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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 6:42:10 PM   
somethndif


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x

quote:

ORIGINAL: somethndif

And I don't know how you could even start to build a committed relationship, D&s or otherwise, without playing with and fucking your partner.


Hmmmm......so i meet somebody, they are a very skilled top and a great fuck. Then i discover they hate bikers, Harleys, and expect me to convert to Christianity.
 
Whoops, that is not going to work!
 
Harleys have been a cornerstone of my life since i was a young un'. I am a biker and i was raised a Druid.
 
Not a great start for a committed M/s relationship. He is not going to suddenly change who he has been all his life and neither am i.
 
Now let's say i meet somebody, they love bikes, they are a biker, they are not religious in any fashion. But they cannot abide the thought of piercing play which i love. Otherwise we are a great match.
 
We can compromise on the piercing play, i can give it up or he can arrange for me to indulge in that type of play at a play party or with a friend who is trusted and skilled at it.
 
As i said at the beginning of the thread, for me the play is something that can be compromised on, opposite personalities or lifestyles are not.
 
I can see where a relationship that started out as just play could turn into something more over time. I can also see if you get together with somebody and you have zero play interests in common that the M/s part would not last either.  


you have now changed the topic.  The question was if you are looking for a COMMITTED relationship, would you play first.  I don't see how you can get into a committed relationship without playing and fucking before you get there. 

your response seems to assume I know nothing about the person.  Not true.  We have met, we know the basics about each other, we know that we share similar interests and outlooks on life.  It isn't a blind date.  And we also know that there is a sexual chemistry or energy there.  Does all play and sex end up in a committed relationship.  No, of course not.  But in every one of my committed D&s relationships, and there have been three, we played and fucked on either the first or second meeting. 

My submissive now is a good example.  We met at a BDSM club, where I was co-topping a woman with a woman dominant with whom I was friends.  My girl was there, watched the scene and when it was over started talking to me.  We talked for about 10 minutes and exchanged cards.  Sometime later, I called her and we had lunch and talked for an hour and a half and kissed when the lunch was over.  Next was a dinner date, and we played and fucked that night.  That was five years ago this September.  But it wasn't a COMMITTED relationship until about 6 months later, when I gave her my collar. 

Again, I don't see how you get to a COMMITTED relationship, without playing and fucking first. (as an aside, it seems like everyone is afraid to mention fucking.  Is "play" the new euphemism for fucking?)

Dan

(in reply to Twicehappy2x)
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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 7:56:04 PM   
YourhandMyAss


Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Sometimes it really does matter, if I'd known everything I do now about some of my choices in significant others, they'd never of been a choice. I would of ran from them the moment they said hello. Regardless if the play or sex was nice.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Evility

We played first. Started right away literally within minutes of meeting in person. We talked online for about 3 weeks prior and there was so much excitement and anticipation built up that neither of us could have waited if we wanted to. That was over two and a half years ago and it continues to get better.

I really don't see how it should matter much one way of the other. If the play and the relationship are both important to you then any information is good information. For me I think it would be harder to find a great play partner than a life partner so I want to know that the play partner side is gonna jive as soon as I can.


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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 8:00:04 PM   
YourhandMyAss


Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		No, because not every one uses play time and fucking to be the same time. I can do bdsm with you play with you beat your ass you beat mine, tie you up you tie me up, flog you, you flog me ect ect, what ever effect  wee went for and it wouldn't have involved fucking in anyway.


Some people do diffrentiate bdsm from sex, and for some bdsm is not all about sex, and neither is play.

quote:

ORIGINAL: somethndif

Again, I don't see how you get to a COMMITTED relationship, without playing and fucking first. (as an aside, it seems like everyone is afraid to mention fucking.  Is "play" the new euphemism for fucking?)

Dan

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 10:25:10 PM   
StormsSlave


Posts: 629
Joined: 2/6/2008
Status: offline 		So,you went to meet them, nobody felt pressured, there were no preconceptions, and everyone went home smiling? Who cares what other people think? What did they do with their weekend?

As My Lord would say, "Fuck 'em!"

We, in our lives, follow our instincts and put each other first. We involve ourselves in one another, and do not concern ourselves with the thoughts of others.

