RE: Can you serve God and your Master?

RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (Full Version)

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pleasingpj -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:04:03 PM)
Yes, i agree with the original post by Aslanemperor...Sometimes things are over analysed. The Old Testament is the foundation for the New Testament. Things that happened in the Old Testament are still being preached about today and they are used to provide guidance in our daily lives ,even today. So, just because the slavery back then was not consentual does not mean that the practice cannot be applied to our lives today. What God wants is for us to have no other GOD before him. This is the key. We must put God first in all things. God would have first place in the life of my Master and i and i would serve my Master second. It is the natural order of things. This is my two cents worth.........

Aslanemperor -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:04:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Satyr6406 quote: ORIGINAL: Aslanemperor I'm personally under the impression that physical punishment should only be ok when agreed upon by both parties in the relationship. Mainly I think this because to do otherwise makes far to much of a chance for an abusive person to say that he's beating up his woman because he's her Dom. And of course, if you know that your submissive is ok with it(and most submissives I have had preferred the occasional punishment because they enjoyed the pain and the play that the action represented. Well, I have never seen corporal punishment as a viable option in any situation (except with VERY young UMs, where telling them: "No!" and then, a light smack on the hand teaches them what the word means) so, I don't advocate the beatings, etc. but, let's go with that, for a moment ... If I thought that my submissive needed some physical punishment, I should "check with her to make sure it's okay"? Should we ask criminals if they agree with their sentences? Should we ask our children if grounding them for a weekend is too long? Once again, in my mind, we're left with an inconsistancy, here. Let's remove the idea of corporal punishment and "go at it", from there. If I decide that my submissive has failed to wash the dishes for the umpteenth time. I might decide that she can no longer use a dish to eat her food (I doubt it but, I'm working on the fly, here). I don't care if she agrees to that punishment or not. As with all things, in this lifestyle, she has a three-pronged choice: "Yes, Michael Sir" "Can we talk about this, please?" "I can't serve you, anymore, Sir." That's it. I couldn't possibly care less if she thinks I'm being "fair". I am NOT going to manage my beliefs on what's right and wrong based upon what someone who has, supposedly, put her care into my hands thinks is fair or not. She'll do as she's supposed to or, she'll be punished. If she doesn't like the punishment, she knows where the door is. Peace and comfort, Michael Once again, I'm not talking about randomly beating her, and also I'm not talking about asking permission before punishing once she's done something wrong. I'll give an example. I had a slave named Alicia. We understood upon the first instance what was acceptable punishment and what was not. Alicia didn't complain if I took a switch to her, anymore then when I ordered her confined to her room, or anymore then when I didn't allow her sexual satisfaction in punishment. Sometimes, she would do things she knew I would whip her for, just because she wanted me to whip her, and admitted as much afterwords. This is the kind of instance I'm talking about.

Aslanemperor -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:06:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pleasingpj Yes, i agree with the original post by Aslanemperor...Sometimes things are over analysed. The Old Testament is the foundation for the New Testament. Things that happened in the Old Testament are still being preached about today and they are used to provide guidance in our daily lives ,even today. So, just because the slavery back then was not consentual does not mean that the practice cannot be applied to our lives today. What God wants is for us to have no other GOD before him. This is the key. We must put God first in all things. God would have first place in the life of my Master and i and i would serve my Master second. It is the natural order of things. This is my two cents worth......... Beautifully stated!

imthatacheyouhav -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:09:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pleasingpj Yes, i agree with the original post by Aslanemperor...Sometimes things are over analysed. The Old Testament is the foundation for the New Testament. Things that happened in the Old Testament are still being preached about today and they are used to provide guidance in our daily lives ,even today. So, just because the slavery back then was not consentual does not mean that the practice cannot be applied to our lives today. What God wants is for us to have no other GOD before him. This is the key. We must put God first in all things. God would have first place in the life of my Master and i and i would serve my Master second. It is the natural order of things. This is my two cents worth......... What she said...

