bottom to be a better domme?

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

bottom to be a better domme?

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> bottom to be a better domme?

Page: [1] 2 3 4 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 11:30:24 AM

ocilla

Posts: 1764
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline

Soooo I allowed myself to be topped last weekend. Many advise that it is beneficila to all if a top or domme experience the other side of the kneel at least a few times. And as ropes in particular is something I am completely enamored of, it seemed to make even more sense to me...the woman who is teaching me ropes believes that one of the best ways to learn ties etc. is to feel it on your our own body. So the rope part was really cool although it felt like anything but bottoming...felt more educational.

But what I learned most from was the ambivilance I felt once tied up and things turned to activities that get done to the bottom who is imobilized in rope aka me. 3 folks were doing stuff two me...and it was sooo weird to be the subject and one of the men just made me pissed off and I just wanted to kick his ass...but I learned alot about my need to be dominant particularly with certain types of men which is interesting and useful.

My question is....
Do you think bottoming makes you a better domme? Have you or would you bottom in order to be a better domme? If you've done it what did you get out of it?

< Message edited by ocilla -- 12/17/2007 11:33:05 AM >

_____________________________

Ocilla

Nature is not a place to visit. It is home.
~ Gary Snyder

It takes a kinky village...

Post #: 1

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 12:28:44 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ocilla

Soooo I allowed myself to be topped last weekend. Many advise that it is beneficila to all if a top or domme experience the other side of the kneel at least a few times. And as ropes in particular is something I am completely enamored of, it seemed to make even more sense to me...the woman who is teaching me ropes believes that one of the best ways to learn ties etc. is to feel it on your our own body. So the rope part was really cool although it felt like anything but bottoming...felt more educational.

But what I learned most from was the ambivilance I felt once tied up and things turned to activities that get done to the bottom who is imobilized in rope aka me. 3 folks were doing stuff two me...and it was sooo weird to be the subject and one of the men just made me pissed off and I just wanted to kick his ass...but I learned alot about my need to be dominant particularly with certain types of men which is interesting and useful.

My question is....
Do you think bottoming makes you a better domme? Have you or would you bottom in order to be a better domme? If you've done it what did you get out of it?

Nope.

In fact that idea that learning to do rope bondage requires one to bottom to it or even that it helps seems just plain weird to me. How can having something tied around you or two you teach you how to do the tying?

I'm a firm believer in apprenticing to learn necessary SM or bondage skills myself, that's how I did it, but the entire "you must bottom first" mentally is just weird.

Do we require bottoms or subs to top or dom before they sub or bottom? Wouldn't they learn more that way too? If it's useful for one group why isn't useful for the other?

Plus I'm suspicious that this idea hides a devaluation of the bottom/sub position by placing it as a sort of learning ground for anyone regardless of their own desires and leanings. I do know from talking to older members of the community that in the past when this mentally was more widely accepted, a top often felt like he had to hide the fact that he still liked bottoming. Switching was some sign of weakness I suppose or perhaps the idea was that topping was superior so why would anyone i their right mind want to do the inferior thing. That's just damned insulting in my opinion.

To cap this entire tirade off (I guess you can all see strongly I feel about this topic, huh?) the worst tops or doms I've ever had the misfortune to meet or get to know where those who did the entire "start on bottom" thing. They lack the basic requirement of empathy and if their partners didn't react exactly as they themselves would then that person was lacking or at fault. The concept that each person is different and processes things differently was foreign to those people.

One does not need to have an experience to empathize or sympathize with those going through an experience. The ability to admit one's limits and weaknesses, find and follow through on learning, and standing up for one's self and one's sub are the things you can have regardless of what roles you've been in.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 2

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 12:36:29 PM

ocilla

Posts: 1764
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline

Well, I know full and well my reaction was not in anyway similar to the reaction of those I have topped. Being topped taught me more about how ingrained and inseparable my dominance is...I do not see how that is going to help me have better understanding for what a sub is experiencing.

Thanks for your response. As always its is very insightful and helpful. I agree with the apprenticeship method, it has worked well for me in other areas of my life too.

< Message edited by ocilla -- 12/17/2007 12:46:55 PM >

_____________________________

Ocilla

Nature is not a place to visit. It is home.
~ Gary Snyder

It takes a kinky village...

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 3

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 12:40:03 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

I am a very experiential person, so I have "tried" most things. I bottomed very heavily, in search of the elusive subspace. What did I learn? Well, that I don't have a submissive bone in my body, pretty much. That I love to be tied! That I suck at "guess the toy". That souvenir marks ROCK.

