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ORIGINAL: Evility

Another reason I am not interested in public play. You have to structure your activities so that total strangers understand what you are doing.

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ORIGINAL: angaothsi

For us, yellow, which I assume could equal amber doesnt mean,  " lets stop and talk" it means "please lessen the intensity of what you are currently doing" talking about it is for after everything is over. 
So maybe that was the case for them? One can never really be sure. But good topic!

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ORIGINAL: sublizzie

~FR~

When I was brand new to all of this I would have been appalled if I'd been watching someone scene, say "Red" and have things continue without anyone interferring. I wouldn't have known if the DMs had been told in advance that the scene was not going to use the same definitions for the stoplight terms and would have been very concerned that no one stepped in to help the submissive. I would not have felt safe, would have been very uncomfortable, and probably wouldn't have been willing to scene with anyone who had been involved in any way.

As one who is introducing a vanilla into the local community it helps me to tell him that if he hears "red" that means the scene will stop and that DMs are available to put a stop to any scene that does not. Then he can enjoy watching what is going on without wondering if he needs to step in. If he were to be in attendance where this did not happen, he would be very untrusting of the people in my local community, not something I want to happen.

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ORIGINAL: DavidS8ist
Why in the world, *especially* when new, would you feel *safe* interacting with anyone you didn't know well enough, have seen do what they do long enough, to *trust* them *regardless* of a color spectrum?  Why are we teaching new people that "safe words" are more important than getting to know the person who is going to tie them up and beat the piss out of them?  When are we going to start relying on common sense, plain communication, and the concept that S&M is *not* "play" or "a scene" or "role playing" but intense physical sexuality involving pain, that folks are better served by actually getting to know the person who is going to deprive their senses, restrain their ability to get away, and pound the shit out of them rather than reciting the ssc mantra.

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ORIGINAL: CruelDesires

Stop means stop in any dictionary that I've ever read. Does it means something else overseas?

C-D

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ORIGINAL: missturbation


Last night i went to a small club with friends. There was only about 14 or 15 people there, so it made observation of scenes very easy. By easy i mean it was pretty quiet, hard to miss what was being said and views of scenes were unobstructed.
There was what appeared to be a fairly new to the scene submissive playing with a dom, who i would say was probably pretty experienced. They also had a girl with them who was topping for the first time. The dom appeared to be mentoring / training her.
In my opinion it seemed like a pretty fluffy, almost gentle scene they were playing out. There were no big hits or anything i would class as edgy. Because my opinion of what is edgy may not be everyones, i will try to describe the scene a little better. Floggers, canes, gags, restraint, scratchy mitts, sensual play and knife. The floggers and cane were leaving red marks but only what i would class as 'skin warming'. The knife never broke the skin, in fact the dom mainly used the blunt side, not blade.
Several times during the play which lasted a good few hours in total, the sub safe worded. They were using the amber and red code, or whatever you would call it! Now it is my understanding that when a sub says amber it means 'i don't want to stop the scene altogether but there is a problem we need to discuss'. Red just means an out and out 'i need the scene to end full stop'.
Several times the sub 'ambered'. The dom would 'say do you mean that', she would say 'yes'. Ok, so you would think time for a little discussion, change of intensity, change of implement, position? Nope after hearing 'yes' he just carried on.
The sub then cries 'red'. Does the dom stop? Yes, very briefly and then again just carries on. This happened several times.
My issues here are as follows.....

1. 
   If you are going to use safe words, surely they should be used properly.
   If amber means stop and lets talk about it a second surely that is what should be done. If red means stop, scene over again surely it is what should be done?
   
2. 
   If you are mentoring a new top, what kind of example is ignoring safe words to set?
   
3. 
   If you are playing with a new or fairly new or hell even an experienced sub, safe words should not be ignored.
   
4. 
   Why would you give them and then ignore them? It's just not safe in any way shape or form!
   
5. 
   Why did the DM's not step in? They clearly heard her safe word just as my friends and i did!
   
6. 
   How about those watching the scene? You hear a sub 'red', do you step in and say 'hey she just asked for the scene to stop, now stop?'. I know if it had been my friend who had 'redded' i would be straight in there.
   
7. 
   What kind of example does it set to possible other newbies watching the scene? What impression of the lifestyle does it give?                     

As you all know (or maybe not) lol, i am not an advocate of safe words, i don't use them. But i will stand up for those who do and for their right to use them. The right to have them adhered to, and not ignored as was done in this case.

Edited for bad spelling and really bad grammar.

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ORIGINAL: DavidS8ist

Why in the world, *especially* when new, would you feel *safe* interacting with anyone you didn't know well enough, have seen do what they do long enough, to *trust* them *regardless* of a color spectrum?  Why are we teaching new people that "safe words" are more important than getting to know the person who is going to tie them up and beat the piss out of them?  When are we going to start relying on common sense, plain communication, and the concept that S&M is *not* "play" or "a scene" or "role playing" but intense physical sexuality involving pain, that folks are better served by actually getting to know the person who is going to deprive their senses, restrain their ability to get away, and pound the shit out of them rather than reciting the ssc mantra.

S&M has become a sanitized participation sport.  See that cool looking guy at a dungeon or party?  See how cool he looks cracking a whip?  Why not ask him to "play" with you?  Don't worry about the fact that he hasn't called his parole officer in two months.  You can say "red", can't you?

Maybe we'd be better off if we stopped "playing" and "scening" and went back to the time when folks took this shit seriously.

But I'm being naive.

ROY G. BIV lives.

D.

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ORIGINAL: Leatherist

I get the distinct impression that you did not know what was really going on.

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ORIGINAL: sublizzie

<snip>
Safe words are only as safe as the Dominant hearing them.

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She didn't die?  If not, then what's the issue?

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She was new, was she?  Hmmm, experienced top, new person with a safe word....which one do *I* think makes the better evaluation??

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Don't make too much of it.  It was a small party with someone on top who evidently knew what he was doing.

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Hi *******, Firstly it was really nice to meet you yesterday and i really enjoyed being at ***. I have a question that i am hoping you will be able to answer for me. As head DM at **** i am wondering why when a sub clearly said red several times the scene was not stopped. I am not being disrespecful but i think that safe words should not be ignored and that the situation was potentially unsafe. Jo

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Thank you for raising this one. I am guessing we are talking about the scene on the spanking bench while *** and *** where playing on the metal grill.
If this is the one then I heard the word red mentioned several time, but what meaning you place on the word and what meaning the player involved place on the word may be different.  
I did keep a close eye on the players I suspect to have been the people you are talking about and saw no play that required me to step in.
How did you see the play being unsafe?
If this explanation or the people involved are not correct please memo back.

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Hi *****,
Thank you for replying to my mail. You have the right scene although my concern isnt just about when *** and ***n  were playing, it was the whole evening. My concerns are as follows.......
1. The couple playing were quite obviously using the traffic light system. Amber to alert the Dom there was a problem, red for stop. When red was called and play did not stop someone should have stepped in.
2. The Dom was mentoring a new domme, her first time. What kind of example was that to set to someone on how to use safe words.
3. I could have been a complete newbie and seeing that scene and safe words being ignored could have had me heading for the hills.
4. How could you have been carefully watching what was going on when half of the time there was no DM in sight. They were all including yourself off playing?
5. How could you tell there was no damage being done? Were you inside the subs head? Just because she was laughing does not mean she was ok. I laugh sometimes when extremely uncomfortable.
I know i am not the only person who was concerned that evening by the events. I would hate to think that because of one unfortunate event the club would be avoided or talked about.

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ORIGINAL: DavidS8ist

She didn't die?  If not, then what's the issue?