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RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 8:28:33 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		Nice post you linked to, LA. And good points on this thread, as well as the sibling thread in another section.

This is one of the topics that seem to seperate the wheat from the chaff when it comes to acceptance vs tolerance (a.k.a. "putting up with") vs intolerance. Some have very contemptuous attitudes with regard to sex work, regardless of whether it is a choice or a last resort. Which, obviously, does nothing to improve conditions for either of them.

I quite agree that other professions can be compared to sex work.

A lot of my colleagues in the IT field refer to certain kinds of consultant work as "whoring oneself", and I don't mean in a sacred whore kind of sense: the client decides what the deliverable is, the consultant negotiates a price, then tries to deliver, only seeing the client again if they were particularly impressed with the interaction (the work is usually irrelevant, as the client usually can't tell the difference) and most of the time walking away feeling rather unsatisfied about the whole thing, but happy that the money is on its way. Doing this kind of work over time tends to cause either burnout, cynicism, or both.

Similarly, if you get the high class clients, the money is better, the feeling is neutral or better, the quality of the work becomes more important, and the process becomes more interactive, leaving both parties happy about the arrangement, although there will "always" be the occasional burnt fingers. Mutual respect is a nice fringe benefit, too. This kind of work over time tends to lead to a nice house, a choice car, a good standard of living, and a decent size black book, with very little grind, and more opportunity to take time off if the load (no pun intended) becomes a problem.

In both professions, there can be associated risks that can fuck up your life, or (worst case) kill you. And these are highest risk with low class clients. These would be STDs, psychos, legal problems, and so forth for the sex worker, I'd guess. For the IT worker, it would be mental illness (fucks stuff up, lifetime mortality rate of about 15%), legal problems, client exclusion, and so forth. And working for a pimp / consulting company can be better or worse than independent work, depending on who your boss is.

Fewer surface similarities, perhaps, but similar nature to the work, according to some who have tried both.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 8:31:19 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		L.A., you are the most sexually liberated woman I will probably ever run across.
Your honesty, amazes and floors me.
You are a Class act, all the way.


_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 8:36:47 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OwnedShylah

quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64

oh wow prostitution lets see again trying to make a wrong right lol but to each their now if your and adult film star or a stripper that is different but your playing russian roulette wish you well


What is the difference between getting paid to have sex in front of a camera, with a stranger, and getting paid to have sex in a privet hotel room?

The only difference I can think of is that one is legal and the other isn't.

In Nevada where they have legal Brothels there was a study done on the STI/STD rate of the working girls... the rates of girls contracting any STI/STD was lower the general population. If you use a condom and get regular check ups it's not Russian rulet. The STI/STD rate in the porn industery is higher then in the escorting industery.

Note: I said ESCORT, meaning high priced women who work for agencys or brothels. I am not taking about street walkers. I am not talking about the junky fucking bear back behind a dumpster for $20.

Shylah


I am enjoying this thread so much.
I never understood the high and mighty attitudes of many that are not Pro Dominants.
These may be choices that many here would not make, but who are we to belittle anyone else?
Many people date, form relationships and marry people ONLY for the money.
Thanks for starting this thread, many people are seriously tripping, when they think they are better
than Escorts, sex workers, or Professional Dominants.
To each their own, this may not be for you, but these people have a right to exist.
If it were not for the MANY people that are willing to PAY for it, they would not have a job!

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to OwnedShylah)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 8:47:20 PM   
milkmaid42dd


Posts: 41
Joined: 3/1/2007
Status: offline 		I'd love to be an escort, or even mature BBW films. I currently have a growing business with lots of repeat customers on the phone lines. I was referred to the site by a Domme friend, Goddess Dianna Vesta, and I'm so glad she did! I absolutely love it. I get excited just hearing the phone ring, LOL. I never enjoyed phone sex before, but my listings are tailored (by me!) to attract men with the same interests as I have, and so I almost always wind up enjoying it as much as the man I'm talking with... I even have favorites that I send free minutes to so they don't have to pay as much to talk to me.

