RE: Birth control = abortion? (Full Version)

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xxblushesxx -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:00:37 AM)

Uninterested;

Even though I am against abortion, I find the way you express your views on the subject disturbing.

If you don't want people to hear the validity of your arguments, I'd suggest continuing in the same vein.

If you'd like for people to at least consider your point, think before you type. Don't be rude, condescending or arrogant. Acknowledge that others may not see things exactly the same way as you. Try to put yourself in others' places, and think about what your reaction would be to the type of rhetoric you spout.

Best wishes,



slvemike4u -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:03:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

Uninterested;

Even though I am against abortion, I find the way you express your views on the subject disturbing.

If you don't want people to hear the validity of your arguments, I'd suggest continuing in the same vein.

If you'd like for people to at least consider your point, think before you type. Don't be rude, condescending or arrogant. Acknowledge that others may not see things exactly the same way as you. Try to put yourself in others' places, and think about what your reaction would be to the type of rhetoric you spout.

Best wishes,
Blushes that is great advice,and delivered so sweetly



xxblushesxx -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:03:19 AM)

PM; I'm very sorry for your friends. Things like this are the reason this option is there. (imo) Not just because a child is 'inconvenient'.
Then again...there but for the grace of God...go I.



xxblushesxx -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:05:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

Uninterested;

Even though I am against abortion, I find the way you express your views on the subject disturbing.

If you don't want people to hear the validity of your arguments, I'd suggest continuing in the same vein.

If you'd like for people to at least consider your point, think before you type. Don't be rude, condescending or arrogant. Acknowledge that others may not see things exactly the same way as you. Try to put yourself in others' places, and think about what your reaction would be to the type of rhetoric you spout.

Best wishes,
Blushes that is great advice,and delivered so sweetly


Thank you so much!
Sometimes, we don't realize that what we say/do has the opposite effect intended.
(happens to me all the time *g*)



uninterested5 -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:09:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o




If your house is on fire, if I bar the door for the firefighters and you burn to death is it the same as if I set the fire?



slvemike4u -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:11:18 AM)

That clears that up!!!!!



Lynnxz -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:11:18 AM)

Well, crap, I'm getting burned either way!

I'm in with the keep it in your pants crowd.



slvemike4u -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:13:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Well, crap, I'm getting burned either way!
Have no fear Lynnxz I would risk my life to save You(hoping against hope you would be suitably appreciative)



MusicalBoredom -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:14:35 AM)

Uninterested who are you really?  This is to be a made up persona right?  Or are you just a stirring the pot for pleasure?  I mean nobody really really things that stuff do they?

OP I have to go with Thadius on this one.  There is no way that "contraception" will actually end up being defined as "abortion" by any legal or governmental agency.



eyesopened -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:14:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: uninterested5

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o




If your house is on fire, if I bar the door for the firefighters and you burn to death is it the same as if I set the fire?


By this response I assume that you will not have sex until married and will stay married and support your offspring?




christine1 -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:15:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: uninterested5


If your house is on fire, if I bar the door for the firefighters and you burn to death is it the same as if I set the fire?


i'm trying not to get a headache here.  contraception prevents the sperm from fertilizing the egg.   eggs and sperm die daily on their own by the millions...it's a natural fact of life.  if you're worried about killing sperm then you better not ejaculate ever again becuase that is exactly what you'll be doing.  and if a woman in your life ovulates, you better get her a hysterctomy pronto because that egg will die as well if it isn't fertilized.



Thadius -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:15:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: uninterested5

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o




If your house is on fire, if I bar the door for the firefighters and you burn to death is it the same as if I set the fire?


Your logic is flawed.  If the egg is never fertilized by the sperm... there never was a fire started.  Then again that wouldn't stop me from advising the firefighters to use the fire axe to prevent you from starting one.



hopelessfool -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:16:35 AM)

I cant support a child, I am on a very effective birth control, and my partner wears a condom, If by some miracle of a chance, that I do get pregnant and I do mean miracle , It wont be because I didnt do everything I could to prevent it.

Realistically until this can happen, or the world starts teaching men, you create a problem you fix it I say the choice is 60 mom 40 dad.

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f114/CuteLittleKitty/488606DD0003E7170000371722070216330.jpg


But, keeping the what 6.6 billion people enough room to live, is more important then bringing 10s of thousands of babies in the world with no room to live....

Im all for birth control and clap for those that take it to prevent bringing in a child they cant care for, Personally No child is better then one that goes through there whole life wondering why their mother and father didn't want them....


