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RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 4:52:23 AM

Madame4a

Posts: 2045
Joined: 2/4/2008
From: Washington, DC area
Status: offline

I feel badly for you.. its a crappy why to find out someone is stepping out and face it.. that's what's happening.

I'm going to be the bitch here and suggest that you've only found the tip of the iceburg. As to looking at the profile.. so what? He knew you could see it and yet didn't choose to hide it. Ever wonder what he is hiding? Sorry.. has to be said -- from what you've said here you had every reason to look.

He told you he's not poly, if that still holds true, you're likely not for him anymore. Unless you think talking about it is going to change something, why would you put yourself through it?

I'd quote his profile here, send it to him and say -- is there something I should know? and be done with it...

all very easy for me to say as I'm not involved in all this but you clearly felt something, you said it very early on, so I'd trust your instincts but be very clear about possible outcomes before you get into something ugly. Personally, I'd just figure out the best way to take care of myself and move on. Again, easier said than done, I know.

_____________________________

You're crazy bitch
But you f*ck so good, I'm on top of it
When I dream, I'm doing you all night
Scratches all down my back to keep me right on

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 41

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 4:55:08 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MaamJay

If it's OK for Him to go against His promise ... then I really don't see why it's not OK for you to use notes if that's what it takes for you to communicate clearly and effectively! I'm getting the impression of a very insecure Dominant here ... whose last girl checked up on Him (yeah, so why did she need to?) and who is so interested in good communication that He denies His new sub the tools to improve that! At very least He hasn't a clue, at worst, He's a cheating bastard. OP ... by all means use your notes to confront Him this time, but do be on guard and think very dispassionately about what life ahead with Him is likely to be like. He's not the only Dom in the sea ...
HUGS
Maam Jay aka violet[A]

I'm going to hijack my own thread for just a moment... what are the warning signs of an insecure Dominant? I know there is basically the same process to see if you are compatible with someone when getting into a D/s relationship, but there is an added layer of finding out if someone is really Dominant or submissive. This is my first D/s relationship, and though I've talked to other Doms, of course, I'm still not sure what to look for when it comes to assessing someone's dominance. Does that make sense?

(in reply to MaamJay)

Post #: 42

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 5:01:41 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Madame4a

I feel badly for you.. its a crappy why to find out someone is stepping out and face it.. that's what's happening.

I'm going to be the bitch here and suggest that you've only found the tip of the iceburg. As to looking at the profile.. so what? He knew you could see it and yet didn't choose to hide it. Ever wonder what he is hiding? Sorry.. has to be said -- from what you've said here you had every reason to look.

He told you he's not poly, if that still holds true, you're likely not for him anymore. Unless you think talking about it is going to change something, why would you put yourself through it?

I'd quote his profile here, send it to him and say -- is there something I should know? and be done with it...

all very easy for me to say as I'm not involved in all this but you clearly felt something, you said it very early on, so I'd trust your instincts but be very clear about possible outcomes before you get into something ugly. Personally, I'd just figure out the best way to take care of myself and move on. Again, easier said than done, I know.

You aren't being a bitch. You are absolutely right that I think there may be more going on. I didn't just look at his profile for the heck of it. I had a gut feeling and that was the first place I started. What I found was proof that he is looking. What I don't have is proof that something more has happened, like I feel it has. I can only go to him with what I know and then ask about what I suspect.

I do not want a fight. I want a simple answer and a decision to either bring everything into the open and try to find a way to make it work or to part ways. I may not get what I want, but I do feel I have to try before just ending it.

(in reply to Madame4a)

Post #: 43

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 5:21:57 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

I just remembered something he said a couple of weeks ago. We were in the middle of talking about a couple we know who is going through a rough patch, and I was thinking about them and didn't catch what he said. He said he kept turning down offers and our friend could to. He keeps turning down offers?? He as much as told me then he was looking and I didn't even see it. I feel like such a fool!

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 44

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 5:47:02 AM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

In that case, the issue isn't how you can confront him. It's how you can confront you. Squarely face the fact that this relationship is in trouble, and DEAL.

You will never know what might have been if you had been willing to approach him about this when you first started getting bad vibes. Please understand, I am not saying he is the good guy here. But I am saying that cheating is usually a symptom of a problem, rather than the problem itself. If neither of you is willing to deal with the problem, well....