Did it make me a better dominant? I hesitate to leap in and say no, because I am sure that I gained a lot from what I did. But, I already was a very empathetic person. I was essentially raised to serve (I suspect Tammyjo can relate to my grandmother-mother-daughter dynamic) so I understand what is and is not reasonable in terms of expectations. It is virtually impossible to humiliate me (ah, childhood! so helpful...) so I didn't gain any insight there. And I am not an endorphin producer, so no subspace for me!

There are some serious jerks out there who have no variable setting on their play. They lack finesse, they think that starting a scene at full out caning is the way to go, and see no problem with their methods. Would bottoming help them? I doubt it highly. Unfortunately, I don't even think it would help them appreciate their playmates more.

At the same time, I admit that I feel a tiny bit superior to those folks who just recoil at the very IDEA that a flogger touch their skin. Those folks make me LAUGH big time. What are they afraid of, that they will lose their union cards? Sure, we don't have the desire, the wiring, the whatever to submit. We have no urge to bottom. No need for a gross-out, just a no, thank you.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 4

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 12:47:24 PM

canupleaseme

Posts: 775
Joined: 7/9/2006
Status: offline

After I had worked in a dungeon for a couple of years and had a few play partners I decided I wanted a proper relationship and went all out to find out everything I coud about myself and the lifestyle. Having never been sub I decided I would have a session as a sub/bottom. I tried it and learnt a lot from the experience and also hated it. I felt that by being on the other end of it I could understand better what goes through a persons mind when they ae doing that. I imagine its much better if your a bottom lol though I did understand better how much of an inpact some play can have on you mentally. I came away with better knowledge. I also came away with an extreme fear of canes. Unfortunatly I didnt pick my top very well. I never onced used my safeword out of stubborness and hated the whole experience! I wouldnt ever do it again. I am definatly Domme lol. I wouldnt change the experience though, I feel its definatly helped me be a better domme in my relationship. But I reakon I would of gotten there anyway sooner or later without the experience too.

_____________________________

Proud mistress

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 5

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 12:53:48 PM

ocilla

Posts: 1764
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline

I really appreciate the insights being shared on this topic. Very helpful.

_____________________________

Ocilla

Nature is not a place to visit. It is home.
~ Gary Snyder

It takes a kinky village...

(in reply to canupleaseme)

Post #: 6

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 1:05:16 PM

Politesub53

Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

Ocilla...... Bottoming would show You what its like to be shouted at to do the dishes, and not even get laid.... A lesson in the lowly life of subbie males......

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 7

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 1:10:54 PM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

Because of the reasons I bottomed, it made me a better PERSON. Same thing about the times I was in service. I am now a better Master because I am a better person.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
-----
BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 8

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 3:20:47 PM

LadyHugs

Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Dear ocilla, Ladies and Gentlemen;

My own experiences began from being a slave for a number of years. I do not mean weekend scene playes but, living as a slave. More everyday chores and not the glammor or the playing in the dungeon every day and or sitting on my beehind.

I have learned more from the slave side than most perhaps, as when I did enter the lifestyle, there were no SWITCHING allowed unless you had completed one year of slavery--if you wished to become a Master, that is when you 'phased' into a status of Master-in-Training. That year you could continue on as a Master or, return as a slave--without judgment and or criticism. Sometimes being in a different experience determines if you are meant to be Dominant or submissive.

I have not had the desire or need to be slave ever since I phased into the Master realm but, my memories and experience as a slave gives me a wealth of knowledge, skill and real practical application when it comes to my mastery.

Life is a continual lesson--I don't stop learning and or refreshing what I have learned in life to date.

Just some thoughts.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

< Message edited by LadyHugs -- 12/17/2007 3:23:20 PM >

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 9

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 5:28:39 PM

Shawn1066

Posts: 987
Joined: 10/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ocilla

Soooo I allowed myself to be topped last weekend. Many advise that it is beneficila to all if a top or domme experience the other side of the kneel at least a few times. And as ropes in particular is something I am completely enamored of, it seemed to make even more sense to me...the woman who is teaching me ropes believes that one of the best ways to learn ties etc. is to feel it on your our own body. So the rope part was really cool although it felt like anything but bottoming...felt more educational.

But what I learned most from was the ambivilance I felt once tied up and things turned to activities that get done to the bottom who is imobilized in rope aka me. 3 folks were doing stuff two me...and it was sooo weird to be the subject and one of the men just made me pissed off and I just wanted to kick his ass...but I learned alot about my need to be dominant particularly with certain types of men which is interesting and useful.

