RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (Full Version)

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SixFootMaster -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 9:35:32 PM)

You're losing track of details again. I said I interview nearly every woman I meet who is open to it, online, offline, public, private. 



silkenfire -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 9:43:59 PM)

Oh, I've had play like that since but something was different the one time. I guess maybe it was emotionally charged enough for me not to be able to have explained it very well in my original posting. I apologize.

I suppose it was all mental and the realization that [[this is sort of twisted]] that if he had wanted to kill me I would have willingly kneeled for the experience. I guess in my mind this breaking was more of an end to one way of thinking. I also know that I'll never respect and/or fully submit to anyone again that can't take me to that same place. Not to mean that I can't partially submit and/or have long term relationships-- I've had both since, but never fully dominated. Maybe it was that it was the tipping point between rough play and knowing that he was my master in every sense of the word. It's the turning point that made it special, and further play that was as brutal didn't have the same connotations to me.

I do realize I have a different image of broken and I'm not trying to shove mine out on you all, only to further explain what I was trying to say the first time.



quote:

ORIGINAL: RRafe

quote:

ORIGINAL: NControlofU

I don't call this breaking a sub. I call this a good time on any given day in the life of me and my slave. It looks like you did return at some point or you woulnt be here now writing about your experience. And you did move on. You were still emotionally yourself and you have a happy memory of the event. So what about you was broken by being whipped and tortured to the point of screming and crying out and tears running down your face? Shit, if my slave was broken just by crying and screaming she would be broken several times a week. Guess we have a differnt idea of what being broken is.
quote:

ORIGINAL: silkenfire
To me, I was broken once. It was emotionally intense. But what I mean by broken is tortured and whipped, etc, to the point of no return. To the point of screaming and crying out and tears running down my face. The ultimate giving in until it could not go any further. That whipping that just goes so much farther than anything else and truly shows that side of me that was submitting to Him. I was emotionally myself. But I was then *His* and will always have a soft spot for him because of what he made me, even though it was long ago and we have both moved on. When someone says breaking a sub, that's what I think of-- and it's a happy memory.



Yes. To me, breaking implies breaking through-something. Not just a brief session of emotional intensity. So if there was no lasting effect-what changed?




NControlofU -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 9:48:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

I'd say from her post that there was a lasting effect.

quote:

But I was then *His* and will always have a soft spot for him because of what he made me


I wouldn't say it was a complete breaking, but it was a definite letting go and yeilding of the will.

Edited to add: What is being broken here is resistance.


Well it sounds like it was just a temporary break and what was broken was later unbroken and her will came back since they "have both moved on".  So where's the lasting effect?  I dont see letting go and yeilding to the will the same as being broken.  My slave has been yeilding to my will since before we had our first meeting and I didnt have to do a thing to break her.  She was whole and unbroken and ready, willing and able to yeild to my will and she still is without me having to do a thing to break her.  Why would there be a need to break a slave's resistance?  If she's resistant to yeilding to her master's will and to serve what kind of slave is she?  Who wants a resistant slave?



SixFootMaster -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 9:57:18 PM)

The lasting effect is the change in her that persists now, as stated, she will never submit to a man who cannot take her to the same place again.

FWIW, and this is just my opinion and theory [:D]

A slave is naturally resistant, a submissive is naturally yielding.



silkenfire -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 9:57:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: NControlofU

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

I'd say from her post that there was a lasting effect.

quote:

But I was then *His* and will always have a soft spot for him because of what he made me


I wouldn't say it was a complete breaking, but it was a definite letting go and yeilding of the will.

Edited to add: What is being broken here is resistance.


Well it sounds like it was just a temporary break and what was broken was later unbroken and her will came back since they "have both moved on". So where's the lasting effect? I dont see letting go and yeilding to the will the same as being broken. My slave has been yeilding to my will since before we had our first meeting and I didnt have to do a thing to break her. She was whole and unbroken and ready, willing and able to yeild to my will and she still is without me having to do a thing to break her. Why would there be a need to break a slave's resistance? If she's resistant to yeilding to her master's will and to serve what kind of slave is she? Who wants a resistant slave?



If he had ever asked me to stay I would have; I was his at that time. Now I have become attached to others and have submitted enough to others that I would not have hurt them to return to him. However, at the time this happened, it was really casual play. I suppose a friends-with-benefits, but in the BDSM realm. He was involved with someone else, is currently married to his collared sub (wasn't married then, nor was she collared).

I also do not mainly identify as a slave but more of a submissive instead. I know that I don't give in completely in all fashions and would be horrible at 24/7 TPE (unless for just a weekend, etc...) so breaking me was not to break me into a slave. I wonder if he ever realized that I would have been his slave without a shadow of a doubt, at that time... I never had the courage to tell him what it meant to me.