Don't wimp out.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 45

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 5:52:46 AM

mztresn0w

Posts: 174
Joined: 1/12/2008
Status: offline

Okay I am wondering why you have no profile. When did he change his profile? Was it in the last few days? I think you need to discuss this with him and leave the angry and hurt at the front door. I can understand being hurt. But I can not understand allowing yourself to reach the point of any negative energy until you discuss this with him. You can "what if " yourself until you are surrounded in negativity or you can just talk to him regarding this. Trust is the a big part of the foundation of any relationship.

< Message edited by mztresn0w -- 7/7/2008 5:53:40 AM >

_____________________________

Becareful what you ask for you may get it and then realize it wasn't what you wanted.
Wicked Evil Grin

(in reply to SylvereApLeanan)

Post #: 46

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 6:17:36 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mztresn0w

Okay I am wondering why you have no profile. When did he change his profile? Was it in the last few days? I think you need to discuss this with him and leave the angry and hurt at the front door. I can understand being hurt. But I can not understand allowing yourself to reach the point of any negative energy until you discuss this with him. You can "what if " yourself until you are surrounded in negativity or you can just talk to him regarding this. Trust is the a big part of the foundation of any relationship.

I don't feel the need to have a profile on the other side as I am not looking for anyone. I turned it off a year ago when he said he wanted me all to himself and wasn't looking for anyone himself.

The profile was changed only yesterday. Before that, all I had was this feeling that something wasn't quite right. I did ask about it, several times in fact, and was assured that everything was fine, that I am all he wants.

Also... I won't be able to speak with him until later today. If I could have reached him last night, I would have then, but he wasn't answering his phone.

< Message edited by gentleslaveheart -- 7/7/2008 6:23:02 AM >

(in reply to mztresn0w)

Post #: 47

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 6:21:02 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

In that case, the issue isn't how you can confront him. It's how you can confront you. Squarely face the fact that this relationship is in trouble, and DEAL.

You will never know what might have been if you had been willing to approach him about this when you first started getting bad vibes. Please understand, I am not saying he is the good guy here. But I am saying that cheating is usually a symptom of a problem, rather than the problem itself. If neither of you is willing to deal with the problem, well....

Don't wimp out.

I did ask him when I first started getting weird feelings that something wasn't right. I just didn't have anything concrete to cite and probably let myself be soothed too quickly for fear of being a crazy bitch.

(in reply to RedMagic1)

Post #: 48

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 6:29:59 AM

AmbrosialWench

Posts: 50
Joined: 10/2/2007
Status: offline

If you are aware he is going to find fault with you checking up on him, then be prepared to have a discussion about that then after you appologize for feeling insecure, checking his profile, blah blah blah and a minute or two of silence to signify the conversation is over, politely ask again why his profile said he was looking. I was seeing a very good talking Master, he could very easily get the conversation off topic and if I tried to gear it back he made sure it didn't happen. I learned to finish his topic and once his conversation was over, pause and politely ask the question I had in the beginning. I found out a lot by using this method. I clearly showed I was intent on finding out what I was asking about and would get then get a clear answer.

(in reply to mztresn0w)

Post #: 49

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 6:33:34 AM

mztresn0w

Posts: 174
Joined: 1/12/2008
Status: offline

Have you talked to him since the change in his profile? If not then I would encourage you to do that as soon as you can. My lil one has a screen name here with a profile. I have a profile here and neither of us are looking for anything other than friendship. That is why I was asking why you didn't have a profile here. I do hope you talk to him. I would not judge him by past relationships you have had.

_____________________________

Becareful what you ask for you may get it and then realize it wasn't what you wanted.
Wicked Evil Grin

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 50

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 6:44:11 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mztresn0w

Have you talked to him since the change in his profile? If not then I would encourage you to do that as soon as you can. My lil one has a screen name here with a profile. I have a profile here and neither of us are looking for anything other than friendship. That is why I was asking why you didn't have a profile here. I do hope you talk to him. I would not judge him by past relationships you have had.

No, I haven't been able to reach him. He was not answering his phone. He did say he would call me today, and I will speak with him about this then.

It was just my preferrence to turn off my profile.

(in reply to mztresn0w)

Post #: 51

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 6:46:49 AM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AmbrosialWench

If you are aware he is going to find fault with you checking up on him, then be prepared to have a discussion about that then after you appologize for feeling insecure, checking his profile, blah blah blah and a minute or two of silence to signify the conversation is over, politely ask again why his profile said he was looking. I was seeing a very good talking Master, he could very easily get the conversation off topic and if I tried to gear it back he made sure it didn't happen. I learned to finish his topic and once his conversation was over, pause and politely ask the question I had in the beginning. I found out a lot by using this method. I clearly showed I was intent on finding out what I was asking about and would get then get a clear answer.