My question is....
Do you think bottoming makes you a better domme? Have you or would you bottom in order to be a better domme? If you've done it what did you get out of it?

Would topping make me a better slave? I just don't see how people think bottoming makes you a better dominant. I mean, I know some submissives who've been around for years and years...and, you know what, they'd absolutely fall apart of they had to top anybody.

I believe something pulls me to be submissive. It's an urge that's been around for as long as I can remember. A dominant doesn't understand that perspective. They have a different urge. They can wear my shoes, but they can't replicate my mindset. So, in essence, I don't think they'd learn too much...if anything...though I concede the possibility. I just think the innate differences make it impossible for a dominant to truly understand how I feel. It's akin to expecting somebody Vanilla to understand what any of us feel. They can't...in any true sense of the matter...they can merely vaguely relate.

But such is just my two cents on the matter.

< Message edited by Shawn1066 -- 12/17/2007 5:36:50 PM >

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 10

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 5:32:32 PM

aidan

Posts: 904
Joined: 5/28/2005
Status: offline

Naaaah, I've subbed to women who've never entertained switching sides a day in their lives. Don't think it's a problem.

Can it give insight or a different experience? Sure. Is it quantifiably better? I think not.

_____________________________

Do what now?

"I aim to misbehave."
-Mal Reynolds

(in reply to Shawn1066)

Post #: 11

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 6:09:30 PM

Blyght

Posts: 78
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ocilla

My question is....
Do you think bottoming makes you a better domme? Have you or would you bottom in order to be a better domme? If you've done it what did you get out of it?

Hello Ocilla,

I feel that bottoming did not make me a better dominant (but then again, it only happened once).

During my one experience I handled restraints, a good flogging and some sensation play. All it did was piss me off and make the top very confused and uncomfortable because I could not eroticize pain, being restrained or the giving over of control. There was no beauty in my anguish, but at least my time under the flogger didn't ruin my relationship with the top in question. I saw that it was difficult for him to continue at times when he was not able to draw anything from me emotionally. Even though it was not a pleasurable experience, it was a memorable one and I am all about the memories. =]

The experience made me even more certain that I adore the dance of one who offers his masochism to my sadism.

_____________________________

Irony is the last bastion of reason in the face of insanity

(in reply to ocilla)

Post #: 12

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 6:21:18 PM

ShaktiSama

Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

I had to try it, like pretty much every other thing in life that other people seemed to enjoy, for fear that I was missing something. I have no idea whether trying it made me a better top, but I'm pretty sure that the willingness to try it makes me a better top. Call it sensual curiosity...

(in reply to Blyght)

Post #: 13

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 6:44:20 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

Blyght, you reminded me of a time at a big Chicago party... a top pal was in our suite, and I asked to feel this supercosmic long flogger. He was whaling away at me, and then he asked if I was enjoying myself. "No!" I said, startled. "I'm done!" he replied. Little shit! lol

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 14

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 7:42:56 PM

PanthersMom

Posts: 2215
Joined: 11/26/2007
From: Cleveland Ohio
Status: offline

i think experiencing life as a sub made ME a better person, but it's not something that everyone can or should do. i grew into the dominant role after finding my submissiveness had some pretty hard limits. i find that having that experience has helped me understand some of where subs come from mentally, and maybe that's made a difference in the dominant i am, but i would not say it's sometiung everyone should do.

PM

_____________________________

That which does not kill me, better run pretty damn fast

I miss my ex, but my aim is improving!

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 15

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 7:51:47 PM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Blyght, you reminded me of a time at a big Chicago party... a top pal was in our suite, and I asked to feel this supercosmic long flogger. He was whaling away at me, and then he asked if I was enjoying myself. "No!" I said, startled. "I'm done!" he replied. Little shit! lol

I had a similar experience I wanted to experience the supreme whip master at the local club, guaranteed to put you in subspace. He layed out all his tools.. strung me up and wailed away for about 15 minutes before he stopped. I looked up wondering why? With his brow beaded in sweat he said "I can't break though your top-space!" I was just relaxed and studying his technique technique. Poor baby!

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 16

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 7:56:53 PM

DarkDaddyZ

Posts: 805
Joined: 4/7/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

Because of the reasons I bottomed, it made me a better PERSON. Same thing about the times I was in service. I am now a better Master because I am a better person.

