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RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 8:32:13 AM

sweetwenchie

Posts: 1993
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

i have a brain, i enjoy using it, and simply could not see myself being with Someone that did not value ALL of me, including my intellect. Can you really imagine not being able to do the simplest of things without being told to first? i dislike being micro managed at work, if i had to deal with that in my relationship i might have to hurt someone. Then again i've always been a bit free spirited and independent.

i suppose there are some Dominants who think a submissive should not be able to think for his or her own self, but those types would never look twice at me, for which i am extremely thankful.

_____________________________

"To make oneself an object, to make oneself passive, is a very different thing from being a passive object." - De Beauvoir

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist." - Nietzsche

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 21

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 8:41:16 AM

OmegaG

Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetwenchie

i have a brain, i enjoy using it, and simply could not see myself being with Someone that did not value ALL of me, including my intellect. Can you really imagine not being able to do the simplest of things without being told to first? i dislike being micro managed at work, if i had to deal with that in my relationship i might have to hurt someone. Then again i've always been a bit free spirited and independent.

i suppose there are some Dominants who think a submissive should not be able to think for his or her own self, but those types would never look twice at me, for which i am extremely thankful.

When I first posted my profile, I was contacted by a man who made it clear that when we were sceening there would be no safe words, that I was to remain silent and endure whatever he chose to inflict upon me and that the only conversation that could I could have after was only to express my gratidude.

He also wanted our very first ever face to face meeting to be in a hotel, where I would strip, make sure the door was unlocked or blocked open and I was to sit on a chair in the middle of the room blindfolded. When I declined and cesed further communication, he started with the rhetoric that I was not a "twue" submissive and tried to bully me into aquiessing. He finally got pissed and told me that I'd never find what I wanted because I wanted to retain to much autonomy.

I wonder if he's found his Twue Wove.

_____________________________

Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. Sydney J. Harris

Sex without pain is like food without taste.
- de Sade

(in reply to sweetwenchie)

Post #: 22

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 9:22:06 AM

sweetwenchie

Posts: 1993
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

i think i received email from either him or his clone. i had to give up my weal and twue submissive badge

Soooooooooo hard for a Twue Dommy God to find wove.

_____________________________

"To make oneself an object, to make oneself passive, is a very different thing from being a passive object." - De Beauvoir

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist." - Nietzsche

(in reply to OmegaG)

Post #: 23

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 9:27:56 AM

laurell3

Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

What motivated you to ask this question? Is someone telling you the answer is no?

i've heard a variety of answers from people on different sites that i visit. S/some have said that a submissive should have and use the ability to think and make decisions on her own. O/others have said that a submissive should always do exactly what she is told by her Dominant.

As has been pointed out, the two do not conflict. The trick is not entering into a dynamic with someone that doesn't understand that or entering into a dynamic with someone that will only make desicions for you that are healthy that you can live with even if you may not always totally agree.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 24

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 9:48:56 AM

Lashra

Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

Ask yourself this one, would you rather own some Low IQ of a bitch that can't figure out her ass from a hole in a ground, or somebody smart and able to understand everything you want even if you are not around?

If the house catches on fire while you are work, would you want somebody to sit in the living room chair doing nothing. Or somebody able to call 911, get her ass out of the joint and deal with what is going on?

I know a slave who when the kitchen was on fire called her Master at work to ask permission to call 911. She had been trained to do nothing without his approval first. I guess her training took well.

To the OP yes most Dominants would want an intelligent slave that can make decisions, those Dominants who would not would seem very insecure in my book.

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)

Post #: 25

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 10:51:28 AM

greyangelus

Posts: 192
Joined: 1/22/2008
Status: offline

Gack, save me from brainlessness

. Those two things are so fundamental of a desirable quality I don't even mention them in my profile. Then again, I see a lot of vanilla people day in and day out who either never had those 2 qualities in the first place, or voluntarily abdicated them at some point.

Now, the ability to suspend those qualities for a limited period of time, thats something to look for...

(in reply to Lashra)

Post #: 26

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 10:56:03 AM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

quote:

i've heard a variety of answers from people on different sites that i visit. S/some have said that a submissive should have and use the ability to think and make decisions on her own. O/others have said that a submissive should always do exactly what she is told by her Dominant.

Following orders does not equate to mindless stupidity.
Geesh

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 27

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 11:29:41 AM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns
i've heard a variety of answers from people on different sites that i visit. S/some have said that a submissive should have and use the ability to think and make decisions on her own. O/others have said that a submissive should always do exactly what she is told by her Dominant.

The two go hand in hand. When I'm told, "Protect my property at all times" that means to use my noggin and, when not in his presence, to do what I need to to take care of myself. Doing exactly what I'm told means to think, to be smart, to be perceptive, to be make sound judgments. So if the house is on fire, call 911. If someone is harrassing me, deal with it. If I'm sick, see a doctor. And so on.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 28

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 12:02:48 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

Depends on the dom. Some depend on their subs to offer well thought out advice and remind them of things, others don't.

I'm one of the former. He's got a job lined up in about a month and hasn't gotten to some of the details that need to be in place by then. I reminded him of it today and he called and got the necessary info. I couldn't call for him because I didn't know what to ask about, only that he needed to check on the scheduled lead time.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to giveeverything)

Post #: 29

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 12:07:28 PM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns

Are the ability and desire for independant thought and decision-making admirable traits in a submissive?

Of course it is important for a submissive to be able to have independant thought and to be able to make decisions. I want a submissive woman who can get along fine on her own and doesn't need dominance in order to make it through each day...she wants dominance to make it through her days...and even better, she wants MY dominance. But someone like that who, the minute I came along, suddenly could not think for herself or make a decision without consultation with me first over each and every thing? Not for me. It may well work for others but not in my world.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 30

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 2:22:39 PM

Chocodelite4U

Posts: 34
Joined: 1/18/2008
Status: offline

Correct a submissive woman, not a dog please God gave everybody common sense and when someone doesn't use it ugh.

