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ORIGINAL: luckydog1

Mnot, if you are a scientific athiest, what could your thoughts possibly be other than the byproduct of Chemical Reactions?

It would not be predetermined by either you or me, but by the operation of the Universe, going back in a chain of predictable events to the instant of creation. 

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ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

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I haven't confused anything with anything. I'm an atheist. Don't presume to tell me what I believe.

Don't be silly...everyone has to believe what Strawd...errr.. Luckydog says they believe, or else what would he have to argue about?

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ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

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ORIGINAL: Nineveh

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ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

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ORIGINAL: luckydog1

Andrew, many, If not all, Athiests believe in an absolute predetermination.  It logically follows that every event, down to the thoughts in our heads, are just physical reactions.  The universe is just a giant machine operating from its start point.  Scientists don't see messages in the stars about it, but generally are 100% deterministic.

Not that I am defending Astrology.  I suspect telling people since they are small children, "you are a scorpio and scorpios are...", has a degree of psychological impact.

Really? Are you an atheist? What do you mean by "predetermination?" How do you know scientists are "100% deterministic"?

I have seen you do this twice now, postulating some horseshit premise, and then doing the "it logically follows that..." schtick.

First off, do you know most atheists? Have they personally told you what they think about "predeterminism"? (do you mean predestination? That event a ---> event b ----> event 200034A, thus there is causality for N-1 events?)
Now, atheism is not having a belief in a deity. (it is NOT having a belief that there is NOT a deity.) Not having a belief in a deity does not exclude believing in beings from other planes of existence which may influence events in this plane.
If a being from another plane influences an event in this plane, is there a direct physical causal chain from the event preceding it? Of course not. (there are other problems with this example, but they are outside the scope of this discussion)
Then the statement "It logically follows that..." is not true.

At any rate, I consider Astrology to be nonsence.

I think you may have confused Atheism with Agnosticism.  Agnostics don't have a belief in a diety, or belief in any other concrete concepts of that nature such as the lack of a diety.  Atheists generally have faith in the lack of a diety.

I haven't confused anything with anything. I'm an atheist. Don't presume to tell me what I believe.

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ORIGINAL: batshalom

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ORIGINAL: Nineveh

I would be interested to see you cite some of these sources that disprove astrology as I suspect that you may simply be carrying the prejudices that you hgave developed over without actually having read studies that disprove astrological theory.

It is not up to the questioner to prove or disprove. It is always up to the claimant to prove. The supernatural can't be touched by science - it isn't falsifiable. All one has to do is say "Oh, this is the hand of god at work" (or whatever) and how can that be disproven?

If it is a truism, it should be generalizable for any given person. If studies can show that it is accurate and able to be replicated, I'm all for it. Otherwise, it's a fun novelty but I wouldn't stake my rent on it.

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ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Could just site the newspaper horrorscopes and the fact that people don't tend to have different sorts of events happen to them so broadly based on the time of the year that they were born.  That's a pretty quick KO.

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Sure, you can call yourself whatever you like.  I can call myself a Celtic Druid if I want, but if I define that in a different way than the majority of Celtic Druids I am, perhaps, being a bit deceptive in my self description.  That's why, despite the fact that my belief system has some things in common with Celtic Druidism, I do not call myself that. 

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ORIGINAL: luckydog1



"Determinism is the philosophical proposition that every event, including human cognition and behavior, decision and action, is causally determined by an unbroken chain of prior occurrences. Determinism may also be defined as the thesis that there is at any instant exactly one physically possible future.[1] With numerous historical debates, many varieties and philosophical positions on the subject of determinism exist from traditions throughout the world.  "

Nothing about Jehova, God or Judeo Christian beliefs are included in determinism at all, despite your assertions.  What I am proposing is a valid recognized school of thought.  I have asked several times for any Athiest to give anything that could contradict it, and so far the only one is beings from another plane

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ORIGINAL: Feric

Astrology, like any pseudo-science, offers vague reassurances and is totally credible to those who want to believe in it. It offers a shortcut to quick answers and a background of hundreds of years of believers who prefer to follow star patterns than logic. A lot of people believe in astrology because they want to. That's the nature of free will, and it's not something that can be easily explained.

However, in my humble opinion, I consider astrology dangerously seductive because it's a quick way to abdicate responsibility for your actions: "I'm not to blame because my destiny is written in the stars." I think a lot of people can fool themselves this way, at least until their crimes or mistakes become too great.

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ORIGINAL: domiguy

I would rather be a witch than a Druid. I met one witch...She sucked and I'm fairly confident that she was representative of all witches...