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Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 6:21:11 PM   
sambamanslilgirl


Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		merely curious

after reading the responses on the General Discussion thread under a thread titled For Dom/mes, i have noticed that many replied that they look for obedience from a submissive. 

this had me wondering - are you seeking instant obedience before actually "getting to know" your potential submissive or are you actually knowing your submissive before seeking her/his obedience?

i already know Daddy never demanded my obedience automatically because we started off as friends before becoming Daddy-daughter.


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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 6:49:21 PM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline 		If it is someone looking to find out if there is potential to build toward becoming Mine (when I am searching, I am not currently and hopefully won't be doing so for a LONG time, if ever ) then I expect politeness, I expect them to show a little effort and at least reasonable communication skills (NO TXTSPK!)... thats it initialy as far as My expectations go.

As we get to know each other a little, and it becomes clear there is interest on both sides, then I expect to see them making effort to please, showing Me they have the right attitude, looking for ways to take onboard My prefrences where I have made them clear.

Once they decide they trust Me enough to take the step of submission THEN and only then  can I make demands and expect obedience. Before submission, I can only expect effort and if I don't get what I expect I can walk away from the discussions every bit as freely as she can, but I am not in a possition to DEMAND obedience from someone who isn't Mine, I might draw it from them, but I can not demand it.


_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 6:49:51 PM   
MasterFireMaam


Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline 		I don't expect obedience, blind or otherwise, right from the get go. Over the course of the relationship...I do expect, however, that the level of obedience, including blind, to increase. This means that trust is growing...and that I'm doing my job correctly. Even so, I don't often demand blind obedience...98% of the time, asking questions about what's going on is what I want.

Master Fire

< Message edited by MasterFireMaam -- 4/23/2007 6:51:50 PM >

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 7:00:57 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Dear sambamanslilgirl, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
Automatic obedience -- To my mind's eyes I see; automatic obedience is much like 'common sense' or 'gut instincts.'  There are 'rules' or 'laws' which humans tend to obey automaticly.
 
However, when paired with another individual, there must be communication as to where the boundaries are that would foster "automatic obedience."  Such as, when there is a fire--get out of the house, etc.
 
What, how and where to be obedient is extremely broad and cannot be expected to be 'automatic' right a way when the relationship is new.  It is a learned behavior and a learned obedience.  In the communications and negotiations there must be a understanding and agreement that rules and or protocols will be in place and the associated obedience is expected.  Other expectations will also be in place, as long as there is a communication and negotiation and or teaching aspect in place.
 
Just some thoughts.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 7:30:46 PM   
SirMIkeSD


Posts: 613
Joined: 3/16/2007
From: San Diego, Ca
Status: offline 		I expect politeness and common courtesy.  If blind submission is given with over eagerness this raises a red flag for me and I start woundering if the exchange is just "jack-off" material for them.

Mike


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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 7:37:58 PM   
bigskycountry


Posts: 43
Joined: 4/19/2007
From: montana
Status: offline 		Obedience? No. Due to the fact that the first submission  is the gateway to such a dynamic.
I shall now wax philosophical:
To quote the author Cormac McCarthy: "Between the wish and the thing, the world lies waiting." Upon an intersection wherein the device I come across functions properly, it is as much because I know instinctively how to utilize it as it is the purpose for its invention.

Anyway, I guess what I am getting at is that at first, it's interplay or indulgence. Sometimes it leads to a connection and an extension of respect or tolerance. Sometimes it leads to a diversion of attitude and desire.

The world lies waiting, indeed.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 7:47:29 PM   
imthatacheyouhav


Posts: 1259
Joined: 4/16/2007
Status: offline 		in my case it wasnt demanded. it was however offered

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 8:01:07 PM   
junecleaver


Posts: 1145
Joined: 4/6/2005
Status: offline 		It wasn't demanded upfront.  It was obvious that I wanted to obey anyway.  When we got to a bump in the road, he would ask me, 'Who do you want to be in control?'  Instead of demanding I obey him, he only needed to remind me that obeying him was what I really wanted.  It was sort of annoying because it's like having your innermost desires exposed and used against you!  Like 'Yes, I want you to be in control.  But does that really have to involve wooden spoons?'

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 8:15:55 PM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		I demand a certain level of obedience right away.  Obedience and submission do not have to necessarily happen at the same time.  And since I am sure that isnt going to make sense to everyone else... I'll explain.
I do not bark out orders from the getgo. Hell I dont do that farther in, just ask Angel.
HOWEVER I do expect that if I tell you to email/call me at a certain time, you will do so. If you do not, I tell you right off that I expect an explination why you did not email or call when I specified if you agreed to the time. I consider that obedience. Yes, common courtesy as well, but obedient none the less.  I tend to use their ability to follow that very simple demand as an indicator of whether or not they are going to be worth my time pursuing anything else.

DV

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VampiresLair

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 8:31:11 PM   
OedipusRexIt


Posts: 634
Joined: 11/15/2005
Status: offline 		No. 

I find it amusing that many do, and telling that many submissives here seem to expect it.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/23/2007 9:57:14 PM   
szobras


Posts: 435
Joined: 9/18/2006
Status: offline 		Obedience is what I require of my submissive.
IMO, a "demand" is not valid without authority, and that does not begin until agreed opon that I have that authority.
Validations of further consideration, intent to obey and please me, may show from resonable requests after time when getting to know someone. Still , it is because they have choosen to, not because I have demanded.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 2:05:59 AM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline 		Lately, I've been having most skip the "friends" stage and just apply to be a slave, so, yes.

