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Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 2:34:39 PM

JaloHurmuri

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One the wonders of social networks like collarme.com are journals. Some of our fellow kinksters make special effort to share their thoughts and feelings with the rest of us. I find this very admirable and inspiring. Thank you for the effort.

Recently I red two columns, both were covering the same theme from slightly different angels. The essential question being what are the ground rules of the game and why they should not be followed. Or should they be?

Back in time, when I was a Master and dominated random people I took great pride of newer allowing my subjects to have safewords.

For me the reason was pretty simple. I felt that having the safeword - even if it was never used – changed the dynamics of the situation. Instead of really being dominant I would have become a character in a role-play. This was never an option, I tried once and felt really silly .-)

At the same time I was deeply involved in the “Scene” and I had a very good insight what can happen when stupid or selfish people use this option. Broken bodies. Broken minds. It was almost like an ordinary afternoon in modern Bagdad.

Safewords are utmost important to majority of the players, simply because most dominants are not capable, or interested, of reading their subjects. Subbies may not be intelligent enough to read their doms and understand how to give suttle instructions about her personal limits.

Furthermore playing without safewords requires a lot of trust. Trust that is usually built little by little in long-term relationship. Having the trust with newly met people takes exceptional courage or - beyond the description stupidity - from the sub. The same goes with the dom; accepting the responsibility means that the he is either careless, stupid or extremely competent.

Should we divide the players into two different categories: Those with enough empathy and courage to play “I trust you game” and to those who should play it “safe, sane & consensual”.

You tell me?

-JaloHurmuri

Post #: 1

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 2:37:25 PM

fluffyswitch

Posts: 1108
Joined: 9/29/2007
From: Buffalo
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what rules? there's rules now?

it boils down to, what works for an individual dynamic works for that dynamic. i think that you'll find that most people fall between those two catagories. this is a notoriously hard group to pin down.

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Post #: 2

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 2:41:16 PM

SweetNika

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From: Forest Hills, Maryland
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What rules?
Who makes the rules? You, me, the governement, a religous group, your mom, your grandmother?

Each relationship has it's own dynamics, those involved set up their own rules and guidelines and those are often tweekend as time goes on. Their is no one true way. There is only the one true way that works for you TODAY.

Blessed be,
Nika

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RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 2:41:45 PM

azropedntied

Posts: 1829
Joined: 7/25/2005
From: Phx AZ
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when did this become a game ?Let alone rules , i must have missed the handing out of this info decades ago nor did i get any update info since .
Perhaps you should try the community VS the "scene " and game"with players " ..
good luck /

(in reply to fluffyswitch)

Post #: 4

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:18:07 PM

kiwisub12

Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
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I play with my Sir without a safeword. I didn't initially - when we were getting to know each other, Sir gave me a safeword, which i never used, then rescinded it when he collared me.
Now i just beg a lot - lol.
Why be divisive - i don't really think we need more labels for ourselves. Seems like there are too many already, and a lot of people who are keen to use them. Perhapes for you it might work to put in your profile that you are looking for a sub with exceptional trust in her chosen dom, and explain your reasoning.

For me, being the somewhat sane, somewhat cautious person i am, if i ever am in the market for another dom, i would want a safeword until i trust my dom. I would not be willing to just assume that he was trustworthy, especially if i had just met him. That would not be to say that i would think he wasn't trustworthy, but it takes a little time to learn your partners reaction to pain, and sometimes you might need a "heads-up".

(in reply to azropedntied)

Post #: 5

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:20:58 PM

Shadow-tiger

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From: California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JaloHurmuri

Should we divide the players into two different categories: Those with enough empathy and courage to play “I trust you game” and to those who should play it “safe, sane & consensual”.

When I saw the thread title my first thought was that there aren't any over arcing rules that everyone follows. It's not like bdsm is regulated among its peers and the more miscreant types have to worry about being punished for flogging a little too hard. Then I thought that perhaps this would be obvious, and that the post was in fact relating to a particular play between two people. That would have made some sense at least.

