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RE: I was just told - 8/31/2007 8:30:34 PM   
adoracat


Posts: 1779
Joined: 2/16/2007
Status: offline 		~fast reply~

Sir loves me.  if he didnt, he wouldnt care so much about my welfare.  i love him.  i worry about his health, and his well-being, and his relationships with other people...

and that's absolutely perfect for us, for a Daddy/Daddy's girl relationship.  others might do it differently.  but this is the way *we* do it.

kitten, who is tired.

(in reply to curiouspet55)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: I was just told - 8/31/2007 8:36:39 PM   
LATEXBABY64


Posts: 2107
Joined: 4/8/2004
Status: offline 		anyone that would not love or could not love in D's relationship is someone that i would be very Leary around or not trusting.
those that or do not have that in them are headed for a life long hurt  

(in reply to adoracat)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: I was just told - 8/31/2007 8:42:01 PM   
catize


Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

   Without love, relationships of any kind are pointless.


 
I have many kinds of relationships where love is not a factor and I do not find them pointless.
I have working relationships where we get the job done as a team but I certainly don’t love my co-workers.
I have friendly relationships with my neighbors.  We joke and gossip and borrow each other’s tools and offer our assistance for home projects.  I find these relationships beneficial and not at all pointless.  And I certainly don’t love them.
There are people I occasionally go to dinner with for good food and conversation.  I enjoy their company but I don’t love them.


_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

(in reply to celticlord2112)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 12:26:27 AM   
AlexanderC


Posts: 34
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline 		I could never be in an M/s relationship with someone I didn't love. Service and submission in this context are only made meaningful by the extent of the esteem I have for the one who offers them to me. I suppose I could appreciate the material and psychological benefits of a more casual d/s relationship without experiencing such intense feelings of affection for my partner, but even in this case I believe I would find the submission of one I did not really care about to be not only uninteresting, but mildly burdensome as I would feel oblidged to discharge the various obligations that come with entering into such a power exchange.

(in reply to callistaIn)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 12:45:38 AM   
obis


Posts: 412
Joined: 9/9/2005
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slave4umastr
I've always imagined when I find the right master, that I would love him, but I also thought that he would love me too, although we would both express our love in very different ways. But what I want to know is, do most people think like this really?


Does it matter what most people think? You know what you think and need and want. You only need ONE person who provides all that. The other 5.99 billion of us don't get a vote on how your relationship works.

But if you're just asking the odds of finding that person, keep looking and he's there. I would guesstimate that most people on both sides of the flogger are looking for love. It's a basic human need, so we may as well get it and feel it for the person we voluntarily spend the rest of our lives with.

(in reply to slave4umastr)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 8:28:53 AM   
denika


Posts: 619
Joined: 8/30/2005
Status: offline 		From the manner that was told to you, it makes me think that Dmonant has some issues.

Love can be many diffrent things, and some can play with even the most thread bare of respect for the person but the  those I have seen in the happiest,healthiest relationships ( not to mention the ones that last the longest) there is a connection, it doesn't always have to be sexual but there is a form of love present.

Personally, if I'm going to submit to someone, and especially if I am going to scene with them they have to mean something to me. Love grows with time, at least in healthy relationships it grows. If A Dom/Top/Master--pick the term can only look at his  sub/slave-whatever with  disdain or best ,a lack of any emotion there isn't going to be a very healthy connection.

denika

(in reply to slave4umastr)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 10:05:07 AM   
DS4DUMMIES


Posts: 180
Joined: 8/7/2007
Status: offline 		Sexi, rest assured, there is no one who could have said it more eloquently than you have, because it could not have come more from the heart. Godspeed.....

Respectfully;
DS4

quote:

ORIGINAL: SexiSubbi

I felt truly special having the love of my former Master. We actually began having great conversations about BDSM, which later evolved into his guidance and training as i explored my submissiveness (is that a word?). Of course our respect grew and as we played together the strength and power we shared grew into love. I was honoured to have been his slave for over 9 years and to have a devoted Master as Gud Master. I know it was love because upon his death, my heart was broken. Now, a 1-1/2 years later...i can now speak of His love for me and proud to share that with You. Yes, there can be love between a Dom and sub. Others have expressed it more eloquently than i, but nonetheless, i wanted to express my thoughts. Be well! 


