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RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 4:53:59 AM   
undergroundsea


Posts: 2400
Joined: 6/27/2004
From: Austin, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Calimistress

I just want to know why is it so many male subs and why do they still hit u even when your a lesban?


I expect the question is why are there so many male subs who post to this forum.

As a male sub, I post to this forum because it centers around female dominance, which is my area of interest. That is, I do not take the name of the forum too literally and see it to be a Q&A session with dommes, but rather a forum that is mostly based on discussion around female dominance and, sometimes, more general ideas within folks who develop familiarity as forumites.

Do you see any fault with this idea? Who do you think should post to this forum and what is the rationale for your opinion?

As for the second part, I expect you mean why do male subs hit on lesbians. Multiple reasons come to mind.

One, some people use the orientation label loosely. That is, bisexual or heteroflexible women who are not lesbians will use the label if they are primarily searching for women, presumably to discourage contact by men by escaping searches or interest level felt upon reading a profile. It is not that they are indeed lesbian and they may even be open to the idea of men if they meet one that interests them. However, the nature of the volume of mail, and, perhaps, the comparative ease or lack thereof of finding potential male and female candidates leads to the choice of presenting self as lesbian and to not actively search for a man.

Two, sexuality is not black and white but grey, as defined by the Kinsey scale. I have been surprised a couple of times by a sexual encounter with women who identify as lesbian, which was initiated by them. There may be women who seek women for emotional intimacy or as primary partners but are interested in encounter with men as secondary play partners.

Three, romantic or sexual orientation and BDSM orientation are not always the same. I know of BDSM couples where a gay man is a master to a gay woman, or a gay woman is a master to a straight man, etc. I have engaged in non-sexual BDSM with lesbians. While you might not be interested in male submissives, there are lesbian women who are.

Four, sometimes what is feminine and masculine and what is attractive to a given person becomes blurred. 

Perhaps some men who write you are testing these reasons.

Five, there are men who will write to anyone who is a woman or (even men) who is online or who is in the same hemisphere and what have you.

While over time I have come to allow that submission to lesbians exists as a possibility, I do not actively pursue it and try to respect their sexuality. Other men might take a different approach. If a lesbian is having trouble with mail she receives from men, emphasizing her preference for no men in her profile and setting her mail filters appropriately might help.

Cheers,

Sea

< Message edited by undergroundsea -- 3/4/2008 4:55:15 AM >

(in reply to hopelesslyInvo)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:29:22 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		Whats wrong with hitting on a lesbian. Fresh meat untouched by man hands. I knew that I should'nt have sent Jefff those knee pads.

(in reply to undergroundsea)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:59:43 AM   
need2bused6


Posts: 49
Joined: 2/2/2008
Status: offline 		Being new to this board and not having the days to read every prior post. I am a gay male sub and I felt I could post on any board here as long as it is respectful and on topic.  Being gay my experience with Dommes is limited but I treat them s I would a Dom.  My guess in answering this question is to quote Willie Sutton bank robber when asked why he robbed banks was quoted as saying "because that is where the money is".  If the Dom's are respectful a simple respectful answer would be called for the first time.  If the same Dom continues then more would be needed.  In the vanilla lifestyle I am surprised that out of the number of Lesbians I know who out of no where have heterosexual sex.  Usually a one or two night stand but they do.  I find it from my experience more that gay men are less likely to do the same with a woman. I have had several married couples, on vanilla sites, ask about a 3 way.  I politely explain I am not interested, although one I did do had a really hot husband and the wife just wanted to watch, I felt bad afterwards because in a Vanilla 3 way I try to be sure that everyone is happy and no one left out.  She said it did a lot for her so that made me feel better.


_____________________________

“There are only two tragedies in life: one is not getting what one wants, and the other is getting it.”

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 9:41:42 AM   
MisPandora


Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

I come here mostly because it concerns me when I see a closed culture approach - that's the breeding ground of ignorance and ultimately damaging to any participants.

In the Ask a Master forum, there's no evidence that anyone really cares who responds to which posts, and lends their insight from their own experiences. There's no real expression of territory. Quite the opposite of here.


Six, I want to express that I enjoy your candor and intelligence in your posts.  While some might consider what you say to be inflammatory, I tend to see that we think alike -- linear -- and that we say things as they are without dressing it up to be something that it's not. 

