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"The Needs of a Slave"

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ORIGINAL: joy2u

But, as for me, i don't need to hear my Master tell me what a good slave i am or that i am accepted by Him.  i know i am accepted by Him and that i please Him, otherwise He wouldn't have me here. 
 
i learned to accept myself long ago and that's good enough for me.
 
joy
Owned servant of Master David

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ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

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ORIGINAL: brainiacsub

[...snip...] The problem I had with this particular list was that it reinforced every negative stereotype faced by submissive women specifically and kinky folk in general. [...snip...]

There were certain things within this list that resonated very strongly with me, but the poor choice of words and expression of ideas far outweighed the values presented in the sentiments.

Wow, this is the first list that DIDN'T make me think all those things!  It's fascinating the difference in how we see things, isn't it?!  It's the only list I've seen that I like, and I'm none of those things above (except the doormat, when he needs to wipe his feet  ).

Maybe it's the mood I'm in lately or something...the list made me feel squishy.    It made me think of all the ways he insists that I rely on my inner strength and think quickly on my feet. 

I'm not trying to be argumentative or criticize your post in any way, btw.  I just loved the differences in how oppositely (is that a word?) two people view the same list. 

The need to know that your owner does not fear you in any way and
that he does not edit his requirements of you so as to be limited to
only those things that you already want to do.

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ORIGINAL: brainiacsub
So, it made ya feel 'squishy', huh? Yeah, me too. Just another example of how  oppositely we see things. 

Personally,  I identify most strongly with ideas and words that make me feel 'empowered', 'enlightened', 'informed', 'persuaded', 'thoughtful', and occasionally, just 'silly.' This list did none of those things for  me. It had a kind of 'romantic' spin to it, which I'm sure is what made you feel good. But it didn't seem very practical.

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Here is one of the more benign ones. Curious to know your thoughts:

The need to know that your owner does not fear you in any way and
that he does not edit his requirements of you so as to be limited to
only those things that you already want to do.

I have been reading you in the forums for quite a while now. You seem to be pretty grounded and more self aware than most. I wasn't at all offended by your position and found you neither argumentative nor critical. It's all good.

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ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

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ORIGINAL: joy2u

But, as for me, i don't need to hear my Master tell me what a good slave i am or that i am accepted by Him.  i know i am accepted by Him and that i please Him, otherwise He wouldn't have me here. 
 
i learned to accept myself long ago and that's good enough for me.
 
joy
Owned servant of Master David

I don't think the list said said she needed to be told what a good slave she is or that he accepts her. 

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For me, not ever feeling accepted in my life made me really appreciate feeling of finally being accepted.  Master doesn't tell me he accepts me; he lives in a way that is accepting of me.

Accepting myself isn't good enough for me if the person I have given myself to doesn't accept me. I don't think I'd want to belong to someone who didn't accept me.

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ORIGINAL: joy2u

Like i said, if this is a need for you, that's fine for you and it's good that you have that need being met.  i said that it's not a need for me.  i know that i wouldn't have ever been brought into my Master's life, if He didn't accept me and i wouldn't still be in His home, if i didn't please Him.  i don't need Him to stroke me or reassure me or praise me for just doing what i am here to do, which is to serve Him and satisfy His needs. 
 
i understand that many people do have these needs.  i'm just not one of them and, like i said in an earlier post on this thread, " Needs, just as with wants, are very subjective".
 
joy
Owned servant of Master David

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ORIGINAL: wordstoponder

The need for certainty and permanence.

The need for containment and clear boundaries of behavior.

The need to feel open and unembarrassed gratitude.

The need to know that you are not in control and cannot successfully
manipulate your owner.
      
The need to know that you are neither required nor permitted to try
to dominate yourself and that your owner will provide the force to
take you and to own you.
   
The need to know that your owner does not fear you in any way and
that he does not edit his requirements of you so as to be limited to
only those things that you already want to do.

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ORIGINAL: yourbetters

I make sure my slaves have no needs. I have needs, they have work to do to fulfill them!

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ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

Hi Joy,

I wasn't trying to say you were wrong or anything, I was just comparing the difference in situations. 

Again, I'm not arguing your point, just sharing my own in return.

"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress." 
~ Joseph Joubert

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ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

I just need to know my Master is pleased...content...fulfilled.  Like you, if he is not, I won't be happy.  It's not the feedback that is important, it is that the man is happy.  :)

My best to you.

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ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

Different people have different needs.  Some people are seeking to be treated like mere fuck meat property without all the love and romantic stuff.  Some people want to have a deep loving D/s relationship that involves marriage, the house with the white picket fence and 2.5 kids.   Some slaves want to be whored out and used and shared by their masters and have no desire for the married life.

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Basically, a list like this should be used as a tool to make one thing deeper about things.   Figure out as a Dom what you are willing to give as well as what you want, and the same goes with sub/slaves.   Feel these needs and wants out with each other and go from there.

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ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
First, thank you for the kind words.  And thanks for inviting my opinion (I never refuse an opportunity, lol).  Here goes:

I see this as saying my Master is not intimidated by me.  That it is clear to both of us that he is the ultimate authoritarian in the relationship and his rule goes - always.  Therefore, he won't compromise his ultimate goal of getting the satisfaction he wants out of his slave, by only giving her the tasks that she prefers to do.  If he said "wear black" today and I said "Master I only like to wear red on Thursdays" and he said "Oh, ok, I didn't realize.  Red is fine."  he would be editing his original direction to telling me something I already wanted to do.  Rather, if he said, "I don't give a shit.  Starting today you are wearing black on Thursdays" he wouldn't be.

That's a really benign example.  There are indeed times when what he orders of me isn't that big of a deal to him and he will adjust, if he's in the mood to.  But any adjustment comes from his own internal motivation, not because of fear of what I might do if I don't get my way.
[...snip...]
Your thoughts??

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ORIGINAL: brainiacsub
...I also need for him to never be apologetic about his own needs and desires. That doesn't mean that I cannot set limits or have boundaries, but I certainly don't want him to 'mold' his expectations to match mine.

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Why is it that you would swoon and I would hurl after reading something that we both fundamentally agree with?  The difference is in how we viewed the presentation. The list made no distinction between need and choice. As written, it presents a picture of someone with an unhealthy mind and spirit. There is a difference between needing love, acceptance, and security and choosing to accept guidance, allow discipline, and relinquish control to have it. You see? The list was poorly written, not necessarily borne of bad ideas.

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A list like this requires the skills of someone with the gift of language, like subtee or kittinSol, in order to produce something that is inspirational and meaningful. As written, it is very amateurish.

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ORIGINAL: joy2u

True but, some of us, probably most of us, fall outside these simple and limited cliches of whore, fuckmeat or "average soccer mom" and we (well, me, at least) just want to be treated like the unique persons that we are. 
 
Being owned doesn't have to mean being treated like this or that stereotype.  In fact, not all Dominants/Masters, want a slave who is a stereotype or cliche.  It's a big world with a lot of different ownership styles and a lot of submissive styles.

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ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

I don't recall seeing those needs on Maslow's heirarchy....