Aslanemperor -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:11:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AquaticSub quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I love how christians try and find justification for what they do when it's something that really matters to them. They don't care about the having sex before marriage because most people keep quiet about that these days. But the kink? Well we've got to find a way to make that OK. I don't believe this is an example of finding justification. The Bible does allow and advocate sexual slavery. People who are religious try to follow the laws of their religion. There is nothing wrong with that. For BDSM Christians who are not familiar with this part of the Bible (frequently hidden by our priests and pastors) this can be troublesome. As a Christian, sometimes I have a problem with the fact that I am having sex before marriage. It is something I have to reconcile with my faith, and I take comfort in the fact that if that is enough to send me to Hell, despite the good works that I have done, my charity work and my sharing of the faith with those who are interested, not to mention my genuine belief in Jesus Christ, then there really wasn't much else I could have done. This would be like a bacon-loving Jewish person finding a little read part of the Torah that allows them to eat pigs. It's not justifying anything. It's saying loudly and clearly that "Hey, this is allowed by the laws of your religion!" It's just nice to know. I love it! I was thinking the same thing but didn't know how to say it quite so well. Well done!

Aslanemperor -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:12:36 PM)
Do you find it funny that the people arguing against this aren't Christians?

imthatacheyouhav -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:19:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I love how christians try and find justification for what they do when it's something that really matters to them. They don't care about the having sex before marriage because most people keep quiet about that these days. But the kink? Well we've got to find a way to make that OK. i love how "x" do "y"........Hmmmmm....

Satyr6406 -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:31:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aslanemperor Once again, I'm not talking about randomly beating her, and also I'm not talking about asking permission before punishing once she's done something wrong. I'll give an example. I had a slave named Alicia. We understood upon the first instance what was acceptable punishment and what was not. Alicia didn't complain if I took a switch to her, anymore then when I ordered her confined to her room, or anymore then when I didn't allow her sexual satisfaction in punishment. How very thoughtful of a submissive to be so acquiescent. Is there any chance that she was a masochist and enjoyed such activities? (Just a wild guess, on my part) quote: ORIGINAL: Aslanemperor Sometimes, she would do things she knew I would whip her for, just because she wanted me to whip her, and admitted as much afterwords. This is the kind of instance I'm talking about. How very passive/aggressive of her! Peace and comfort, Michael

MadameMajidah -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:32:11 PM)
raises Her hand** Christian here.. I just, like literally today used these verses against My parents...devout baptists IE " chilllllllllllllllllllleeeeeeeeeee you is gonnna burrrrrrrrn in heyyyyyyyyullllll if you continue-ah to do theeis!!" ( Ok they really dont talk like that, but in essence that's what they say.) I believe that God gave us free will for a reason. Jesus Died on a cross to absolve sin..therefore all is forgiven if it is repented. As far as BDSM being a sin, I dont view it that way, and yes I believe you can serve both your Master/Mistress and God at the same time. The most important thing is to keep an open mind and an open heart..and screw what others think of you and your lifestyle... it's not for them to judge you. ~~GM

myobedience -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:51:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: junecleaver I'd like a reference for 'scriptures which say that it's ok for a man to sleep with his slave without marrying her because she is his property.' It must be right beside those verses that talk about stoning unwed mothers and burn homosexuals alive? Me tooo. I was on a few yahoo boards back 3 or so years ago and one was VERY strict and Biblical. There was an argument on several boards about men OWNING a woman. There is a verse...but I cant remember it....I suppose our 23 yr old theologian knows?

rmanrr -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:54:57 PM)
Greetings... We are all on the path of death from the moment of conception....or am I being too literal? heh

junecleaver -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:58:10 PM)
quote: Me tooo. I was on a few yahoo boards back 3 or so years ago and one was VERY strict and Biblical. There was an argument on several boards about men OWNING a woman. There is a verse...but I cant remember it....I suppose our 23 yr old theologian knows? As a Christian, I've never felt I needed to justify my submission. It feels natural, especially within the context of Christianity. Even pain has been used by the catholic church as a way to grow closer to the 'Master' in the sky. Sex before marriage? I've never really been able to justify that one. The closest I can think of would be the Patriarchs who had sex with their servants to continue their lineage. Even in those scenarios, there is no justification for what they did. In fact, it eventually lead to bigger problems and heartache for the family involved. I don't know? I had hoped the OP could show me a verse.