This is what is probably going to happen. He, too, is good at steering the conversation off topic. But, why should I apologize for viewing his profile and checking up on something that didn't feel right?

(in reply to AmbrosialWench)

Post #: 52

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 9:30:13 AM

cantilena

Posts: 224
Joined: 8/6/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gentleslaveheart
This is what is probably going to happen. He, too, is good at steering the conversation off topic. But, why should I apologize for viewing his profile and checking up on something that didn't feel right?

I don't have much to add except my best wishes to you... It sounds to me like you understand precisely what's going on, that you know what you need to do (i.e. talk to him), and also how he's likely to react. There's not much practical advice, then, to give. That said, none of it is pleasant or positive. Having long ago been in a situation something like what you're facing now, I can only send my empathy your way.

Just remember, keep calm at whatever cost, even if your words get twisted (sounds likely), he tries to attack you verbally (sounds likely), or if the conversation veers off track (sounds likely). I'm overlaying my own experience on top of yours - never a good thing - but for what it's worth, don't accept him questioning your submission merely for doing what you did, or for bringing this up to him. Don't accept that this is your problem and not his problem. If he gets angry or out of control, it's really important that you are calm, reasonable, operating completely in the objective, and wholey in control. Just two cents.

Best, best wishes.

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 53

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 9:56:52 AM

Willowmoon

Posts: 227
Joined: 9/25/2007
Status: offline

Not much to add except this.

If you were in a vanilla relationship how would you deal with this? Just because you are sub or slave does not mean you leave your brains behind, forget about the relationship dynamic for a while and talk to him human being to human being not sub/slave to Master/Dom.

(in reply to cantilena)

Post #: 54

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 11:51:04 AM

slavemaia

Posts: 395
Joined: 8/26/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gentleslaveheart

This is my first post to the forum. I'm new here, and really, I'm new to the M/s lifestyle, as in an active participant. I've been reading online about it in forums like this for a couple of years now. I don't really know what forum to post this question in, so I figured I would try the general forum. I hope that is okay.

I'm really upset right now. I just found out my Master updated his profile today to say he is "once again" searching for a sub. I really don't want to get into a debate over whether Masters can have more than one sub or do things without the sub being ok with it. The simple fact is this... he has told me a few times in the year and a half we have been seeing each other - promised me even - that he is not looking for anyone and would tell me beforehand if he changed his mind. This is something that has been of concern to me recently as I just have had a gut feeling. It started when I asked why he chose not to change his profile to indicate he has a sub and is not seeking any longer. His response then was that he just hadn't gotten around to it, and I didn't press the issue because I didn't want to start an argument. Maybe that wasn't the best thing for me to do.

I feel terrible and like a fool. My ex-husband cheated on me a number of times. I should know the signs! Anyway, I'm just not sure how to approach a conversation with him about this. I know I am supposed to come to him respectfully, but questioning his judgement is hardly respectful. Just what is the protocol in a situation like this? If I were thinking of ending things I wouldn't be worried about this, but I know from experience that things like this can be worked through. I didn't agree to be his slave to have it end over the first upset without at least talking it through with him.

I know I'm rambling. I don't really know what I am trying to say other than I want some good advice on how to bring up this conversation. He is going to be upset that I was checking up on him, and I can understand that, but yet when you have a public profile that anyone can see... well, I feel you shouldn't have anything on there you would be ashamed to have seen. Communication is not my strongest suit, and I really don't want this to turn into a ugly thing. Any advice would be welcomed. Thank you.

Personally, I think it's a damn shame when people use this or any lifestyle to say one thing and do another. I don't care what one calls themself - Dominant, Master, Great Pooh Pah - what earns my respect is trust, what earns my trust is words and behavior that match - period. I'd say run, don't walk away. Ha - easier said than done, I know. But the fact is - sounds to me like you're sincere and this so-called Master, is one of those of the mindset "Me Master, me get to do anything I damn well please because Me Big Kahoona". OY. Evidently communication is not his strongest suit either - at least the kind that expresses what he really means. Sorry, don't mean to be sooooo sarcastic, but I have to tell ya - this is really a pet peeve of mine - those who claim to be Dominants, Owners, Masters, whatever and think that means do whatever you damn well please, regardless of agreements. Good luck to you.

_____________________________

She reaches up, not for the apple, but for what causes it to be there.
slave to love - - Chairman's maia

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 55

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 11:52:16 AM

TreasureKY

Posts: 3032
Joined: 4/10/2007
From: Kentucky
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gentleslaveheart

I'm just hoping to get everything out in the open. I can deal with him wanting another sub much better than I can feeling lied to. I just know with dishonesty, the relationship is doomed. With honesty, there still may be a chance.

