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RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/24/2008 8:15:29 PM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

No one does something for nothing, unless they happen to be insane.


That doesn't work either, i am completely insane, and thoroughly selfish.  people may view some of the things i do as selfless, but they make me, and often those helped quite pleased and that is a doubly selfish act, as other's happiness enhances my own.


_____________________________

live hard, die young and leave a good looking corpse when you die.
Love ya, but, when the zombies start chasing us, i am tripping you.
The glass is always full, the question is, "with what?"

(in reply to Leatherist)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/24/2008 8:32:37 PM   
joyfulmalcontent


Posts: 19
Joined: 3/20/2008
Status: offline 		Im not involved right now, but my past relationships with Doms...well, I think that people cannot be selfless but people can perform selfless acts. Being selfless means being without need and there isnt a body on this planet without some sort of need, healthy or not. Some people need love, some need pleasure, some need pain, some even might "need" abuse, some need to dominate, some to submit. We all need something so no one is selfless. Being selfish is going beyond meeting your own need to wanting that little bit extra that makes it overboard. Thats my definition of being selfish. Its like eating til your full, then taking that second helping that puts you right over the edge. Taking care of yourself is just a basic survive instinct so that is meeting your needs, that's not selfishness. Selfishness is exceeding your needs. At least to me.

(in reply to atursvcMaam)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/24/2008 9:45:43 PM   
Poetryinpain


Posts: 341
Joined: 3/20/2008
Status: offline 		~fr~
This thread has been an interesting read. It has made me think of something in a new light.

When I was growing up, my parents were always skeptical of others' motives in doing nice things for us. They were sure that if someone did something that appeared selfless, there was always some ulterior motive.

Seeing things in the light of the posts here, however, has made me realize that indeed every act of kindness might well be viewed as "enlightened self-interest," but so what? I have the same motivations, don't I? So we're all human. And if I feel that an act of kindness was not absolutely altruistic, I can still be glad that the person saw doing good to me as being good for them.

I can live with that.

_____________________________

There is none so blind as he who will not see.

(in reply to joyfulmalcontent)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 6:27:56 AM   
petdave


Posts: 2479
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quote:

ORIGINAL: joyfulmalcontent

Im not involved right now, but my past relationships with Doms...well, I think that people cannot be selfless but people can perform selfless acts.
...
Being selfish is going beyond meeting your own need to wanting that little bit extra that makes it overboard.


That's what i was trying to get at, but expressed much more betterly. Thanks!

(in reply to joyfulmalcontent)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 6:55:31 AM   
chiaThePet


Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline 		I'm a little bit country,

I'm a little bit rock-n-roll.

Excuse me.....

It's about what?

Damn it Marie, quit laughing.

chia* (the pet)

_____________________________

Love is a many splendid sting.

You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

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RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 7:02:11 AM   
mistoferin


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Joined: 10/27/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

Ultimately selfish, with acts of selfless(to an extent) acts.  But the selflessness leads to selfish pleasure.
 
the.dark.

 
Ditto.

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Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 8:27:12 AM   
stella41b


Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline 		Balanced.

Here I mean something reciprocal, a transaction, an exchange, something for something.

It is knowing that the fulfillment of her needs is synonymous with the fulfillment of mine.

My opinion here is based on the theory that nothing is for free, therefore everything costs something.

Therefore you cannot obtain something without giving something (or losing something) and you cannot give something without receiving something in return.

Such is the nature of the transaction, such is the nature of the relationship.

_____________________________

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(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 8:29:16 AM   
joyfulmalcontent


Posts: 19
Joined: 3/20/2008
Status: offline 		Thank You, petdave, for your kinds words. smile

(in reply to stella41b)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 9:46:43 AM   
kaleique


Posts: 13
Joined: 3/17/2008
Status: offline 		If I find pleasure in doing a selfless act that doesn't make it selfless does it?  I suppose the pleasure I get from submitting makes it selfish.  The thrill I get from being rewarded for a job well done...yes, I get something from my submission.  Don't we all?  It is about balance. 

(in reply to LadyHathor)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 10:06:31 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kaleique

If I find pleasure in doing a selfless act that doesn't make it selfless does it?  I suppose the pleasure I get from submitting makes it selfish.  The thrill I get from being rewarded for a job well done...yes, I get something from my submission.  Don't we all?  It is about balance. 


I am not picking you out personally, but I wanted to use the questions you asked for my "what if" questions.  I hope you don't mind!

What if you aren't finding pleasure in doing what you are required to do for a period of time?  What if there is no thrill?  What if you aren't getting rewarded for a job well done?  What if, for an extended period of time, you were required to "hang in there" with something that was painful, but that you had committed to do?  And what if you doing this was what your Dominant/Master needed and wanted from you and so you did it?

Would you consider that to be selfish or selfless....and why?

I hope LadyHathor doesn't mind me extending the question a bit!

_____________________________

Good is the enemy of great.

(in reply to kaleique)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 10:09:05 AM   
petitespitfire64


Posts: 182
Joined: 10/4/2007
Status: offline 		Damn it...I actually had one Dom of mine accuse me of wanting to suck his cock for MY OWN enjoyment. The NERVE of the man for being right. Sheesh

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**Daneene**
"The right thing to do isn't always the popular thing to do"

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 10:16:40 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

I am not picking you out personally, but I wanted to use the questions you asked for my "what if" questions.  I hope you don't mind!

What if you aren't finding pleasure in doing what you are required to do for a period of time?  What if there is no thrill?  What if you aren't getting rewarded for a job well done?  What if, for an extended period of time, you were required to "hang in there" with something that was painful, but that you had committed to do?  And what if you doing this was what your Dominant/Master needed and wanted from you and so you did it?