My concern for what you've said above in quotes that it seems you're taking it upon yourself to come and "police" the posts here.  I mean, we can't have the fem doms and the male subs getting out of hand and upsetting the apple cart, can we?  I say this in jest however, it feels a little.....elitist?  Snobbish?  Like you're somehow better than all of us to feel you need dispatch yourself to address our ill-conceived notions?  That part of your post struck me as off-putting and disparaging.

Was that deliberate or were you so blunt I missed the jest?

< Message edited by MisPandora -- 3/4/2008 9:45:36 AM >

_____________________________

Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to SixFootMaster)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 11:33:14 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		SixfootMaster are there only certian post we are supposed to respond to. Do you purpose to set yourself up as the Grand Master and inform us as to which post we may address. If you wish I will come to your mail and get permission  first. I didnt know that you had already pissed on the trees and marked your territory.

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 2:00:30 PM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

I come here mostly because it concerns me when I see a closed culture approach - that's the breeding ground of ignorance and ultimately damaging to any participants.

In the Ask a Master forum, there's no evidence that anyone really cares who responds to which posts, and lends their insight from their own experiences. There's no real expression of territory. Quite the opposite of here.


Six, I want to express that I enjoy your candor and intelligence in your posts.  While some might consider what you say to be inflammatory, I tend to see that we think alike -- linear -- and that we say things as they are without dressing it up to be something that it's not. 

My concern for what you've said above in quotes that it seems you're taking it upon yourself to come and "police" the posts here.  I mean, we can't have the fem doms and the male subs getting out of hand and upsetting the apple cart, can we?  I say this in jest however, it feels a little.....elitist?  Snobbish?  Like you're somehow better than all of us to feel you need dispatch yourself to address our ill-conceived notions?  That part of your post struck me as off-putting and disparaging.

Was that deliberate or were you so blunt I missed the jest?


Police is too strong a word. That presumes something above the authority I, or any one has, to state their views. It has nothing to do with anyone being "better" than anyone else, but in providing alternate opinions and options, perspective, history, and so on.

That said, there are some here that are unable to take even the most lightly given opinion from a male - particularly a dominant one.

If you read "argumentative" as "defensive", "male dominance" as "a man disagreeing with me", and "being imposed" as "me being wrong and refusing to admit it" you'll know who I mean.

I treat everyone equally, being a female dominant does not give you special status above female subs, male subs, or male dominants, we're all intelligent, rational adults with valid experiences, points of view, knowledge, and wisdom. Same for being a male dominant.

In regards to my tone - it comes from being a teacher, and a life of speaking with authority and instruction. That and being raised on british television.

SixFoot.

(Ya, it's the girl's account, can't be bothered signing in just to make a post before going to work)

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 2:04:14 PM   
xoxi


Posts: 1066
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

SixfootMaster are there only certian post we are supposed to respond to. Do you purpose to set yourself up as the Grand Master and inform us as to which post we may address. If you wish I will come to your mail and get permission  first. I didnt know that you had already pissed on the trees and marked your territory.


Sorry Dnomyar, I rarely check my CMail these days (maybe every second day) so you'll just have to guess and hope to crikey you don't get it wrong.

It pays to mark out your territory while your bladder is robust.

SixFootJester.



(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 2:34:19 PM   
Mezrem


Posts: 311
Joined: 11/12/2007
Status: offline 		Police.. police how or why? I don't recall if I have posted here before.. then again I read often but rarely post on any of the boards. I don't know any or I should say few of the people who post on CM, so why would I feel the need to even try and police anyone here.

Now that said.. I come here to read because frankly many of you have alot to teach when it comes to new ideas for male submissives. Domme's are not the only ones who play with 'boys' after all. On the other forums you don't see as many people talking about topics dealing with male submissives. So there you go in a nut shell.. just my two cents.

James

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 5:17:46 PM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama
Then you emailed ME and literally begged me (and by this I mean repeated use of the word "please") to stop responding to Mr. Gor-face and to "let him win" because it would "prove I was the bigger person".

Unfortunately demonstrating why I don't hang out here much.

Here's the complete text of the email I wrote you on 2/2/08 at 4:36pm, except that I have removed my real name, which I shared with you.

OMG, Shakti, you know I think you're a good writer. I praised and thanked you for that Lifestyle Domme post before this pro wrestling thing between you, Aswad and Nephandi ever came up. But I am soooooo not going to get dragged into this any further. If you want my advice, and you probably don't, be a little less macha and let him "win" if he posts again. People will think you are the bigger person. All the best.