It appears as if you have both. He has already lied to you by assuring you that he would inform you prior to looking for someone else. How much dishonesty do you reckon there needs to be before the relationship is doomed?

There was a reason for my asking what you hoped to accomplish by talking to him. From your response, it would seem you are looking for a reversal of his decision to find another sub... to give him the opportunity to come clean and salvage the relationship. Do you think he'll be any more trustworthy this time?

(in reply to gentleslaveheart)

Post #: 56

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 12:37:27 PM

KneelingSilently

Posts: 38
Joined: 4/15/2008
Status: offline

Wow. All I have to add is that you should be sure to communicate just how hurt you are by this.

(in reply to TreasureKY)

Post #: 57

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 12:39:14 PM

AmbrosialWench

Posts: 50
Joined: 10/2/2007
Status: offline

I don't mean you should have to appologize. I was just speaking from my own experience. When my Master started on a path of steering things his way, I generally felt remoarse at the end of the conversation or at least in general agreed that he felt displeased. However I still needed my question answered, thus I would humbly appologize and aggree he felt displeased and then would humbly and politely ask my question.
I too had the feeling my Master was involved with someone else after a few months. I asked the question directly. Had a conversation off subject about slaves not trusting and questioning their Master's, in theory I agree but in reality I was actually not owned. I felt awful about questioning him thus I humbly appologized for not being a perfect slave he desired. Paused. Asked the question again. He just looked at me and told me" yes". He was seeing someone else who was vanilla. I calmly absorbed the answer and appreciated the truth. It took a week before I could absurb the full meaning for me.

(in reply to TreasureKY)

Post #: 58

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 2:43:27 PM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: gentleslaveheart

I'm just hoping to get everything out in the open. I can deal with him wanting another sub much better than I can feeling lied to. I just know with dishonesty, the relationship is doomed. With honesty, there still may be a chance.

It appears as if you have both. He has already lied to you by assuring you that he would inform you prior to looking for someone else. How much dishonesty do you reckon there needs to be before the relationship is doomed?

There was a reason for my asking what you hoped to accomplish by talking to him. From your response, it would seem you are looking for a reversal of his decision to find another sub... to give him the opportunity to come clean and salvage the relationship. Do you think he'll be any more trustworthy this time?

Maybe I'm being too naive, but I do think not only do most people deserve a second chance, but that people sometimes lie for reasons other than maliciousness. I may be completely wrong, but I feel that talking to him and giving him a chance to answer my question of why may be a way to save the relationship. If he lied because there is some need I am not fulfilling and he feels the only way to meet that need is by bringing in someone else, then there is a potential for renegotiation and finding a workable solution that allows the relationship to continue. Then again, I may well find out that he is tired of me and wants out and chose this way to accomplish his goal.

It is my hope that he finds that I do not go all crazy and bitchy and psycho when presented with a truth that may not be the most appealing thing to me. Maybe he has never had that in his life and and learned to lie rather than confront potentially volitile subjects. I don't know. Unless I talk with him I don't know anything but what I have seen and what I feel.

Again, maybe I am wrong and silly for thinking this way, but I still feel a responsibility to do so.

(in reply to TreasureKY)

Post #: 59

RE: protocol and communication question - 7/7/2008 2:46:37 PM

gentleslaveheart

Posts: 28
Joined: 7/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AmbrosialWench

I don't mean you should have to appologize. I was just speaking from my own experience. When my Master started on a path of steering things his way, I generally felt remoarse at the end of the conversation or at least in general agreed that he felt displeased. However I still needed my question answered, thus I would humbly appologize and aggree he felt displeased and then would humbly and politely ask my question.
I too had the feeling my Master was involved with someone else after a few months. I asked the question directly. Had a conversation off subject about slaves not trusting and questioning their Master's, in theory I agree but in reality I was actually not owned. I felt awful about questioning him thus I humbly appologized for not being a perfect slave he desired. Paused. Asked the question again. He just looked at me and told me" yes". He was seeing someone else who was vanilla. I calmly absorbed the answer and appreciated the truth. It took a week before I could absurb the full meaning for me.

Yes, I have that tendency too, to feel remorse just because he is displeased... whether or not I have done anything wrong or not. I have been working on acknowleging the other person's feelings without feeling the need to apologize if I have done nothing to apologize for.

(in reply to AmbrosialWench)

Post #: 60

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