Like the old saying goes if one jumps off the bridge are you?

_____________________________

Shit happens then you have to flush down the toilet!

Discpline is attitude Mind, Body and Soul

reach me at http://blackplanet.com/PHILSHARPE/

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 31

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 2:37:59 PM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns

Are the ability and desire for independant thought and decision-making admirable traits in a submissive?

Absolutely. Slaves are humans, not robots.

_____________________________

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 32

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 2:40:42 PM

breatheasone

Posts: 4004
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Now, the ability to suspend those qualities for a limited period of time, thats something to look for...

Really?....how come?

_____________________________

Romans 10:13,For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Mike posts in black font
candy posts in pink font

(in reply to greyangelus)

Post #: 33

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 2:41:17 PM

Nineveh

Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline

They are in any submissive I might have. I absolutely do not want someone who is weak and stupid and can't think for herself. I want a strong, intelligent woman who I can hold a conversation with who has that need inside her to be controlled, a need that compliments my own need to control. Stupidity annoys me, althoguh not to any extreme level. But intentional stupidty I cannot and will not stand.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 34

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 2:44:50 PM

Nineveh

Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns

i've heard a variety of answers from people on different sites that i visit. S/some have said that a submissive should have and use the ability to think and make decisions on her own. O/others have said that a submissive should always do exactly what she is told by her Dominant.

I do not see these two actions being incompatible. A good submissive will do whatever she is told by her Dom, she will also use her ability to think and make decisions in areas where the instrucitons aren't clear. And, hopefully, if the instrucitons are clear and she thinks it is an incredibly stupid idea or has a problem with it for other reasons she will discuss this with her Dom. After all, if she is truly owned then it is not only her body that is owned, it is also her mind, and that includes her reservations, criticisms and fears. if she keeps these things from her Dom then she is depriving him of herself.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 35

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 2:52:47 PM

lronitulstahp

Posts: 5392
Joined: 10/17/2007
Status: offline

hmmm...well...ummm...let me think....Yeah! What Dom wants to say he was "chosen" by a totally midless twit, and what sort of reflection would that in turn have on Him? It seems to me if she is unable to form clear,coherent, and informed thoughts...perhaps her choice in D-type would be less than ideal.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 36

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 3:15:09 PM

greyangelus

Posts: 192
Joined: 1/22/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: breatheasone

quote:

Now, the ability to suspend those qualities for a limited period of time, thats something to look for...

Really?....how come?

Scenes that require it (that micromanagement fetish thread that was floating around is a great example).

Seen from different point, it could be argued that anyone identifing as submissive suspends those qualities on a regular basis; pretty much every time thier dom makes a decision for them. They conciously ignore what their own thought and decision making abilities tell them in favor of the doms thought and decision making abilities. Arguably, it is the desire to suspend those qualities (and the consequences and pressures of those qualities) is what makes and enables a submissive to be submissive.

Suspending those qualtities does not equate with a lack of those qualities, however. Without those qualities in the first place, a sub would never seek out a dom who is a compatible fit. Reason being the desire to suspend must also be balanced against the assurance that when those qualities are suspended, that the person who is now making their decisions for them will do so in their best interests.

(in reply to breatheasone)

Post #: 37

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 3:16:50 PM

subtee

Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline

Just like Mitt Romney's campaign...

_____________________________

Don't believe everything you think...

(in reply to greyangelus)

Post #: 38

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 4:05:56 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns

Are the ability and desire for independant thought and decision-making admirable traits in a submissive?

Yes... it's a very desirable quality in my world....

But remember... just because one has an ability doesn't equate to exercising that ability.

My girls will exercise this ability when I have given them such freedom to do so.

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 39

RE: ability and desire for indepentant thought/decision... - 2/8/2008 4:16:24 PM

kuriousreturns

Posts: 43
Joined: 1/28/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kuriousreturns

Are the ability and desire for independant thought and decision-making admirable traits in a submissive?

WOW! Open, honest, blunt .... i love it! i need to spend more time on the message boards and less time in the chatrooms, because the questions and answers here are so much easier to read and understand.

i really did not post this question out of stupidity. i posted it because i do believe these qualities are admirable in everybody whether they be male, female, Dominant, submissive, adult, or child. these qualities were not taught to me or instilled in my mind as a child, and not even until late into my adulthood (i'd say within the last 4 years). my "introduction" to the Lifestyle was a bogus online M/s story that bled over into real life, with a "master of ignorance" who's philosophy was "jump when I say jump, and if I don't then sit there and act stupid" (and i was dumb enough to go along with it, because i relished the attention). Thankfully, i was lucky enough to hear different opinions early on (about 3 months in) and started questioning him. i ended things shortly after that, because things just didn't seem right to me (we remained friends off and on until a few weeks ago, when he tried to get me involved in "play" again and i told him back off). At any rate, i was taken underwing by a wonderful Mentor and led down a different path; He taught me the importance of thinking on my own, asking questions when needed, voicing my thoughts and opinions when i was so inclined, and making my own decisions. To this day, i occasionally come across someone who thinks similar to my "bogus master" and i don't know whether to comment on it, pass it by, or run like hell! my reaction generally depends on my mood, although i'm leaning more toward "pass it by and run like hell" these days. Anyway, i was just curious to see what O/others had to say on the subject; i love the answers that were posted, and i thank A/all who responded. Be well and good day to A/all.

(in reply to kuriousreturns)

Post #: 40

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