As for my Master, of course He knows and approves, naturally! We don't really talk about it much, aside from him asking how business is doing. He's much more interested in the "toys" I buy with the proceeds <grin> as are my customers! LOL!

< Message edited by milkmaid42dd -- 8/5/2007 8:48:58 PM >

(in reply to OwnedShylah)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:38:31 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
So, tell me, why did you decide to serve Sex?

To be true to myself.

I don't "serve sex" unless you mean like a waitress who serves food or a teacher who serves knowledge and information.  I serve THROUGH sex.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to CuriousLord)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:39:47 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia
L.A., you are the most sexually liberated woman I will probably ever run across.
Your honesty, amazes and floors me.
You are a Class act, all the way.


Mia you continue to humble me!  I gotta get you in touch with some people who put me to shame :)  Try femcar!



_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to MzMia)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:40:31 PM   
ChainsandFreedom


Posts: 222
Joined: 6/20/2007
Status: offline
quote:


Like I said, I'll look forward to the Pro's opinion of your activities in  the name of domination.  The fact remains, you are a prostitute doing domination calls.  And you would have to be stupid to think what you do has no repercussions on the real Pros. 


-Why should anybody care what effect their having on 'the real pros'? We're talking two different types of sex workers here, 'pro' domme's aren't exactly earning their money any more ethically than anyone else-and often just as illeagally. Nude queening, penetration, hell even unclaimed taxes aren't just legally dubious but downright unbusinesslike.  

Just as a whore may preform domination routines which are sexual favors without the sex, many "professional" dominants are preforming sexual scenes sans sex.

At least this topic-starter is honest about what she does for a living.

If someone is appealing to a client's sexual urges and providing an outlet, than the difference is really only what name they're using.

Personally, I feel that a whore is fulfilling a very old profession. Some 'pro' domme's are simply trying to pretend their somehow better or different than their competition.

-xak 

(in reply to OwnedShylah)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:46:42 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
So, tell me, why did you decide to serve Sex?

To be true to myself.


What truth is it you find?

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:49:44 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord
What truth is it you find?

The experience of myself. 

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to CuriousLord)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:50:01 PM   
RWAble


Posts: 282
Joined: 1/5/2007
Status: offline 		Well, I would never pay to have sex with anybody. I would lose respect for them, but most of all I would lose respect for myself. It just plays into the corporate world we live in. They will own all that one day too.

_____________________________

When the Yankees leave Florida, then we can be free.

Life is a voyage, not a destination.

(in reply to OwnedShylah)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:52:03 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

Like I said, I'll look forward to the Pro's opinion of your activities in  the name of domination.  The fact remains, you are a prostitute doing domination calls.  And you would have to be stupid to think what you do has no repercussions on the real Pros.
 
Also, if you are so secure in your opinion of what you do, my comments should be of absolutely no relevance to you.


Since when did Professional Domination require an advocacy group?

The 'repercussions' towards professionals would seem to be only what they permit.  If not, who is really in control?

For my experience, the laws (cough) regarding prostitution are hardly written with the public health interest in mind.  They're little more than remnants of an age when laws against sodomy and oral sex and against women cutting their hair without their husband permission on a sunday afternoon were still political buttons.  First world countries that permit and regulate sex workers repeatedly show, statistically, far better working conditions and overall health.  AND they get to tax the business.  Imagine if a brothel required weekly drug screenings; with an 'escort' under our current model, there's simply no way to know.

I worked in a strip club as a DJ in college.  First hand, I agree; the women sell fantasy and companionship, not heels and garters.  Because it's a taboo topic, most people don't take the time to look any deeper than that.

Stephan


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to LotusSong)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:54:54 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RWAble
Well, I would never pay to have sex with anybody. I would lose respect for them, but most of all I would lose respect for myself. It just plays into the corporate world we live in. They will own all that one day too.

What is the key difference for you between paying someone for sexual companionship, and paying someone for a meal?  Do you lose respect for paying for their skills and services which bring you pleasure on a plate? 

Or if you own a car, do you lose respect for the people you pay who use their skills and services to keep your car runing well and giving you the pleasures and satisfaction it brings?