mnottertail -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 1:59:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: junecleaver I'd like a reference for 'scriptures which say that it's ok for a man to sleep with his slave without marrying her because she is his property.' It must be right beside those verses that talk about stoning unwed mothers and burn homosexuals alive? um there are several on the pro side, I might point out Abram off the cuff, but insofar as passages burning homosexuals alive (i assume sodom and gamorrah) there was not such reason -- it was e pluribus unum there---additionally I am unaware of any unwed mother being stoned ---- Jesus

slaveluci -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:06:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I love how christians try and find justification for what they do when it's something that really matters to them. They don't care about the having sex before marriage because most people keep quiet about that these days. But the kink? Well we've got to find a way to make that OK. Some Christians do and some Christians don't. As with any group (Christians, Muslims, Caucasians, African-Americans, men, women, kinky and vanilla, etc.) you can never simply assume they ALL do/say the same things. That makes no more sense than saying everyone interested in this "lifestyle" acts/thinks exactly the same....luci

junecleaver -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:06:51 PM)
Yeah, because sending Hagar out into the desert was really taking care of her. I guess God kind of saved Mary off the fly, but it was common for girls in her position to be stoned to death. I <3 Jesus.

slaveluci -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:18:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail insofar as passages burning homosexuals alive (i assume sodom and gamorrah) there was not such reason -- it was e pluribus unum there Interesting point......very few people ever take note of this verse from Ezekiel which clearly states that Sodom was destroyed for reasons in addition to sodomy: "Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fullness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy" - Ezekiel 16:49 (Why's it always gotta be all about the homo's?) [;)] ......... luci

slaveluci -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:24:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: junecleaver Yeah, because sending Hagar out into the desert was really taking care of her Just an observation but, according to Scripture, God didn't initiate or condone the banishment of Hagar into the desert. This was a human decision much as her having Ishamel in the first place was. There are lots of stories told in the Scriptures about man's folly when they did things like this that they were not instructed to do by God. Just because the Bible tells of someone doing it, doesn't mean it was the right thing for them to do.....luci

fairerthanshe -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:31:19 PM)
Greetings all, There is and always will be confusion between what is scriptural and what is church tradition. For me, i do not believe that my sexuality is something that is shameful. it is a gift like any other from God. i choose to use it responsibly. church tradition had a lot more to do with the idea of monogamy than any scripture and there is nothing in the Bible which states that slavery is wrong. Yes, Levitical law does state that for a man to lay with a man as he would a woman is wrong - but it also says that we should be sacrificing doves after menstruation - and if the church saw fit to give up one then they should give up the other. That's my two very random cents worth today! well wishes, fairer than she

sensualmagirl -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:36:14 PM)
I'm in agreement fairerthanshe, I don't beleive in church traditions, rather, I beleive in God and the spirit world... my sexuality and curiosity is a great gift from God. [:D]

junecleaver -> RE: Can you serve God and your Master? (4/21/2007 2:49:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slaveluci quote: ORIGINAL: junecleaver Yeah, because sending Hagar out into the desert was really taking care of her Just an observation but, according to Scripture, God didn't initiate or condone the banishment of Hagar into the desert. This was a human decision much as her having Ishamel in the first place was. There are lots of stories told in the Scriptures about man's folly when they did things like this that they were not instructed to do by God. Just because the Bible tells of someone doing it, doesn't mean it was the right thing for them to do.....luci My post was a response to mnottertail. Maybe I misread his post? When I mentioned unwed mothers and he mentioned Abram, my mind jumped to Hagar---the woman he impregnated. It wasn't a response as to what God did, but rather what Abram did. It wasn't stoning an unwed mother, but he certainly wasn't all that kind.

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