Edited because I really cant spell today... >.<



Lynnxz -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:19:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: christine1

quote:

ORIGINAL: uninterested5


If your house is on fire, if I bar the door for the firefighters and you burn to death is it the same as if I set the fire?


i'm trying not to get a headache here.  contraception prevents the sperm from fertilizing the egg.   eggs and sperm die daily on their own by the millions...it's a natural fact of life.  if you're worried about killing sperm then you better not ejaculate ever again becuase that is exactly what you'll be doing.  and if a woman in your life ovulates, you better get her a hysterctomy pronto because that egg will die as well if it isn't fertilized.


Best Shirt Ever.

I'm thinking he's either trolling, or just amazingly ignorant of how this whole process works.



Thadius -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:21:13 AM)

His profile says it all, here just a sample...

quote:


If this site is a pointless pissing away of your time and you have no idea why you still have a profile, but log on twice a day anyway, message me, we have something in common.



slvemike4u -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:25:28 AM)

Lynxxz a combination of the two would be my guess!!!!



CalifChick -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:26:01 AM)

Gotta wonder if anybody even read the link.  If I understood it correctly, it creates a loophole so that federal grant recipients (including clinics accepting Medicaid funds) can choose to not offer any sort of contraception whatsoever.

The argument presented is that some believe that hormonal contraception does not prevent an egg from being fertilized, but merely prevents it from implanting (test for pregnancy are positive AFTER implantation).  Therefore, no woman with an intact reproductive system can ever prove she is not pregnant at any moment in time.  Thats their contraception=abortion link.

Cali





camille65 -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:29:25 AM)

I vote on the latter.

Yes this is a scare tactic but it IS scary. To yank even the choice of birth control is absurd to me, it is used for more than just the prevention of pregnancy it is also used by many women to regulate their menstrual cycle.
It makes me wonder if people who follow that thought also think that menstruation itself ought to be stopped? That somehow we ought not shed that tissue every month (or in my case about every 4 months because my cycle is wonky)?

We live in a world where our basic rights that we grew up with are being pulled out from under us. Privacy is gone.
I don't see this as just an alarmist fringe oriented article because people do believe that crap, example being the poster known as 'uninterested5'.

Already there are pharmacists who refuse to fill those prescriptions, not caring if it is used to regulate a cycle or prevent a pregnancy. Yet their stores carry condoms.....

This does bother me, this does scare me. I am past the age of worrying about it myself but I worry for future generations of young women who NEED control of their own bodies. The bodies don't belong to the government nor do they belong to religious organizations IMO.

I am ProChoice. That doesn't necessarily mean pro abortion, it means exactly what it says.
Pro Choice. I am for the opportunity to choose, and to be able to choose safely.



hizgeorgiapeach -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:29:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u
This is more than a "bit"of gender bias.While I fully concede a woman's choice in this matter,somewhere a man is involved....saying they have no voice in this discussion is a little rediculous!


I have my reasons - whether they would be considered "reasonable" to others (especially males) is moot.  Ask my exhusfreak why I'm so dead set against allowing any male to have a say (other than being a sperm donor) in whether or not I have a child.
 
Do You go through pregnancy?  Do you swell, gain weight, spend almost a year at the mercy of out of control hormones, not be able to sleep or sit comfortably?  Go through the 24 hours of sheer hell that is called LABOR?  Don't think so, on any count. Not unless you're a TG woman to man who had children prior to deciding to be surgically altered. (I've got a local friend who is just that - got married and had a couple of kids because she wasn't "out" as a Les, then finally outted herself, got a divorce, moved in with her lover, and got partial surgery.  It hasn't been completed, and she's debating whether she can afford to do so, which is why I still refer to her as "she" rather than "he".)
 
Abortion is Not the same as preventing pregnancy in the first place, Panther.  Abortion, except in cases such as you mentioned (life of child, life of mother, rape, incest) - is Forgoing reproductive responcibility.  Preventing the pregnancy - whether it's by abstinance or contraception - is a case of Accepting reproductive responcibility, or at least making an honest attempt to do so.  Should people who do Not choose abstinance - for whatever reason - be punished by being forced to take a greater than necessary risk, or be forced perhaps to the option of aborting because they weren't allowed ANY preventative measure OTHER than abstinance?  Yes, the currently available methods are not 100% effective (both of my daughters were concieved while I was on the pill)  but that doesn't mean they should be made unavailable as an option.



Thadius -> RE: Birth control = abortion? (7/22/2008 9:31:38 AM)

Cali,

I read the article, and then went on to research over at the HHS.gov site, looking for anything remotely close to what they were suggesting as a new proposal.  I couldn't find it.  Even searching using the buzzwords (keywords) they used in the header such as Title X.  The article seemed to be more of an attempt to enrage the readers and rally the troops for the upcoming political season.

That is just my opinion of it... if I missed something in my research, please point me to it, as I would love to become better informed.

Thadius



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