As for this question of dividing the players into two categories, I've got to say that thinking is just daft. You always play Safe, Sane & Consenual. Period. I can think of specific instances where two adults may negotiate things that push the limits. But you just don't break your toys.

</rant>

(in reply to JaloHurmuri)

Post #: 6

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:28:51 PM

SweetNika

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From: Forest Hills, Maryland
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Shadow-tiger,
Some people enjoy breaking their toys and that is the scary part at least to me.

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Blessed be,
Nika

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RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:35:18 PM

Shadow-tiger

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Joined: 6/8/2008
From: California
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Well there is that. I happen to have a certain affection for the idea of breaking my toys. But it's the difference between wanting to and being willing to.

(in reply to SweetNika)

Post #: 8

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:39:46 PM

IrishMist

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/rubs both her eyes vigorously before grabbing some towels and window cleaner and scrubbing hard at the monitor screen

quote:

Safewords are utmost important to majority of the players, simply because most dominants are not capable, or interested, of reading their subjects. Subbies may not be intelligent enough to read their doms and understand how to give suttle instructions about her personal limits.

Am I reading this right?
/rubs eyes one more time

Yep, it has not changed.

Did this...person....actually say that we are not intelligent enough to convey to another when a limit has been reached?

NOt to mention the fact that he said Dominants aren't sensitive or....human...enough to read the emotions of the person that they are playing with.

My mind boggles at the complete ignorance of some people.

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RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:45:53 PM

beargonewild

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You must remember that for many people, there are some who just engage in WIITWD as a role play scenario to add that "zip" to their lives and then there are others who basically live this 24/7. What I see as being most important is the rules being laid out and adhered to by the dominant and the submissive in accordance to the type of relationship they are building together.

I perceive trust being an entity which is nurtured and developed between a dom and sub. Quite often they reach a point where enough trust is given from both sides where they banish the use of safewords because of that great level of trust between them. For others, having a safeword, even if it's never used, is something which is part and parcel to their dynamic.

Let me ask this, do we really need to divide the two? In the overall scheme, we are all in this for our own reasons. We are seeking a partner who is best suited for us which logically means that we create our relationship that we feel is appropiate for ourself and not according to an unwritten code of rules. As I see it, the "I trust You game," "safe, sane, consensual," or "RACK" are different terminology yet they still indicate a measure of trust and trustworthyness.

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Post #: 10

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:47:43 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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Safewords have nothing to do with trust.

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RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 3:48:27 PM

beargonewild

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Yet it seems for many it is an indicator.

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Promiscuous boy you already know
That I’m all yours what you waiting for?

Resident MANWHORE ~1000 Bear pts~

10 NZ points
Whips~n~Cuffs

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 12

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 4:58:11 PM

MasterErrant

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Joined: 11/9/2005
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I'm not much for the established rules...many of the are PCC (Politically correct crap) Designed to make us more accepeible to the ret of the world.

I use safe words. As unless you are superhuman you can't predict everything...Murphy you know. But I make it clear that useing them is very bad and a last resort. Worthy of discipline at least and punishment for misuse. Thus it becomes a part of the scene.
Beside the fact that happy subs ETC. make better ones.

(in reply to JaloHurmuri)

Post #: 13

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 5:11:56 PM

MasterErrant

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I just my respect for SS&C the night I saw a "Master" Strapping his pregnant wifes belly/ And was told it was negotiated and therefore ok.

What we do is not particularly safe. questionable sane and consent goes out the door as soon as the endorphins start pumping.
It's amazing what you gan get a high flying bottom to agree too. let alone a sub

(in reply to MasterErrant)

Post #: 14

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 5:18:41 PM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: azropedntied

when did this become a game ?Let alone rules , i must have missed the handing out of this info decades ago nor did i get any update info since .
Perhaps you should try the community VS the "scene " and game"with players " ..
good luck /

Apparently about the same time that someone decided they were special enough to 'just know' when their sub was having a medical emergency.

