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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:41:57 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

From what I've read the Chinese are having some very serious problems with pollution and loss of arable land/desertification. I've been thinking that they might collapse under that load.

That is a very serious problem for them.  Of course, would such a collapse make them more or less militaristic?  That would be my concern.  (China does have a nuclear arsenal of its own)



Why is it only the USA that sees China as a danger, could it be to do with US paranoia rather than anything China is doing?

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:47:09 AM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		That's completely contrary to every news article that I've seen that's been written about the Chinese military. I really think you're making it up. The truth is, the Chinese military has fistfulls of cash and they're on a spending spree, aquiring all the latest toys including aircraft carriers, ICBMs, tactical nukes, and on and on and on.

And Washington is hardly paying any attention.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
China has a host of problems including unrest in more places than Tibet because of land erosion and river pollution etc. It also has to contend with a paranoid Washington. You are right in what you imply, China is in no fit state to invade anyone and even on Washington's estimates, it is bearly replacing obsolete weapons.

This whole Tibet thing is being stirred up by people not interested in Tibet but more interested in getting at China.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:49:21 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
You still haven't answered my question.  What has he actually done that is great besides writing books and making speeches? 


He is a teacher.  That is great in and of itself.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:52:00 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

Yeah, he does change his tune when he is in front of gay and lesbian groups or is speaking in San Francisco. Good con men know how to change coats depending on the company.


So you bend the facts to fit the conclusion.  The greatest error of all--lack of logic.

We will discuss this matter again when your mind is open.  So long as your mind is closed, discussion is futile.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:56:15 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

That's completely contrary to every news article that I've seen that's been written about the Chinese military. I really think you're making it up. The truth is, the Chinese military has fistfulls of cash and they're on a spending spree, aquiring all the latest toys including aircraft carriers, ICBMs, tactical nukes, and on and on and on.

And Washington is hardly paying any attention.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
China has a host of problems including unrest in more places than Tibet because of land erosion and river pollution etc. It also has to contend with a paranoid Washington. You are right in what you imply, China is in no fit state to invade anyone and even on Washington's estimates, it is bearly replacing obsolete weapons.

This whole Tibet thing is being stirred up by people not interested in Tibet but more interested in getting at China.



You live in America, I understand why Americans get paranoid, at times it seems the sole raison d'etre for the American media is to instill fear into the American population, probably to keep them patriotic and in line.

The Chinese military is renewing its obsolete weapons on the back of its new found wealth and adding a little extra. It's what countries do. America does it all the time, in fact America is the world's biggest arms spender by a mile so it is a little rich that America should expect other countries not to have the potential to defend themselves. From what I have read, China has done and is doing nothing to provoke such paranoia in America.

As has turned out, we have got onto the real meat of this thread which isn't freeing Tibet but getting at China.

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:57:25 AM   
Sanity


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Status: offline 		What do you base those assumptions on?

What makes you think that Washington sees China as a threat, and what makes you think that no one else in the world does.


quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
Why is it only the USA that sees China as a danger, could it be to do with US paranoia rather than anything China is doing?


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 10:59:24 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

From what I have read, China has done and is doing nothing to provoke such paranoia in America.


There is the fairly constant saber-rattling at Taiwan under the rubric of "One China".  I'd say that's something.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:00:14 AM   
slaveboyforyou


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quote:

He is a teacher.  That is great in and of itself.


It depends on what is taught, the sincerity behind the lessons, and the actions to back up your assertions.  Thought without action is not admirable.  It's easy to sit around telling other people how to live, when you don't have to make a living.   

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:07:42 AM   
Hippiekinkster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

From what I've read the Chinese are having some very serious problems with pollution and loss of arable land/desertification. I've been thinking that they might collapse under that load.

That is a very serious problem for them.  Of course, would such a collapse make them more or less militaristic?  That would be my concern.  (China does have a nuclear arsenal of its own)

That's a darn good question. I guess it would boil down to whether the generals would do the CP's bidding, or if they would  have their troops sit any extra-territorial aggression out.

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:07:55 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

Thought without action is not admirable.
Ironic this should come from you.

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:07:58 AM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		Look, meatcleaver - I'm on the Internet right now. That should have given you your first clue that everyone here including me has total access to news sources from the world over, so please quit making such terribly misinformed and groundless assumptions like 'the American media is engaged in mind control'. If anything, the Chinese are engaged in mind control through their media restrictions and their tight control of all other sources of information - it's the only way Socialists can remain in power, after all.

Isn't it. 

And besides, most of the American media hates America even more than you do.  They would be the last ones to try to "keep Americans patriotic and in line".

