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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 1:43:30 PM   
Nashvegas


Posts: 10
Joined: 1/22/2005
Status: offline 		No, the Pentagon did not tell Osama that he could not go. They told him he could not campaign or use the visit as a photo op. When told that, he decided he'd rather play B-ball than visit wounded American soldiers.

(in reply to Vendaval)
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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 2:01:55 PM   
Vendaval


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Status: offline 		Are you saying he should have gone against the advice of the Pentagon?

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 2:18:07 PM   
asyouwish72


Posts: 69
Joined: 11/2/2004
Status: offline 		I think it would have been tasteless for Obama to make such a visit as a "campaign stop", but he could have spun it as simply a visit by a sitting U.S. Senator (both he and Senator McCain still hold that position, however neglected it may be at the moment) who happened to be in the region on business. From a PR standpoint he was in trouble either way (either he's callous if he doesn't go or he's cynically using others' suffering for his campaign if he does), but there would have been some moral value in showing up anyway. For all his faults, McCain would have.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 2:35:07 PM   
NataliSaysSo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nashvegas

No, the Pentagon did not tell Osama that he could not go. They told him he could not campaign or use the visit as a photo op. When told that, he decided he'd rather play B-ball than visit wounded American soldiers.


They have basketball hoops in his cave?  I always wondered if the FBI is after Barack, they still let him make highly publicized campaign stops. 

 

< Message edited by NataliSaysSo -- 7/25/2008 2:39:22 PM >

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:01:08 PM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nashvegas

No, the Pentagon did not tell Osama that he could not go.



The Pentagon didn't tell who? I love Freudian slips, especially when they're typed: they have this irreversible permanency to them.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:11:42 PM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nashvegas

No, the Pentagon did not tell Osama that he could not go.



The Pentagon didn't tell who? I love Freudian slips, especially when they're typed: they have this irreversible permanency to them.


...sure it was a freudian slip? Sadly there are some who think that this kind of word play is a legitimate political tool............even more sadly some people fall for it.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:19:55 PM   
thornhappy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SophiaCorrupted

True, McCain's supporters aren't known for assuming that Barack Obama is a Muslim because of his name, or that his wife is a radical because she is black, or that he was sworn in on The Qur'an. They're all so educated on the issues! It's very clear that people following the crowd only applies to the Democratic party!

McCain 2008!




I sincerely hope this is a troll post, given how many times Snopes's been quoted on these urban legends....

thornhappy

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:21:21 PM   
Politesub53


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Status: offline 		Nicely said Phil.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:25:03 PM   
Level


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Joined: 3/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

quote:

ORIGINAL: SophiaCorrupted

True, McCain's supporters aren't known for assuming that Barack Obama is a Muslim because of his name, or that his wife is a radical because she is black, or that he was sworn in on The Qur'an. They're all so educated on the issues! It's very clear that people following the crowd only applies to the Democratic party!

McCain 2008!




I sincerely hope this is a troll post, given how many times Snopes's been quoted on these urban legends....

thornhappy



Yes, it is quite trollish, or foolish, take your pick.
 
Gotta keep those secret Muslims under wraps.....

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:27:01 PM   
Level


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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nashvegas

No, the Pentagon did not tell Osama that he could not go.



The Pentagon didn't tell who? I love Freudian slips, especially when they're typed: they have this irreversible permanency to them.


...sure it was a freudian slip? Sadly there are some who think that this kind of word play is a legitimate political tool............even more sadly some people fall for it.


Too true, phil.

quote:


Ten percent of American voters believe Sen. Barack Obama is Muslim, despite the presidential candidate's frequent descriptions of his Christian faith and a high-profile flap over his former pastor. The finding was contained in survey results released by the non-partisan Pew Research Center for the People & the Press.



While a majority — 53% — identify Obama as a Christian, 16% of conservative Republicans, 16% of white evangelical Protestants and 19% of rural Americans believe the Illinois senator is Muslim.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-04-01-obama-muslim_N.htm

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:36:39 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nashvegas

No, the Pentagon did not tell Osama that he could not go.



The Pentagon didn't tell who? I love Freudian slips, especially when they're typed: they have this irreversible permanency to them.


...sure it was a freudian slip? Sadly there are some who think that this kind of word play is a legitimate political tool............even more sadly some people fall for it.


Which makes me wonder... is a Freudian slip better than a deliberate attempt at CIA style language manipulation?


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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:37:13 PM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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So?

