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Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 5:32:17 PM   
Kostly


Posts: 60
Joined: 1/1/2004
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I am new to a relationship with a submissive I care deeply for.  I feel trapped.  This is the first relationship that I have had in BDSM, where I can find myself falling in love with this woman.  I am so confused for the emotions have made everything flippy floppy!

There is some things that I LOVE.  Buttplugs are one of my FAVORITE toys.  However my submissive is finding it very difficult and it seems to me that the limited usage of these Toys are a major difference in how we play.  She has gone so far as to say "Maybe I am not the submissive for you!".  I am flexible and well educated in this area of play, and have done allot of research so I realize the issues at hand.  In addition my submissive has hemeroids, which I found to be not a major issue in this type of play.  I keep telling her that with practice and training that these toys can stop hurting and become pleasurable.  I would like to train her in this area of play.

There seems to be more underlining questions within this relationship.  My submissive is a heavy Masochist who likes splankings.  However when it comes to tight bondage or longer term disconfort she starts to complain.  I had brought up this complaining issue with her in the past, and it seems to have stopped except for more larger issues.

Sex is not everything to me in these relationships, but where and how do balance what she likes with what you like, yet not loose her as a friend and lover.
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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 5:41:00 PM   
hisannabelle


Posts: 1992
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL, USA
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greetings kostly,

to me this isn't a question of balancing pleasure at all. plenty of people have pleasure from each other regardless of the fact that the other party may have limits or physical limitations. the problem to me is more that you are working with one idea in mind and she is working with another - it seems like you two need to figure out what getting on the same page would mean for you, and if you're willing to do that.

the question would be, how much of her limitations is she willing to compromise and how much of your desires are you willing to compromise? because if you can't find a middle ground on those things, she is going to end up hurt because she feels like she's not pleasing you and that you are pushing her, and you are going to end up upset because you feel she's denying you these pleasures. i am not going to say i think she's being unreasonable - i can understand not wanting butt plugs or tighter bondage myself, although i usually do those things, but just because someone assures you "everything is going to be okay" or tries to justify doing it doesn't necessarily make it easier or more appealing. the problem may be that her definition of submitting to you means she is able to voice her worries and complaints, and also stop at a certain point, and your definition of being submitted to is different. my advice would be to talk about that.

respectfully,
annabelle.


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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 5:59:22 PM   
DesFIP


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Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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Have you been to a colonorectal specialist to ask if butt plugs with hemorrhoids is a good idea? Because I don't think it is. Instead of ignoring the fact that she's in pain, why not help her seek/pay for medical help?

Quite honestly, you're not a doctor and the fact that you're insisting on something she doesn't feel capable of, to a point where she's saying you're incompatible, doesn't seem a good way to prove yourself trustworthy or having her best interests in mind.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 6:17:10 PM   
Kostly


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do research online to ask for safety issues regarding them, disconfort, etc...  I have

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 6:19:13 PM   
MystressDream


Posts: 345
Joined: 7/11/2004
From: Colorado
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Have you been to a colonorectal specialist to ask if butt plugs with hemorrhoids is a good idea? Because I don't think it is. Instead of ignoring the fact that she's in pain, why not help her seek/pay for medical help?

Quite honestly, you're not a doctor and the fact that you're insisting on something she doesn't feel capable of, to a point where she's saying you're incompatible, doesn't seem a good way to prove yourself trustworthy or having her best interests in mind.


I completely agree with this post.  If your "pleasure" is having her use butt plugs, and she is not physically capable of it, then is that a deal breaker for your relationship??
 
You need to sit down and talk to her.  Not about the plugs... without medical attention, you are way out of line requiring that of her.... but, about the relationship dynamics in general.  If she has had a prior Dom, they may have had the understanding that she would voice objections, etc.  If that is not what you want to have happen, then you need to make that clear to her.  Considering your trying to force her to use toys that are extremely painful due to a medical condition that you know about, I don't doubt that she feels the need to be vocal about what she does or doesn't like. 
 
This all comes down to some level of compassion, intelligence, and communication.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 6:22:02 PM   
daddyncherry


Posts: 656
Joined: 10/9/2007
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Hi to the OP....i was going to send you a message regarding this, something i have experience with, that might be helpful, but alas, you have no profile account to message you.