And as I have said that I have moved on, I certainly won't tell him at this point in my life because I'm looking for someone myself, not a foolish grasp into the past of someone I cared for years ago.



NControlofU -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 10:07:54 PM)

I have gone through many changes in my life that persist and no one ever broke me.  Most every major event in m y life has caused a lasting effect in me that persists.  She had a very nice experience that sounds like a heavy dose of subspace and she enjoyed it and would like to repeat that feeling.  That doesnt say to me that she was broken by the experience.

A submissive is naturally yeilding and a slave is naturally resistant?  That doesnt fit with my experiences with slaves ans submissives.  If any thing I would say the opposite would be more true but still not in every case.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

The lasting effect is the change in her that persists now, as stated, she will never submit to a man who cannot take her to the same place again.

FWIW, and this is just my opinion and theory [:D]

A slave is naturally resistant, a submissive is naturally yielding.



NControlofU -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 10:10:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: silkenfire

I do realize I have a different image of broken and I'm not trying to shove mine out on you all, only to further explain what I was trying to say the first time.


THis is true and if you feel that you were broken by what you say is a very happy memory, then I guess you were.  Glad to hear you enjoyed your breaking so much.



RRafe -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 10:15:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: silkenfire


quote:

ORIGINAL: NControlofU

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

I'd say from her post that there was a lasting effect.

quote:

But I was then *His* and will always have a soft spot for him because of what he made me


I wouldn't say it was a complete breaking, but it was a definite letting go and yeilding of the will.

Edited to add: What is being broken here is resistance.


Well it sounds like it was just a temporary break and what was broken was later unbroken and her will came back since they "have both moved on". So where's the lasting effect? I dont see letting go and yeilding to the will the same as being broken. My slave has been yeilding to my will since before we had our first meeting and I didnt have to do a thing to break her. She was whole and unbroken and ready, willing and able to yeild to my will and she still is without me having to do a thing to break her. Why would there be a need to break a slave's resistance? If she's resistant to yeilding to her master's will and to serve what kind of slave is she? Who wants a resistant slave?



If he had ever asked me to stay I would have; I was his at that time. Now I have become attached to others and have submitted enough to others that I would not have hurt them to return to him. However, at the time this happened, it was really casual play. I suppose a friends-with-benefits, but in the BDSM realm. He was involved with someone else, is currently married to his collared sub (wasn't married then, nor was she collared).

I also do not mainly identify as a slave but more of a submissive instead. I know that I don't give in completely in all fashions and would be horrible at 24/7 TPE (unless for just a weekend, etc...) so breaking me was not to break me into a slave. I wonder if he ever realized that I would have been his slave without a shadow of a doubt, at that time... I never had the courage to tell him what it meant to me.

And as I have said that I have moved on, I certainly won't tell him at this point in my life because I'm looking for someone myself, not a foolish grasp into the past of someone I cared for years ago.


But at least you know there is the possibility. Here is the closest that I have found-from past experiences of similar intensity. Barriers to transparency were broken.

The aftercare in this is critical. THAT is the time the walls are not just down-but in shattered bits. And that damned near anything I am curious about-any admission I want to have made-is open for my grasp. BUT-I need to be in a zen like enough state to not overlay my expectations and desires on top of that. I look for the base, the bedrock. The animal core from which all else arises-there I find real truth.

And once that has been opened, and I have the way to inhale that-everything changes-there is no going back.

And I'll tell you this much. It's never about power-I've never felt so humble-as to simply reach out an cup in my hands-the soul of another person.



SixFootMaster -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 10:16:23 PM)

For once, In total agreement, RRafe.



SixFootMaster -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/25/2007 10:22:24 PM)

A lot depends on the definition of slave and submissive you're using. Flip back to page 5, and you'll get some sort of idea of the differences that I'm using. I'm still hesitant to fully subscribe to the suggestion that she was "broken", but rather she did yeild fullly and without reservation, in that moment,  and as much as the term is abhored in these parts, I would say that she was totally submitted.





SixFootMaster -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 1:15:10 AM)

Rover, you have a private message, please read it before deleting



Rule -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 2:09:40 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster
It might seem contradictory , but what happened to you was - in my book at least - evil. I cannot express even partly the pain I feel just reading what was done to you, such things are an abomination and that is the true word for it, an abomination. The abuse of a slave, rather than rejoicing in her beauty and glory, supression and degredation. It makes me shudder.
Quite.
 
