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RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/2/2007 9:55:52 PM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Just to contribute a data point. $17,000US gets you:

CATERPILLAR XQ GENSETS:

TRAILER-MOUNTED, SOUND ATTENUATED PACKAGES, EACH WITH WEATHERPROOF ENCLOSURE, CRITICAL GRADE EXHAUST SYSTEM, AIR INLET LOUVERS WITH AIR INTAKE BAFFLES, CHARGING ALTERNATOR, ELECTRIC START, RADIATOR, FAN, FAN DRIVE, SAFETY SHUTDOWNS, CATERPILLAR GENERATOR END, BATTERY CHARGER, AUTO OR MANUAL START, ELECTRONIC GOVERNOR, 110 VOLT GFI RECEPTACLE, AND DUAL CIRCUIT BREAKER.

MULTI-VOLTAGE 60 HERTZ: 277/480 VOLT 3 PHASE, 120/240 VOLT 3 PHASE, 120/208 VOLT 3 PHASE, OR 120/240 VOLT SINGLE PHASE.

XQ105 3,000 TO 6,000 HOURS $17,000.00 TO $23,000.00

That's 105KW, btw...

weeeeeellll i sorta like this one tho... it has a 350 chevy souped up a bit LOL 75 kw which is 25 more than i can pump back on to the line with my present service anyway... but what is important is that it has the switch gear and live monitoring so it runs online continuously and auto syncs with the grid so it will automatically put any power i do not use into the grid, up to the setpoint.

i have to haul it into my basement, put a radiator outside, also a an auto valve to go through the hydronic floor heating system in the winter, the engine gen will be convestion cooled in the basement in winter and louvered out in summer, the hydrogen convertors will also have dual intercoolers, the exhaust will be recirculated.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

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Post #: 21

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/2/2007 10:19:18 PM

CuriousLord

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Didn't you want to get off the grid to stop relying on gas..? I'm pretty sure the generators you may be looking at would likely run off some sort of gas..

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 22

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 5:35:59 AM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Didn't you want to get off the grid to stop relying on gas..? I'm pretty sure the generators you may be looking at would likely run off some sort of gas..

yah heat and hydrogen both, off gas and making my own juice both. car too, no gas. (well hybrid till i get the on demand control system fine tuned.) you know the technology the gov says cant be done? They talk about it somewhere in that movie that posted in the OP. That is "how they are using it on the oil rigs" LMFAO (but i am sure everyone wrote it off by the mere mention of illuminati and did not bother to watch it)

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 23

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 5:41:56 AM

FLFunTop

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Just to clarify some things here U-238 is weapond grade material, but if you were wanting to terorize or invade with out that nasty 200 year fall out then simply charge up some sodium or potasium in a regular reactor and the fallout is less then 3 days no fuss no muss

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 24

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 5:45:25 AM

farglebargle

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From: Albany, NY
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"Just to clarify some things here U-238 is weapond grade material,"

Actually U-238 is an isotope ( GO 'TOPES! ) of Uranium, which when concentrated, has this useful property of REALLY not liking to be compressed too tightly.

"Enriched" U-238 is weapons grade material.

"Un-Enriched" U-238 is not.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to FLFunTop)

Post #: 25

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 6:28:50 AM

samboct

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Umm, Fargle- right idea, wrong isotope. U-235 is the fissionable material- U-238 doesn't do much of anything. "Enriched" uranium is a mixture of U-235 and U-238 with an extra dollop of U-235. U-235 is what can hit critical mass. Most uranium- like 99.5% or so is U-238.

In terms of passive detection- I wish. U-235 is pretty silent- doesn't emit much at all. Makes it hard to detect unless you're using neutrons- and neutron detectors kinda zorch living things. You could carry a U-235 bomb past most of the detectors in an airport (and I think Canada's ahead of the US on this one by the way- Homeland Security seems to be the same bunch of clods that came up with the wonderful Katrina response -if you have an IQ higher than a moron, don't bother to apply for a job.) and nothing would happen. Airport detectors work for dirty bombs though- probably a more credible threat.

In terms of size of bombs-well- the first a-bombs were pretty big-the bomb bay of a B-29 had to be modified- and they weighed upwards of 10,000 lbs. This is a pretty big suitcase, even for King Kong. (Hiroshima was U-235, Nagasaki was Pu-239 IIRC) Bear in mind that most people that died in these attacks died of the fires started by the bombs, not the radiation or blast effects.