So when you're finished trying to change this Free Tibet Now!!! thread into some weird  indictment of the United States, then perhaps we can debate the real issues before us. You can choose to pretend that the massive Chinese military buildup is something that Washington really cares about, you can pretend that their massive buildup isn't happening all you want.

But your pretending isn't anything close to reality!

And I'm not personally paranoid about it, I don't even care all that much about it. Things will work our somehow and besides, I'll be dead soon. The world has always been a harsh place. No reason to lose any sleep over it, but there is no reason to try to pretend that the sudden massive Chinese military buildup isn't for real, either.

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
You live in America, I understand why Americans get paranoid, at times it seems the sole raison d'etre for the American media is to instill fear into the American population, probably to keep them patriotic and in line.

The Chinese military is renewing its obsolete weapons on the back of its new found wealth and adding a little extra. It's what countries do. America does it all the time, in fact America is the world's biggest arms spender by a mile so it is a little rich that America should expect other countries not to have the potential to defend themselves. From what I have read, China has done and is doing nothing to provoke such paranoia in America.

As has turned out, we have got onto the real meat of this thread which isn't freeing Tibet but getting at China.


< Message edited by Sanity -- 3/16/2008 11:56:37 AM >

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:09:37 AM   
slaveboyforyou


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quote:

So you bend the facts to fit the conclusion.  The greatest error of all--lack of logic.

We will discuss this matter again when your mind is open.  So long as your mind is closed, discussion is futile.


When did I do that?  I pointed out the inconsistencies with his statements.  He says different things depending on who he is standing in front of.  His writings clearly state that he sees homosexuality as immoral. 

By open minded, I guess you mean blind.  I suppose should set aside the real history of the Lama system, because the Dalai Lama says warm, fuzzy stuff in front of crowds and celebrities to further his cause.  Well sorry, but not in this lifetime.  The Dalai Lama maybe able to fool the sheep, but I see right through his charade.  Skepticism is not close mindedness. 

quote:

Ironic this should come from you. 


What's that supposed to mean?  You don't know me or what I do.  That's cool though.  When people turn to personal insults in a debate, they have lost.  I guess I offended you by tearing apart your Messiah. 

< Message edited by slaveboyforyou -- 3/16/2008 11:13:23 AM >

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:10:52 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

Well sorry, but not in this lifetime.
As you wish.  Perhaps our discussion will occur in the next one.

< Message edited by celticlord2112 -- 3/16/2008 11:11:38 AM >

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:39:44 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

What's that supposed to mean? You don't know me or what I do. That's cool though. When people turn to personal insults in a debate, they have lost. I guess I offended you by tearing apart your Messiah.


Words are exactly as they appear.  Any insult you perceive is the product of your own anger  When you release the anger you release the insult.  That is the order of things.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:40:37 AM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

Any insult you perceive is the product of your own anger  When you release the anger you release the insult.  That is the order of things.



How Tibetan  !

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:41:57 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

Any insult you perceive is the product of your own anger  When you release the anger you release the insult.  That is the order of things.



How Tibetan  !


Thank you.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:46:36 AM   
slaveboyforyou


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quote:

Words are exactly as they appear.  Any insult you perceive is the product of your own anger  When you release the anger you release the insult.  That is the order of things.


I'm not angry, and I never said I was.  I'm have found this amusing. 

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 11:59:18 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

Words are exactly as they appear.  Any insult you perceive is the product of your own anger  When you release the anger you release the insult.  That is the order of things.


I'm not angry, and I never said I was.  I'm have found this amusing. 


You have not used the word "anger".  That much is true.


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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 12:00:27 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

And besides, most of the American media hates America even more than you do.  They would be the last ones to try to "keep Americans patriotic and in line".



I know you might find it incredible but I don't actually hate America, my brother lives in California and I visit quite often and enjoy myself immensely. I have shelfs full of books by American writers and racks of CDs by American musicians. I will even be drinking with a couple of Americans this evening. It's the constant worrying about potential competitors that lights my fire, when no one is within a million miles of the USA's military and economic power.

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RE: FREE TIBET NOW!!!!! - 3/16/2008 12:13:57 PM   
boy46


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Joined: 7/1/2007
Status: offline 		I think China and States respect each other due to their size. Instead of it, States prefer being bully agaisnt countries like Cuba, Irak and recently Iran, easier to handle. Israel agaisnt Palestine, etc, etc,,, I was surprised when recently Bush made a observation about Tibet, but i think he did because wanted wash a litle his face (votes?).
Tibet is the history of an abuse, a cruel represion in wich China is especialist. States has their own, like Irak or Guantanamo. Today we have hear that till today in Irak has died 90.000 habitants no military.
How many palestines have died due to Israel first-class armament?
World is a ugly site if we think about it. Its like the school when the big boys make bullying over their weaker mates... or not?
Be well :)

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