Would you consider that to be selfish or selfless....and why?

I hope LadyHathor doesn't mind me extending the question a bit!


For it would still be selfish. I'd be hanging in there because I knew we would eventually go back to the relationship dynamic that I love and don't want to live without. I've done it before, and I'll probably do it again because life gets in the way. Even when I'm doing chores I don't like doing, that I hate doing, that maybe even hurt, in the end I'm doing it for his smile and how his smile makes me feel.

I can make a lot of different people smile and I can make a lot of different people happy. The selfishness is that I choose who to make happy because of how their happiness makes me feel, not just to make people happy.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 10:41:40 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
I can make a lot of different people smile and I can make a lot of different people happy. The selfishness is that I choose who to make happy because of how their happiness makes me feel, not just to make people happy.


Thanks, Aquatic, for your answer.  You presented an interesting perspective to consider and I appreciate it!


_____________________________

Good is the enemy of great.

(in reply to AquaticSub)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 10:53:01 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		You are most welcome.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 10:57:12 AM   
Poetryinpain


Posts: 341
Joined: 3/20/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
What if you aren't finding pleasure in doing what you are required to do for a period of time?  What if there is no thrill?  What if you aren't getting rewarded for a job well done?  What if, for an extended period of time, you were required to "hang in there" with something that was painful, but that you had committed to do?  And what if you doing this was what your Dominant/Master needed and wanted from you and so you did it?

Would you consider that to be selfish or selfless....and why?


It's still selfish - not in the sense that you are taking more than you deserve, but in the sense that you know you will eventually get some positive emotional reward for your actions.

For instance, what if (don't you just love what-ifs?) your Dom became very ill and you had to provide in-home care for him? I know from experience that there are some aspects to caring for an invalid that are decidedly unpleasant. I had to commode my mother for nearly a week, and at first I thought I'd be sick. But I wasn't. There was no special 'thrill' in doing this onerous task, but it had to be done.

If I had to perform the same duties for a Dom, I would do it, even if he were incapable of giving me any sign that he appreciated it. Because I'd be doing it for a person I love deeply, darn it, there's the reward. And I think that any task I performed for him, whether I liked it or not, whether I got any joy from doing it or hated every minute of it, would generate the same reward.

_____________________________

There is none so blind as he who will not see.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 11:01:17 AM   
BeingChewsie


Posts: 1633
Joined: 10/27/2005
Status: offline 		It is selfish on my end and it happens to be something he finds useful. So it *works*.

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to Leatherist)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 11:05:10 AM   
celofane


Posts: 7
Joined: 3/25/2008
Status: offline 		oops, time to drop the dual personality, I think

< Message edited by celofane -- 3/25/2008 11:06:57 AM >

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 11:13:18 AM   
charmdpetKeira


Posts: 916
Joined: 6/2/2007
Status: offline 		~fr~

I don’t understand why everyone keeps saying their participation, in their relationships, is selfish.

I mean, you are thinking of your SO, when you do that stuff; aren’t you?

confused

_____________________________

Life is tough, that does not mean it isn't fair.

There is no wrong choice, only consequence.

(in reply to celofane)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 11:16:43 AM   
kaleique


Posts: 13
Joined: 3/17/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

quote:

ORIGINAL: kaleique

If I find pleasure in doing a selfless act that doesn't make it selfless does it?  I suppose the pleasure I get from submitting makes it selfish.  The thrill I get from being rewarded for a job well done...yes, I get something from my submission.  Don't we all?  It is about balance. 


I am not picking you out personally, but I wanted to use the questions you asked for my "what if" questions.  I hope you don't mind!

What if you aren't finding pleasure in doing what you are required to do for a period of time?  What if there is no thrill?  What if you aren't getting rewarded for a job well done?  What if, for an extended period of time, you were required to "hang in there" with something that was painful, but that you had committed to do?  And what if you doing this was what your Dominant/Master needed and wanted from you and so you did it?

Would you consider that to be selfish or selfless....and why?

I hope LadyHathor doesn't mind me extending the question a bit!


I find myself in a position like that currently.  I've been asked to do something that my whole being is screaming at me not to do but I'm doing it anyway.  And yes, it's still a selfish decision.  The act may be selfless, but the decision to committ myself to doing it stems from the hope that there will still be that reward at the end.  I don't have to like the act, I love him and that's where the selfishness comes in.  I want his love in return...everything else stems from that.  Perhaps not everyone feels that way but for me my submission comes from the desire to make the one I love happy.  That's my desire though....how can my desire be a selfless act?  When it comes to doing something I don't find enjoyment in....something that makes me utterly miserable, I may not be happy in the moment but moments pass and it's future joy I hope for.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Selfless or Selfish - 3/25/2008 11:49:13 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		Thanks to those who replied to the sub-question I asked on this thread.  It's something I have found myself not understanding yet wanting to.

I looked up selfless, because I have OCD and when I'm on a subject I have to pick at it until my brain is satisfied.

Oxford:  concerned more with the needs and wishes of others than with one’s own.

Cambridge:  Someone who is selfless only thinks of other people's advantage:

American Heritage: Having, exhibiting, or motivated by no concern for oneself; unselfish:

Webster:  Having no regard to self; unselfish.

Encarta:  putting other people's needs, interests, or wishes before your own


Perhaps relationships are simply a blend of selfish and selfless motivations and acts.  Perhaps it is not one or the other.  I put my Master's desires before my own.  It feels good to see him content.  The two go hand in hand - his contentment feeds my own.

It's been an interesting thread.



_____________________________

Good is the enemy of great.

(in reply to kaleique)
Profile   Post #: 40
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