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 10:43:48 PM   
baddog123


Posts: 32
Joined: 5/15/2004
Status: offline 		I have always taken the direction that trust, and friendship need to come first.
Asking for play first would be asking for something In have not earned, and that is just not my way. I am acustomed to working for what I have. How can one ask for such a true dedication of a good relashionship with out bringing to the table a value to share in kind. I try to be nice, and considerate, polite, helpful, and careing. Some are reseptive to this, and some are not. I do have a strength, a sence of direction in my life, the leadership qualitys needed to help better the quality of life of the people arounnd me. The power and strenght enrich both the people I share this with, and so also myself. I think things through. I see things.
dagnabit, we all need and suport each other, each in our own way.
Yes kink, and raw sex are great things, and I need them, but there is much more to life in the long run.
Hope my spellin' aint too bad, this systm is old and has minimal bells and whistles.

MCF (I keep wondering what the c stands for)

(in reply to Twicehappy2x)
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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 10:47:51 PM   
AMaster


Posts: 814
Joined: 8/4/2005
Status: offline 		I have never been into one night stands.  For BDSM to work the parties have to know each other fairly well.   I have to say relationship first.

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 10:49:20 PM   
scarlettjinx


Posts: 117
Joined: 3/14/2008
Status: offline 		I don't think that I could play with someone I had just met. It would make me feel cheap and I would worry that it would send the message that all we wanted was a plaything. It is more important to Papa and I that we enjoy spending time with our possible third outside of the bedroom. But that is just us.

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 11:09:15 PM   
MstrssM4u


Posts: 11
Joined: 4/5/2005
Status: offline 		I have had My boi for over two years now, and I have to say that we played first for over a year before we even started with sex. and now two years later I am going to marry My sub. so I say it's each to their own in which direction they take in what they want to do. to Me you really get to know that person and they really get to know you. so there is No wrong way or right way about getting into what you enjoy in this lifestyle. if you have sexy first, who cares. you do what is best for you in your situation. and if you have a realtionship first, again who cares. you do and take whatever measures that you feel that you both will be happy and comfortable with.

Ms M

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 7/31/2008 11:10:20 PM   
steviemichael


Posts: 177
Joined: 1/6/2007
Status: offline 		for me it very simple  play first  which is a realtionship  !
dont wish or need  a long term  realtionship .
I will take a person home but they dont stay over nite  that is the deal


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(in reply to Twicehappy2x)
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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 2:33:04 AM   
Evility


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quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss
Sometimes it really does matter, if I'd known everything I do now about some of my choices in significant others, they'd never of been a choice. I would of ran from them the moment they said hello. Regardless if the play or sex was nice.


So if you met them and built a great realtionship only to find out that you are left somewhat unfufilled by the D/s or play aspect of the relationship you'd just say "Well, I have a great relationship - I can live without the D/s life that I want" ? That sounds to me like what you are saying.

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 3:51:22 AM   
Twicehappy2x


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quote:

ORIGINAL: somethndif

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x

quote:

ORIGINAL: somethndif

And I don't know how you could even start to build a committed relationship, D&s or otherwise, without playing with and fucking your partner.


Hmmmm......so i meet somebody, they are a very skilled top and a great fuck. Then i discover they hate bikers, Harleys, and expect me to convert to Christianity.
 
Whoops, that is not going to work!
 


you have now changed the topic.  The question was if you are looking for a COMMITTED relationship, would you play first.  I don't see how you can get into a committed relationship without playing and fucking before you get there.  


No, i did not change the topic, not at all. And i do know what the question was, seeing that i am the one who asked it.
 
You however have amended your answer.
 
First you stated you would want to play and fuck first. You did not state you would've spent some time getting to know this person first. Now you have expanded that to state;

"your response seems to assume I know nothing about the person.  Not true.  We have met, we know the basics about each other, we know that we share similar interests and outlooks on life.  It isn't a blind date.  And we also know that there is a sexual chemistry or energy there.  Does all play and sex end up in a committed relationship.  No, of course not."

So apparently you have already started a relationship of sorts before getting to the playing and fucking.
 
I simply feel that you need to meet and spend more time together than one "date" to see if you get along well, share common interests. When the people doing this live a great distance from each other a one time one day meeting is just not practical.
 
I think i understand your point, you are trying to say you would not commit to a relationship until you had played and had sex with some one.
 
Yet here, in this house, we all want to know the relationship is a solid one before committing to play, if not before sex.
 
In order to scene with another don't you want to know what makes them tick? What gives them the shivers, what delights, pleases, reassures them?
 
Sure, if you like casual play you can negotiate a scene in 5 minutes. I think here we all prefer it to be more than that.
 
Scooter and i have never ever negotiated a scene or used a safe word for that matter. Before play he knew enough about me, and i was confident enough in him, to not feel the need for all of that before scening with him.
 
Relationship before play, at least for us, is about being sure this new person can be and is willing to commit to that relationship. It is about trust, about knowing more about your partner than "me Dom you sub, me beat your ass good".
 