_____________________________

"When we walk to the edge of all the light we have and take the step into the darkness of the unknown, we must believe that one of two things will happen. There will be something solid for us to stand on or we will be taught to fly.” Patrick Overton

(in reply to SexiSubbi)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 10:33:17 AM   
rmanrr


Posts: 358
Joined: 7/25/2006
Status: offline 		Greetings
to the OP...while love can have a role to play it does not have to be a part. And that simply means any definition anyone might want to apply to the word "love". I grant you that affection might have to actually be present and further sexual attraction for something to develop into a long lasting (lifelong perhaps?) relationship. For Service oriented girls though neither might be the case. Just a few meandering thoughts (since I used most of My intellect on another thread).


_____________________________

Be Well, Be Careful

Jarl Rmanrr

"the road untravelled is the loneliest." Me
Courage...the ability to overcome obstacles during the course.
"to be insane is to be original!"...Me

(in reply to DS4DUMMIES)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 10:37:51 AM   
MstrSkyWoIf


Posts: 238
Joined: 10/26/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slave4umastr

I was just told, quite angrily actually, that a master should never love his slave, and that love has NO place in this lifestyle. I've always imagined when I find the right master, that I would love him, but I also thought that he would love me too, although we would both express our love in very different ways. But what I want to know is, do most people think like this really? That love has no place in M/s, or was it just a bad experience? 


Ok quick answer  I have not even read any of the post yet but My opinion is it was a bad experience. IMO if someone is in a relationship unless it is purely a sexual or play exchange, love will find its way in in most cases. As much as all the big bad Dominants would like everyone to think they are heartless I have found over the years most truly love there submissive or slave deeply.  I know for myself I do not enjoy play as much if I do not have an emotional attachment to my playmate. If I love or am in love with her it is a much deeper connection and therefore much more fulfilling to me.  I can play just for plays sake but it to me is not as fulfilling. Many over the years have told me I am not a "true Dom" because of my feeling on this. I think those who said this to you and to me had read "Dominating for dummies" and then started searching for a sub on line. I don't feel they had in fact based there thoughts on any real life experience.

< Message edited by MstrSkyWoIf -- 9/1/2007 10:41:00 AM >

_____________________________

this is just my opinion, I do not claim to be an expert on life. I am just Me, Love me or Hate me I really don't care. I am the culmination of my life's experiences. I am an ever changing block of clay molded by life's experiences on a daily basis.

(in reply to slave4umastr)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: I was just told - 9/1/2007 1:41:37 PM   
wittman40


Posts: 29
Joined: 8/4/2007
Status: offline 		No-one has a monopoly on the correctness of any relationship whether that be vanilla or BDSM. It is just as absurd for someone within the lifestyle to say your relationship style is "wrong" just because it is not their favoured relationship style as it is for a vanilla person to say that our lifestyle is "wrong".

I am continuously disappointed by the manner in which people within the lifestyle who should know better insist on marginalising others within the lifestyle. Just because someone's style and beliefs are different doesn't make them wrong.

It allreally boils down to one simple thing: Are you happy? If you are happy with your dynamic then go with it and long may it last. It may be a dynamic which is anathema to me BUT it isn't MY happiness we're talking about, it is YOUR happiness. That's the key.

(in reply to callistaIn)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: I was just told - 9/6/2007 3:08:54 PM   
teamnoir


Posts: 226
Joined: 4/5/2005
From: San Francisco Bay Area California
Status: offline 		I like love. Love is cool.

Lust is hot too.

Seriously, I think someone was playing a head game or has taken their role playing too far.

(in reply to slave4umastr)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: I was just told - 9/6/2007 4:36:34 PM   
Karynn


Posts: 773
Joined: 6/8/2007
Status: offline 		Hi,

On the subject of love and the comment bluntly that a Master could not or should not love a slave likely comes from the concept of love being used as a manipulative power play that subverts some examples of what otherwise might be true power exchange. If a slave has set in their mind that their relationship must be based on love, there is the mental default that accompanies this that ends up landing it in the questionable zone of fake or topping from the bottom: "If you loved me, you wouldn't..." or "If you loved me, you would..." With those two subtle undertoned statements either thought or expressed verbally, the balance of power exchange in the extreme state of slavery becomes imbalanced and thus not slavery at all.