Master Fire

I know this is in the ask a Domme category and I hope no daggers are sent my way but I feel the same way Master Fire does and I also relate to what Lady Hugs said. I knew that sexually that there were somethings that turned me on that many consider (bottoming) but that I didn't really want to submit. However, I did submit to 2 Mistresses with the hope of learning how to be a better owner and I believe that it helped me. Mentally and physically.

Z-

_____________________________

"Flirting is part of the job description." DJ Jesus (Lucy Daughter Of The Devil)

Vanilla Official Music Page http://www.myspace.com/djzulu

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 17

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/17/2007 8:10:35 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

If it made Me a better Domme, that's probably because, like others have said, it made Me a better person. The more I learn, the more I become. The more I help to teach (as some of My bottoming experiences have been for) the more knowledge I share.

There are benefits to bottoming, even if it's just to say that it was an experience to learn from. Even if that lesson is to say it isn't for you or your not wired that way. Kind of makes you appreciate those who are.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to DarkDaddyZ)

Post #: 18

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/18/2007 5:10:00 AM

ElanSubdued

Posts: 1511
Status: offline

Shawn (Shawn1066),

quote:

Shawn1066:
Would topping make me a better slave? I just don't see how people think bottoming makes you a better dominant. I mean, I know some submissives who've been around for years and years... and, you know what, they'd absolutely fall apart of they had to top anybody.

People are indeed very different. I'm a man who is, at his core, a submissive. This hasn't stopped me from topping people and indeed I've been the dominant in a few of my relationships. If someone asked me to top them, as long as I felt appropriate chemistry between us, I'd have no problem at all.

quote:

Shawn1066:
I believe something pulls me to be submissive. It's an urge that's been around for as long as I can remember. A dominant doesn't understand that perspective. They have a different urge. They can wear my shoes, but they can't replicate my mindset. So, in essence, I don't think they'd learn too much... if anything... though I concede the possibility. I just think the innate differences make it impossible for a dominant to truly understand how I feel. It's akin to expecting somebody Vanilla to understand what any of us feel. They can't... in any true sense of the matter... they can merely vaguely relate.

I see where you're coming from here, but this is much too broad a brushstroke with which to describe the motivations and understandings of all dominants, submissives, and even vanilla people for that matter. My own experiences as a dominant have helped me immensely as a submissive. Experiencing some of the responsibilities of the top side gave me much better understanding and empathy for my (dominant) partner's needs. Now I'll agree, my headspace and approach may have been different from those who identify as dominant, but this didn't make my experiences less valuable and certainly no less rewarding. The notion that there is a unique dominant or submissive urge seems unlikely. Those who decide to lead are motivated by many different things. Similarly, there are as many differing types of leaders as there are differing followers. Each learns, communicates, and makes their way through life in their own way. While sampling the other side may not work for some, others (such as myself) find it an excellent way of learning by "walking a bit in someone else's shoes".

Lady Pact wrote something that resonates with my own experiences:

(Note, Lady Pact is writing from the perspective of a dominant. Flip the roles around and this speaks equally well for me as a submissive.)

quote:

LadyPact:
If it made Me a better Domme, that's probably because, like others have said, it made Me a better person. The more I learn, the more I become. The more I help to teach (as some of My bottoming experiences have been for) the more knowledge I share. There are benefits to bottoming, even if it's just to say that it was an experience to learn from. Even if that lesson is to say it isn't for you or you're not wired that way. Kind of makes you appreciate those who are.

Bingo. :-)

Elan.

(in reply to Shawn1066)

Post #: 19

RE: bottom to be a better domme? - 12/18/2007 5:15:15 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

Blyght, I can completely relate.

I tried bottoming or submitting just twice, both times with someone who I completely trusted and frankly nothing happened either times because as soon as the blindfold went on me the unconscious vibes I was sending scared the top.

I was totally unaware of my raw negative reactions. I just thought I was waiting patiently and trying to stay focused on doing what I was told and processing sensations.

The only it taught me was that either it is completely not me or it triggers too many abuse memories to be possible.

Perhaps it increased my respect for people who do bottom or submit but I had a very high level of respect for them anyway. Now I simply know that some of them can do things that I cannot and that makes them powerful and attractive people in my eyes.

< Message edited by thetammyjo -- 12/18/2007 5:17:46 AM >

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to Blyght)

Post #: 20

Page: [1] 2 3 4 next > >>

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> bottom to be a better domme?

Page: [1] 2 3 4 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.094