RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (Full Version)

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celticlord2112 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 5:24:43 PM)

Ummm.....does anyone have a link to the speech Obama gave that Dobson is all worked up about?

I'd like to know what Obama actually said before I decide whether to agree or disagree with Dobson (not too fond of his politics but the boy generally knows his way around the New Testament)




Emperor1956 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 5:30:47 PM)

I have been waiting for a place to post this:







When it comes to bullshit, big-time, major league bullshit, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time!

But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit!
George Carlin, 1999.

RIP, funny guy.




celticlord2112 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 5:33:49 PM)

[sm=offtopic.gif]

A link to Obama's speech, however, would be on topic.  Anyone?  Google is not being my friend today.




Alumbrado -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 5:34:14 PM)

quote:

George Carlin, 1999.

RIP, funny guy.


He was da man...




Level -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 6:08:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

Ummm.....does anyone have a link to the speech Obama gave that Dobson is all worked up about?

I'd like to know what Obama actually said before I decide whether to agree or disagree with Dobson (not too fond of his politics but the boy generally knows his way around the New Testament)



The speech http://www.barackobama.com/2006/06/28/call_to_renewal_keynote_address.php

and Obama's response to Dobson: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080625/ap_on_el_pr/dobson_obama




Alumbrado -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 6:26:57 PM)

Let's see what we get when we apply a well known Biblical pesher based on Obama's social security number, and highlight the selected passages...

quote:


Good morning. I appreciate the opportunity to speak here at the Call to Renewal's Building a Covenant for a New America conference. I've had the opportunity to take a look at your Covenant for a New America. It is filled with outstanding policies and prescriptions for much of what ails this country. So I'd like to congratulate you all on the thoughtful presentations you've given so far about poverty and justice in America, and for putting fire under the feet of the political leadership here in Washington.
But today I'd like to talk about the connection between religion and politics and perhaps offer some thoughts about how we can sort through some of the often bitter arguments that we've been seeing over the last several years.
I do so because, as you all know, we can affirm the importance of poverty in the Bible; and we can raise up and pass out this Covenant for a New America. We can talk to the press, and we can discuss the religious call to address poverty and environmental stewardship all we want, but it won't have an impact unless we tackle head-on the mutual suspicion that sometimes exists between religious America and secular America.
I want to give you an example that I think illustrates this fact. As some of you know, during the 2004 U.S. Senate General Election I ran against a gentleman named Alan Keyes. Mr. Keyes is well-versed in the Jerry Falwell-Pat Robertson style of rhetoric that often labels progressives as both immoral and godless.
 


Well, there you have it, for those willing to read between the lines...




atursvcMaam -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 6:39:02 PM)

i am not really hot on Dobson or Sharpton, but this piece came up in a Dobson interview, and honestly, this scares me.
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewCommentary.asp?Page=/Commentary/archive/200801/COM20080109b.html

Please, someone tell me this is WAY off base.  Whose version of Christianity, no matter how it is altered does not honor "Thou Shalt Not Kill"?




TheHeretic -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 6:42:40 PM)

     Nice.  [sm=rofl.gif]




celticlord2112 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 6:52:08 PM)

Taken from that CNS News article:
quote:

"Number one," said Obama, explaining his reluctance to protect born infants, "whenever we define a pre-viable fetus as a person that is protected by the Equal Protection Clause or the other elements in the Constitution, what we're really saying is, in fact, that they are persons that are entitled to the kinds of protections that would be provided to a -- a child, a 9-month old -- child that was delivered to term. That determination then, essentially, if it was accepted by a court, would forbid abortions to take place. I mean, it -- it would essentially bar abortions, because the Equal Protection Clause does not allow somebody to kill a child, and if this is a child, then this would be an anti-abortion statute."

With these words, Obama is placing abortion above the question of what constitutes a "person".    Obama is protecting abortion even to the extent of denying personhood to ostensibly "aborted" fetuses, whose hearts beat on their own, whose lungs breathe on their own.

What a guy.




atursvcMaam -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 7:12:16 PM)

quote:


Jesus spoke about social justice and taking care of the weakest among us,feeding the hungry,clothing the naked,aiding the sick,counseling/caring for people in prison,etc.

He didn`t say jack shit about gay rights or abortion.How the fuck did those things become the main issues and not what Jesus spoke about?
  


i actually have an open mind about abortion, it would not be my choice, but i have debated it with myself, with cause.  I am not at peace  making anyone else's choice.  However i do believe in helping the weakest.  Mr. Obama appears to not give them a chance.  Don't tell him, but where there is life there is hope.




