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RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 9:48:17 PM   
Ozzfan1317


Posts: 62
Joined: 5/13/2008
Status: offline 		*From a former Veteran* I want no part of a Draft and I feel the war in Iraq is a waste or Rescources and of Soldiers lives. Any person who directly supports reinstating a draft I will move To Canada or Even Europe before I would let them be my president.

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:07:12 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		It's morally repugnant to force anyone to go to "serve". We used to be a free country. I am a free and sovereign citizen. I owe service to no one.

(in reply to Ozzfan1317)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:18:16 PM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
Status: offline 		Wow, do you pay taxes, obey traffic signals, subject yourself to searches and screenings at airports, public builings, and expect that their might be some solution for Social Security when you get older?  Yep, you are free and sovereign.

_____________________________

live hard, die young and leave a good looking corpse when you die.
Love ya, but, when the zombies start chasing us, i am tripping you.
The glass is always full, the question is, "with what?"

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:24:34 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		No, I don't pay taxes, obey traffic signals only when they make sense, haven't gone through an airport since the TSA pigs were installed, and Social Security is the greatest Ponzi scheme ever invented, so I have a 401k in case I don't die in the saddle. Thanks, though.

(in reply to atursvcMaam)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:32:44 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: StructuredKing

No, I don't pay taxes, obey traffic signals only when they make sense, haven't gone through an airport since the TSA pigs were installed, and Social Security is the greatest Ponzi scheme ever invented, so I have a 401k in case I don't die in the saddle. Thanks, though.



            Do let us know how that works out for you...

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:34:25 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		And you be sure to let me know how much your shackles chafe, serf. Lick the hand that robs you, and may history forget you were my countryman.

< Message edited by StructuredKing -- 8/21/2008 10:36:36 PM >

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:36:56 PM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
Status: offline 		Right.

_____________________________

live hard, die young and leave a good looking corpse when you die.
Love ya, but, when the zombies start chasing us, i am tripping you.
The glass is always full, the question is, "with what?"

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:37:28 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Forcing someone to fight and kill is immoral. 

That`s why there`s a purposed non-military option.

If we linked it to driving "privileges",I think most people would be more open minded about serving.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 8/21/2008 10:38:19 PM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:40:38 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		I'm just curious as to why forcing someone to kill is immoral, when stealing a piece of their life (2 year service) is moral?

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:42:16 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		If you don`t need to drive,that`s fine with me.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:45:43 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		You didn't answer the question, and driving isn't a privilege, just because someone said so. :-)

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:46:47 PM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
Status: offline 		why are you involved with a 401k if it doesn't effect your taxes?How do you choose whether to obey a traffic signal if you don't purchase gasoline which is taxed at 18% or pay to be licensed?  How do you purchase almost anything without sales tax?   Of which planet are you actually a free sovereign citizen?

_____________________________

live hard, die young and leave a good looking corpse when you die.
Love ya, but, when the zombies start chasing us, i am tripping you.
The glass is always full, the question is, "with what?"

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:50:00 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Driving is most certainly a privilege.

Personally,I think allowing just a few lads to shoulder the entire war effort,is immoral.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:53:03 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		I'm in a 401k because my employer matches at 10%, which beats the current rate of return for most stable investments these days. It's pretty easy to avoid the fuel tax if you drive diesel. It's really easy to avoid sales tax, I just buy out of state via the Internet or buy used. It's not like I'm hiding out of caves, it just takes a little creativity.

(in reply to atursvcMaam)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 10:54:52 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		We "lads" volunteered. Theres nothing immoral about allowing them to shoulder it. They wanted to.

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 11:03:30 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Well.that makes at least two opinions on the matter.

Question,what if we need a draft?That might be a reality,like it or not.

What then?

Added: Are you a vet?

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 8/21/2008 11:04:46 PM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 11:08:06 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		I am a crazy war vet. I am so glad I never had to fight next to conscript soldiers.

I can't think of a time when a draft would be needed. If it's a righteous war, there will be plenty of volunteers. But then again, I think the last righteous war was Revolutionary War. So, what would I know?

< Message edited by StructuredKing -- 8/21/2008 11:11:05 PM >

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 11:15:53 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Thanks for the service.Thank your buddies for us too.

I hope you`re right about this.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/21/2008 11:20:33 PM   
StructuredKing


Posts: 27
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		It's not service, if you're not serving. I did it selfishly, and so did every other soldier I ever met. Maybe there were some in some support unit that joined for their country, but not a one in any combat line units. But you're welcome anyways. Sorry I couldn't do anything about the gas prices, even though my team guarded numerous refineries at one time or another. :(

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: McCain supports return to draft? - 8/22/2008 5:32:53 AM   
Thadius


Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: StructuredKing

It's not service, if you're not serving. I did it selfishly, and so did every other soldier I ever met. Maybe there were some in some support unit that joined for their country, but not a one in any combat line units. But you're welcome anyways. Sorry I couldn't do anything about the gas prices, even though my team guarded numerous refineries at one time or another. :(


Quite the idealist, eh?  Thanks for casting such a generalization on all of us that did serve, as selfish unless we were in a support role.  If I had to guess you were either Army or Air Force.  Now let's think about a few things you have stated. 

I agree that I am against serving with conscripts, I rather enjoyed knowing that those standing next to me were there because they volunteered.

Assuming that you served your entire enlistment, you have been in the private sector about a year or so?  I am curious how you think you are going to get around paying taxes, or better yet get away with not paying them on your earnings, and capital gains.  Let us know how that works out for you.

Thanks for your service, but I advise against trying to put motives or words in the mouths of others that served.

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

(in reply to StructuredKing)
Profile   Post #: 60
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