I'll bet similar numbers believe that all Republicans hate children and the elderly, love pollution and oil spills, hate the Constitution and also believe that the Bush tax cuts benefited only the rich.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
quote:


Ten percent of American voters believe Sen. Barack Obama is Muslim, despite the presidential candidate's frequent descriptions of his Christian faith and a high-profile flap over his former pastor. The finding was contained in survey results released by the non-partisan Pew Research Center for the People & the Press.



While a majority — 53% — identify Obama as a Christian, 16% of conservative Republicans, 16% of white evangelical Protestants and 19% of rural Americans believe the Illinois senator is Muslim.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-04-01-obama-muslim_N.htm


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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 3:44:36 PM   
Level


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Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


So?

I'll bet similar numbers believe that all Republicans hate children and the elderly, love pollution and oil spills, hate the Constitution and also believe that the Bush tax cuts benefited only the rich.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
quote:


Ten percent of American voters believe Sen. Barack Obama is Muslim, despite the presidential candidate's frequent descriptions of his Christian faith and a high-profile flap over his former pastor. The finding was contained in survey results released by the non-partisan Pew Research Center for the People & the Press.



While a majority — 53% — identify Obama as a Christian, 16% of conservative Republicans, 16% of white evangelical Protestants and 19% of rural Americans believe the Illinois senator is Muslim.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-04-01-obama-muslim_N.htm



Of course they do, Sanity.
 
So, it's equally wrong.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:08:19 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Which makes me wonder... is a Freudian slip better than a deliberate attempt at CIA style language manipulation?



......from a karmic pov i'd say yes.......a freudian slip is less culpable than a deliberate smear. From a pragmatic pov though, there's no difference at all. Damage is done to the perception of truth.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:11:30 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


So?

I'll bet similar numbers believe that all Republicans hate children and the elderly, love pollution and oil spills, hate the Constitution and also believe that the Bush tax cuts benefited only the rich.



...apples and oranges. The counterpart to the group you've mentioned is those who believe all Democrats are secret communists, rabid abortionists who hate the Constitution, who welcomed Bush's tax cuts as a clarion call for class revolution, according to the Marxist theory of dialectics.

Now, if 10% of voters believed McCain to be the secret leader of the KKK then you'd have a comparison.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:15:30 PM   
puella


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? Bad Move, Senator Obama.




I have not read all the responses yet, but I am sure someone has pointed out to you that the Pentagon would not allow him to visit the troops.  Who's bad is it now?

***Just an addendum as I have read some more replies... actually yes, the Pentagon did say he could not go the the base, the reason being that his trip was funded by his campaign monies and not those of his Senatorial funds...

Can you imagine the shit fit that would ensue (and rightly so) if he had used his Senate funds for his trip?  I do not think the Pentagon was wrong in this protocol... but I also think it has been very very wrong to imply that Senator Obama was just dissing the troups..and when that was done, not to retract and apologize for those erroneous comments.

< Message edited by puella -- 7/25/2008 5:21:39 PM >

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:20:25 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Which makes me wonder... is a Freudian slip better than a deliberate attempt at CIA style language manipulation?



......from a karmic pov i'd say yes.......a freudian slip is less culpable than a deliberate smear. From a pragmatic pov though, there's no difference at all. Damage is done to the perception of truth.



I agree. I also fear that if it is indeed a lapsus, it shows that the unconscious is somewhat damaged.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:24:01 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Which makes me wonder... is a Freudian slip better than a deliberate attempt at CIA style language manipulation?



......from a karmic pov i'd say yes.......a freudian slip is less culpable than a deliberate smear. From a pragmatic pov though, there's no difference at all. Damage is done to the perception of truth.



I agree. I also fear that if it is indeed a lapsus, it shows that the unconscious is somewhat damaged.


.......agreed, but i was only addressing the idea of culpability........

......times like this i wish i'd stayed working in psych....healing individuals is one thing, but sometimes healing individuals has a greater than usual social benefit.

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:28:10 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

I agree. I also fear that if it is indeed a lapsus, it shows that the unconscious is somewhat damaged.


Surely if its a lapsus its the conscious thats damaged, as the unconscious shone through ?  

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RE: A Workout Instead of Meeting U.S. Troops? - 7/25/2008 5:36:13 PM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
Status: offline 		Obama could go.  He just had to leave the rock star entourage behind and go as a sitting Senator.  The protocol is standard.

No, Obama dissed the troops because he couldn't show up as the Democratic Messiah come to save the world.  So he blew them off.

Wonderful display of leadership, that.


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