hizgeorgiapeach
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Venatrix
quote:
ORIGINAL: mistoferin
Are you defining crap as anything that contains meat? Your posts really do seem as though you are disgusted by anyone who eats meat.
Not at all. But take a look at the standard Western diet: it's high in fat, it's high in cholesterol, it's high in sodium, it's high in sugar. It's possible to have all of these in a vegetarian diet, but the fact remains that the vast majority of people with diet-related health problems are meat eaters, not vegetarians. I'm not particularly sympathetic to people who make a big production of how they don't want to give up eating meat because it tastes sooooo good, then want everyone to feel sorry for them when they wind up on the operating table with a heart attack. If I'm disgusted by anything, it's a lack of personal responsibility. That goes for people who lie out in the sun and get skin cancer, smokers who get lung cancer, and alcoholics who get liver cancer.
Your assertion that the vast majority of people who display health problems are meat eatters is nominally correct. However, it fails to take into consideration that the Ratio of Meaties to Vegans is substantially higher as well. In any system where one factor is disproportionate to the rest, that factor IS going to have an impact on results. That's the whole thing behind statistics, research, and blind or double blind studies using careful control measures. I have yet to see any studies done on this particular subject that adjust/account for the ratio difference, which somehow discovers an irrefutable link between meat eatting diets and strict vege diets in proportional relationship to illness. I've seen several that show a marked increase in health concerns based on Weight (which is one of the reasons that I'm working with a nutritionist/weight specialist MD - to get a handle on that Before it becomes a problem.) I've seen several that show a relationship between illness and Junk Food of whatever sort. (Refined sugars are bad for us, whether we're a vegetarian or an opportunistic carniore.) That disgust at people not accepting personal responcibility is fine. The problem is that you're making a few assumptions.
(a) That those who eat meat are Going to develop health issues, or already have them, despite several saying nothing one way or the other and the rest specifying that there are none. Simply because YOU choose to believe that meat eatting diet = automatic poor health does Not make it true - any more than an assumption that a vegan diet = automatic poor health made it true when Termy made a comment to that effect.
(b) That anyone who Does somehow develop health problems of some sort, those health problems will be directly related to their choice of diet or that no longer eatting meat will somehow miraculously cure them and/or keep them from developing further health problems. I've never personally been able to find conclusive evidence to support such a theory. If you have access to such evidence, I'd be more than happy to take a look over it. Until then, my own physician has seen no need to have me modify my diet to exclude meat - and in direct contradiction to that suggested a Balanced diet containing both meats and vegitables of a wide variety cooked by numerous methods and eatten in moderate amounts (as opposed to the stereotypical giant sized portions that Americans have been conditioned by media advertising to consider "normal"). If you are in possession of either medical skill or a degree in nutrition, to match what my Medical Specialist has, then perhaps you're Educationally Qualified to refute her statements. If you're not - then I'll take her word for things concerning my dietary habits and requirements - as well as her word for it as to which food groups I should "blame" for my existing weight issues.
(c) That anyone who happens to develop a health problem is going to automatically forgo Personal Responcibility, and/or is going to fail to follow the recommendations of their Health Care Professional in how to correct or treat those problems. This is simply ludicrous and unsubstantiated by anything so far posted in this thread other than your own opinions and prejudices against those who do not follow a vegetarian or vegan diet.
Myself, I started seeing a specialist in order to Avoid developing any of the Potential problems that I could see a possibility of developing. Part of the process of seeing a specialist included standard medical checkup procedures like BP and Cholesterol and Fasting Blood Sugar levels (which I have checked annually anyway, along with things like breast cancer screening and cervical cancer screening.) BP - chronically on the low side of normal, despite being overweight and a meat eatter - and it has been since I was in my teens. The doc is more concerned about my BP being driven up by stress - caused by anxiety over my weight issues - than by my diet choices. Cholesterol - low end of the normal scale, with HDL to LDL ratios that amazed the doc. I prefer to cook with Olive Oil and have for years because of Taste - the fact that it's also much more heart friendly is an added side benefit. FBS - borderline for diabetes, but connected directly to processed sugars rather than meat, and rather rapidly coming under control now that the majority of the processed sugars are out of my diet. Does this mean that I'm definately not going to develop any problems? No, it simply means that I lower the risk factors to what I consider an acceptable level.
My point to all this? Twofold. First - no ONE choice, or choice Change, can be singularly pinpointed as the source of all dietary evil in this country. It is a Collective process that has a plethora of variables which need to be taken into account regardless of what Anyone's Personal Preferences are. Second - while Risks can be lowered by moderating various aspects of diet and life, that is All that can be done - Risk Management. There are NO guarentees in life, not for any of us, regardless of which options we choose or don't choose to avail ourselves of.
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Rhi
Light travels faster than sound, which is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
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RE: A question for Vegans & Vegitarians re: animal prod... - 
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