And i know a whole lot of folks who fell into "heat" over the scening or the sex, jumped into a relationship only to discover down the road that outside of those two things they were totally incompatible.
 
Most incompatibilities related to play or sex can be worked out, if you communicate the issues openly with each other. Those that are based on the personalities or lifestyles of the folks involved generally cannot.

_____________________________

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 3:58:13 AM   
Twicehappy2x


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Evility

quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss
Sometimes it really does matter, if I'd known everything I do now about some of my choices in significant others, they'd never of been a choice. I would of ran from them the moment they said hello. Regardless if the play or sex was nice.


So if you met them and built a great realtionship only to find out that you are left somewhat unfufilled by the D/s or play aspect of the relationship you'd just say "Well, I have a great relationship - I can live without the D/s life that I want" ? That sounds to me like what you are saying.


You would find out while trying to build that relationship if the D/s or M/s was working between the two of you. D/s or M/s being the way your mind works, how your personalities match and having zero to do with how your scening or fucking went with each other.
 
Obviously since the question was "while getting ready to enter a committed M/s relationship" if that particular element was missing you would not have entered into the relationship at all.
 
If the scening or sex left either partner unfulfilled that is something that can be corrected if both parties honestly communicate with each other.

< Message edited by Twicehappy2x -- 8/1/2008 4:07:29 AM >

_____________________________

The human heart is not a finite container but an ever expanding universe with all the stars contained there in.

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 4:10:44 AM   
lusciouslips19


Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline 		There are people who fooled around and fell in love. After all, there is a song about it.
I however as of late have been taken another route. This ole easy slut who never waited is waiting and going slow as thats how this new Sir wants it. Not that there has been no play at all, A kiss, a hair pull, a spank. All tastes of whats to come. Its all been slow and serious. has it made me feel bad? Heck no. It shows me how much in control he is and how valued he thinks I am.

_____________________________

Original Pimpette,
Keeper of Original Home Flag and Fire of Mr. Lance Hughes
Charter member of Lance's Fag Hags,
Member of the Subbie Mafia
Princess of typos and it's my prerogative

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 10:51:14 AM   
somethndif


Posts: 136
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x


In order to scene with another don't you want to know what makes them tick? What gives them the shivers, what delights, pleases, reassures them?
 
Sure, if you like casual play you can negotiate a scene in 5 minutes. I think here we all prefer it to be more than that.
 
Scooter and i have never ever negotiated a scene or used a safe word for that matter.


Of course I want to know what makes them shiver, delights and pleases them.  Not so sure about reassuring them.  *grin*  A little apprehension, even fear of the unknown goes a long way.  But I don't think you can know that without playing with them.  I have been with too many submissives who say, I don't like this, I don't like that, blah, blah, blah.  But they have never been introduced to it, or had one bad experience with it with someone else.  I have had a number of submissives who did things with me they had not done before, or said they had not liked before, and liked it, and wanted more.  You just don't know how its going to go, unless you do it, in my experience.

I like having a long-term, committed relationship.  I'm in one now.  Its rich and deep and rewarding.  But I don't look down my nose at what you call "casual" play, either, as you seem to do.  My submissive and I both play with others, usually together, but not always.  And we enjoy it, and find it rewarding, too.  I don't think that "here we all prefer it to be more than that."  How presumptuous of you.  I sometimes like casual play for what it is, casual; just fun, no commitment.  Just as sometimes I like a hotdog, instead of steak or lobster. 

As for negotiation, *smiling* its not my thing, and neither are safe-words.  If something isn't working, I can usually tell, or I'll ask, and I will either stop, or do more to prepare her, and try again.

Bottom line, I don't think you can know how the sex or play will be with someone by talking about it.  You have to do it.  And you surely have to do it before you get to the point where you are "committed" to someone.  

Dan

(in reply to Twicehappy2x)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 11:19:56 AM   
Twicehappy2x


Posts: 1096
Joined: 3/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: somethndif

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x


In order to scene with another don't you want to know what makes them tick? What gives them the shivers, what delights, pleases, reassures them?
 
Sure, if you like casual play you can negotiate a scene in 5 minutes. I think here we all prefer it to be more than that.
 
Scooter and i have never ever negotiated a scene or used a safe word for that matter.
 

But I don't think you can know that without playing with them.  I have been with too many submissives who say, I don't like this, I don't like that, blah, blah, blah.  

But I don't look down my nose at what you call "casual" play, either, as you seem to do.  

I don't think that "here we all prefer it to be more than that."  How presumptuous of you. 

