest in Me as a person (and in Master too), and when he moves to be nearby (hopefully within 2 weeks), understands it will be a long courtship and training period and that there is no guarantee of Our choosing him to be Our 24/7 slave. However, all 3 of U/us are serious about giving it a damn good try.

So, if you think there is true potential, give a damned hard pull back on the leash and stick to Your beliefs. Maybe, just maybe, puppy will pull his head in and think about growing up a bit! I am still "fingers crossed" and still will be until after he gets here, but I am now feeling more confident. Somewhere deep down right from the start I have had the gut feeling that this puppy is genuine ... I hope My gut doesn't prove to be misguided! I'll keep You all posted!

Maam Jay

_____________________________

Life is a song ... and I love singing it! (By me!)

(in reply to smilinguy)

Post #: 35

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/3/2007 10:48:01 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

MaamJay, I'm really glad to hear that. Did My heart good to see a positive to the story.

I completely agree with the distaste of the 'figurehead Domme' syndrome. Probably a big contributing factor as to why I have yet to have any luck on this site. It's not enough for one to want to serve. There has to be some connection to wanting to serve Me. It can be disheartening when so often, it seems like the quality is not out there. Very few of the subs seem to get the concept.

(in reply to MaamJay)

Post #: 36

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/4/2007 11:17:34 AM

Unrepentant1

Posts: 283
Joined: 8/25/2006
Status: offline

The mental aspect is far more important to me, I guess a lot of subs are not really submissive, they just want sexual gratification. To me it all begins in the mind, and a Domme must win that before any form of submission can happen. Maybe I am just hard work, lol.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 37

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/5/2007 10:03:06 AM

MistressDolly

Posts: 917
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Unrepentant1

The mental aspect is far more important to me, I guess a lot of subs are not really submissive, they just want sexual gratification. To me it all begins in the mind, and a Domme must win that before any form of submission can happen.

It is equally as important for you to trust and respect the Woman you choose to submit to as it is for her to trust and respect you. I believe most dominant women seeking a D/s relationship would appreciate your mindset, Unrepentant1.

_____________________________

m i s t r e s s d o l l y . c o m

m y s p a c e

(in reply to Unrepentant1)

Post #: 38

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/5/2007 2:42:30 PM

pixelslave

Posts: 1444
Joined: 8/19/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Unrepentant1

The mental aspect is far more important to me, I guess a lot of subs are not really submissive, they just want sexual gratification. To me it all begins in the mind, and a Domme must win that before any form of submission can happen. Maybe I am just hard work, lol.

I don't think you're wrong in your thinking in regard to yourself at all (can't speak to whether others are submissive or not). For me, it does begin in the mind in that I need a connection before I can submit to a woman. Plus, it is very clear to me, that my mind is the largest sexual organ in my body.

I also think it is very much about being submissive to one woman in particular. Learning that you can trust a woman to give your submission to her takes time and doesn't happen overnight. Relationships of any kind take work of some kind in my opinion. Even if it's only the work of taking the time to get to know each other as people, sharing each other's history while learning who and what they're about. For me, that is part of the process; a necessary one at that!

- pixel

_____________________________

Chivalry isn't dead! It's for those who have it in their hearts & are willing to be taught. It's a way of life, a code of honor; this one's armor still needs some polishing!

(in reply to Unrepentant1)

Post #: 39

RE: Figurehead Domme - 5/5/2007 4:13:36 PM

Laura

Posts: 573
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

I think trust comes from respect. If someone does not respect you you won't ever really trust them. I think both things are important but they don't come instantly. You have to get to know someone awhile to have anything sincere.

Someone wrote about training him. But, I don't see a male sub as a toddler in need of potty training. If submission is what he wants he should know what that means and what that is. We can work on learning fetishes and skills such as spanking. But, submission itself is not something I am going to train a man for. It is either there or it is not. If he wants a Domme, any Domme, he can pay someone. I could use the money but it's just not something I can see myself doing. I want a personal connection, a relationship and I want to be the one smiling while he grimaces - not the other way around.

_____________________________

Bait & Switch - Adult column

(in reply to pixelslave)

Post #: 40

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