Those are my own words, so I can post them.  I will not post your email response to me of 2/2/08 at 4:54pm.  You might, however, reread it and then decide if I was inaccurate when I said you told me you would no longer respond.

Edited to get the times correct.


< Message edited by RedMagic1 -- 3/4/2008 5:18:32 PM >

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to ShaktiSama)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 5:29:59 PM   
LadyHathor


Posts: 775
Joined: 1/2/2008
Status: offline 		because they are submissives topping from the bottom!
 
 


_____________________________

Lady Hathor, I am the Mistress Hathor of Orleans, I am what I am, often to the dismay and discomfort of others.

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 6:01:05 PM   
ShaktiSama


Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1
You might, however, reread it and then decide if I was inaccurate when I said you told me you would no longer respond.


You are inaccurate.  I never said I would "cease responding"--which you seem to think means "exit the thread without another word" or, as you put it, "let him win".  And I did not agree to make peace by submission.

More importantly, you missed the line of the message which was most germane to this discussion, which was:

quote:

In the end, the person I must be true to is myself, and that is all I can promise anyone.


I take my word very seriously, and I do not give it or break it lightly.  Do not tell people that I made promises to you and then broke them, because I did not.  I would no more promise to accede to male dominance than I would promise to grow a pair of wings and fly. 

_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

(in reply to RedMagic1)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 6:09:19 PM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline 		I am prohibited by TOS from posting your email. 

I did not name you, or Aswad, because that was only one example of a problem I have seen repeatedly.  The identities of the individuals really did not matter to me.  You chose to name yourself.

I see no value in a "he said-she said" thread hijack.  I hope you have a good evening.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to ShaktiSama)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:02:26 PM   
QueensWay


Posts: 22
Joined: 7/17/2007
Status: offline 		It is my belief that you acted reasonably and well within this thread and all threads at that. Seems many men are threatened by you. Dont pay attention to some of the male dom jerks in here, they give men a bad name.

(in reply to ShaktiSama)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:18:04 PM   
need2bused6


Posts: 49
Joined: 2/2/2008
Status: offline 		As new as I am on this board I have not noticed the position, Dominate Sub Switch ect that reply to a question or comment.  I am a gay male sub who reads all posts I find interesting regardless of where it is posted.  As a sub I probably learn less from the Ask a sub board than any other.  I attribute that to experience and I do go on to it to answer questions if I can add anything.  This lifestyle in my experience was far more segregated 25 years ago than it is now.  I look to other boards for information on the subtle differences in interaction that makes my Dom look better and shows proper respect, that is due to a Domme who are very tolerant and kind in accepting the same treatment I would give a Dom, even though it may be a subtle change that not only shows she is respected enough that I learned something seldom used and that may put make her more comfortable at that event.  I have found the fact in this case trying means more than doing the act of service perfect.   Although that is my goal

_____________________________

“There are only two tragedies in life: one is not getting what one wants, and the other is getting it.”

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:33:15 PM   
SixFootMaster


Posts: 829
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: QueensWay

It is my belief that you acted reasonably and well within this thread and all threads at that. Seems many men are threatened by you. Dont pay attention to some of the male dom jerks in here, they give men a bad name.


Mutual affirmation and validation is a beautiful thing, isn't it?

Six.


_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to QueensWay)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:38:40 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		Domi, we aren't "hurt", at least not more than anyone is.  If you didn't read the thread being referenced---and since it was my thread that one of our Gorean members derailed, I was up close and personal for it---then you don't know what went down.  So you think fem doms are a bunch of pissy bitches with ego problems.  Thanks for sharing.

He-said she-said arguments are pointless, but let's face it, it's not the women who start the pissing matches.  If I wasn't a tired old lady, I'd be kicking some shit myself, but I put such battles in the "teaching pigs to sing" category, and leave it to those with more energy. 

That said, RedMagic, why did SHAKTI have to back down and be less macha?  Why couldn't Aswad be the one to just STFU?  Why does a woman have to take the so-called high road, and STIFLE, as Archie Bunker said to his wife so often?  I am here to tell you that she doesn't.  *NONE OF US DO*. 

Guys, feel free to post here.  I don't care if you hate women, hate female dominants, or hate me.  This is an open forum.  But let me tell you this:  you do not have the right to silence us, or anyone else.  You do not have the right to "reprimand" anyone here--Mod 11 takes care of that nicely, thank you.  If you are a jackass, rest assured that at least one of us will call you on it, and your lame excuses for your bad behavior will *not* fly.  