Just my own take on things,
K

_____________________________

In all things, to thine own self be true.

(in reply to callistaIn)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: I was just told - 9/6/2007 6:52:45 PM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slave4umastr

I was just told, quite angrily actually, that a master should never love his slave, and that love has NO place in this lifestyle. I've always imagined when I find the right master, that I would love him, but I also thought that he would love me too, although we would both express our love in very different ways. But what I want to know is, do most people think like this really? That love has no place in M/s, or was it just a bad experience? 


I would say it was just a bad experience for you... the following is a post I have done in the past... and it might help you

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
 
Some may say Love is a hindrance to the M/s dynamic.  But, I would say that Love is a fundamental aspect of my M/s Relationships.   I couldn't imagine myself having this type of relationship without Love being apart of it.

Love and Respect of thy self... the most Powerful of Motivations... it comes from within...It's the intrinsic motivation that is only limited by oneself and dependent on no one but oneself.
Love for me has always been a Choice as much as it has been a Feeling.  My feelings have always been motivated by what I perceive... Be it real or illusion.  The choice is to see the truth of what I perceive from the lies.  Therefore, one must make the effort to Love!  Love will flow like water if you let it.  But, water will flow the easiest path... and this could lead you over a cliff.  Healthy Thoughtful Love is much more than free flowing water, but just as powerful.  We control it, we manage it.  We guide it.  When it is time to allow it to flow, we let it flow.  When must harness its power, we focus it and feel its power.  But we never push it up hill!  Remember the flow well pick up everything and can move anything over the course of time.  But if allowed to flow uncontrolled, it will wander aimlessly and finally dumping in a pool... its power never focused and utilized.

Love to me binds the people to a relationship.  It moves the focus from themselves to focus on the other and the relationship itself.  I question when love is not part of the relationship, if the focus ever moves from oneself to the relationship.  Without love, I wonder if the individuals are only using the other and the relationship to serve their self-centered interests.  Taking what they can and maybe draining the lemon dry, then going to find a new lemon.  I wonder if there are some that use the word love, but it is a shallow use of the word instead of the intense devotion that it leads one towards.  Love to me is a powerful word if it used with the feelings that back it up.  It moves one from the self-centered focus to that of a focus to another person and a relationship.  We become givers instead of takers and as result of our giving out of love we receive more than we could ever take.  Instead sucking the lemon dry... We plant an orchard and reap the rewards of that effort

I have been in a relationship with Alandra since in summer of ‘87.  It was then as is now without question a relationship that is very much a loving and growing relationship. I am also growing a young loving relationship with Kyra that began in spring of ‘05. I also have a deepening friendship with my bottom Denika and her husband where love is very much a part of the relationship. Frankly, I find it difficult to comprehend how anyone can have an intimate BDSM relationship without love being an important part of that relationship. I suppose it is done, but I have not seen it done successful over a course of many years.

I thought I was in love with Alandra years ago... but I kept finding that day by day our depth of love just kept growing and never stopping.  It's to the point that I look to tomorrow with excitement because my experience has showed me that I will be loved and love her even more than I do today.  My experience with alandra has also had an extremely positive effect on my relationship with kyra.  When I first touched her gently on the cheek that first time we saw each other... I felt a deep sense of love... but today that love seems pale in comparisons to the way I feel now... god I can hardly wait for tomorrow.

My approach is simple in the relationships I am in. Out of love, We become open to be who we are. I seek not to make my girls what they are not... I only seek to support them to shed that which is illusions of them selves, as they support me in doing the same thing. A relationship with me is about bringing the inner self out into the open and being this person. Out of love we accept what comes. This line of thought is nothing new. A noted psychologist termed the word "congruence" Essentially it means that the more we are able to demonstrate that inner self to the world/relationships, The more content/stable and at peace we become. We are happier. The deeper we hid this inner aspect of our self, well it is a path of unhappiness. I see love as a vehicle to facilitate this path towards happiness.  It is not only path that I use. For I believe there are many strategies in building our personal happiness with our self and our relationships.

