RE: Racist (Full Version)

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honeygirl -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 7:44:48 AM)

I give up!  What's a sloist??   I could very well be an undercover slo!



kittinSol -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 7:47:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: honeygirl

What's a sloist??  



You never know, with Ron. A soloist slut? He is the master of cryptic - have you seen his hood, and funny Jawa eyes?



mnottertail -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 7:48:24 AM)

one is racing the other slowing.....

I am a raconteur, and a salamander.

Peter Ustinov



Griswold -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 7:49:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Speaking of education Griswold said
quote:

There are however, races and groups that statistically do less well...and it's not racist to say so. It's just a statistic.
Which has been known for a long long time.

The convolutions that those who attempt to deny the facts go through make me dizzy.
As MrG pointed out it was fashionable to integrate secondary education. Now that hasn't worked suggestions are being made that education be segregated again. 

Mixed ability groups which disadvantaged everybody.
Streaming accord to ability. Not fair for those put in the lower streams.
There appears to be no end to this ongoing farce.



I think you encapsulated everything I said in my post (and with vastly fewer words LOL).



honeygirl -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 7:55:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol
A soloist slut?


Hahaha -- sadly, that is the case right now!   Ron's on to me!



bigdevs -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 9:31:54 AM)

I think the way in which Geraldine Ferraro spoke was right on par. She felt it was a fact that Obama was being voted in because he is biracial. By the same token, she also said she doubted whether, had her name been Gerald instead of Geraldine, she would have been the vice presidential nominee. She was sharing her thoughts and wasn't being racist and I tend to agree with her.

There are so many people I know who are afraid not to vote for Obama. They don't want to make it seem their racist so rather than put their views above the welfare of this nation, they vote for who they feel they have to vote for. I even know a black male who had to defend voting for Hillary. As he said, he has had to tell people repeatedly that he voted with logic and reasoning for the person with more experience (the one he feels can get us out of the mess Bush made) rather than voting with his heart.

People aren't voting for Obama because they believe he can give us change (come on - he rallies people like a football jock at a pep rally - who is going to vote for the jock for president?!). Many are voting for him because he'll be the first black president. It's history in the making I guess. Nevermind he's only been a senator for three years and he has little to no foreign policy experience. Let's vote him in because he said he is going to change the country and because he is a bigger minority than Hillary.

I vote based on who I think will do the best job. As a minority myself, I dislike Obama's stance on gay rights, disability rights (he believes in a separate but equal policy to solve the disability job crisis with over 70% of the disabled unemployed...yeah lets segregate them and pay them minor ducats they won't be able to survive on - its called sheltered workshops), and healthcare. I also feel pulling out of Iraq without forethought is foolish. Yes, I want the troops home, but we're so entrenched in the crap in  Iraq, it will be difficult to just leave.



FullCircle -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 9:42:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bigdevs
There are so many people I know who are afraid not to vote for Obama. They don't want to make it seem their racist so rather than put their views above the welfare of this nation, they vote for who they feel they have to vote for.


I know loads of people that are afraid to vote Obama because they don't want to be seen as being sexist. I tell these people that they don't have to worry because no one has to know who they ultimately voted for.[:D]



xxblushesxx -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 10:09:56 AM)

People should vote for the person that they feel would do the best job, not make the best statement.
I personally don't care if it's a black gay t-girl from mars, as long as this person (imo) has the best qualifications for the office.

As to the issue we were discussing before, do you feel it is racist to give certain people advantages that others don't only because of their race? I do.



FullCircle -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 10:19:11 AM)

Positive discrimination has been around far too long and I for one don't find anything positive about it.

You get to a certain position in life and you want no one to be able to say you got there because of this or because of that. I don't think positive discrimination ultimately helps anyone or gives anyone pride in themselves.




LotusSong -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 10:22:27 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bigdevs

I think the way in which Geraldine Ferraro spoke was right on par. She felt it was a fact that Obama was being voted in because he is biracial. By the same token, she also said she doubted whether, had her name been Gerald instead of Geraldine, she would have been the vice presidential nominee. She was sharing her thoughts and wasn't being racist and I tend to agree with her.

There are so many people I know who are afraid not to vote for Obama. They don't want to make it seem their racist so rather than put their views above the welfare of this nation, they vote for who they feel they have to vote for. I even know a black male who had to defend voting for Hillary. As he said, he has had to tell people repeatedly that he voted with logic and reasoning for the person with more experience (the one he feels can get us out of the mess Bush made) rather than voting with his heart.

People aren't voting for Obama because they believe he can give us change (come on - he rallies people like a football jock at a pep rally - who is going to vote for the jock for president?!). Many are voting for him because he'll be the first black president. It's history in the making I guess. Nevermind he's only been a senator for three years and he has little to no foreign policy experience. Let's vote him in because he said he is going to change the country and because he is a bigger minority than Hillary.