Available atomic weapons-two types, fission (WWII era) and fusion- 1950s Bikini Atoll tests. The really scary thing is the 50 lb fusion bomb of approx. suitcase size. These were on MIRV missiles and were at least an order of magnitude more powerful than the Hiroshima bomb. However, they are very, very tough to build and design- not happening in towelhead land unless they "liberate" one of the ones from Russia. And has been pointed out, these bombs need maintenance, but even a 1/4 size blast is nothing to sneeze at. I have no idea about how good the tracking and destruction of these weapons has been- since one hasn't gone off, I suspect that it's not so terrible.

Older- and easier to build- in the 50's everything was going nuclear- so a lot of the nukes in the arsenal back then consisted of artillery shells or little rockets (Honest John)- don't know about the atomic bazooka or the Polish atomic hand grenade. (not a PC comment today- I plead historical context.) These weapons were considerably smaller and less powerful than the Hiroshima bomb (which IIRC was 50 kilotons or so) Could one of them be built? Don't know, but I suspect that it took some trial and error- so unless the terrorist had plans or one to copy- probably not.

In one of the examples of possible urban myth- Princeton undergrad came up with a nuke bomb (fission, not fusion device) from reading the available literature that could be built in the on-campus machine shop. The bright laddies at Lawrence Livermore looked at the design and pronounced it sound- only problem was where to get the U-235. However, I don't think this was suitcase sized. Also don't think it was as powerful as the Hiroshima bomb.

So cheer up! Even if the towelheads do build a bomb, it's only likely to kill 10,000 people instead of a million or more. And given the way they operate (large numbers of individual cells- very hard to work together on a big project), it seems very unlikely.

Sam

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 26

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:41:09 AM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Didn't you want to get off the grid to stop relying on gas..? I'm pretty sure the generators you may be looking at would likely run off some sort of gas..

cl you are spinning your wheels here.

it is setup for a propane carb which requires virtually no mods to use hydrogen in. you have to get out of that conservation of energy in a depleting mode only mindset to fully realize what is being said here.

If this were mobile i woudl use 12 voilts but it is not so i will use the line voltage and crack the hydrogen to run the chevy, then once the chevy is running and producing 50kw i can make enough hydrogen to literally heat everyhouse on the block if i made it big enough.

i do not remember which thread but i posted a little demo, and that is enough hydrogen to run your lawnmower all day using just a few watts input.(way less than the lawnmower would put out if running a generator)

watch the videos i post and the one in the OP of this post where they talk about the oil rigs. i really am trying to help with global warming issue here as well as save peole money but its like trying to pull a cat by the tail across a carpet with you guys.

We can go round and round on this forever if you are stuck in the depletion of energy thing as being the god of all.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 27

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:56:07 AM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Didn't you want to get off the grid to stop relying on gas..? I'm pretty sure the generators you may be looking at would likely run off some sort of gas..

present for ya

this is at about 40 - 50 watts input, this is another guys rig not mine, mine is simpler, but it is a great pic to show it off.

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/nine_one_one/hydrogengeneration.jpg

It should be quite obvious to you that is some serious hydrogen generation at very low cost.

they are teaching you revisionist science you know. :)

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 28

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 2:55:51 PM

kentaro1980

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Joined: 12/9/2004
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So...You need how much energy to create hydrogen to keep that generator running? I mean unless I am mistaken, you are planning to build a perpetuum mobile, is that right?
Via Electrolysis you split ordinary water into Hydrogen and oxygen and then burn the hydrogen in that generator to produce electricity. Hydrogen has a much lower energy than gasoline, volumewise speaking... a hydrogen car has a 2-3 times higher consumption than the same car running on gasoline (Look up BMW 750hl. with gasoline: 15.2 liters / 100km, with hydrogen: 35,7 liters / 100km....and for the metric impaired ;-) -> 15.6mpg with gasoline vs 6.7 mpg with hydrogen)
So you can expect your generator to consume twice the amount of hydrogen..give or take.
On top of that, you need to multiply that number with the efficiency of your generator. An efficiency of 75% means (unless i'm totally on the wrong track) that for every gallon of hydrogen you burn up, you effectively only get the potential energy of 3 quarts of hydrogen.