The path I describe is one of Self-Awareness leading to Self-Acceptance leading to Self-Actualization. The interesting aspect of this path is that it is actually circular. As we Self-actualize we are destine to become more aware of aspects of our inner self... which will lead us to need to Accept this new found awareness in order for further actualization to occur.

It is my beliefs that if we stop this cycle at any point we stop to grow in ourselves and in our relationships. We stop to bringing that inner self into the light of day and thus we establish a ceiling to our individual happiness. I suspect that many of us do this from time to time and can actually live very happy lives to the end of our days.  Being in a relationship that is fundamentally a loving relationship promotes trust, security, validation and whole array of things that promote this cycle of growth.

I am loved not for what I do for them, "but for who I am".  To push and bring my full awareness of my inner self to the open to those that love me can only grow this love.  So I choose to be "Me" and enjoy the great happiness it gives me. Just as I love my girls for them are being who they are. However, I do not believe I could ever enjoy the love that is given to me, nor give love my girls to the depth I do unless we first love ourselves.

However, It is so much easier to love another than to accept the love from another.  We know what is in our hearts and minds, but we only think we know what is in theirs.   The difference is subtle but significant.  To accept the love of another when we don't love our self is never an easy path.  When we fail to love ourselves it begs to question the motivations of another that express love towards us.  It is therefore my thoughts that “Awareness, .Acceptance & Actualization” is to grow our love of self and not just our relationship.

Some may say Love is a hindrance to the M/s dynamic and I would have to agree in some cases.  In comparison, Many parents who love their children very much are blinded by that love to make the choices and decisions that are best for raising their children. They are blinded by "my children do no wrong" and I suspect everyone can think of examples of such. Because this, are they good parents? Should they be parents? Should parents not love their children?

I see no difference between the Master that allows his/her love to negatively affect his/her responsibilities towards the slave as the parent that allows love to negatively affect their responsibilities towards their children.   It is my opinion we choose to love and as Masters we choose to exercise our authority.  One need not conflict with the other.

To me it is not a question if Love should be in the relationship... It is should they be a Master?

If love causes a person not to fulfill their responsibilities... then let them never know what love is.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to slave4umastr)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: I was just told - 9/6/2007 11:46:45 PM   
heartcream


Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline 		for me love is very important. love for me is trust and feelin safe wif dat person. it would be findin someone i am compatible wif and enjoy bein around and vice versa. all the bdsm sex stuff is like addin even more excitement to the mix. i trust him, i believe in him, i feel he cares about me, that is love. maybe it does not end up in marriage or long term but it would still be love.

_____________________________

"Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague." Vincent Van Gogh

I'd Rather Be With You

Every single line means something.
Jean-Michel Basquiat



(in reply to KnightofMists)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: I was just told - 9/7/2007 5:19:53 AM   
DomN8USlave


Posts: 17
Joined: 8/19/2007
From: Oregon
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SexiSubbi

I felt truly special having the love of my former Master. We actually began having great conversations about BDSM, which later evolved into his guidance and training as i explored my submissiveness (is that a word?). Of course our respect grew and as we played together the strength and power we shared grew into love. I was honoured to have been his slave for over 9 years and to have a devoted Master as Gud Master. I know it was love because upon his death, my heart was broken. Now, a 1-1/2 years later...i can now speak of His love for me and proud to share that with You. Yes, there can be love between a Dom and sub. Others have expressed it more eloquently than i, but nonetheless, i wanted to express my thoughts. Be well! 


I, too, met my Master, fell in love, and then explored the world of BDSM.  I have been His slave for 6 years now, (7 on Oct. 22nd) and love Him very deeply as He loves me.  IMHO I do not believe I could submit to someone if I didn't love them. 

And Bob, please don't hurt the bunnies......

_____________________________

Collared on October 22nd, 2000 by DomN8U2007
Married on May 8th, 2001

(in reply to SexiSubbi)
Profile   Post #: 75
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