Edited to add: If you make a profile feel free to message me on the other side if you feel like it.


< Message edited by daddyncherry -- 12/20/2007 6:23:38 PM >


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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 6:23:32 PM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kostly

I am new to a relationship with a submissive I care deeply for.  I feel trapped.  This is the first relationship that I have had in BDSM, where I can find myself falling in love with this woman.  I am so confused for the emotions have made everything flippy floppy!

There is some things that I LOVE.  Buttplugs are one of my FAVORITE toys.  However my submissive is finding it very difficult and it seems to me that the limited usage of these Toys are a major difference in how we play.  She has gone so far as to say "Maybe I am not the submissive for you!".  I am flexible and well educated in this area of play, and have done allot of research so I realize the issues at hand.  In addition my submissive has hemeroids, which I found to be not a major issue in this type of play.  I keep telling her that with practice and training that these toys can stop hurting and become pleasurable.  I would like to train her in this area of play.

There seems to be more underlining questions within this relationship.  My submissive is a heavy Masochist who likes splankings.  However when it comes to tight bondage or longer term disconfort she starts to complain.  I had brought up this complaining issue with her in the past, and it seems to have stopped except for more larger issues.

Sex is not everything to me in these relationships, but where and how do balance what she likes with what you like, yet not loose her as a friend and lover.



Dude, I cannot tolerate such selfish crap like this. You are not a medical specialist. Your girl should go to her own doctor to determine if these practices are ok for her to do IF she wants them. If she is finding it difficult to use them, you may have to find another compromise. I love butt plugs but fuck, if had hemmorrhoids I would tell you to shove it yourself if you insisted.

Just because she identifies with being a heavy masochist for spankings, does not mean she would like long term bondage, for example.

I think you are overstating your expertise in areas which you are not qualified to judge. Anal play is great, but there are certain things to be careful about and you need to acknowledge that. Just because you say your Dom and she is sub, does not mean everything you know is right.

(in reply to Kostly)
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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 6:59:08 PM   
Kostly


Posts: 60
Joined: 1/1/2004
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wow,  first any medical condition that would prevent any type of play would be regarded as harmfull in my mind and thus would not be a issue.  I am well educated in anal play, and have read quite a bit.  I have suggested she talks to her doctor about it.  In fact she loves anal sex, just seems to be the frequency she does it, or uses toys.  I am aware that she can not handle multiple anal sex sessions within a few days, and have no problem accepting that, I would be even give up these toys all together if that is the only issue.  But I guess you have already jumped over everything about me and my relationship and have deviced your own set of pre-conceived notions of who and what I am.  I hope you enjoy thoose perceptions of me.

The question was also about balance; which is the deeper harder question to answer.  Many submissives seem to have a tough time acknowledging this issue, because they dont face it directly.  I have seen many abused subs that would do anything and everything well beyond what is reasonable limits.  I have also seen well cared for subs and subs that constantly Top their Doms over these issues.

In the end you get doms so tired of it, that they simply shut down their needs for romantic relationships and go into relationships that are purely selfish.  Really, us Doms hurt when our submissives complain.  When we make a mistake and do something that we shouldnt of, its worse then any punishment you subs have to face.  We sit there and hurt for days because we screwed up and had made a mistake.  No ones there to rescue us, and there is no rescue.  Then again do we give everything the sub wants and ignore our own needs, or do we do what we want and fuck the sub.  The answer is somewhere in the middle.  Understanding this is hard, and then our subs and we change and so does the balance.  So how do you find and maintain the balance?

I love you so I must beat you, humiliate you, tie you down, and make you do somethings you dont want to do.... mean while us loving Doms want to give the world to our loved ones.  We want to say, "Yes Hunny, you can have whatever you want!", but that doesnt make anyone happy:(


< Message edited by Kostly -- 12/20/2007 7:05:44 PM >

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:16:18 PM   
LittleWench


Posts: 265
Joined: 11/27/2007
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I have seen the pain and regret in my Owner's face when he has pushed me in areas I am not ready for yet, when he has made a mistake, but you are wrong, it is not worse than any punishment I have to face as a submissive when I make a mistake, whether that be punishment he hands me or my own internal dialogue because I too have fucked up.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:16:53 PM   
Kostly


Posts: 60
Joined: 1/1/2004
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I didnt come here looking to be flamed, but I figured that I could get a quick answer.  Didnt put all my ideas and life story in the original post... guess its just piss on the Dom.

