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RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 2:21:21 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		 
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

I'm confused as to why everyone is saying the guy is the bad icky wanker when he talked about all this stuff, but no one mentioned that not only did that ENTICE Defiant, it made her want and wait and react positively to him as well.

This should say she's at least as much of a wanker as he is- she just stopped playing around before he did.



I think most people are saying he's a wanker for not calling when he said he would.

I pointed out that if he was trying to have phone sex right away he probably wasn't interested in a deep fulfilling emotional commitment...but that doesn't make him a wanker.  I also told her not to do that shit if she's trying to screen for guys who are serious...so have plenty of other people.

quote:


Defiant is well known to have issues with males and sex- so my only piece of advice os STOP trying to hook up with guys UNTIL you understand them and have decent judgement for yourself.  Until then, this is going to keep happening.


That's kind of a really rude thing to say.  Someone is "well known to have issues with males and sex" and thus can't ask for advice on the forums?  Well I'm kind of new here so I guess I made the horrible mistake of treating her as a person rather than a pariah but even so I think if someone is asking for advice it should be given honestly rather than dismissing them as "unfixable" or "too many issues."

Life is a learning process and some people 'get it' sooner than others.  But being rude and outcasting someone because they have made bad decisions isn't going to show them what they *should* do...if anything it will just surround them with other outcasts who make bad decisions.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 161
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 2:49:45 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		You may want to go back and read some of DBG's other threads.  She def has issues, but then so do most of us.  She tends to do the same things over and over again and wonders why the outcome is always the same.  Don't misunderstand, I am NOT knocking her at all.  But it pretty much stands to reason if you tend to seek out the same type of guy and do the same types of things, then the outcome is pretty much going to be the same.

I don't see LA as being rude, just pointing out the obvious.

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 162
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 2:56:45 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		I'm not saying she does or doesn't have issues.  I don't know the girl.

I do know that it's more productive to give honest advice in a friendly or neutral tone than to say basically "you're fucked up, go fix yourself before you try to date anyone."  That just seems so unneccessary.  To be honest everyone has issues - men too.  It won't help a relationship to convince a girl all the relationship issues stem from her.

I heard a great piece of advice once that said basically a good relationship isn't about having no issues or baggage but rather finding someone whose issues and baggage is compatible with your own.  I mean come on now.  Buddha left his wife and Christ never took one.  I'm not looking for a perfect man and I can never be a perfect woman - but in a good relationship we bring out the best in each other.

(in reply to bandit25)
Profile   Post #: 163
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:01:32 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Sure, honest and friendly advice is always good.

But you can only give the same exact advice a handful of times, until you realize that the person isn't asking for 'advice'; they're asking for help in crucifying the wooden man, or cracking open another gallon of ben and jerry's because she's done the same foolish thing....again.... for the tenth time.

Not everyone wants to learn from their mistakes.  Sometimes that needs to be pointed out as well.

Stephan


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 164
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:01:35 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		That's why I said to go and read some of her past posts.  And yes, I believe I said that everyone has issues...I certainly wasn't singling her out.  I don't believe LA said that all the relationship issues stem from her.  I think what she said was the DBG might want to take a step back and figure out why she tends to attract these types of men and why she reacts to them.

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 165
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:05:32 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		Exactly.  Course I tend to agree with most of what you say!

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 166
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:07:05 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		Well I agree with that completely.

But...

Isn't it nicer to first of all address that person rather than the forum ("Defiant, you might want to look at your own issues with males and sex" vs. "Defiant is well known to have issues with males and sex") and second of all give advice that can actually be followed? "Don't date men until you understand them"???? - I still don't understand "men" as a whole...I've gotten to understand certain men in my life but I can't explain the nature of the beast any more than men can understand women as a whole.

Advice like "get to know a man before getting attached" is far more productive than "understand men before you date them" but still I guess my biggest issue was how she addressed the forum to say "this girl has issues" rather than tell the person herself "you might want to work on this."

That's what I thought was rude.

(in reply to bandit25)
Profile   Post #: 167
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:13:30 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bandit25

Exactly.  Course I tend to agree with most of what you say!


Dammit, it's too early to make me blush.

shoshi,

The 'suggestion' that she look at her own issues has actually been made at least a dozen times.  I'd be happy to do a little research to show you that fact if you like.  Many included advice that would have been easy to follow. 