Alumbrado -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 7:17:55 PM)

A Democrat Presidential candidate who doesn't support a zero tolerance policy against abortion? Plus he's... gaaaasp... a politician?  And he is upsetting the 'natural order of things', AND isn't a dominionist?  Well I never...[sm=hewah.gif]


Y'all are going to have to do better than this or it is going to be a looooong time until Novemeber.  [sm=sleepy.gif]




atursvcMaam -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 7:26:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

A Democrat Presidential candidate who doesn't support a zero tolerance policy against abortion? Plus he's... gaaaasp... a politician?  And he is upsetting the 'natural order of things', AND isn't a dominionist?  Well I never...[sm=hewah.gif]


Y'all are going to have to do better than this or it is going to be a looooong time until Novemeber.  [sm=sleepy.gif]


Sleep well, read the article, and i hope all your ums are born and stay perfect.




Alumbrado -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 7:28:14 PM)

And hope no one you know is ever raped, and forced to be a breeder by the government... 




celticlord2112 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 7:30:03 PM)

quote:

A Democrat Presidential candidate who doesn't support a zero tolerance policy against abortion?

A person who would argue that a living, breathing, infant is not a person merely because it is expelled from the womb via an "induced labor abortion".

Take the abortion issue itself off the table.  What should we make of an articulated position that a child, outside the mother's womb, breathing on its own, heart beating on its own, is not a person and should be denied the equal protection of the law?

Unless the article quotes Obama in error, that was his stated position in the Illinois Senate.




atursvcMaam -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 7:35:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

And hope no one you know is ever raped, and forced to be a breeder by the government... 
  

Thanks, me too, and i am quite happy that no one has the opportunity to define whether my UMs are or are not a "person".
i have a few that might come under question from time to time.




Owner59 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 8:12:00 PM)

Obama dismisses Dobson criticism about Bible

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080625/ap_on_el_pr/dobson_obama

Obama disses Dobson..

Dobson,you have been served!....




celticlord2112 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 8:22:22 PM)

Obama's got this one wrong:

From his original speech:

quote:

And even if we did have only Christians in our midst, if we expelled every non-Christian from the United States of America, whose Christianity would we teach in the schools? Would we go with James Dobson's, or Al Sharpton's? Which passages of Scripture should guide our public policy? Should we go with Leviticus, which suggests slavery is ok and that eating shellfish is abomination? How about Deuteronomy, which suggests stoning your child if he strays from the faith? Or should we just stick to the Sermon on the Mount - a passage that is so radical that it's doubtful that our own Defense Department would survive its application? So before we get carried away, let's read our bibles. Folks haven't been reading their bibles.
As I recall my uncle's sermons (my mother's brother is a Presbyterian minister), a Christian takes the Bible as a whole or not at all.  There are no singular passages one can parse out to guide public policy.

quote:

This brings me to my second point. Democracy demands that the religiously motivated translate their concerns into universal, rather than religion-specific, values. It requires that their proposals be subject to argument, and amenable to reason. I may be opposed to abortion for religious reasons, but if I seek to pass a law banning the practice, I cannot simply point to the teachings of my church or evoke God's will. I have to explain why abortion violates some principle that is accessible to people of all faiths, including those with no faith at all.

This is just simply incorrect.  The religious man may well craft legislation and cast votes in Congress based wholly upon the tenets of his faith.  Indeed, if he is sincere in his belief he has a duty to conduct the public's business in this manner.  Likewise, he has the duty to his constituents to explain his conduct fully, honestly, and with full articulation of the religious beliefs that guide him.  It is then up to his constituents to decide if his service merit re-election or removal.

A Christian may--and I would argue, should--point to his religious faith as justification for his vote on a matter of public policy, if in fact his faith is what moves him to the specifics of that vote.  To do otherwise is to engage in a pernicious dishonesty, with himself as well as his constituents.  Likewise, the Muslim should point to his understanding of Mohammed's teachings, just as the Buddhist would rely on the Sutras.

Democracy does not demand that any person set aside religious conviction in the discharge of his office.  The Constitution demands that laws giving preference to one religious conviction over another not be enacted.  That proscription, however, does not inure against the spiritual man from following the dictates of his faith in the discharge of public service.

The First Amendment bars God from legislation, not from the hearts of legislators.




Alumbrado -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 8:31:53 PM)

Which still doesn't answer the question 'whose Christianity?'.  Your's?  Reverend Wright's? The Quaker's?  Rev. Wildemon's?  Westboro Baptist church? Louis Farrakhan's?




Owner59 -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 8:38:07 PM)

Mine,of course....




atursvcMaam -> RE: James Dobson to blast Obama (6/24/2008 8:46:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Obama dismisses Dobson criticism about Bible

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080625/ap_on_el_pr/dobson_obama

Obama disses Dobson..

Dobson,you have been served!....


i think i have lost my universal translator, what does the sermon on the mount have to do with the department of defense????




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