The truth is that I care for subs, and I am tired of this BS all Doms are assholes.  Some of us are kind, caring, and even romantic.  Yet, there are many on this site that are not.  Judge me based on these others, do as you must.  I dont appreciate flame


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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:21:07 PM   
YourhandMyAss


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From: Sacramento
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Online is not a reliable source of information, and I think it's foolhardy to rely only on online saftey info. Speak to a real doctor, not rely on some online saftey info.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kostly

do research online to ask for safety issues regarding them, disconfort, etc...  I have

(in reply to Kostly)
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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:26:28 PM   
LittleWench


Posts: 265
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Well aren't we the martyr?  I didn't flame you.  I didn't make any assumptions about you based on anything other than the information you provided.  You said subs don't understand how much pain you feel when you make a mistake, and that pain is worse than any punishment we subs have to endure.  You are wrong.  

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:31:15 PM   
CelticPrince


Posts: 3613
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Status: offline
Lostly,

Ever had those things that your sub tells you of?

Very painbull and plugs will only make it worse. If your dedicated to ass play, then she may be right, she may not be the one for you.

CP

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:34:43 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kostly

I didnt come here looking to be flamed, but I figured that I could get a quick answer.  Didnt put all my ideas and life story in the original post... guess its just piss on the Dom.

The truth is that I care for subs, and I am tired of this BS all Doms are assholes.  Some of us are kind, caring, and even romantic.  Yet, there are many on this site that are not.  Judge me based on these others, do as you must.  I dont appreciate flame




People here don't actually say all Doms are assholes.  In fact, quite the contrary.  However, you posted indicating you are participating in an act she is reluctant to do that may have medical consequences for her.  Maybe it was the wording.  I don't know.  I would suggest laying off any anal activity and have her see a doctor.  Stressing hemorrhoids at all is not a good idea.  I don't believe these statements are actually true:  "In addition my submissive has hemeroids, which I found to be not a major issue in this type of play.  I keep telling her that with practice and training that these toys can stop hurting and become pleasurable." but may be wishful thinking on your part.  If just buttplugs are painful, that's probably not a good indication.  I'm not sure where you have done your research, but she should be doing it at her physician's office.

For me personally trust is built on the fact that my D type is not willing to take me somewhere I'm not ready to go even if I beg for it.  He is more likely to say no to me requesting something that isn't good for me than trying to convince me.  This is not the perception you are creating with this post and that is what people are responding to.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:39:59 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kostly


In the end you get doms so tired of it, that they simply shut down their needs for romantic relationships and go into relationships that are purely selfish.  Really, us Doms hurt when our submissives complain.  When we make a mistake and do something that we shouldnt of, its worse then any punishment you subs have to faceWe sit there and hurt for days because we screwed up and had made a mistake.  No ones there to rescue us, and there is no rescue.  Then again do we give everything the sub wants and ignore our own needs, or do we do what we want and fuck the sub.  The answer is somewhere in the middle.  Understanding this is hard, and then our subs and we change and so does the balance.  So how do you find and maintain the balance?



Dissapointment and regret aren't role based.  Stop saying one side is different than the other with regard to human emotion.  They aren't.  Yes, you do have someone to save you, your sub.  Stop focusing on your role and communicate.  Tell her and let her help you.  Trust me, there's no requirement that any role not be a human being.

You find balance by leading.  Protect her interests well.  Learn her limitations.  Listen to what she has to say.  Encourage her to tell you what is wrong instead of seeing it as whining and complaining.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:47:52 PM   
bandit25


Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
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What the hell are you talking about?  Your girl hurts, she tells you she hurts and you tell her she'll get used to it?  What's that all about?  And I agree that your pain isn't worse.  I'm not saying hers is either, but you really need to get over yourself.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:51:17 PM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kostly

I am new to a relationship with a submissive I care deeply for.  I feel trapped.  This is the first relationship that I have had in BDSM, where I can find myself falling in love with this woman.  I am so confused for the emotions have made everything flippy floppy!