This is why we say she has issues.  It's not a personal attack on her so much (I think) as it is a public service announcement that it's not likely that anything we tell her will change her approach.

Regards,

Stephan




_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to bandit25)
Profile   Post #: 168
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:16:48 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		That's fine...I'm not saying the information present in the "public service announcement" is incorrect.

I'm just saying making a public service announcement that a person has issues is rude.  Cuz it is.  Even if it's true.  If you've 'given up' on advising a person, feel free to stop advising them.  Christ, feel free to make a PA about it...but just don't convince yourself it's a polite thing to do to that person.

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 169
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:17:02 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		Maybe, but like Stepahnn said, not everyone really wants advice...they just want someone to agree with their point of view. 

< Message edited by bandit25 -- 9/18/2007 3:19:47 AM >

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 170
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:24:03 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		As far as blushing,  woo hoo for me!

We may be talking apples and oranges here. .

"but just don't convince yourself it's a polite thing to do to that person"  I don't think LA thought she was being polite and I don't know that I think it was particularly polite, but I don't think it was rude either.  As I've said, we all have issues...myself included.  If someone wants to point that out to me on a public message board...have at it!

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 171
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:25:59 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		Some people just want a shoulder to cry on too...you don't have to offer your own shoulder but you certainly don't have to throw them in the mud and say "cry about that bitch" 

If someone asks me for advice I will either give them advice or say I have no clue what I would advise in that situation.  Even if it goes in one ear and out the other I still believe in treating a person with respect...and you never know.  Maybe it's the five thousand and first time they hear it that will click.  Or maybe the first time they hear it, from someone they really respect who they feel understands them, it will click.

Meh.  It's late anyway.  I'm probably reading way too much into this.

(in reply to bandit25)
Profile   Post #: 172
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:29:42 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		LOL!  I hardly equate a public message board to throwing someone in the mud!  This is the internet...the advice on any of these boards is worth just about what you pay for it.  Anyone with access to a PC and an ISP can say whatever he or she wants as you well know.  Take what advice you find helpful and leave the rest...I don't remember who said it, but it's about the most helpful advice I've ever read.


(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 173
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:31:13 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Speaking of Advice....

I'll agree, it's not really polite to say someone has issues.  I do see the value in alerting the public message board at large that the person posting has a biased opinion though.

I think the truth is, though, that (possibly) LA and (certainly) I feel badly for her in her lack of willingness to learn from the past.  That's a whole other ball of wax though.

Stephan

< Message edited by Stephann -- 9/18/2007 3:36:55 AM >

_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 174
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:33:03 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		LOL I know...I was just saying...just because you don't want to help doesn't mean you have to be mean about it.  I guess it's more like saying "Aww don't cry...it makes your face look all puffy and ugly and you aren't that cute to begin with."

Although that might make me laugh instead of cry.  So that's probably an even worse analogy.

Ugh.  I can't believe I'm actually telling people on the internet to be polite.  I really should know better

(in reply to bandit25)
Profile   Post #: 175
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:36:31 AM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline 		I like that thread.  I think this quote from TotalMaster4you says it best:

quote:

Over time we learn we can't help or save everyone. We can only help those that ask and are ready to hear the truth.


I'm still not going to judge whether someone is 'ready' or not...if they're asking, I will assume they are.  Even if they asked twelve times before.  Because maybe this time they are.

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 176
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:38:15 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		Zackly.  And I know that would make me laugh!  So it's a good thing. 

You do know better .  It's just pretty easy to get caught up.  Have a great day.

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 177
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:38:49 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Sometimes saving the world helps us save ourselves.

I readily admit, I believe I've inflicted infinately more good upon myself in offering advice and thoughts to others, than others have received in reading my dis-jointed bullshit.

M. Landers


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 178
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:40:56 AM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline 		I agree with disjointed bullshit?  Now, Stephann, don't go destroying my image of you as advice giver extraordinairre!

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 179
RE: I screwed up big time. - 9/18/2007 3:44:38 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Make a career out of substandard performance, and you'll never worry about being rich.

That means the fucking Feds won't have their hand in your pocket quite so often.  That, and slaves will love you for you, and not your money. 

The Pauper


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to bandit25)
Profile   Post #: 180
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