As for the mentioning of terrorist attacks. Last summer i worked for a cleaning company (among others) and it is amazingly simple to produce chlorine gas by using 2 very common and not difficult to obtain cleaning agents. Breathe deep.

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 29

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 3:24:03 PM

CuriousLord

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Four things.

1. It's very hard for me to understand the things you say. I'd ask you type with a bit more grammar.. you abridge a lot, which is fine, I do it too, but, without punctuation, it comes out as a garbled mess. At least, in replies to me.

2. I'm not sure what any of this has to do with you not wanting to be oil-reliant. Using hydrogen produced, in part, from the power from oil is still using oil.

3. You don't have to tell me things like "this set up is enough to do <such and such>". You can just give the numbers, ratings, or measurements- I'm keenly aware of such things and can likely derive more from it.

4. I just skinned my hand twenty minutes ago. This has nothing to do with you, but I'm watching it still bleed, and wanted to whine about it to someone.

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 30

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 7:55:47 PM

Real0ne

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Ok first i have to correct myself, i got the two designs mixed up. that reaction in that last pic i posted was really closer to 250 watts... oops...

But you can run a 5 horse lawn mower all day woth the amount it puts out.

1 hp = 746 watts and even after all the efficiencies are put in we are still way ahead and over unity. so all that is needed is upscale till you get it large enough to run whatever engine you want to run.

oh and that is not the supercharged hydrogen you are talking about eith btw, which is several magnitudes more explosive, can look at rocket booster design for the space shuttle. they use it there.

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/3/2007 7:57:42 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to kentaro1980)

Post #: 31

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:00:44 PM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Four things.

1. It's very hard for me to understand the things you say. I'd ask you type with a bit more grammar.. you abridge a lot, which is fine, I do it too, but, without punctuation, it comes out as a garbled mess. At least, in replies to me.

2. I'm not sure what any of this has to do with you not wanting to be oil-reliant. Using hydrogen produced, in part, from the power from oil is still using oil.

3. You don't have to tell me things like "this set up is enough to do <such and such>". You can just give the numbers, ratings, or measurements- I'm keenly aware of such things and can likely derive more from it.

4. I just skinned my hand twenty minutes ago. This has nothing to do with you, but I'm watching it still bleed, and wanted to whine about it to someone.

well i have to lubricate the engine with something.

you know that is his design so i cant tell yhou every intimate detail about it, mine is different and i am still waiting for the final parts to come in but it produces substantially more hydrogen than his does.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 32

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:04:43 PM

CuriousLord

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You do realize that hydrogen is very simple to make through electrolysis, correct?

Hell, my freshman year in an Engineering club, we did one of the more popular newbie engineering projects. Got a model car that ran on a hydrogen engine and a solar panel that conducted electrolysis to store up hydrogen in its battery.

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 33

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:05:58 PM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

You do realize that hydrogen is very simple to make through electrolysis, correct?

Hell, my freshman year in an Engineering club, we did one of the more popular newbie engineering projects. Got a model car that ran on a hydrogen engine and a solar panel that conducted electrolysis to store up hydrogen in its battery.

yeh thats why i cant figure out why you seem to be having such a hard taim with thisw?

so now it all comes together and you see how easy it will be right? i did sort of switch horses and decided to just build a hydrogen generator setup and use that rather than go the reactor route too. the i nixed the reactor it would have costed me more over the long run to ultimately accomplish the same thing i can this way

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/3/2007 8:13:25 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 34

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:17:22 PM

CuriousLord

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Buddy, all this time, you've been talking about cold fusion.. which is a mythical nuclear reaction.. you've provided links to cold fusion sites and documents..

Hydrogen power is something very different. But, this is what I think you still need to consider.

-You're talking about using a hydrogen car to avoid spending money on gas.
-You're going to produce the hydrogen for that car from a generator that runs off gas.
Do you see where I'm going witht his? It seems a bit silly to me.

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 35

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:36:20 PM

Real0ne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Buddy, all this time, you've been talking about cold fusion.. which is a mythical nuclear reaction.. you've provided links to cold fusion sites and documents..

Hydrogen power is something very different. But, this is what I think you still need to consider.

