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RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:28:14 PM   
rulemylife


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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife


Since when is any tax fair?

The question is, if you eliminate the estate tax, or even follow McCain's proposal, where do you make up the lost tax revenue?


How about the option of cutting spending?  When did the concept get flipped that the money belongs to Congress and not to you and me?

Edited to fix the quotes... as some folks delete one too many sets of tags.


A long time ago, and, as much as I would like, it is not likely to change.  Cutting spending is the idea, but the money McCain claims to be able to cut by limiting pork-barrel spending does not come anywhere close to the amount he has proposed in tax cuts.  As far as I can tell, he's counting on the same failed supply-side theories that gave us record deficits under Reagan and Bush Jr., not to mention the massive increases in federal debt. 

(in reply to Thadius)
Profile   Post #: 141
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:31:58 PM   
Jeffff


Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

i believe that the American people are worried about our future in this war.  having a leader that has actually fought in a war is important to alot of people including me!  i want our troops home now, but i want them home safe and victorious if that is possible.  i respect McCain for his service in Vietnam and i respect our troops fighting in iraq, even though i truly believe we should not have put our troops in harms way then or now! 


Richard Nixon  called it, " peace with honor"

50,000 american dead  later and Vet Nam is one big country...... on big comunnist country.
If you want them home safe...... then you want them home now.
Read  "Clausewitz On War" and then get back to me on this one

Jeff

Jeff

(in reply to bestbabync)
Profile   Post #: 142
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:36:44 PM   
needsOwner


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has no one here went to google and watched the Zeitgeist movie?  seriously......everyone wants have loud opinions but all while their heads are stuck in the sand.  at least see the facts people  this is our country not the 1% who we put in charge

(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 143
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:38:52 PM   
lronitulstahp


Posts: 5392
Joined: 10/17/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

hmmmmm?

osama bin laden
obama biden

that rhymes!!!


_____________________________

Truth is, everybody is going to hurt you; you just gotta find the ones worth suffering for." -Bob Marley

(in reply to bestbabync)
Profile   Post #: 144
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:39:26 PM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
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but that 1% we put in charge have thousands of our young men and women in a war.

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to needsOwner)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:43:27 PM   
Thadius


Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

hmmmmm?

osama bin laden
obama biden

that rhymes!!!



Closest I can come up with is.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APx2YJ-_jos

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

(in reply to lronitulstahp)
Profile   Post #: 146
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 6:48:29 PM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

hmmmmm?

osama bin laden
obama biden

that rhymes!!!



Closest I can come up with is.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APx2YJ-_jos



i cannot stop laughing!!!!

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to Thadius)
Profile   Post #: 147
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:22:07 PM   
xXLithiumXx


Posts: 723
Joined: 9/2/2008
From: Hell, Kentucky
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx

quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

oops...apparently, i couldn't find anything saying he'd been married prior to Michelle.  Guessi read something too quickly once.



I think thats what happened when I said the thing about the middle east. Lol. It must be an epidemic I have started.


Relax, huh?  I know it seemed everyone piled on but sometimes all the responses come at once.  I think it was especially touchy because a lot of people have believed those rumors.  There's only one person that doesn't make mistakes, and it's really been a huge burden for me.   



Thats great. Lol. I wondered when I would meet the perfect person. I can see how straining it would be, and I do not envy your perfection.

Lol.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 148
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:30:05 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

This doesn't even deserve recognition it's so bogus. Let me get this straight...so if my ancestors weren't called racial epithets, and treated as "less than" citizens 400 years ago, but i was...my black american experience is now defunct?  And your expertise on being black in America comes from where?  Sorry if i seem highly sensitive, but it's a sensitive subject.  Debating it and living it are two very seperate things...and not at all equal.


I didn't invent the issue. It came from Black communites. Hilliary Clinton was all to happy to pick it up and play up to her black supporters and for it worked for her.You can find black scholars and laymen all over the internet talking about with nary a white person in or on the site.

Mainstream debate?

