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I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 11:58:41 AM

palerose

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/25/2007
Status: offline

Okay so it's not exactly groundbreaking, but I'm new, so I'm gonna throw it out there again

Do you every wonder as Doms, if you are just doing what all men want to do? You can have your woman do whatever you want her to do; if you want more than one woman you can have them, you can have sex anyway you want, and someone to clean up for you if you want!

This is why I think Doms are special. You deserve to have subs to do all this for you because you are careful and have learnt how to give her what she wants in return. You take everything, without taking advantage.

An example of 'normal' relationships to compare BDSM to: Domestic abuse. People beating their partners because they have not done what they wanted them to do, or in mere frustration..or the barage of other reasons....
Sure physical violence is an aspect of BDSM, a pretty big one!!But in the most part it is designed specifically NOT to cause any real harm to the sub.

I'm a total newbie, just wanting to get more involved in discussing the lifestyle to help me learn how to live it and to generally broaden my horizons

Also I know Doms have male subs aswell, I'm just writing this from my p.of v, that is male Dom and female sub.

Also I realise this is a very rambling message...will do better in future

palerose x

Post #: 1

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 12:25:01 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose
Do you every wonder as Doms, if you are just doing what all men want to do? You can have your woman do whatever you want her to do; if you want more than one woman you can have them, you can have sex anyway you want, and someone to clean up for you if you want!

Considering I know plenty of men who
a) don't want to be dominants in relationships
b) don't want more than one woman

then you've got some issues right there. As well, vanillas can have sex any way they want, too.

quote:

This is why I think Doms are special. You deserve to have subs to do all this for you because you are careful and have learnt how to give her what she wants in return. You take everything, without taking advantage.

You've got a false idea of doms- plenty of doms are ignorant loser assholes.

And what you describe is a healthy RELATIONSHIP- not Ds or vanilla.

quote:

An example of 'normal' relationships to compare BDSM to: Domestic abuse. People beating their partners because they have not done what they wanted them to do, or in mere frustration..or the barage of other reasons....
Sure physical violence is an aspect of BDSM, a pretty big one!!But in the most part it is designed specifically NOT to cause any real harm to the sub.

You don't think there are abusive bdsm relationships?

What you most need to realize is that people in bdsm are EXACTLY LIKE people NOT in bdsm. Same issues, same personalities, same fears, joys, fuck ups and more.

What makes us different? Only our personal relationship orientation.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 2

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 12:32:25 PM

earthycouple

Posts: 4462
Joined: 2/19/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose

Okay so it's not exactly groundbreaking, but I'm new, so I'm gonna throw it out there again

Do you every wonder as Doms, if you are just doing what all men want to do? My male slave would disagree with you. You can have your woman do whatever you want her to do; if you want more than one woman you can have them, you can have sex anyway you want, and someone to clean up for you if you want! Um....no...only if the relationship is poly and both agree. Not to mention the dynamic of each relationship.

This is why I think Doms are special. You deserve to have subs to do all this for you because you are careful and have learnt how to give her what she wants in return. You take everything, without taking advantage. I know many who consider themselves dominant and I wouldn't go near em with ten foot poles. Not all dominants are good dominants or good people, for that matter...just like in other sects of life...there are good and bad. To blanket statement that all dominants deserve subs is terribly naive.

An example of 'normal' relationships to compare BDSM to: Domestic abuse. People beating their partners because they have not done what they wanted them to do, or in mere frustration..or the barage of other reasons....
Sure physical violence is an aspect of BDSM, a pretty big one!!But in the most part it is designed specifically NOT to cause any real harm to the sub. I'm not sure I get your point here...but if you mean that if abusers would just "turn dominant" I'd be appalled and also keep my ten foot pole handy. And by the way....violence and M/s are two entirely different animals...entirely.

I'm a total newbie, just wanting to get more involved in discussing the lifestyle to help me learn how to live it and to generally broaden my horizons

Also I know Doms have male subs aswell, I'm just writing this from my p.of v, that is male Dom and female sub.

Also I realise this is a very rambling message...will do better in future

palerose x

edited for spelling

_____________________________

D~

Seeking, searching, hoping, living, loving, jumping. So what's new with you?

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 3

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 12:37:17 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose
I'm a total newbie, just wanting to get more involved in discussing the lifestyle to help me learn how to live it and to generally broaden my horizons

Cause...

