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RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:32:30 PM   
SinergyNstrumpet


Posts: 305
Joined: 2/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

I have never seen so many judgemental people in my life....... those of us that need meds to have " quality of life" be they pain meds... psych meds ..... asthma meds ... or whatever .. should not be judged... but supported and encouraged to lead the best possible life we can.


If that was pointed at me, please show me where I have judged anyone. If you were just hitting "fast reply" perhaps it would be best to note that because otherwise it is easy to misinterpret your meaning


julia

(in reply to MissHarlet)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:33:11 PM   
seeksfemslave


Posts: 4011
Joined: 6/16/2006
Status: offline 		I haven't read the whole thread but the recent publicity against anti depressant drugs occured because it came to light that the drug companies were less than honest in reporting the results of the trials on those drugs.

In some cases placebos performed as well and in others children in particular
became even more depressed.

Any who suffers serious psychological problems has my sympathy but I am not sure that sufficient knowledge is available at the moment to really help.
The brain is a complex and mysterious "machine"

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 3/16/2008 4:34:37 PM >

(in reply to Kalista07)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:34:38 PM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Rule
What if being depressed is one's purpose in life?

I don't for a second believe depression would be anyone's Purpose in life. Absurb

quote:

 Termyn8or
I believe that people who are depressed are so because there is a mental skill they have not yet acquired, which is to step back. 
    Mental skill ?    "I am not going to be depressed today- I will walk backwards"
 
faerytattoodgirl
making jokes seems to be your style No matter what the topic may be 


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A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:34:47 PM   
MissHarlet


Posts: 2728
Joined: 9/11/2005
From: El Paso , TX US
Status: offline 		No Julia it wasnt meant at you .. I just didnt hit fast reply like I thought I did .. give me a break .. senilty is setting in <wink>

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(in reply to SinergyNstrumpet)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:39:21 PM   
SinergyNstrumpet


Posts: 305
Joined: 2/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissHarlet

No Julia it wasnt meant at you .. I just didnt hit fast reply like I thought I did .. give me a break .. senilty is setting in <wink>


It's cool, I know this is a sensitive topic, It is one that I used to argue with my sister.



julia

(in reply to MissHarlet)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:39:28 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		I am in two minds about SSRI's, one side of me, the cynical side says all SSRI's serve is the drug companies who make them, and I would be interested to learn if depression medications were their biggest seller. The other side of me says, well, they might work, they have sort of rounded off a few edges from time to time, but on the whole, do little to lift mood, except when you either forget, or get so pissed off you can't be bothered to take them, then the mood shifts, within a couple of days forcing one to remember.

Stiff upper lip, that does'nt work, all you do is store everything up until one day it blows.


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to MissHarlet)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:41:12 PM   
Daddysredhead


Posts: 23574
Joined: 11/6/2005
From: Northern (yet still part of the South) Virginia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: swtnsparkling

quote:

Rule
What if being depressed is one's purpose in life?

I don't for a second believe depression would be anyone's Purpose in life. Absurb

quote:

 Termyn8or
I believe that people who are depressed are so because there is a mental skill they have not yet acquired, which is to step back. 
    Mental skill ?    "I am not going to be depressed today- I will walk backwards"
 
faerytattoodgirl
making jokes seems to be your style No matter what the topic may be 



SnS -

I agree with you on all 3 counts.

_____________________________

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Do not challenge me to a battle of wits & come to fight unarmed.

Are you really that stupid? ~ Bless your heart

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(in reply to swtnsparkling)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: why - 3/16/2008 4:55:30 PM   
awakenednj


Posts: 657
Joined: 2/10/2008
Status: offline 		Faery- Um... comedy takes timing. But, because that sorta razzled my nerve a little it made me wnat to post on this one.

Snippets of Mercnbeth's snippets..

quote:

No physical cause has been found for any of today's so-called mental illnesses.
The modes of action of psychiatry's drugs are unknown.
Psychiatric drugs interfere with a normal biological function, namely, normal neuroreceptor functioning.
Psychiatry's drugs are not normally found in the body.
Psychiatric drugs have an opposite kind of effect: They take away (mental) capabilities the person would have in the absence of the drug.
Psychiatric drugs disable the brain and hence the mind, the mind being the essence of the real self.



I do not believe these statements are true. At least not completely. I understand that someone wrote them in a book... but that still doesn't make them true. I would wonder when this book was copywrited? There are physical causes for chemical depression. There are physical causes for Schizophrenia, Bi-polar Disorder, BPD, and any number of other mental illnesses. Yes, many of these physical issues can be counteracter through non-chemical therapy, but that does not mean there is NOT a physical cause. I agree that there is not enough known about the modes of action for psychiatric drugs. Too many of the studies are based on cause and effect (well it worked in this many patients..) as opposed to the painstaking and not-so-cost effective research that needs to be done. They have only outlined the actions of the drug, but not accounted for sooooo many variables.... and that does make psyche meds scary. They prescribe them too much on "Well this one seems to work for 10 of my patients, lets try it".

