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Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:03:24 PM   
thisisafakename


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Joined: 2/24/2008
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I'm fairly new to the world of BDSM, but well versed in the ideas/philosophies. I've met enough people from online over the years, and am street smart enough to recognize some red flags, but this one really got me.

New to this website/forum, this was my first experience please note that this is more of an abusive online dating experience rather than an abusive BDSM experience:

Stumbled across a Dom's profile who actually sounded like someone could potentially have a long term relationship with, a rare occurance online. So I wrote a heartfelt email to him and received an immediate response. We got along well, and even though he seemed a little crazy, it was no more than as crazy as I consider myself, or my closest friends, in the best sense of the word. Several emails, chats, many phone calls and three days later we planned to meet. Everything seemed potentially great. This is where my better judgement went out the window.

Coming from out of town he arranged to pick me up at my house. Despite a reservation about this, I stupidly agreed, because I already built a sense of trust in this person and was distracted by that. He picked me up, he looked just like his pictures, and was quite a gentleman. Prior to meeting he had expressed his strong feelings towards me and expected me to reciprocate. I maintained that we should keep things casual until we meet, but secretly felt the same way. We drove into town and went to see a movie.

During this time, I discovered that things weren't feeling right for me. There was no chemistry. Unfortunately, this is something that truly is impossible to tell online or even over the phone. So after the movie, I started to articulate this in my head in order to tell him. Before I could do so, he tried to kiss me, and my body language said it all. We were sitting in his car, as I explained that I just wasn't 'feeling' it. This is where things get ugly.

He totally freaked out and proceeded to flip between being devastated and angry as he expressed incoherent thoughts. There was some discussion, but the general jist was that he couldn't understand this "chemistry bullshit" and why couldn't I just give it some time, because "we are perfect for each other" and "we are going to have good days and bad days over the next 10 or 20 years". I started thinking about getting out of the car at this point (it was parked) but was worried that he might freak out even more if I did that. I soon regretted that decision as he started the car and drove maniacally around the city trying to take me "the fuck home". During this time, and in between almost crashing every 2 seconds he called me all manner of names at the top of his lungs, said that I had misrepresented myself, that I was a liar and a worthless bitch amongst many many other things. He then told me that he'd been looking for 10 years for someone like me and if I couldn't be with him then he might as well die. He told me he wanted me to die, that I deserved to be yelled at and that I was a waste of space and so on.

I had a panic attack and was hyperventilating and crying hysterically. I kept seeing cop cars and hoping someone see my face or see his bad driving and pull us over. The thought that he knew where I lived was going over and over in my head and I was so scared I could barely collect my thoughts and think what to do, but the idea that prevailed was to stay calm and be as least antagonistic as possible and try to get through it. Eventually I summoned the courage to ask him if he would prefer I got a cab home seeing as how he felt he was wasting his gas. After a few more blocks he pulled into a gas station. He yelled at me some more, then broke down and cried and expressed his severe disappointment. I wanted to smooth things over as much as possible so as not to create a tricky future situation, so apologized profusely and re-assured him that I never intended to lead him on in any way. He then asked me if I would like to go to the beach, to which I declined. I was then asked to "fuck off and die" and "get the fuck out of the car".

I got out of the car, tears streaming down my face, as patrons of the gas station gawped in my direction. It was 3:30am and I went over to the cashier window to buy a packet of cigarettes and a drink as I watched him drive away. The cashier let me inside the shop and I went in the bathroom and broke down for a while. Then I flagged a cab home, had the cab drive me to my car, got in my car and drove around for 3 hours because I was scared he would show up at my house. Eventually I pulled myself together enough to go home, and as I predicted, he was there. Fortunately he didn't see me, and took off. I parked my car, and sat there with the key in the engine for 30 minutes before I could get out and walk across the street to my door.