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose
This is why I think Doms are special. You deserve to have subs to do all this for you because you are careful and have learnt how to give her what she wants in return. You take everything, without taking advantage.

Effect...

Stay too caught up in the honorful and knightly nature of the Dominant and your horizens will be broadened in ways you wont like.

Edited to Add : I would even venture a guess that you will be receiving some private messages from honorable and knightly Trainers and Mentors with the noble desire to educate you in the ways of BDSM as a result of this thread marking you as a lamb.

Edited Again To Add : After reading your profile, too late.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 7/14/2007 12:46:24 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 4

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 12:43:00 PM

sambamanslilgirl

Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose
Do you every wonder as Doms, if you are just doing what all men want to do? You can have your woman do whatever you want her to do; if you want more than one woman you can have them, you can have sex anyway you want, and someone to clean up for you if you want!

Considering I know plenty of men who
a) don't want to be dominants in relationships
b) don't want more than one woman

then you've got some issues right there. As well, vanillas can have sex any way they want, too.

quote:

This is why I think Doms are special. You deserve to have subs to do all this for you because you are careful and have learnt how to give her what she wants in return. You take everything, without taking advantage.

You've got a false idea of doms- plenty of doms are ignorant loser assholes.

And what you describe is a healthy RELATIONSHIP- not Ds or vanilla.

quote:

An example of 'normal' relationships to compare BDSM to: Domestic abuse. People beating their partners because they have not done what they wanted them to do, or in mere frustration..or the barage of other reasons....
Sure physical violence is an aspect of BDSM, a pretty big one!!But in the most part it is designed specifically NOT to cause any real harm to the sub.

You don't think there are abusive bdsm relationships?

What you most need to realize is that people in bdsm are EXACTLY LIKE people NOT in bdsm. Same issues, same personalities, same fears, joys, fuck ups and more.

What makes us different? Only our personal relationship orientation.

what LA said - we're no different or special from the vanilla world

_____________________________

...2011 - year of the fabulous rock star life ...and i do it so well...

...announcing Mr. & Mrs. British Petrol ...yeah, marrying into oil is slick business...

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 5

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 12:59:57 PM

palerose

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/25/2007
Status: offline

I'm not sure I get your point here...but if you mean that if abusers would just "turn dominant" I'd be appalled and also keep my ten foot pole handy. And by the way....violence and M/s are two entirely different animals...entirely.
I really did NOT mean that all abusers 'turn dominant' as you put it.Okay they are different animals, but most people here include whips, wax play etc in their interests, hence why I mentioned it. Perhaps I should have said pain, instead of violence.

Considering I know plenty of men who
a) don't want to be dominants in relationships
b) don't want more than one woman

then you've got some issues right there.
Was I being too general?I was basing it on my experience of what men want. What they have as fantasies or what they wish they could get away with. Sure you know plenty of men who don't want that. Sure I know plenty who do want that, which is why I said it. I should not have said "what ALL men want".

Hmm...okay I don't think I meant that we are special or different in the way I was interpreted. I think I said that because for me, it's special to find people who can give me what I need in my relationship/sex life.

As for everything else you have said, I guess I am being naive, but if I am then you are being cynical. I specifically mentioned that I am new to all this, I KNOW I have alot to learn. I based my post on my experiences so far, lucky for me they have all been positive.

To MadRabbit....I met him before I posted anything in forums. And how else is a newbie supposed to learnn??????????????????????????I've been reading for years and thinking for longer. What's the next step in getting what you want?Well meet a person who can give it to you surely??I realise that getting caught up in ifeelings is dangerous and I am trying my best to keep part of me detached and sensible. Sorry got carried away with the punctuation there, but you really lost me with that one.

I'm gonna stear clear of posting on forums for a while. Thankyou for your replies.

(in reply to earthycouple)

Post #: 6

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 1:02:06 PM

PAcpllooking

Posts: 73
Joined: 5/14/2004
Status: offline

In answer to your question;

I dont feel like I am doing what every man wants too. In fact I think that as a Dom I want and do more then most men want to do.
Sure to the newcomer or outsider it may seem like the perfect set up sexually, as you describe, but there is a lot of work to get someone to the point of trust and wanting to serve to get everything you may want.
As far as having as many women as you want, well thats not in all relationships. I would almost say that the majority of real life couples are monogamous.
We dont deserve anything that we havent earned. Like I said it takes time to build the trust.
Yes there many, myself included, who have had one night stands where it was no holds barred and that is exciting................for a while. But it does get boring after a while, not to say I wouldnt have a one nighter again they can be great every now and then.
Yes there is violence in the life using the purest sense of the word, but to me it sounds too harsh.
to learn you have to experience, to experience you have to get out there. use Common sense and always meet for a meal and drive your own car. Dress the way you want and make sure he pays.