_____________________________

[page 23 girl]



(in reply to QueensWay)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:44:03 PM   
hopelesslyInvo


Posts: 522
Joined: 2/10/2008
From: the future
Status: offline 		the problem seems to come from people who just love to think of their opinions as ultimate knowledge, and seem incapable of tolerating others not sharing their standpoint to the degree that *gasp* they will reply with a counter point.  "captain ego" will then provoke, insult, and belittle the writing of the poster and try to get the last word in so they can feel hunky dory and if things don't go their way or become too much of a burden, try to back out gracefully so as not to look as large of a fool as they have been.

i am more easily frustrated with the melee mouths that pick a side, but pretend they're "neutral" or "unbias".

perhaps the worst thing that has happened is to associate this sort of arrogance with the dominance of either gender, especially when in fact, i'm the only one that seems to know what they're talking about.  

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 7:51:34 PM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus
RedMagic, why did SHAKTI have to back down and be less macha?  Why couldn't Aswad be the one to just STFU?

I am responding because you asked me a direct question and I respect you.

Aswad and I corresponded at the same time.  He has not come to this thread, and has not said I wrote something I didn't.  I'm not going to discuss the specifics of private communication he and I had on the other side.  I wouldn't have done it at all with anyone, except that Shakti named herself, and brought up the (false) specific content of an email I sent her.

Anyone can post whatever they want.  However, if you get a reputation as someone who posts based on emotion instead of facts, you commit self-muzzling, because fewer and fewer people take you seriously.  My suggestion was one, based on my experience as a professional communicator, for how she could capture people's attention more, not less.

I will not return to this thread.  If anyone has further questions for me, please ask them on the other side.


_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 8:02:00 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1


I will not return to this thread.  If anyone has further questions for me, please ask them on the other side.



And so I did.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]



(in reply to RedMagic1)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Curious: why so many male doms - 3/4/2008 8:03:39 PM   
SixFootMaster


Posts: 829
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Domi, we aren't "hurt", at least not more than anyone is.  If you didn't read the thread being referenced---and since it was my thread that one of our Gorean members derailed, I was up close and personal for it---then you don't know what went down.  So you think fem doms are a bunch of pissy bitches with ego problems.  Thanks for sharing.

He-said she-said arguments are pointless, but let's face it, it's not the women who start the pissing matches.  If I wasn't a tired old lady, I'd be kicking some shit myself, but I put such battles in the "teaching pigs to sing" category, and leave it to those with more energy. 

That said, RedMagic, why did SHAKTI have to back down and be less macha?  Why couldn't Aswad be the one to just STFU?  Why does a woman have to take the so-called high road, and STIFLE, as Archie Bunker said to his wife so often?  I am here to tell you that she doesn't.  *NONE OF US DO*. 

Guys, feel free to post here.  I don't care if you hate women, hate female dominants, or hate me.  This is an open forum.  But let me tell you this:  you do not have the right to silence us, or anyone else.  You do not have the right to "reprimand" anyone here--Mod 11 takes care of that nicely, thank you.  If you are a jackass, rest assured that at least one of us will call you on it, and your lame excuses for your bad behavior will *not* fly.  



There is a difference between backing down, biting your tongue, etc, and simply acknowledging either that you were wrong in part or whole, or that the other party has made some decent points of consideration.

I expect a dominant - a genuine dominant, not merely someone who likes being in control or abusive - of either gender to be perfectly capable of admitting fault or error, or even keeping an open mind. That and to not fall back onto petty and immature name calling and school yard antics. The good news is that generally that expectation has been met, which has done a lot to maintain mutual respect between male and female dominants here and in the other forums. The bad news is that it hasn't been met universally, and there is one lady in particular who has not only failed, but failed spectacularly.

I mean, come on now, "Gor-face"?

Now, you consider this your domain, that much is obvious, but guess what? It's not. This is not a forum where female dominants reign supreme. Everyone is free to post, with respect accorded to the regulations and deference to the moderators. Yes, even without your permission. Not even the Gorean forum however is on a par with this one for territorial behavior. Ask a Master regularly sees a slew of comments on posts by Mistresses. Do we mind? No, not even a single iota. In fact, generally the content is worthwhile and thought provoking. Ask a submissive likewise gets slews of comments from Masters and Mistresses alike. Again, noone is enforcing domain or territory there. No strutting, no posing, just mutual exchange of information, ideas, ideals, and experiences.

It would be really good to see that happen here. Without the overaching defensiveness.

SixFoot.


_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 60
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