You were abused, twistedkytten. Your soul was damaged to the point of dying and your ego was suppressed as well. The reason that you kept a fragment of your ego was because you were in an abusive relationship, because you could not rely on your abuser to nourish your body and spirit and to keep you safe. All that was left of you was your ratio, who eventually decided that the appropriate action was to get out.
 
What happened to you was antithetical to the transformation of a natural slave into the Goddess of Slaves. In fact what happened to you was a sacrilege. The soul and the ratio of a natural slave are her priceless assets. Damaging either of them is comparable to crushing an exquisite diamond into worthless dust.
 
You were not 'broken' in the sense of being transformed, but in the sense of being severely damaged.



Rule -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 2:33:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: silkenfire

First, I don't have time to read the whole thread so I cannot swear that this is even pertinent.

I also realize this is "Ask a Master" but I feel like sharing a totally different view and definition than what I found in the few posts I did skim.

To me, I was broken once. It was emotionally intense. But what I mean by broken is tortured and whipped, etc, to the point of no return. To the point of screaming and crying out and tears running down my face. The ultimate giving in until it could not go any further. That whipping that just goes so much farther than anything else and truly shows that side of me that was submitting to Him. I was emotionally myself. But I was then *His* and will always have a soft spot for him because of what he made me, even though it was long ago and we have both moved on. When someone says breaking a sub, that's what I think of-- and it's a happy memory.

You are a submissive, not a natural slave. So what you experienced is not pertinent to the transformation of a natural slave into the Goddess of Slaves that SFM and I have commented on. In our opinion breaking the ego of a submissive is to turn her into a worthless husk, which is an abomination and a sacrilege.



SixFootMaster -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 2:41:15 AM)

Still, quite a lovely person to talk to. 



Rule -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 2:44:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

Then All's well and good.

No, all is not well and good.  Because you are not qualified in psychology or statistics, yet continually present yourself as if you were.  In fact, you're not qualified in any of the areas in which you have summoned up so much hot air.  
 
I think that you are not qualified to see rain fall - or do you have some university degree or other accreditation that says you do?



laurell3 -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 4:59:45 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: silkenfire

First, I don't have time to read the whole thread so I cannot swear that this is even pertinent.

I also realize this is "Ask a Master" but I feel like sharing a totally different view and definition than what I found in the few posts I did skim.

To me, I was broken once. It was emotionally intense. But what I mean by broken is tortured and whipped, etc, to the point of no return. To the point of screaming and crying out and tears running down my face. The ultimate giving in until it could not go any further. That whipping that just goes so much farther than anything else and truly shows that side of me that was submitting to Him. I was emotionally myself. But I was then *His* and will always have a soft spot for him because of what he made me, even though it was long ago and we have both moved on. When someone says breaking a sub, that's what I think of-- and it's a happy memory.

You are a submissive, not a natural slave. So what you experienced is not pertinent to the transformation of a natural slave into the Goddess of Slaves that SFM and I have commented on. In our opinion breaking the ego of a submissive is to turn her into a worthless husk, which is an abomination and a sacrilege.


Well slap a label on her and tell her she's not "pertinent" when she shares intimate details about her life...way to go Level....you've succeeded in proving the point that you lack the emotional maturity to be responsible for a persons feelings.



Rule -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 5:49:06 AM)

I appreciate that silkenfire shared intimate details about her life. However, being a submissive instead of a natural slave, her experience is not pertinent to the transformation that SFM and I have commented on.
 
To understand what SFM and I have been discussing one has to read all of our posts. Unlike you silkenfire herself is aware of that, as her first sentence was:

quote:

ORIGINAL:silkenfire
First, I don't have time to read the whole thread so I cannot swear that this is even pertinent.




TheChauvinist -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 6:53:03 AM)

Interesting. But since in the part of her post you quoted , she referenced the thread as a whole and the rest of her post is in the theme of the thread as a whole and not anything you or SFM had said or are going on about, one can easily reason that her post has nothing to do with you. Therefore, the only post that was not pertinent is your reply to silkenfire and consequent posts because of it. After-all, and I know this is difficult for you to comprehend but, it's not all about you or what you think, Rule. It always amazes me that self titled "super-geniuses" are always so narrow-minded.

I also find interesting that this thread as gone on and on over something that two guys can not even prove. Over conjecture. Useless rhetoric that has done nothing but stagnate this thread.



Rule -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 7:14:41 AM)

That is an excellent argument, TheC.
 
However, I have never said that what she said was not pertinent to the thread. I have always said that it was not pertinent to what SFM and I commented on in our posts.



TheChauvinist -> RE: Breaking a sub/slave? (10/26/2007 7:20:17 AM)

Touche.



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