William

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 7

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 1:20:29 PM

nephandi

Posts: 4470
Joined: 9/23/2005
From: Cold and magickal Norway in a town near Bergen!
Status: offline

Hi

First le me say welcome to Collarme. i hope you will like it here.

quote:

Do you every wonder as Doms, if you are just doing what all men want to do? You can have your woman do whatever you want her to do; if you want more than one woman you can have them, you can have sex anyway you want, and someone to clean up for you if you want!

Well not all D/s or BDSM relationships allow the Dominant partner to have more than one partner or have sex anyway they like, or have domestic service or anything else. The bonds of a BDSM relationship wary from relationship to relationship. In many such relationships the sub would leave on the spot if her Dom slept whit another woman.

i wish you well.

_____________________________

Whatever you think you can do or believe you can do, begin it. Action has magic, grace and power in it.--Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Futon torpedoes, make love not war!--Aswad

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 8

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 1:20:33 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose

To MadRabbit....I met him before I posted anything in forums. And how else is a newbie supposed to learnn??????????????????????????I've been reading for years and thinking for longer. What's the next step in getting what you want?Well meet a person who can give it to you surely??I realise that getting caught up in ifeelings is dangerous and I am trying my best to keep part of me detached and sensible. Sorry got carried away with the punctuation there, but you really lost me with that one.

Dont read too much into it. Some of the people who regularly post and have been around for awhile got the joke.

And a joke was all it was

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 9

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 1:20:59 PM

palerose

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/25/2007
Status: offline

Okay well after this I won't post again for a while.

Thankyou William for a sane response and for restoring my faith in the community here. You have similar points to the other replies and I have been given yet more to think about. I'm thanking you for managing to say it in a way which did not make me feel like a complete idiot.

I know I have alot to learn, I said I was new.

A warning to MadRabbit...if people who I (as a newbie) talk to on forums jump down my throat with criticisms, and my Dom treats me kindly and is patient with my ignorance...who am I going to talk to more? I do not believe this is a problem for me, I pray I won't be proven wrong on this, but I believe my Dom is a decent person, and he will introduce me to things gently and respect me if things are wrong for me or if I do not want the same things he does.

My worry is....Doms who have found young and inexperienced newbies and who have taken advantage of them.
Like internet paedos (my spelling is awful tonight I can't think straight nevermind write straight, I'm not drunk btw!) a Dom could "groom" a new sub to be exactly what he wanted, with complete disregard for their wellbeing and in doing so could abuse them. If the sub is recieving only criticism from the BDSM community, then there is a danger that he or she will be pushed further towards the abusive partner and risk physical and mental abuse.

The great thing about this site for me, is that it offeres the opportunity to learn and to talk to other people and hear their experiences and compare them to my own and discuss ideas and reasons behind the Dom/sub mentality.

I'm not asking for anyone to go soft on me, I'm just saying this because I know there are vulnerable people out there, and I think you should have perhaps taken note of the fact that I mentioned I was a newbie.

pr x

(in reply to PAcpllooking)

Post #: 10

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 1:21:14 PM

robertolapiedra

Posts: 520
Joined: 5/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

I'm gonna stear clear of posting on forums for a while. Thankyou for your replies.

Hello palerose. Doms do not do or have "everything" they want. There are "limits", remember?

People are "people" in all walks of life. You have just as many fuckups in BDSM as in the vanilla world.

"I'm gonna stear clear of posting on forums for a while. Thankyou for your replies."

Do not let "opinion" directly or "indirectly" dictate or influence what you do. If the answers are not helpfull, it is "we" who fail you, not "you" failing us. Please post again, as you and your opinions are not less "valuable" than those of the "genius" set. RL.