Or the clothes you wear?  Do you lose respect for the people who built and made the clothes, transferred them, sold them and allowed you the pleasure they bring?

Or what about the company that provides you the service of the internet and the pleasurable experiences you have on that?  Is paying them somehow making them and you lose respect?

People are so arbitrarily ridiculous in what services they consider "disrespectful."

And you'll have to let me know exactly how it is for a nice gentleman to pay me for my time with him is feeding into the corporate world?

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to RWAble)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/5/2007 9:59:16 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		I read what LA had to add to this discussion....The problem with the pros and the sex workers is that they rarely get to "complete the circuit."  I think it is a hollow and rather empty existence.  It matters little if one is getting paid or just jumping from bed to bed w/o payment. With everything in life there is a sacrifice that has to be ultimately paid for the choices we make....Whether it is an unfulfilling career or that of a sex worker.

I agree with LA in that there is a unique energy found in sex....When shared by two people who are on the same frequency....How often does this take place?  It can be random....Or it can be hopefully heightened by finding those on your wavelength...But in far to many cases it simply leads to mutual masturbation and the lone payoff is an orgasm and an awkward exit.....For the sex worker the exit may not be awkward but the act itself I'm sure is rather empty.

I have little empathy or use for someone who makes a living in the sex industry....It is the employer of lost dreams, it caters to the people who have found the bottom wrung and have found a way to get by on the fact that they have holes and nothing more. Where an unfulfilling career (IT worker as an example) might feel used or mentally unchallenged....Hell, this person might feel that they are not pursuing their calling, that they are not serving the purpose that they were meant to....And yes, this can be a spiritually damaging practice.....But it is different than that of a sex worker....I am not a prude by a long shot, and maybe there are people who's true calling is fucking...It might just be possible that it is the only thing that they are good at....I just find it to be ....Sad.  I know no one is looking for pity, and certainly not from Tupac.

I think that sex is electric....It is meaningless at worst and mind blowing, universe connecting, world makes sense and time stands still at it's best.  It is one hell of a price to pay not to achieve the latter or have this aspect of one's humanity so diminished by pursuing it as an occupation or a callousness that values the dollars over the soul. I'm not talking about heaven or hell or God or sin.....It seems that there is just too much of a price to be paid and the true costs can be devastating to one's very essence.

_____________________________



(in reply to milkmaid42dd)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 6:52:59 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RWAble

Well, I would never pay to have sex with anybody.


You mean you have never courted the opposite sex with an expectation to get laid?

quote:


It just plays into the corporate world we live in.


Prostitution predates corporate entities, money, and so forth. And it is still practiced by the barter system. Any time you effectively give something in return for sex, be it a meal, alcohol, and so forth, you are engaging in prostitution via the barter system. Many western courtship rituals are basically just that. Some have posited that marriage is no more than sticking to a single client in many cases.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to RWAble)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 7:30:47 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		domiguy,

Wow, where's the usual domihumor?

Legalize prostitution, regulate it in the usual ways, and make it socially acceptable ... that will make it a profession like any other. It's not sex work in itself that is the problem, but rather the conditions that come attached to it, and people's attitudes to those doing the work. Without straying too far off topic, I've seen consultants who can very much relate to the statement "I'm just tissue paper they resent/hate and wipe their dick with."

If you can't compartmentalize the work from the Art, you have to turn the work into Art, or the Art into work.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 7:32:34 AM   
sophia37


Posts: 1433
Joined: 2/7/2006
Status: offline 		To Domiguy. While its true Ive never been a sex worker, it's also true I have thought of sex as one of my true callings. Maybe its not the only thing Im good at, but while Im in the midst of the encounter, I engage in it like it is. 

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 8:02:48 AM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		You can legalize it....You can treat it like it is any other type of profession....I just think the people who participate in this line of work will pay a serious price.....They will lose a certain spark...They will have traded dollars for a piece of themselves....It's hard to put into words....I believe that people who pursue this industry suffer from side effects that are extremely unique to this occupation....It has little to do with the pressures or the opinions of society....It simply has to do with pursuing a line of work that is damaging to the soul....The people who participate just seem so empty,translucent and hollow.

