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hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:34:27 PM   
soultoshare


Posts: 519
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		Hello All.  i have a question that has been rnunning thru my mind, and i'd like some input prior to approaching my Sir about them.  (We are still in the early bonding stages of our relationship, He has said that now is the time for my questions.)

He has told me that my hard limits have no bearing on punishment.  By this, he means that regardless of what my hard limits are, he will not honor them when i am to be punished.

Is this something that is normal or prevalent among Masters?  Should i be concerned about this?  All input, Master or sub, will be greatly appreciated.

m
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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:36:11 PM   
imthatacheyouhav


Posts: 1259
Joined: 4/16/2007
Status: offline 		I was under the impression a hard limit was just that...a hard limit...i would have serious issues with this....if it were me....

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(in reply to soultoshare)
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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:44:27 PM   
szobras


Posts: 435
Joined: 9/18/2006
Status: offline 		For me, there is no limit in regards to questions in a stage of a relationship.Questions should be asked and addressed, throughout. As far as not respecting and honoring your hard limits using any justification,  punishment, or otherwise. Absolutely Not. But that's just me, it depends on the agreement  between the two of you.
~edited for addition~
If perhaps the statement is being used as a "scare" tactic.(Similar to letting you know just what may in store should you get punished. Some consequences mean more than others to some.) Still, I would find it to be completely unacceptable , and show unreliability of words and actions.

< Message edited by szobras -- 5/23/2007 1:27:26 PM >

(in reply to soultoshare)
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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:51:39 PM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline 		I handle limits somewhat diffrently and as such My comments may not be relevent to this situation.

My girl didn't set any limits.... instead she helped Me start to build the information I needed to set MY limits in regard to her.

The way I see 'hard limit' is something that would HARM My girl, causing lasting damage (Not simply physical). These *I* consider no-go areas because I may hurt what is Mine but I won't HARM what is Mine.

"Soft limits" are areas where I know she has difficulty, where I can expect compliance but know she will struggle to do so and where a litte extra care and patience on My part is likely to be helpful in getting the result *I* want.

So no, like hell would *I* use hard limits as punishment. If you trust His duty of care and know He isn't going to HARM you, then you are probably OK, but if you haven't got that trust... I'd advise caution... a LOT of caution!


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This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:52:05 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		You should only be concerned if you don't want him crossing your hard limits.

Anyone looking for an "out" to do stuff to you when they've said "OK I won't do that stuff to you" isn't worth a second glance. 

Punishment isn't a convenient excuse for someone to ignore their commitments.

A lot of doms will say and do a lot of things- what matters only is what YOU agree to do and what they have told you that you can expect from them.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:53:29 PM   
SirRober


Posts: 364
Joined: 1/2/2006
Status: offline 		2 Things
1  Hard limts are there for your and or his comfort level.

2 Are any of your hard limits because you don't know/haven't expercinced said thing yet??

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 12:53:50 PM   
drawntothedark


Posts: 572
Joined: 10/19/2006
From: Arkansas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: soultoshare

Hello All.  i have a question that has been rnunning thru my mind, and i'd like some input prior to approaching my Sir about them.  (We are still in the early bonding stages of our relationship, He has said that now is the time for my questions.)

He has told me that my hard limits have no bearing on punishment.  By this, he means that regardless of what my hard limits are, he will not honor them when i am to be punished.

Is this something that is normal or prevalent among Masters?  Should i be concerned about this?  All input, Master or sub, will be greatly appreciated.

m


I am not a Master but I do have something to say on this subject.

First off - how does knowing your hard limites will be used against you make you feel. You have a right to choose not to be with him.

Second - it is my understanding that hard limites are those things you will NOT do. Which means in my thinking they are not an option, not open for discussion and simply not going to happen.

If he is not going to respect them.....then perhaps you should think about that.

Now if you two have a diffrent defination of a hard limit or a relationship where he can access them when he wants, then obviously my thinking would not work here. However, if you don't want to do it then don't.


(in reply to soultoshare)
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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:02:56 PM   
mstrjx


Posts: 2045
Joined: 11/27/2005
Status: offline 		I don;t know.  For some reason, 'absurd' and 'moron' come to mind.

But I shouldn't judge.

Jeff

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Know thyself. It's the best gift you can ever give yourself.

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:21:51 PM   
YourShyPet


Posts: 185
Joined: 6/30/2006
Status: offline 		I've always thought of Hard Limits in this way...

That either..
A)  It is something a person really really doesn't like doing.... or
B)  It is something that perhaps might be connected to something damaging in their past

For me it's never mattered if it was A or B... but as RavenMuse put it a .... no go ..... place.

kittin

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:22:48 PM   
mrbob726


Posts: 155
Joined: 4/15/2007
From: Illinois
Status: offline 		A hard limit is just that - a hard limit - and nothing excuses exceeding it



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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:36:58 PM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mrbob726

A hard limit is just that - a hard limit - and nothing excuses exceeding it



That was going to be my reply verbatim

Here's something to ponder. It's a bit disgusting but I'm making a point.