I vote based on who I think will do the best job. As a minority myself, I dislike Obama's stance on gay rights, disability rights (he believes in a separate but equal policy to solve the disability job crisis with over 70% of the disabled unemployed...yeah lets segregate them and pay them minor ducats they won't be able to survive on - its called sheltered workshops), and healthcare. I also feel pulling out of Iraq without forethought is foolish. Yes, I want the troops home, but we're so entrenched in the crap in  Iraq, it will be difficult to just leave.



I give this post my standing ovation!!!



FullCircle -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 10:37:33 AM)

The image that creates in my mind so bizarre.



bigdevs -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 11:04:09 AM)

Hey thanks LotusSong - I was just being honest and speaking truthfully about My feelings. I hate when people say I'm racist because I don't like Obama. I've heard it more than once. If I was a racist or homophobic or anything I wouldn't have a best friend who is African American, a lesbian, and in a wheelchair. She calls herself the minorities minority (black, in a wheelchair, a woman and gay - the quadruple whammy). We became best friends in college and I'd give her the shirt of My back....I often think people just say others a racist because it's PC to be proper and not mention any of the differences we all have. I have my differences and I'm  proud of them. There's differences between saying I got a job because they were afraid I would sue for discrimination since I am a minority and all...and I got a job off My own merits. Frankly, I'd take the job for My qualifications and skip it if I only got it for My minority status.

Just like that, theres a way to say he or she got preferential treatment due to their minority status and a way to say something mean because it is a racist statement. Not everything is racist. I think Ferraro handled herself well and I'm sad she stepped down.

-D



popeye1250 -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 11:05:48 AM)

Lotus, "no foreign policy experience" is a plus.
Seems the people in Washington are incapable of doing any foreign relations without the Taxpayers' checkbook in their hands.
You can have "relations" with foreign countries without giving them money.



RealityLicks -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 11:53:39 AM)

Unlike Hilary's role in "bringing peace" to Northern Ireland - where no-one involved can remember talking to her. [:D]



domiguy -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 3:54:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bigdevs

I think the way in which Geraldine Ferraro spoke was right on par. She felt it was a fact that Obama was being voted in because he is biracial. By the same token, she also said she doubted whether, had her name been Gerald instead of Geraldine, she would have been the vice presidential nominee. She was sharing her thoughts and wasn't being racist and I tend to agree with her.

There are so many people I know who are afraid not to vote for Obama. They don't want to make it seem their racist so rather than put their views above the welfare of this nation, they vote for who they feel they have to vote for. I even know a black male who had to defend voting for Hillary. As he said, he has had to tell people repeatedly that he voted with logic and reasoning for the person with more experience (the one he feels can get us out of the mess Bush made) rather than voting with his heart.

People aren't voting for Obama because they believe he can give us change (come on - he rallies people like a football jock at a pep rally - who is going to vote for the jock for president?!). Many are voting for him because he'll be the first black president. It's history in the making I guess. Nevermind he's only been a senator for three years and he has little to no foreign policy experience. Let's vote him in because he said he is going to change the country and because he is a bigger minority than Hillary.

I vote based on who I think will do the best job. As a minority myself, I dislike Obama's stance on gay rights, disability rights (he believes in a separate but equal policy to solve the disability job crisis with over 70% of the disabled unemployed...yeah lets segregate them and pay them minor ducats they won't be able to survive on - its called sheltered workshops), and healthcare. I also feel pulling out of Iraq without forethought is foolish. Yes, I want the troops home, but we're so entrenched in the crap in  Iraq, it will be difficult to just leave.



quote:

LotusSong
I give this post my standing ovation!!!


Of course lotus gives this a standing ovation. Who would be surprised?

Why aren't people voting for the potential of change? Correct me if I am wrong but name the last candidate that is as convincing and as magnetic as Obama...White,female,brown or black?

If you can do those things then I will put some weight on to the crap that you spew.


You feel that pulling out of Iraq is foolish...Why? When it is now established that virtually every single reason for the invasion has now been proved to be false. Please enlighten me.



OrionTheWolf -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 3:56:25 PM)

I suppose that is another acceptable discussion/debate tactic? You obviously have a reading comprehension problem if you believe that I wish fairness in anything. I notice the Defenders of Truth and Justice seem to life hypocricy as well, since they avoid questions and examples from their own posts that prove what they say is contrary to what they support.


quote:

ORIGINAL: RealityLicks

"Life is never fair so get over it and stop whining."




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 3:58:40 PM)

I accept your concession.


quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: RealityLicks

"Life is never fair so get over it and stop whining."



[sm=biggrin.gif]



Alumbrado -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 4:21:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

"Is social science from whence the construct of race came, not science?"