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 11

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 1:34:12 PM

palerose

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/25/2007
Status: offline

Okay...lol reconsidered not posting again. I will continue to post. Was just a bit put off my first couple of rather cynical replies. I got the feeling that my views were dismissed as irrelevant, stupid, common misconceptions. This they may be, but no need to be so harsh about it, I girls gotta learn somehow!

Glad you had a laugh MadRabbit.

Thankyou to the last few replies for being decent and making me want to keep discussing everything

pr x

(in reply to robertolapiedra)

Post #: 12

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 2:04:15 PM

Quivver

Posts: 1953
Joined: 11/27/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palerose

Okay...lol reconsidered not posting again. I will continue to post. Was just a bit put off my first couple of rather cynical replies. I got the feeling that my views were dismissed as irrelevant, stupid, common misconceptions. This they may be, but no need to be so harsh about it, I girls gotta learn somehow!

Glad you had a laugh MadRabbit.

Thankyou to the last few replies for being decent and making me want to keep discussing everything

pr x

Pale, if we run away every time someone disagree's we wont ever grow.
Stick around, your hide will toughen in time.
As for your post? I understood where you were going with it, but it was a bit general and it seems your the one who got my old rose colored glasses. (hint, peek over the top occasionally)
.................... Grin

_____________________________

The problem with communication ... is the illusion that it has been accomplished. ~George Bernard Shaw

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 13

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 2:15:03 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

Pale- you posted a theory. People then responded showing how that theory is weak, and how it doesn't match up to real life. You then got huffy because you didn't get what you liked.

Welcome to the cyber forums. Don't get upset at US when you post a theory and invite criticism. No one insulted you, no one condescended to you. If you want serious discussion, stick around.

If you want people to just act all happy happy and pretend doms and subs aren't real people, there are other forums for that.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Quivver)

Post #: 14

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 2:15:09 PM

PAcpllooking

Posts: 73
Joined: 5/14/2004
Status: offline

Your welcome palerose, anytime .............................

William

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 15

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 2:20:09 PM

Lashra

Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline

No I dont think that ALL males want to do this. My male sub was a Master in his previous relationships and he found it very unfulfilling as he has a submissive personality. After doing much soul searching he discovered that the sub in him wanted to serve a Dominant Lady. So that ended his marriage to his slavewife and then he met me.

We've been together for 3 years now and he has come a long way in learning how to stop wearing a mask for other people and how to be himself.

Its been a bumpy road but it has totally been worth it.

I think Dom/me's are special, my sub tells me that I am everyday. I think he is too.

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 16

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 2:54:15 PM

Corve

Posts: 15
Joined: 9/23/2006
From: Boca Raton
Status: offline

I have a master's degree is social work. It is only through socialization that starts when we are babies, that trains men to live a in rituals and actions that restrict his genetic hormonal drive for dominance. Look at a pack of dogs and there is a pecking order with the alpha male in charge of all, and the females always submissive to the males. Is it hard to believe that we may share our life drives to be shared with another mmal species? There was a time with tribal man where women were taken by conquest as a norm.
Master Corve

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 17

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 3:14:30 PM

HeavansKeeper

Posts: 1254
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline

Palerose, I'll defend your theory. You seem to have a good idea of servitude, even though your theory is hinged on a few stereotypes. There are exceptions to every rule, and multiple forums have all taught me that if you don't protect yourself from these, you might appear unimformed.

The stereotypical middle-American vanilla guy is the one you seem to be talking about. While he's trying to romance his wife into sex, if he's lucky and she's in the mood, I could easily claim it from My Pet. This isn't to say I don't romance My Pet, but I don't HAVE to. Owning her is certainly a dream come true.

You have quite the advanced view on being submissive, even in light of your lack of experience. You realize the difference between being taken advantage of and being taken. Men and women can be dominant and/or submissive. Whether its nature or nurture, or can be forced upon them, or taught to them, is irrelevant now. Some men are submissive. Some women are submissive. Some men are dominant. Some women are dominant. The problem is, most of the world is closeminded to a d/s world. In a world where 'slavery' is seen as a bad thing, consensually owning someone is not well received. In the stereotypical vanilla relationship, there is little discussion of the dominant or submissive nature of the participants. Even if the lean one way out of the bedroom, it could be different behind closed doors.

There are many happy vanilla relationships. There are many vanilla relationships that are unhappy because two dominant people or two submissive people have found eachother AND don't know how to handle that.