The meds do interefere with normal function of the different neuroreceptors. However, if those receptors are broken... wouldn't it stand to reason that fixing them is good?
Psychatric drugs are found in the body naturally. I do not know about all of them, but for chemical depression, they are trying to replace what your body has stopped producing. The brain is part of your body, after all... These drugs might take away function from a brain operating in normal parameters, but if one of the chemical producing regions is not functioning, than they can bring function back.

Psychiatric drugs can disable, but they can also help.... I do not believe they are being used responsibly across the country (son't know about other countries), but they do have the capacity to help. I agree that so much more needs to be known before they can really be used completely safely and effectivley, but i do understand the struggle of a practioner who wants to help as well.

I do not know that i am ready to post my own story in such a public place. I know how different people in my own life react to my story, and it's hard enough on a one-on-one basis to take... Depends on people's experiences and how close to home it hits for them. However I will say that I do know from experience that whenthe chemicals are used properly there is a wold of difference. Incorrectly or sloppily applied by burnt-out md's (who i personally call pez dispensers) can ruin the life they are treating and many of those connected to them.

SHOULD NOT BE USED WITHOUT THERAPY. They can help imensly- they can change your outlook to one that you can now use to fix and grow... but if you are far enough down to need them, it is a REALLY good idea to have help climbing back up... even if  you have been given  rope.

To the one that mentioned it- DBT therapy is an incredible way of looking at things. Wish I could get the people in my life without psychiatic problems to take the class... Marsha Lineham (sp?) presented a wonderful outlook in her books.

Mercnbeth: I used your quotes because i have heard them before. I hope you realize that I that my disagreement with those ideas is meant to be a respectful one, not a put down. I know that people come to their viewpoints in many ways, and i hope that you don't hear my words as snippy... because i don't mean them to be....



(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: why - 3/16/2008 5:01:24 PM   
Daddysredhead


Posts: 23574
Joined: 11/6/2005
From: Northern (yet still part of the South) Virginia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

I am in two minds about SSRI's, one side of me, the cynical side says all SSRI's serve is the drug companies who make them, and I would be interested to learn if depression medications were their biggest seller. The other side of me says, well, they might work, they have sort of rounded off a few edges from time to time, but on the whole, do little to lift mood, except when you either forget, or get so pissed off you can't be bothered to take them, then the mood shifts, within a couple of days forcing one to remember.

Stiff upper lip, that does'nt work, all you do is store everything up until one day it blows.


I've found that the meds don't serve as a "happy pill" for me, but they help all the other garbage in my brain settle down, so I can deal with life as it comes, without letting it cripple me.  Being debilitated that way, and having small ones rely on you, can be a great motivator to get treatment, whatever kind of treatment is best for you. 

The best first step is getting help when you are the patient.  The best first step is being supportive when you are the patient's loved one.

Wishing those who have been there or are there... peace and the strength to get through the shadows, one day at a time until you see the sun again.

With love,
DRH

_____________________________

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Do not challenge me to a battle of wits & come to fight unarmed.

Are you really that stupid? ~ Bless your heart

13th doughnut


(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: why - 3/16/2008 5:05:17 PM   
awakenednj


Posts: 657
Joined: 2/10/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

I am in two minds about SSRI's, one side of me, the cynical side says all SSRI's serve is the drug companies who make them, and I would be interested to learn if depression medications were their biggest seller.


In my work I see the sales numbers for all types of drugs across the country. SSRI & SSNRI medications in the Retail, Mail Order, LTC & Nursing Home type facilities are by leaps and bounds the the biggest sellers. I mean by Billions and Billions.  This pisses me off everytime I have to run numbers for them. As long as the money is the motivation, i don't believe the research neccessary to make these drugs truly effective will ever happen. I do not deal in my job with other classes of trade too deeply, so I cannot say if the same is true for places like hopsitals, clinics, physicians offices, etc...

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: why - 3/16/2008 5:17:02 PM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

Greedy...i think you expressed yourself very well. I urge you to talk to a social worker (your pcp can put you in touch with one). There are many free/low cost services that you may not know about, including obtaining meds at little to no cost. A social worker can give you more info about this.


um... what's a pcp? (seriously...)

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(in reply to sirsholly)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: why - 3/16/2008 5:23:46 PM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Daddysredhead
I've found that the meds don't serve as a "happy pill" for me, but they help all the other garbage in my brain settle down, so I can deal with life as it comes, without letting it cripple me. 


Exactly.

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polysnortatious
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Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

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Profile   Post #: 52
RE: why - 3/16/2008 5:24:24 PM   
awakenednj


Posts: 657
Joined: 2/10/2008
Status: offline 		Primary Care Physician.. If you have insurance that you have to go mainly to one doctor... it's that guy/gal.