There is some things that I LOVE.  Buttplugs are one of my FAVORITE toys.  However my submissive is finding it very difficult and it seems to me that the limited usage of these Toys are a major difference in how we play.  She has gone so far as to say "Maybe I am not the submissive for you!".  I am flexible and well educated in this area of play, and have done allot of research so I realize the issues at hand.  In addition my submissive has hemeroids, which I found to be not a major issue in this type of play.  I keep telling her that with practice and training that these toys can stop hurting and become pleasurable.  I would like to train her in this area of play.

There seems to be more underlining questions within this relationship.  My submissive is a heavy Masochist who likes splankings.  However when it comes to tight bondage or longer term disconfort she starts to complain.  I had brought up this complaining issue with her in the past, and it seems to have stopped except for more larger issues.

Sex is not everything to me in these relationships, but where and how do balance what she likes with what you like, yet not loose her as a friend and lover.



Hell to my way of thinking new relationship and love do not belong in the same paragraph.  I appears to me that you have a lot more invested in the relationship than she does judging by her" I'm not the sub for you" comment.  It sounds as if your pushing your kinks on her <which I don't have a problem with> but she is not willing.  <which I do take issue with>   My ex would do as instructed not because she enjoied it she did it because she knew it brought me pleasure.  I would be looking for another sub that was more compatable with my kinks. 

BadOne


(in reply to Kostly)
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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 7:59:39 PM   
hisannabelle


Posts: 1992
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From: Tallahassee, FL, USA
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greetings kostly,

if you want advice, listen to it and discard what you don't feel like listening to. (or better yet, listen to the stuff that you really don't feel like listening to - it will probably do you more good.) why ask if you are not planning to at least consider the many very reasonable things that have been said?

regardless of what you may have personally read online or experienced - which does NOT give you the expertise to judge one particular individual's health by the way - there is no substitution for making sure your submissive goes to the doctor and discusses her health issues before continuing any play in that area, and making sure you take into account those issues accordingly. just because you may have read about it online or experienced something similar with someone else does not make you an expert, unfortunately. for example, my dominant has been with women who are pierced before; i've read a lot about piercings online; i know a lot of people with similar piercings to what i have. but nevertheless, when the issue came up of wearing my piercings in an mri, despite the negative things i was hearing from people around me and what i read online about the dangers, i discussed it with my piercer (who is licensed, a registered nurse, and has extensive experience professionally and personally with piercings and medical procedures), and his advice was the right advice but did not necessarily match up with what i "thought" i knew from what i'd read and talked to people about and experienced. the fact is, there is NEVER a substitute for a good professional opinion, regardless of what you think you know.

quote:

The question was also about balance; which is the deeper harder question to answer.  Many submissives seem to have a tough time acknowledging this issue, because they dont face it directly.  I have seen many abused subs that would do anything and everything well beyond what is reasonable limits.  I have also seen well cared for subs and subs that constantly Top their Doms over these issues.


i have no problem acknowledging this issue, because i do and have faced it directly. i know what i am willing to do and what i am not willing to do, and how far i am willing to go. i also have a fairly good idea of how far he likes to push me in some areas and not so good of an idea in others, but i want to learn. the fact that i go above and beyond what some may consider "reasonable" does not make me abused; i would call myself well-cared for, and topping from the bottom would have gotten me released a long time ago. did you not even read my first post? i thought i addressed your issues of balance. the fact is, you and your girl are not on the same page in terms of what you are expecting. she is expecting the right to set limits and have those limits be respected, regardless of how you may feel about them. she is expecting the right to voice opinions, concerns, and complaints. your expectations are clearly at odds with that; otherwise you wouldn't be having concerns about balance in the first place.

quote:

In the end you get doms so tired of it, that they simply shut down their needs for romantic relationships and go into relationships that are purely selfish.  Really, us Doms hurt when our submissives complain.  When we make a mistake and do something that we shouldnt of, its worse then any punishment you subs have to face.  We sit there and hurt for days because we screwed up and had made a mistake.  No ones there to rescue us, and there is no rescue.  Then again do we give everything the sub wants and ignore our own needs, or do we do what we want and fuck the sub.  The answer is somewhere in the middle.  Understanding this is hard, and then our subs and we change and so does the balance.  So how do you find and maintain the balance?