-You're talking about using a hydrogen car to avoid spending money on gas.
-You're going to produce the hydrogen for that car from a generator that runs off gas.
Do you see where I'm going witht his? It seems a bit silly to me.

i know that is why i pointed it out. i just wanted to make it clear that the reactor is not the best way to do what i wanted to do. it would take more equipment and more maintenance etc... anyway..

i do not get what your gas insinuation is? yeh it will run on hydrogen gas so yes it will run on gas but it will take me off of gasoline and it will take me off of the gris so what are you driving at? That i will burn gas-oline to make hydrogen? no i will burn hydrogen to make hydrogen lol

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 36

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:40:05 PM

CuriousLord

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Okay.. ditching the cold fusion thing was a good idea. You might still be reluctant to admit it, but that thing was full of crap and you know it. I'm glad you have enough of a head on your shoulders to do that, too.

Alright.. I have a hard time making out the stuff you type.
So, you need hydrogen.
-Are you getting it from somewhere else? If so, where?
-Are you making it? If so, with what energy source?

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 37

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 8:53:56 PM

Real0ne

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Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Okay.. ditching the cold fusion thing was a good idea. You might still be reluctant to admit it, but that thing was full of crap and you know it. I'm glad you have enough of a head on your shoulders to do that, too.

Alright.. I have a hard time making out the stuff you type.
So, you need hydrogen.
-Are you getting it from somewhere else? If so, where?
-Are you making it? If so, with what energy source?

first nothing of you said has any bearing on my nixing the reactor, it was purely more cost effective to go this route and that was why i made that determination.

ok lets make this really simple. go out and get a generator set, say a nice 5 kw genset, use it to make the hydrogen to run and make the juice for more hydrogen.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 38

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 9:11:34 PM

CuriousLord

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Joined: 4/3/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
first nothing of you said has any bearing on my nixing the reactor, it was purely more cost effective to go this route and that was why i made that determination.

Hehe, I like the word 'nix'. Alright, I'll just take your word for it the "reactor" you're talking about being mythical had no bearing on your decision not to use it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

ok lets make this really simple.

Never feel a need to 'make thins simple' for me. Just state your point and case. I'm very good at putting things together.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
go out and get a generator set, say a nice 5 kw genset, use it to make the hydrogen to run and make the juice for more hydrogen.

Okay.. so you're talking about making hydrogen from a generator- which is running on still, as of yet unindetitifed fuel- to make hydrogen. Then this generator will use that hydrogen it's just made to continue making more hydrogen?

I would encourage you to consider that a generator running on hydrogen can, at 100% efficiency, only make as much as it's consumed. However, this is never the case, as we don't have 100% efficiency things, and it will make less than it consumes each time, until, eventually, it's too low on any to run at all.
It will never produce any net hydrogen.

< Message edited by CuriousLord -- 5/3/2007 9:12:01 PM >

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 39

RE: Ok So Suitcase Nukes Are Real After All? - 5/3/2007 9:31:02 PM

Real0ne

Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

I would encourage you to consider that a generator running on hydrogen can, at 100% efficiency, only make as much as it's consumed. However, this is never the case, as we don't have 100% efficiency things, and it will make less than it consumes each time, until, eventually, it's too low on any to run at all.
It will never produce any net hydrogen.

ok suffice to say we disagree on the reactor that makes neither you right nor me wrong.

ok once again.

i will start the genset, that means by puilling the cord.
hydrogen will be sucked into the cylinder, it will explode and the engine will turn using hydrogen as its fuel.
when the engine turns the generator will turn, thus producing electrictywhich will produce and endless amount of hydrogen as long as you keep it filled with water.

you are wrong, i gave you numbers already that shows that you are wrong.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Ok first i have to correct myself, i got the two designs mixed up. that reaction in that last pic i posted was really closer to 250 watts... oops...

But you can run a 5 horse lawn mower all day woth the amount it puts out.

1 hp = 746 watts and even after all the efficiencies are put in we are still way ahead and over unity. so all that is needed is upscale till you get it large enough to run whatever engine you want to run.

Thats why i do not understand your questioning here? i mean quick math says that if i can load up a 5 hp motor on that amount of hydrogen that motor is putting out a full 5hp.

doing the math 5hp = 3730 watts if the generator was 100 % efficient which it is not.

so 100*(300/3730)= 8%

So are you trying to say that the generator is less than 8% efficient?

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/3/2007 9:56:29 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 40

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