(in reply to GreedyTop)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: why - 3/16/2008 5:27:40 PM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		thank you.

Nope, no insurance. No medical care for me unless it gets to the point of hitting the ER.


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polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: why - 3/16/2008 7:29:19 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Actually 70% of people on antidepressants don't have to stay on it for life. They are on it from 18 to 24 months and get relief.  Of the 30% remaining, about half need 5 years on before it lifts for good. Only about 15% of people prescribed them need to stay on everyday.

I'm fourth generation mood disorder, fourth that I know about. We have no family history on this prior to my great-grandfather immigrating here. I'm the first generation with no suicide. The fifth generation has it a lot easier. No suicide attempts, no dropouts because they can't cope. They've all been diagnosed and treated at puberty if not earlier. The unipolars took a year or two of a SSRI and they probably won't need another round until middle age when the hormone levels change again. The ones with severe ADHD take a pill a day. Mine is bipolar and takes two pills a day. And is in the top 100 nationwide in her sport and in one of the top 20 private universities in the nation.

We believe in medication because we know what it's like to suffer needlessly.

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(in reply to MontrealPhoenix)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: why - 3/16/2008 7:31:52 PM   
MontrealPhoenix


Posts: 1526
Joined: 2/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

cure for depression:

1)buying me steak dinner
2)getting you drunk
3)sleeping with me that same night


faery, do you really think it's appropriate to make a joke in a thread like this one? There's a time and place for this sort of thing, this is not it.
 
Phoenix

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(in reply to faerytattoodgirl)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: why - 3/16/2008 8:05:03 PM   
Phoenix2raven


Posts: 347
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline 		After working in the mental health field for 12 years and seeing so many people get put on medication by their GP. Then finding out that the GP gets kick backs from the pharmaceutical companies. That about 80% of  the people never even went to see a therapist or a psychiatrist. They just saw a tv commercial that contains generalized symptoms. That is partially why I am very wary of any medication unless you are schizophrenic, bipolar, or organically depressed and have been properly diagnosed by a psychiatrist who spends a full hour or two with you not just 15 min. Most of all the people who took paxil or prozac and wound up psychotic  nuf said Steps of of soap box grumbling.     

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(in reply to MontrealPhoenix)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: why - 3/16/2008 8:14:27 PM   
SubbieOnWheels


Posts: 590
Joined: 12/14/2007
Status: offline 		~fr~
I have had situational depression - from being disabled and being out of work due to the disability. That crushing feeling that I was all alone - that I was useless and could do nothing worthwhile. It was temporary, and I came through it with the help of a good counsellor.

I can only imagine having that feeling clamping down on you day after day, month after month. I know of people who are unable even to leave their homes.

I say that whatever relief these people can get is fine by me.


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(in reply to MontrealPhoenix)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: why - 3/16/2008 8:23:24 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		So the cynical side of me had a point then. My doc knows my theories on this, as it is I get annoyed when I see all the drug company 'sweetner' merchandise around his office and only then wonder at what other unseen thing he or his practice have got from the various drug company sales reps.

On another side, I know of a barrister who was presribed amyltriptelene for a sore throat, been on it years now and cannot get off it.The same person given their job took a year off work to try and make a good go of getting off, it did not work, she is still on it.

I got diagnosed with clinical depression and PTSD, and so am on meds for it. I did not automatically seek medication, I tried to shift this without drugs, but I had to succumb at a particularly bad point of last year and am now one of the millions experimenting with SSRI.

Honestly, I think some doctors hand these things out like sweeties to all and sundry instead of finding out what the problem is first.


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: why - 3/16/2008 8:27:08 PM   
Owned1


Posts: 847
Joined: 7/6/2005
From: Toronto, Ontario
Status: offline 		It is similar to a dear friend of mine who fortunately is almost never sick enough to call sick to work.  She does not understand why people call in sick.  However she is now coming to realize how fortunate she is that she has not had to call in sick to work and said to me the other day she was worried that her time is coming and fears it will be a major illness.

Too many people today are not able to "walk in another's shoes".  As DRH said, " Just because you can't see the injury doesn't mean that it hurts any less."

Depression is an illness - a chemical imbalance - no different than any other chronic illness. 

Are antidepressants over used, perhaps but has anyone thought that is is now OK to admit they have depression?  It is not as taboo as it used to be.  In the past it was a weakness - you were simply not able to cope with your life.  It was taboo to admit never mind the fact the diagnosis and treatment was not out there.

I would suggest to those of you who have not ever experienced the deep darkness of depression be thankful.  If you have not ever had a family member or someone you care about experience the deep darkness of depression again be thankful. 

Depression is not simply about - life sucks - It is clinical and real.

There are many treatments some work for some others don't.

It really is quite simple.

Owned


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(in reply to Kalista07)
Profile   Post #: 60
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