Our relationship (My Pet and I, not readers and I) can work so well because of our power exchange. If there is a problem, she doesn't start yelling and sleeping around. She goes to Her Master. Her Mentor. Her Teacher. Her Lover. Her Rock. If I have a problem, I have no fear in telling her what I feel. I know is being trained to take news from me calmly, and digest it before making decisions. Her training is subtle, but going very well =).
Our power exchange (My Pet and I, not readers and I) can work so well because of our mutual understanding and attunement to one another. I can see what she's thinking. I can sniff the air around her and tell how her day went. I can read written words and tell her more about herself than her last vanilla boyfriend could at the end of their relationship. She trusts me like in a way she doesn't trust anyone else. She has given me the power of our love because she knows I willl use it for good. For her, for me, for us.

Relationships are work, that's not news to anyone. Work is always easier with the right tools, also, not news. In our relationship, her submission gives us the tools to work on our relationship. She learns to love (and more importantly SEE) the little things I do for her everyday. I learn to nurture and love her in a way I've never done before because it's my responsibility. A responsibility that I love to have. I am here to teach her. To train her to love me better, to make me happier, to gain even more happiness in pleasing of me. For better or worse, the good with the bad, tongue bathes and spankings, I love the way she loves the way I Love Her.

Palerose, you're a chauvenist pig, just like your master, and he probably loves you for it. =)

Concerning this forum: I've posted here a few times. The exact number can be seen to your left. There will always be people who misread your words, who assume things you didn't say, who nitpick on spelling and grammar, who comment more about themselves than your post (guilty), who defend the fact that stereotypes are dumb and don't encompass everyone, who feign knowledge, who hijack threads, who don't answer question, who make smart ass responses... The list goes on and on. The good with the bad. Some people here are very helpful and have given me insight and viewpoints I would not have had otherwise. I've learned a lot here.

_____________________________

The Loving Owner of HisHeavan

... You've waited your whole life for this moment...

(in reply to Lashra)

Post #: 18

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 3:23:35 PM

Grlwithboy

Posts: 655
Joined: 2/8/2005
Status: offline

Most of the men I've met and progressed to flirting with or talking about possibilities with express desire to submit, to be able to let down the guard, to have decisions made NOT by them, etc. I've often thought that this is a case of water seeking its level, or maybe more one of "if you have a hammer everything else looks like a nail" on my part, at worst.

(in reply to HeavansKeeper)

Post #: 19

RE: I have a theory... - 7/14/2007 3:34:48 PM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline

I agree a few of those early replies were needlessly harsh but take it as a lesson learnt. It is a reflection on them, NOT you, that they'd rather be short, cynical and condescending to a newbie as opposed to simply 'X'ing out of a topic they've obviously got little time or patience with.

To the uninitiated, there is a blurred line between D/s and abuse, if any line at all, and in that context, I find your questions reasonable. And I admire your courage for asking on a public Forum, because in theory it shouldn't require courage at all - until some no life gives you grief for daring to be new and inexperienced.

To the new or any outsider, you're correct in that the Dominant seemingly does get everything their own way. What you don't see initially is that a caring Dominant in a healthy D/s relationship has responsibilities and obligations to the happiness and well-being of the submissive in response to her service.

I tell my girl what to do and she is rewarded or disciplined on the basis of how she performs a set task. But I'm also working in conjunction with her individual submissive need to serve and please me. I would not give commands to a vanilla partner (for eg) who did not have a need and appreciation for being commanded. But to command and control my partner is my individual need, which equally means I would not ever have a vanilla partner again - too exasperating for my need to control or command.

Much of what others have posted is also true. There are the honourable and arseholes wherever there's a group of people, including BDSM. And there *are* vanilla males posing as dominants solely to get all the sexual favours they can on demand - preferably from newbies too inexperienced to recognise the warning signs.

I'm a Dominant but just another lonely man without a submissive to command - that empowers a submissive with the gift of desirability. (as does long red hair, actually - <drool> lol). Yet a submissive has her own needs which only a Dominant can fulfill - that equally empowers Dominants. If both are getting their needs met and are happy, where is the abuse?

All newbies (at anything) are naturally inquisitive but knowing what to ask is the most exasperarating ordeal of all. I understand that as do most with experience so stick around and learn to ignore those who'd just rather dump on your lack of knowledge to presumably feel good about themselves .

Focus.

(in reply to palerose)

Post #: 20

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