The next day, I was greeted by many phone calls from him. I didn't answer any of them. The messages were something to the effect of "you stupid bitch you could have had me and you fucked it all up". Then he left me a message, and an email stating that he didn't want to live if he couldn't have me so he was going to kill himself. At this point I called the cops to report the suicide threat. As much as it seemed like a superficial cry for help, having someone tell you they are going to kill themselves is very scary. This was my first experience with that. Since then he has called and left other messages so I think he is ok. But if he continues to harass me I will have to get a restraining order just to stop the calls and emails alone.

I wanted to share this not only as a catharsis but also as a warning to even the most wary of those of you, who are actively meeting people online. I was taken in by a manipulative person who was mentally unstable and the situation could have been a lot worse. I let my guard down, and got really unlucky. But I consider every bad experience in life to be a gift. Because those experiences are part of me and partially shape my personality, and it strengthens me and makes me wiser, as well as feeding my creative side. In addition to learning my lesson about protecting myself and not being so trusting, this situation has effectively erased any desire to ever meet anyone from online ever again. Although I'm sure I will get over that, and these things can happen anywhere, not just online. Also it has opened my eyes up to an element of the BDSM world that is now a reality for me, that some people use it for the wrong reasons. I think everyone needs emotional release, whether it be through kinky-ish bedroom activities or 24/7 BDSM lifestyle - but where is the line drawn between a healthy play desire, and a person who is being abusive or abused - and how do you tell the difference sooner?

Thanks for reading...



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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:08:56 PM   
kittinSol


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Not wanting to come down all moralistic here, and I'm glad you got away safely, yet it's important to emphasise to potential datees and daters that they shouldn't get too close to each other at first.

Looks like you didn't meet the guy on this site anyway. But thanks for sharing your experience and for reminding us that we should always exercise caution.



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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:10:45 PM   
thisisafakename


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yes I did meet him on this site and in case you are wondering....he has deleted his profile.

And yes, you are right on about not getting too close before meeting.

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:11:21 PM   
CalifChick


Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
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I'm sorry you went thru what you did, and I'm glad you understand where you went wrong.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thisisafakename

In addition to learning my lesson about protecting myself and not being so trusting, this situation has effectively erased any desire to ever meet anyone from online ever again. Although I'm sure I will get over that, and these things can happen anywhere, not just online.


Yes it can. It can happen with a blind date, a not-so-blind date, or with someone you've known for a long time.

quote:


Also it has opened my eyes up to an element of the BDSM world that is now a reality for me, that some people use it for the wrong reasons.


I'm sorry, I missed the element you are talking about.  I didn't see anything related to BDSM in your post.  Are you talking about trusting someone sooner than you would otherwise? That's not a BDSM thing.

Cali


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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:15:17 PM   
thisisafakename


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This particular guy uses the guise of being a "Dom" to cathartically get over his issues in a very destructive and volatile way, which all made sense after that night

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:16:41 PM   
CalifChick


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From: California
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Maybe I'm dense, or maybe it's the start of a headache, but I just don't know what you mean.  Maybe type a little slower for me??

Cali


_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:22:31 PM   
thisisafakename


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OK example - it might never occur to him to have a safe word or to sit down like adults and go over a list of likes/dislikes and limits because for him, its all about him. He wants someone who is just going to say "ok i submit" and let him do whatever he wants, without need for permission, and have that person do whatever he wants without question, and his needs are always more important. Forgive me if I am mistaken, as I am new to the scene, but this seems a little off?

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:24:22 PM   
thisisafakename


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I mean I guess what I'm trying to say is, this guy isn't really a Dom, he is something else.

....what's the word? .... psycho?

< Message edited by thisisafakename -- 2/24/2008 7:25:05 PM >

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:35:01 PM   
Sinergy


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Joined: 4/26/2004
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I have dealt with lots of similar stories.  This is abuse, not D/s.

It reminds me of people asking us "What do you do when you are locked in the trunk of a car?" or similar things.

The usual response is "Was there any point you could have done anything to avoid being locked in the trunk of a car?"