It seems frowned upon, to have slaves obeying you before you collar them.  I think it's silly to be so prejustice.. if a slave wants to give her obidience at first sight, why stop her? 

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 7:05:41 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		I think what you mean by obedience is more than the subtle offers of it that a woman offers up to someone she feels and likes the dominant energy flowing out of someone. 

I tend to slowly ratchet up the orders, but I liken it to a dance and each is unique.  I have yanked women to their knees at first meetings, fucked others, and simply listened to many more.  

I think for me the best way to say it is I strive to take a bit less than openly given and to take a bit more than offered.  That isn't as clear as I wish it could be.  If a woman is being polite, meaning the obedience is coming from a place of respect, I take less than offered.  If that obedience is coming from a place of submission, I sometimes take more.  That isn't out of some lofty philosophy, it is entirely cynical and the goal is to make them melt.  I have blown it both by being too nice and recently by taking too much.  Probably should have gotten slapped and yelled at, would have been better than the drama that ensued.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 7:57:13 AM   
Celeste43


Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: junecleaver

Like 'Yes, I want you to be in control.  But does that really have to involve wooden spoons?'


Lol. I keep threatening to use the damn things as kindling in the fireplace!

He wasn't interested in blind obedience then and he still isn't. He'd rather I uphold the spirit of the law and not the letter. And he wants not an outward show of obedience but instead he wants me to feel perfectly comfortable putting my heart and soul in his hands. Emotional transparency.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 8:19:56 AM   
MistressNoName


Posts: 664
Joined: 10/26/2006
Status: offline 		This is always an interesting point to consider. As one who is actively looking I can honestly say that I have a general methodology I employ but it is catered to the particular personality and needs of whichever individual I'm working with. I don't demand obedience, but I do make it clear that I expect certain things. Like one person said, I expect for a submissive to make an effort, a real effort. I expect honesty and real communication. And I expect that a submissive will be true to his word. If it becomes apparent that this is not within the sub, then he is dropped. But as for this concept of blind obedience, I do not believe it's wise for any submissive to give that. One should be able to reason out precisely why one obeys another. And a Dom/me must earn the trust it takes in order to be obeyed.


MNN

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 10:25:32 AM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline 		I Inspire obedience in potential subs. It's part of how I know that I am dominant, rather than simply sadistic. It's also part of how I know that there's the right sort of chemistry with someone for me to want to play with them. If someone dosen't want to do as I tell them, it dosen't bother me in the slightest. I have no authority over them. If someone wants to play, but dosen't seem very obedient, I chalk them up to a one-night-stand sort of person, and usually politely decline (unless I'm at a party or otherwise feeling social).

For the most part, I don't demand anything, except in a petulant whiny having-a-bad-day adult tantrum sort of way, and then I usually recover my composure and shamefacedly apologize to all and sundry for having behaved like a child.

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Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 11:05:11 AM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline 		Obedience is kind of a broad subject.

If I were to ask someone on the first day of meeting them, to obediently turn over all their money and possessions, any rational human being is not going to obey.

If I were to ask someone to get me a glass of water on the first day of meeting and they were to not obey, then I would be seriosuly questioning whether this is gonna work out or not.

There really isnt a simple answer to what I would expect...since it depends on a lot of factors.

Much like respect though, I beleive, to a degree, that obedience cant be demanded...though I can certainly expect a certain amount.

Much in the same way I dont demand any particular level of respect, but I expect, at least, for them not to refer to me as a shithead or some other derogatory term during every conversation.

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 11:25:28 AM   
SirDominic


Posts: 711
Joined: 11/22/2006
Status: offline 		this had me wondering - are you seeking instant obedience before actually "getting to know" your potential submissive or are you actually knowing your submissive before seeking her/his obedience?

As for myself, I never demand anything. Demanding is a forced form of power play, far as I am concerned.

I expect obedience, which is a very different thing. It starts from the moment the relationship begins and continues for as long as it lasts. My expectations are always clear, never confusing. As the relationship is forming, the expectations are simple things, little tests to see how she reacts. What I expect grows as we grow together into a deeper more meaningful union.

If, for whatever reason, a woman cannot meet my expectations, I'm not going to waste my time trying to make demands. Either she is comfortable enough with me to accept what I expect from her, or we are not meant for each other. Others may enjoy those kinds of power plays, but that is not what I am looking for. My expectations flow like a stream of energy in her direction; I look for a willingness and eagerness to return that energy back to me in the form of her submission. Slowly increasing over time to an intense, passion of our desires merging with each other.

Namaste, Sir Dominic

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 7:25:15 PM   
sambamanslilgirl


Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		thank you for your replies - i for one must be comfortable and safe before fully obedient to anyone (trust issues) ...this where the "getting to know" me part comes into play. i don't blindly obey however i will be curteous and nice.

_____________________________

...2011 - year of the fabulous rock star life ...and i do it so well...


...announcing Mr. & Mrs. British Petrol ...yeah, marrying into oil is slick business...

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RE: Do you demand obedience automatically? - 4/24/2007 7:52:38 PM   
WhippingPostNY


Posts: 46
Joined: 9/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

are you seeking instant obedience before actually "getting to know" your potential submissive


Absolutely not!  Now do it!

WP

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In a bedroom locked ... whispers soft. Refusal. And then ... surrender.

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