As I said, I have no idea. I've already given you a link to a lecture (he has also written at least one book: http://www.amazon.com/Race-Myth-Joseph-Graves/dp/0525948252 )

Here is a very cool pic: http://bizzbangbuzz.blogspot.com/2007/04/power-of-myth-of-race.html

Here's a link to a PBS "article": http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

Do you believe that modern biology/genetics shows that there are races in the Homo Sapiens sapiens genome?  Screw what the Social "Sciences" say.


Since you already know the answer to that question, trying to turn a false insinuation into straw is just disingenuous.

Added to your earlier logical fallacies that all science is the same, and your recent comment 'screwing' anything that blows holes in your erroneous assertions, and you now have identified yourself firmly as the garden variety troll species.

A pity, you almost had me fooled for a moment, hoping that you might actually be an honest, rational, and progressive poster, instead of another pseudo-lib hatemonger using high school debate tactics to promote ignorance....I'll leave you in the company of your comrades.



Hippiekinkster -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 5:09:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

"Is social science from whence the construct of race came, not science?"

As I said, I have no idea. I've already given you a link to a lecture (he has also written at least one book: http://www.amazon.com/Race-Myth-Joseph-Graves/dp/0525948252 )

Here is a very cool pic: http://bizzbangbuzz.blogspot.com/2007/04/power-of-myth-of-race.html

Here's a link to a PBS "article": http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

Do you believe that modern biology/genetics shows that there are races in the Homo Sapiens sapiens genome?  Screw what the Social "Sciences" say.


Since you already know the answer to that question, trying to turn a false insinuation into straw is just disingenuous.

Added to your earlier logical fallacies that all science is the same, and your recent comment 'screwing' anything that blows holes in your erroneous assertions, and you now have identified yourself firmly as the garden variety troll species.

A pity, you almost had me fooled for a moment, hoping that you might actually be an honest, rational, and progressive poster, instead of another pseudo-lib hatemonger using high school debate tactics to promote ignorance....I'll leave you in the company of your comrades.
Whatever, dude. I think I have been entirely open and forthcoming with you. I have attempted to answer your questions, and where I did not know the answer, said so. And I have done so in good faith, in good spirits, with the intent of having a good discussion.

Kitten: "Alumbrado argued (rightly, in my opinion) that in social sciences, "race" was used as a cultural construct."

Me: "I accept there is a socio-political reality known as "race" wherein people are judged on the basis of skin color and other minor genetic variances."

Cultural construct. Socio-political reality.

You have chosen to be adversarial, aggressive, evasive, and insulting.

This statement of yours, "Added to your earlier logical fallacies that all science is the same..." appears to assert that I made the statement that "all science is the same." I cannot find where I said that. Perhaps you could point it out for me. While we're at it, perhaps you can explain to me, and to the readers of this exchange, just how my belief that the concept of "race" is a human invention, and that modern genetics does not support the notion that there are separate "races" within the human genome, makes me a "hate-monger"?

Yes or no, do you believe that modern biology/genetics shows that there are races in the Homo Sapiens sapiens genome?



bigdevs -> RE: Racist (3/14/2008 5:23:40 PM)

I didn't say I didn't think we shouldn't leave. I'm all for bringing our troops home. I think the way in which Obama claims he's just going to say, ok lets come home and leave the mess we've made of the country without a thought, and leave the real terrorists who attacked on 9/11 in Afghanistan/Pakistan or wherever they are, yeah I think that's foolish. I hate the Iraq war and think we need to pull out, just not all at once, dropping everything and abandoning everything we have done to mess up a country we really had no right to invade in the first place.

As for Obama being charismatic, I don't see it. He's kind of 'pud-ish" to Me. I don't enjoy his speeches. I think he's shady and hiding something, and I think his inexperience shows. The only thing anyone remembers him saying is Change and Yes We Can. When is he speaking on the issues? A trained monkey (aka Dubya) could have said the same thing 4 years ago if his peeps had told him to and probably been just as believable as Obama. That wouldn't have gotten him my vote anymore than it didn't in either election he ran in.

Back to Obama, what is he going to change? He didn't do much to help Chicago or Illinois. Heck, some of the politicians supporting him can't name one redeemable thing he has done or fought for throughout his political career. So, lets put the messed up country in the hands of a Kindergartner and see how our debt doesn't get erased and the whole world decides to attack us because they realize the President is unexperienced.

Do you think it was any coincident 9/11 happened when Dubya was in office? He, too, lacked experience. He, too, made promises. Promises he never kept. Dubya was unexperienced so I won't be surprised if another 9/11 happens if Obama gets into office and it will be the fault of the US for electing an unexperienced president.

Talk is just talk, especially without action. Obama could promise us all the moon and it'd still be just talk. When he starts doing instead of speaking then I might start believing him.



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