I feel bad for you, and email me on the other side if you want to know who I work for, but the danger flags that jump out are...

1)  Meet in a public place.  Go home from that public place without him.

2)  Dont bring the enemy to your door.  You dont know him and he knows your address?

3)  You feel weird about this person, dont get in a moving vehicle with him. Your odds of survival plummet.

4)  You decide it is weird, call a cab, tell him thank you but.., and go home.

5)  You are still here.  That means you are a survivor, so dont beat yourself up about it.  Think positive and move on.

Sinergy



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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:43:29 PM   
BoundDown


Posts: 76
Joined: 11/25/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thisisafakename

This particular guy uses the guise of being a "Dom" to cathartically get over his issues in a very destructive and volatile way, which all made sense after that night


Cali, don't feel bad, your not the only one who missed the point of that psyco -babble.

Thats an interesting assesment of that person... I would think he would do that with any woman that rejected him, vanilla or other. Maybe he targets alt sites because alot of submissives are willing to deal with quirks and piccadillos that the vanilla woman won't even give him a chance to shine away.
The only fact here is that any person any where that does this is nuts.
I am glad to know that the story ends well , though the need for a fake ID does cause one to wonder.


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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:45:21 PM   
TracyTaken


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Wow.  That's terrifying.  I'm glad you are okay.

I echo another post on how to prevent it.  Meet at a public place and provide your transport.  Safe calls:  A friend calls you half and hour after the designating meeting, so if you need an out (or help) it's available.

My personal opinion (which probably will tick some people off), this might have happened anywhere, but BDSM tends to attract a fringe element, unstable people, etc., in greater number than vanilla cricles.  Put BDSM online and that number seems to skyrocket.

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:45:45 PM   
SailingBum


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From: Sailin the stormy sea
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick


Yes it can. It can happen with a blind date, a not-so-blind date, or with someone you've known for a long time.

quote:


Also it has opened my eyes up to an element of the BDSM world that is now a reality for me, that some people use it for the wrong reasons.



My daughter had a similar thing happen to her from a guy she had been dating for 2 years.  There is just no way of knowing.  Try as we might we can't protect/ predict behaviour no matter how street/ safe smart we are.

BadOne

< Message edited by SailingBum -- 2/24/2008 7:51:00 PM >


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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:50:44 PM   
thisisafakename


Posts: 14
Joined: 2/24/2008
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Thanks for pointing them out, and they are obvious to me, now, in hindsight. I did get caught up in the situation prematurely. By the way - he knows the building (if he remembers) but not my unit, which is something at least.

Also.....I am trying to work on how to deal with confrontations as I don't do very well in them - if someone yells at me I tend to shrivel up and in this case had a panic attack. The point at which I got into the car was before I realized that it would go pear shaped, and I made that choice based on respecting him enough not to just take off as it were, when we had planned to go somewhere else too.

You are right, and maybe the best thing would have been to go somewhere public to talk or make an excuse and leave but thats just the way it unfolded...it may sound silly but sometimes its hard to apply basic logical rules to human interactions.



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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:52:24 PM   
Sinergy


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Lessons learned.

I am glad you are still here.

Sinergy


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"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 7:58:03 PM   
thisisafakename


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Joined: 2/24/2008
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quote:


ORIGINAL: BoundDown

Thats an interesting assesment of that person... I would think he would do that with any woman that rejected him, vanilla or other. Maybe he targets alt sites because alot of submissives are willing to deal with quirks and piccadillos that the vanilla woman won't even give him a chance to shine away.
The only fact here is that any person any where that does this is nuts.
I am glad to know that the story ends well , though the need for a fake ID does cause one to wonder.




Agreed. and yes as I said in my original post, it IS more of an online dating situation than specifically a BDSM situation, although it just happened that we met on this website and he identifies with being a Dom and I identify with being a sub, and the way he uses his "Dominance" is abusive in nature. It CAN happen anywhere with anyone. Nevertheless I have to agree with Tracy about the fringe element, ratio of unstable people and online catalyst.