That will have to do for now.

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 8:11:55 AM   
EPGAH


Posts: 500
Joined: 12/25/2006
Status: offline 		I've often wondered why "everyone hates prostitutes", but porn--prostitution with a camera--magically becomes OK?
Also remember Anna Nicole Smith, the world's best-paid prostitute, $9 BILLION in cash and gifts while her ancient sugar-daddy--er--HUSBAND was alive, then $88 MILLION more (And a declaration of bankruptcy...If she had someone managing her affairs, pun intended, that person needs to be beaten down, shot, and given another beating...Most of us would KILL to be that "bankrupt"!) Divided over the course of her "marriage" (Which she said before God, country, species and media was for "love", not money, inviting howls of derisive laughter from all quarters!), calculates down to $150,000 per night! Immediately after her husband's death (Some still suspect foul play...What, did she smother him with her mammoth mammaries?), she announced she didn't want any boyfriends, she was afraid of gold-diggers...She must have changed her so-called mind later, as the subsequent ferver over her child and who fathered it proved. I wonder if there's going to be another court-battle over HER assets?
But I digress...The original point is, why is porn legal, when it's sex for money, and prostitution is illegal, but in my own opinion, money for sex greatly cheapens--pun intended--the "gift"...Indeed, some scholars believe Jesus was killed for interfering with their "bidness" in the temples (See "Den of thieves and whores" speech...FIRE AND BRIMSTONE!)

(in reply to sophia37)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 8:14:08 AM   
ChainsandFreedom


Posts: 222
Joined: 6/20/2007
Status: offline 		In a completely hetro and non-sexual way, DOMIGUY is the man.
All his small post's are HILARIOUS once you realize how deep the guy really is-at first I took him too seriously, but that just makes what he say's more convincing and more hilarious in hindsite.

Aswad said:
quote:

Prostitution predates corporate entities, money, and so forth. And it is still practiced by the barter system. Any time you effectively give something in return for sex, be it a meal, alcohol, and so forth, you are engaging in prostitution via the barter system. Many western courtship rituals are basically just that. Some have posited that marriage is no more than sticking to a single client in many cases.


And I'm wondering if he's actually been reading the post's in the thread, or maybe if he's just responding very selectively....
There's a big differance between a gift, which is intimate and serves a specific purpose, and cash, which has general use-value and is anymous. A gift, dinner, ect. can be used as an act of sharing between two individuals, while cash (or drugs, if its that kind of prostitution) is divorced from any form of physical bond. Also, if the only reason you're taking a woman out to dinner is to get in her pants, your porbably not going to be very sucessful. If you wish, you could even join the 1970's and find woman who take pride in picking up the tab every once in awhile.

By your logic, a mother fixing her child a meal or a father putting a roof over his elderly parents heads is buying their love and thus prostitution, also.

quote:

  Legalize prostitution, regulate it in the usual ways, and make it socially acceptable ... that will make it a profession like any other. It's not sex work in itself that is the problem, but rather the conditions that come attached to it


- You cannot divorce the occupation from its conditions and thats why society makes it illeagle-to protect those who would enter into it as well as those who patronize it. It's physically and emotionally exploitative and leaves the worker with little to fall back on should they become unattractive or sick in terms of alternate employment.

You compare computer programming/corporate whore-dom to prostitution, which is very Marxist, but you have the benifit of specif job skills and training which are sought after and worked for to put you in that place. You have the benifit of having chosen your profession, and the luxury to trade your skills for alternate employment should conditions become unbearable. High class or cheap, too many sex workers enter into the industry either out of desperation or greed. Just because bordello's are leagle in Amsterdam or Reno doesnt mean their workers dont pay a price which cannot be compensated for with money.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles - 8/6/2007 8:22:51 AM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		Wow i can't  believe i am saying this but.... i absolutely agree with you domiguy and you said so eloquently what my sentiments were, and i thank you for that.

_____________________________

Religion is for people who are scared of hell, Spirituality is for people who have been there

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 40
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