Bottom line, I don't think you can know how the sex or play will be with someone by talking about it.  You have to do it.  And you surely have to do it before you get to the point where you are "committed" to someone.  


Point one; I feel you can get to know some one very well by just paying attention to all those little cues you get when speaking to them, by watching their reactions, like a subtle change in their breathing, prior to engaging in any play. Perhaps you just need to be very perceptive.
 
Point two; i stated i do not engage in casual play, could you please copy and paste exactly where i stated i looked down my nose at it? Or that i thought that those who engaged in casual play were inferior in any way?
 
Point three; it is presumptuous of me to state my preferences and the preferences of the household i have been in for three years? How very presumptuous of you to deem yourself able to tell me how to speak for myself and of this household.
 
Point four; Perhaps you, yourself do indeed need to scene with some one to know it will be good. Perhaps if they do not care for or get off on what you deem good, you lack the ability to offer them what they deem good. Perhaps if they do not offer you what you deem good immediately you are unable or unwilling to teach or communicate to them otherwise.
 
But, here, in this house, the relationship is first and most important. Scene desires/needs and compatibility can be altered in form and content so that both parties walk away entirely satisfied. It only takes communication and versatility.
 
If play and sex first works for you, wonderful. But from what i've read it appears otherwise to me.

< Message edited by Twicehappy2x -- 8/1/2008 11:31:59 AM >

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 11:22:13 AM   
Twicehappy2x


Posts: 1096
Joined: 3/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: baddog123

MCF (I keep wondering what the c stands for)


Cute? Collared? Comfortable?

_____________________________

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 12:08:42 PM   
dawntreader


Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Oh, I never "play" on a first meet.

It takes a few months of more casual dating and communication to get that much trust from me.


Really?  I have played with people and then done the whole "How do you do, my name is Taggard." thing...so I guess I have played with people even before the first meet.

But as GreedyTop so accurately pointed out, I am a bit of a slut...

Taggard


i am afraid i am going to have to take the "slut" card as well...

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 12:15:01 PM   
YourhandMyAss


Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Not exactly, but if the relationship is as great as two people think, then to me the communication should be as great and I can communicate my disatisfaction about the sex an bdsm, and if we're as great a couple as we think we are, we'll work towards resolving that issue. Working through it. Most times it's much easier to get someone to play with you more than it is to change who they are fundamentally, if you can't live with those traits an flaws, but found out after you were in a serious relationship.

Yes you can always leave if you can't live with who or what they are, but it would of been much easier to find out I couldn't live with them an their traits before I was involved emotionally.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Evility

quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss
Sometimes it really does matter, if I'd known everything I do now about some of my choices in significant others, they'd never of been a choice. I would of ran from them the moment they said hello. Regardless if the play or sex was nice.


So if you met them and built a great realtionship only to find out that you are left somewhat unfufilled by the D/s or play aspect of the relationship you'd just say "Well, I have a great relationship - I can live without the D/s life that I want" ? That sounds to me like what you are saying.



< Message edited by YourhandMyAss -- 8/1/2008 12:22:03 PM >

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 1:07:22 PM   
ShiftedJewel


Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
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quote:

I don't think that "here we all prefer it to be more than that."  How presumptuous of you. 


I believe she meant here... as in OUR home/household. And no, it isn't presumptuous of her at all... I can, and often do, speak for our little family and she is correct.

quote:

Bottom line, I don't think you can know how the sex or play will be with someone by talking about it.  You have to do it.  And you surely have to do it before you get to the point where you are "committed" to someone.  


That sounded an awful lot like an absolute to me... no, I don't have to do it. None of us do, some simply chose to. I can be totally committed to someone long before I'm willing to "play" with them. My personality speaks for its self in that department. As far as I'm concerned, I could be totally committed to someone with out ever "playing" or fucking.
 
Jewel

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RE: Play first? Or relationship first? - 8/1/2008 1:55:37 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: somethndif

And I don't know how you could even start to build a committed relationship, D&s or otherwise, without playing with and fucking your partner.


I was committed to my Master before we played and fucked.  We had two months of intensely personal conversation first, in which he explored my mind and my heart and had me reveal myself to him in ways I had never allowed myself to be so vulnerable before.  By the time we were physical, I knew all I wanted was to give him what he wanted of me, and for him to have a great experience.  And we both knew if I were lacking in anything, he would teach me so that I would not be.  And sure there were (and are) things he does that are less than pleasant for me, but it's his preference to do so and my obligation and fulfillment to deal with it.

We created a base to grow from, and we have both adjusted and changed along the way.

_____________________________

Good is the enemy of great.

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