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 8:00:32 PM   
juliaoceania


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I wanted to make sure I posted my thanks to you for writing about this experience. It may prevent someone else from making a perhaps fatal mistake in the future. You are really very lucky to be posting about what happened. 

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 8:01:19 PM   
alwaysuna


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This site IS going to attract unstable people.  I think there are two types (and that is simplifying things extremely, but for the sake of making a point).

Type 1: People that are healthy, normal, sane, and feel a need to seek a relationship that embraces a strong element of their physio and psychological make-up.  Dominance - or - submissiveness.   They are seeking the other half of that yin/yang to complement the way they move through this world, because they have learned that while they are ABLE to have relationships with people who are not seeking that balance, those relationships are limited in depth and breadth.

Type 2: People who can not have relationships because they can not RELATE because they are mentally ill.  Sadly (and it is sad) they resort to the possibility that perhaps if they OWN someone or BELONG to someone then relating doesn't matter.  You are a thing..they are a thing!

How can you tell?  Eh, sometimes you can't, but I think some good advice has been given.  Please dont completely rule out the online community though.  I think that using the safety  precautions mentioned earlier, and taking a TON of time is worth it.  I would never have met the person I did in RL.

One more suggestion to gauging the sanity of someone.  Really ask pointed questions about their relationships with family, exes, friends, coworkers, etc. Often times therein will lie your biggest clue.  I was once talking to a man who after several discussions clued me in to the fact that he had been evicted from 3 apartments because his neighbors "were crazy" and even now his new neighbor was spying on him through the walls!  errr....yeah.... 

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 8:02:53 PM   
lusciouslips19


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This is why I never give out phone numbers until after we meet. Some find it odd, but I explain why. I have learned the hard way. Dont let them know where you work. One guy(domabe) that told me  to fuck off and die threatened to out me at my work.Always meet in public at a book store or starbucks in the day time. No alcohol. Decide after that if you want to proceed or are comfortable with giving them your cell number.

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 8:07:27 PM   
thisisafakename


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FYI to those who replied with some advice...

I asked him a lot of questions about his life, relationships, family, childhood, upbringing etc. and still didn't see it coming. I also had a friend call me 1 hour into the date and I sent that friend all this guy's information in case of an emergency.

Thanks for all the advice, feedback, kind words!

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RE: Abusive encounters - 2/24/2008 8:09:35 PM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thisisafakename
Coming from out of town he arranged to pick me up at my house. Despite a reservation about this, I stupidly agreed, because I already built a sense of trust in this person and was distracted by that. He picked me up, he looked just like his pictures, and was quite a gentleman. Prior to meeting he had expressed his strong feelings towards me and expected me to reciprocate. I maintained that we should keep things casual until we meet, but secretly felt the same way. We drove into town and went to see a movie.


First, I am very sorry you had such a terrifying experience.

Second, while no victim should ever blame herself for an abusive date's misbehavior, your narrative gives some clear early warning signs of potential problems.


  • He wanted to pick you up at your home. By extension, he wanted to know where you live.
  • He expressed "strong feelings" before even meeiting you--and "expected" the same from you.


Building a stable relationship takes time, and emotionally stable people invest the time to build a relationship. Aggressive tactics such as he used indicates he is unwilling to invest the time to get to know you slowly. No matter how charming the man may seem, not being willing to take the time to respect personal safety, personal space, and personal privacy is never a good thing.

You asked "how to tell the difference sooner?" This is how. The good man (or woman) will respect the boundaries, and will allow trust to develop of its own accord.

However, please don't take any of what I have said here as even an implied criticism of you. What he did was wrong; nothing will change the fact that his behavior was abusive, and nothing will change the fact that abusers are 100% at fault for their mistreatment of others. Yes, there are red flags to his behavior--and in the future you will be able to spot them and take proper steps to protect yourself.



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