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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/18/2007 9:55:40 PM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		This couple has to make the decision to have this baby not because they get a certain amount of money but because their hearts are open to raising a life.  Abortions happen everyday and there's nothing anyone can do to stop them.  i don't believe in abortion but i would not want to force anyone to raise a child they did not want or adopt my personal ethics regarding this issue.  If i knew this couple personally i might help them, but to send money to an anonymous couple who puts an add on the internet is rather foolish in my estimation. 

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/18/2007 10:18:26 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
Wonderful just world, you can't afford to raise your baby, so give it to some people that waited too long chasing the almighty buck until their plumbing dried up and they became infertile... nice "choice" there...




Ouch.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/18/2007 11:07:04 PM   
NeedToUseYou


Posts: 2297
Joined: 12/24/2005
From: None of your business
Status: offline 		I just hope these scammers get a nice bullet in there brain, after being brutally beaten and tortured for weeks on end.

Give me your wallet or I'll kill the baby...... What the fuck ever. Pure trash.  I hope it's fake or else they are even worse.



(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/18/2007 11:18:08 PM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Wonderful just world, you can't afford to raise your baby, so give it to some people that waited too long chasing the almighty buck until their plumbing dried up and they became infertile... nice "choice" there...

Don't want your baby aborted, stop having sex dude


At least they would be alive. You would rather see them dead then with older parents?

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Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 1:34:19 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

http://www.helpmybabylive.com/


I want pro lifers to start adopting children.  Preferrably black crack babies.  Then I'll believe their rhetoric.

C~



And of course, some do.

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Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 1:37:47 AM   
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Joined: 3/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Wonderful just world, you can't afford to raise your baby, so give it to some people that waited too long chasing the almighty buck until their plumbing dried up and they became infertile... nice "choice" there...

Don't want your baby aborted, stop having sex dude


At least they would be alive. You would rather see them dead then with older parents?


Exactly.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 3:03:01 AM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		I think this is a total scam.  You know, the kind where people spin a sad story in order to get money from strangers.  

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 3:06:45 AM   
Level


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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I think this is a total scam.  You know, the kind where people spin a sad story in order to get money from strangers.  


I agree, Katy. They seem the kind of folks that have a good chance of either ending up on Jerry Springer, or America's Most Wanted.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 3:21:25 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveluci

If you honestly don't have a clue, no amount of explaining is going to make a dent


There's a saying that, if one cannot explain something to a nine-year-old, one does not understand the thing to be explained. Of course, adults are more likely to "block out" an explanation than kids are, but apart from that obstacle, I've found that it generally holds true for things like this as well.

Since I don't understand it, but would like to, and he doesn't understand it, but you do, why not try?


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"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 3:33:38 AM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		I'd be more impressed if this "grabber" text wasn't nearly verbatim from "The Complete Book of Model Fund-Raising Letters" (R. E. Kuniholm, Prentice-Hall, 1995 p.315). 

What I do find amusing is that people rail against this apparent scam on the one hand, and yet buy into some of the story posted on this website on the other.  Why does anyone assume the donation "counter" is accurate?  If I were running this scam I'd make sure that the donation level stayed low.  Why do people assume there is even a pregnant woman involved? 

The nicest touch to my mind is the assertion that they are not a not-for-profit and that donations are not tax deductible.  These statements take the scam out of the realm of two very powerful enforcers who might otherwise investigate:  State Attorney Generals, who use their powers to regulate charitable trusts all the time on these scams, and the IRS which could prosecute an illegitimate "charity".

E

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"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 7:11:12 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Wonderful just world, you can't afford to raise your baby, so give it to some people that waited too long chasing the almighty buck until their plumbing dried up and they became infertile... nice "choice" there...

Don't want your baby aborted, stop having sex dude


At least they would be alive. You would rather see them dead then with older parents?


If the biological parents did not want to keep the embryo around to be adopted out, take the time off work to have the embryo, deal with morning sickness, stretch marks, explaining to everyone they were giving away their offspring, I would rather those people had a choice not to bring the embryo to term. I am not for older people forcing young ones that are economically disadvantaged into providing them with heirs because they did not have their kids at the right time themselves...

Harsh, but the entire topic is harsh....

And I think that this website highlights this perfectly.... having kids is an economic endeavor that many can ill afford, this couple maybe scum... but they highlight the fact that the rich are not willing to help poor people keep their babies.. but they are more than happy to take the shiny newborns out of some crushed young woman's arms.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 7:29:47 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
If the biological parents did not want to keep the embryo around to be adopted out, take the time off work to have the embryo, deal with morning sickness, stretch marks, explaining to everyone they were giving away their offspring, I would rather those people had a choice not to bring the embryo to term. I am not for older people forcing young ones that are economically disadvantaged into providing them with heirs because they did not have their kids at the right time themselves...

Harsh, but the entire topic is harsh....


I'm still confused as to why you think those who want to adopt are not having their own because they waited too long due to financial gain?  I know my sister adopted after 6 miscarriages destroyed her fallopian tubes.  She began trying to have kids in her 20s...after all that agony, she adopted in her mid 30s. 

As for me, I was pretty much robbed of motherhood, but that's a different story.  I won't have kids now - adopted or otherwise - but for my own personal reasons having nothing to do with my plumbing going dry due to my pursuit of financial wealth.  I've always been an advocate of adoption over abortion, since in my 20s.  

I know I'm only a single example here, but you've made your comment more than once now, and it does seem a gross generalization, and to be honest, quite painful to those who are not as you describe.  While you may be accurate that some people waited "too long,"  I still don't see the issue of why it's a bad thing for them to now adopt? 