Let's say that your hard limit is one of the "named taboo topics" here on the boards & Master says satisfying Fido is your punishment.... would you?



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MstrssPassion


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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:41:42 PM   
michaelOfGeorgia


Posts: 4253
Status: offline 		i agree, Hard Limits should never be crossed...ever.

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:53:01 PM   
soultoshare


Posts: 519
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you all for your input.  He has in fact used one of my hard limits as punishment already, however, it was one that more or less squicked me out, not damaged me. However, now there is the threat, (i hate that word!), of crossing an established  and AGREED upon hard limit, and that actually has me rethinking this whole thing.  As i myself in the past have advised others to follow their guts, it seems a little odd for me to be asking for advice, but since i'm still finding things out, i thought i'd ask.

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:54:48 PM   
MsKatHouston


Posts: 1909
Joined: 6/7/2006
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline 		I'm in the hard limits are not to be crossed for any reason camp.

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-Kat

~If you can't be a good example, you'll just have to serve as a horrible warning~

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 1:55:26 PM   
YourShyPet


Posts: 185
Joined: 6/30/2006
Status: offline 		I totally agree with the gut thing... I've always listen to mine, and it's yet to steer me wrong.

kittin

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 2:07:42 PM   
MissHarlet


Posts: 2728
Joined: 9/11/2005
From: El Paso , TX US
Status: offline 		First of all for me punishment is never in the form of pain .. but is never fun either and makes an impression.

Having said that, HARD limits are just that hard limits.  Not somethign you havent experienced .. something that is NEVER to happen .. and if someone is responsible they would respect those limits. 

Even NOT knowing the whole story I would advise leaving if you think your safety is compromised and even if it isnt would want lots of communication and rethinking time before you stayed in this.

_____________________________

Protectress of hearts/souls of all submissives calling Bounty's Place home, by order of Bounty~Proprietor

To be respected you must be respectful, to be loved you must be willing to love,
to be trusted you must be willing to trust.

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 2:08:08 PM   
slaveish


Posts: 1086
Joined: 2/19/2007
Status: offline 		Fast Reply

Assuming you have established your hard limits, your "Master" saying they have no bearing for any reason is absurd. Perhaps he has a good reason for saying so - I don't know since yours is the only side of the story here - but taking this as a black and white issue, it's hogwash.

_____________________________

You only lose what you cling to. ~~Gautama Sidharta

If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other. ~~Mother Teresa

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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 2:15:42 PM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

I don;t know.  For some reason, 'absurd' and 'moron' come to mind.


Oh I so agree.

But I would also like to ask the OP. Did you ever research Hard Limits what they are supposed to be and stand for?
If you didn't  mistake #1


_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 2:20:50 PM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: soultoshare

Thank you all for your input.  He has in fact used one of my hard limits as punishment already, however, it was one that more or less squicked me out, not damaged me. However, now there is the threat, (i hate that word!), of crossing an established  and AGREED upon hard limit, and that actually has me rethinking this whole thing.  As i myself in the past have advised others to follow their guts, it seems a little odd for me to be asking for advice, but since i'm still finding things out, i thought i'd ask.



What is your gut telling you? I bet you it is screaming loud & clear that this is not right.

Take a step back & think about it like this. Someone comes to you asking what you think about their Master using their hard limits as a form of punishment. What would be your initial reaction to hearing this?

I guess what it all boils down to is what do you consider a hard limit to be?

You said that the thing he already did to punish you was a hard limit but it was more like something that you just found to be kinda yucky.

You need to figure out what you feel are hard limits (absolute no-no's) & if these "no-no's" are ignored you need to establish what your course of action would be if they are not respected. If you aren't willing to back up this breach with the repercussion then do not expect them to be respected.

If you were to ask me a direct question such as:
What do you think about a Master who doesn't (or hasn't) respected hard limits? My answer would be that he/she is an abusive %$#*&@! that should not be trusted.

< Message edited by MstrssPassion -- 5/23/2007 2:24:48 PM >

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MstrssPassion


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RE: hard limits as punishment - 5/23/2007 2:26:36 PM   
soultoshare


Posts: 519
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		to all,

my hard limits aren't very many....really only the extreme things, no blood, scat, needles, piercings, tat's......i hate needles in any form.....watersports, and the one that is in jeopardy.....no woman to woman contact at all......which he had agreed to already.  i have no idea why he chose this for punishment, escpecially as he knows i am 110% straight, and has known from the start.  Whether or not he was actually going to do it, i don't know, but right now, i'm feeling betrayed and angry that he did.  He's out of state right now, and will be, so the only contact i have with him is sporadic e-mail.  Based on what his response is to the one i sent, this relationship will in all likelihood be over.  But i'll live......i have before.

I agree that punishment should not be about pain, that is actually his stance on it also.  But with what he is suggesting for punishment will only breed resentment on my part. 

i guess that i've pretty much answered my own question here.....just wanted to see if i was maybe harboring an unreal expectation on my part.

Thanks everyone!  As usual, great advice!

(in reply to swtnsparkling)
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