(in reply to azropedntied)

Post #: 15

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 5:27:17 PM

SageFemmexx

Posts: 240
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MasterErrant:

My first thought was who was the master negotiating with? I don't think the fetus got much of a sayso in that scene and my second was I'd like to see the explanation to the ER doc when she breaks her water or abrupts her placenta. They'd better have decent health insurance to pay for that premie baby.....

I think you make a good point about endorphins but common sense is no long common.

Be well,
Sage

(in reply to MasterErrant)

Post #: 16

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 5:32:19 PM

Prinsexx

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Joined: 8/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JaloHurmuri

Should we divide the players into two different categories: Those with enough empathy and courage to play “I trust you game” and to those who should play it “safe, sane & consensual”.

You tell me?

-JaloHurmuri

Hi Jalo
This is your first post so welcome....let me see...
I hate team sports

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Post #: 17

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 5:42:44 PM

pinkwind

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In my life, slave or no, there are certain elements in place to keep me mentally and physically as whole as i can be, having regard to disability endured. i call what i have "insurance", something one never hopes to call upon, but what i feel necessary to function, me being the one ultimately responsible for my own welfare, no matter what kind of relationship i am in.

That i trust Andy is a given, he slices me with knives, throttles me with his bare hands, burns me, hits me with gawd knows what, sends me soaring with pleasure whilst he takes his own, and throughout all he watches out for me, understands as much as is possible my reactions to stimulus, to pain, and has a care not to damage what he hopes to use for many a day to come.

But ultimately we all have to look out for our selves, there isn't a relationship out there where that doesn't hold true, no matter the power exchange or the trust. We are very communicative, have learned the nuances within our interactions together, are jointly responsible for each others well being, safety and happiness, but no matter how good were are at reading each other, no matter how emotionally attuned we are, the bottom line is still personal responsibility.

It isn't a rule, there aren't any. It probably isn't a widely held viewpoint either, but that's not what relationships are about, the approbation of others. It's just a fact of life where i am concerned, and accepted by my partner.

< Message edited by pinkwind -- 7/2/2008 5:45:09 PM >

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Post #: 18

RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 6:01:09 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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One; he isn't stupid. Two; I trust him. But the reason I have the ability to stop play is simple. He isn't a mindreader.

I've had a hand go cold and numb. No way could he tell in the position I was in, propped up on pillows so my arms weren't compressed. But my left wrist goes numb very easily, the nerve must be closer than normal to the surface. Not a question of me taking control or role play. Not a question of SSC. Just that he can't feel what I feel.

The same way I began a panic attack one day when we were doing the same thing we've done a hundred times before. He isn't a mindreader. I needed play to stop. We've since learned that if I'm getting sick but not yet in the coughing, sneezing stage this is what happens. I panic and need releasing. Me not being able to play for no reason means I'll be sick the next day. I can't talk to him about what's wrong because there isn't anything wrong. It's my body's response to getting ill even before I have symptoms or feel ill. Hell, even if he could read my mind he wouldn't know what was going on because it's a physical reaction, not a mental process.

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RE: Should the rules of the game be followed? - 7/2/2008 6:23:07 PM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
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From: Sacramento
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My hard limits don't change just cause I am flying, and when I fly I still retain common sense. Now maybe I don't go as hard an deep as others in that case, but just cause I am flying does not mean people will be able to talk me into stuff I wouldn't agree to when not flying.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterErrant

I just my respect for SS&C the night I saw a "Master" Strapping his pregnant wifes belly/ And was told it was negotiated and therefore ok.

What we do is not particularly safe. questionable sane and consent goes out the door as soon as the endorphins start pumping.
It's amazing what you gan get a high flying bottom to agree too. let alone a sub

(in reply to MasterErrant)

Post #: 20

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