Anyway, off to work...enjoy the discussion, everyone!

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Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 7:38:55 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

I'm still confused as to why you think those who want to adopt are not having their own because they waited too long due to financial gain?  I know my sister adopted after 6 miscarriages destroyed her fallopian tubes.  She began trying to have kids in her 20s...after all that agony, she adopted in her mid 30s. 



I am not going to say "all". I have a sister with fertility problems her entire life also, but many people put off having children to pursue a career, and then their clock started ticking and it was too late to have their own offspring. Now this is not a universal, but it is rather common.

Infertility is up for all age groups, but every year after 30 it becomes increasingly likely that people will become infertile. Because these people have no kids they are more free to pursue economic priorities instead of familial ones... meaning that childless people usually make more money.

I am so against forcing young women to bear kids for rich people to adopt, especially when those rich people have plenty of handicapped kids they could be adopting, or kids that are older... but they want the shiny newborn to take home and love....The idea that we will force women to give birth because there are all these people wanting to adopt is just ridiculous... my sister is in the process of adopting a shiny newborn... she could have a child older than 2 in half the time, but she does not want the older child, she wants the shiny newborn.  Now I am not judging her for the desire to have a brand new baby, but I also know that the birth mother made a choice about it too.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 7:52:46 AM   
slaveluci


Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad
There's a saying that, if one cannot explain something to a nine-year-old, one does not understand the thing to be explained. Of course, adults are more likely to "block out" an explanation than kids are, but apart from that obstacle, I've found that it generally holds true for things like this as well.
Since I don't understand it, but would like to, and he doesn't understand it, but you do, why not try?

Hello Aswad,
I don't believe that you, of all people, don't "understand" why it's not appropriate to pay crack-addicted people to go get sterilized.  I can try to explain my feelings about this but I really don't have the time or energy to get into a moral debate about it.  People with addictions - to crack or any other mind-altering substance - are not exactly in the right frame of mind to make life-changing decisions such as to whether or not to get sterilized.  And to assume that they are some lower life form who SHOULD be sterilized is, in my mind, akin to the eugenics and ethnic cleansing used by the Nazis (though not based on ethnicity, of course). 

To me it is the height of arrogance to take it upon yourself to decide that crackheads should all be sterilized and so you go out and offer them money (the one thing they are most desperate for) in order to get them to do so.  What if they were to actually go through with it and then got clean and straightened their lives out and regretted it?  There's just no way anyone can justify such behavior to me.  I think there's lots of folks who shouldn't breed but it's not necessarily based on the fact that they are currently battling addictions that they may eventually overcome.  I don't know what to say.  I'm just kind of rambling because I just can't imagine that anyone could really defend that.  Wanna take a stab at it?.............luci

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 8:04:54 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle in " Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up."

http://www.helpmybabylive.com/


It's disheartening you would post such a scam, farglebargle.


You have *evidence* to back up your claim?



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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 8:07:23 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou

I just hope these scammers get a nice bullet in there brain, after being brutally beaten and tortured for weeks on end.




Fucking hell.

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 8:10:19 AM   
kiyari


Posts: 631
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Pro Choice or Pro Life? Hmmmmm is there an Anti-choice or a Pro Death camp? Ahhh the abortion thing, which is only a symptom of unwanted pregnancies. If unwanted pregnancies are the cause, how many Pro Lifers are doing something to prevent unwanted pregnancies? Not sure why I wonder these things when they come up because I am definately in the Choice Life Camp.

Orion


It has been my observation as well,
that the vocal 'pro-life' (anti-choice) groups
are generally also vocally against contraception and even sex-ed.

As if babies are punishment (to the woman/girl)
or as if fetuses are somehow sacred (and screw the born; 
the born are someone else's headache... or was that, punishment)

To some great degree,
one's perception of what it may mean to 'abort' a fetus,
hinges upon one's beliefs regarding life, afterlife, souls and such.

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Black Water Dragon

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 8:14:10 AM   
kiyari


Posts: 631
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

I would like a crack baby.


No crack babies for you either!

God it feels good to deny.



ROFLMAO!!!

Thank you both! *wiping tears*

_____________________________

Black Water Dragon

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Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 8:25:02 AM   
kiyari


Posts: 631
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveluci

People with addictions - to crack or any other mind-altering substance - are not exactly in the right frame of mind to make life-changing decisions such as to whether or not to get sterilized.  And to assume that they are some lower life form who SHOULD be sterilized is, in my mind, akin to the eugenics and ethnic cleansing used by the Nazis (though not based on ethnicity, of course). 

To me it is the height of arrogance to take it upon yourself to decide that crackheads should all be sterilized and so you go out and offer them money (the one thing they are most desperate for) in order to get them to do so.  What if they were to actually go through with it and then got clean and straightened their lives out and regretted it?  There's just no way anyone can justify such behavior to me.  I think there's lots of folks who shouldn't breed but it's not necessarily based on the fact that they are currently battling addictions that they may eventually overcome.  I don't know what to say.  I'm just kind of rambling because I just can't imagine that anyone could really defend that.  Wanna take a stab at it?.............luci


Meth is an addiction that drives some to sell their bodies for a fix.
Fertile females who do this may concieve.
If the fetus survives to term, it may well be born addicted.

Or... the lady may opt to abort

Neither of these are wonderful things

I think that 'recovery' from meth addiction is... low

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Black Water Dragon

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RE: Pro-lifers. Put up or Shut up. - 6/19/2007 8:26:48 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		As if 'pro-choice' meant 'anti-life'!



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