"us doms" is an insult, in my opinion, considering i know many dominants, including my own, who may not always agree with you. you cannot speak for anyone but yourself; i don't claim my experience is that of all submissives, why would you claim to speak for all dominants, or even a majority of them? this, to me, is no different than your lack of ability to understand that just because your experience previous to this may indicate something different in terms of anal play, that doesn't make this experience the same.

it seems like you, and not your submissive, need to find the balance. if he does something he knows is wrong, he apologizes to me and gets over it. if he does something and doesn't realize he's being a jerk, he prefers i tell him he's being a jerk. and then he apologizes and gets over it. shit happens. our dynamic isn't all that difficult to understand; i am property. i am owned. i happen to be human property with thoughts and emotions, and he happens to like his property to be in good condition, and we also happen to love each other deeply, which means that yes, my opinions, thoughts, feelings, emotions, and physical limitations are taken into account so that he can adequately decide when he feels comfortable going past my comfort zone and when he doesn't...because he knows where that comfort zone is. the fact that i am of use and service and that my pleasing him also happens to bring me great benefit and pleasure is where the both of our needs and desires being in balance thing comes into play.

you are trying to make this more difficult than it is. the truth is, it's not. you're overthinking it. communication is the key. we know each other well because we've been together for almost two years and we are extremely open with one another in terms of our thoughts, desires, and what we are going through physically, mentally, and emotionally - and we can get a good read on how things affect each other. until you stop seeing this as a one way street where you are playing the martyr for your submissive, and start talking to her and understanding that experience, emotion, and desire go both ways and difficulties happen for both human beings in the relationship, you are still missing the point.

respectfully,
annabelle.


_____________________________

a'ishah (the artist formerly known as annabelle)
i have the kind of beauty that moves...

(in reply to bandit25)
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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 8:08:45 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
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Well, I am not a doctor, but common sense and a little logical thought tends to make me think that you don't know what your talking about.

Wearing a butt plug for an extended period of time would fall in the same category as multiple anal sex sessions in a short period of time. In other words, something in her ass for too long.

Sooo...I would really go and talk to a specialist about this issue and get accurate first hand information about this from an authority instead of relying on whatever information you gathered from whatever website written by a self appointed BDSM authority.

Now with that said...if the reason for not wearing the plugs is because of pain from hemorrhoids, then I certainly would give them up for her health. If the reason isn't that but rather an "I just don't want to do it!", that doesn't fly with me.

As far as balancing out pleasure in the relationship, I would say that mostly comes down to compatibility so it's not an issue. Since I am too pragmatic to think that the "perfect match" exists, the rest comes down to taking your partner's needs and wants into consideration and making good decisions that work for both people in the relationship.

Unless your a hardcore butt plug fetishist where your entire sexual drive revolves around fixation of that object, I don't think reducing the amount of time you use them is gonna ruin your life.

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RE: Balance Doms Pleasure with submissive's pleasure - 12/20/2007 8:09:29 PM   
Daddysredhead


Posts: 23574
Joined: 11/6/2005
From: Northern (yet still part of the South) Virginia
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I think that most submissives really wish to please their Dominant partners.  When the Dominant partner wants something that the submissive cannot seem to do (for whatever reason), it can make the submissive feel like a failure because s/he isn't able to make that desire a reality.  If the activity in question wasn't something that "sometimes was ok" (as you say she can sometimes enjoy anal sex), but if it was a "trigger" for her - would you still push her to work through it?  Maybe it isn't something that she wants to work through, and therefore she has suggested that she may not be the submissive for you.  That isn't a slight to either of you, but if this going to be the cause of anxiety between the two of you, perhaps re-thinking this relationship is in order.

Just my 2 cents...
Red

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