How about Time Magazine:
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1584736,00.html

It first came to my attention via the brilliant critic and writer Stanley Crouch when he wrote this column in The New York Daily News:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1730861/posts

Crouch ended that column (written two years ago) with this:

" if he [Obama] throws his hat in the ring, he will have to run as the son of a white woman and an African immigrant. If we then end up with him as our first black President, he will have come into the White House through a side door - which might, at this point, be the only one that's open."
 
That is exactly what happened at least the first part. The second part is in great doubt at the moment.





< Message edited by FatDomDaddy -- 9/4/2008 7:36:30 PM >

(in reply to lronitulstahp)
Profile   Post #: 149
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:30:51 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

hmmmmm?

osama bin laden
obama biden

that rhymes!!!


...no it doesn't.

However, this does.....

Palin failing.....

...now tell me how such a puerile exercise adds anything substantive to what is a serious debate, that has the potential to affect millions of lives........

(in reply to bestbabync)
Profile   Post #: 150
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:31:44 PM   
xXLithiumXx


Posts: 723
Joined: 9/2/2008
From: Hell, Kentucky
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

OK, for the record, I am both PRO-obama (in a vacuum) and, in general, rabidly against the republican party (in general).   That being said, I find the following statements both unfair and uncalled for...

quote:

ORIGINAL:  xxLithiumxx
Like I said in the post before this one, McCain has a some what shady history. As a woman, I wouldnt trust a man who uses his record shamlessly to win a seat in office, which he has tried to do in this election. (I have seen several ads about wouldnt you like to have a veteran on your side, or some such drizzle) Nor, would I trust a man who met one wife while still with a wife. It seems to me from that stand point that he doesnt know what he wants. NOR, would I trust a man who is known for his temper, and his love of war


Insofar as him using his record to win a seat, what else WOULD you have him use?  As far as I am concerned, McCain's record in the armed forces is commendable and a valid part of who he is and perfectly appropriate to bring up in an election discussion.  Insofar as his wife situation, that's none of my business, mostly because these things are almost always too tangled to understand from the outside.  I didn't like it when the republican's brought similar issues up with Clinton and I like it even less with the McCain situation.  I cannot comment on his temper adequately, but I somehow sincerely doubt that anyone with his history "loves war".

Just because I dislike the man's personal political views and those of his party doesn't mean he ought to be demonized.


Unfortunately, just as he's abandoned all his previous positions to kow-tow to every special interest in his party, he has gone beyond touting his record to using it as a shield.  When asked about McCain's inability to remember how many houses he owns, campaign aide Brian Rogers told the Washington Post, "This is a guy who lived in one house for five-and-a-half years--in prison.".  McCain himself has used similar statements in response to this and other criticisms.  Running on your record is fine, blatantly courting sympathy to deflect from criticism is not. 



That was kind of the point I was getting at, but for some strange reason, the verbalizaion of my mind is no good. Of course, it could be old age setting in.

I think the hardest thing for me to look at in the whole thing was McCains involvment in the Keating thing. How could he cover for them and then be so ignorant as to say..."well..I just didnt know what I was doin!" He might as well have used the Twinkie defense. I mean fuck sake, how would it be possible for him to be able be blind to something that involved? So, now, he wants us to put him in charge of the finances of a nation? Why not just throw the damned Twinkies he wants to use as a defense to the American public and say..."Here ya go..eat cake.." Or would that be plagerism on his part?

Not that I think he is above that mind you. But of course, there is always the fact that he has rallied to be able to accept soft money...which from my understanding, (and mind you I didnt get into all the definitions and terms, so I may be wrong, yet again) basically means that he wants to be able to get as much money as he can from as many places as he can. Which leads me to the question, did he get his pay off back in the day for the Keating thing? Or is this some secret way of paying him off now? Or is this a whole new pay off? Basically the man is little more than a pick pocket and a deflecting bit of shit. I have no respect for him, I have no intrest or use for him, and the American public at large is over looking those few small, but significant facts. If the man will steal and lie about it once, why would you put him in a place to do it again. If thats the case, my little brothe needs a job. And hes a convicted felon for stealing.

And as for using his time as a POW as a way to get votes that has to be the single most deplorable thing I can think of. I have two uncles who were in Nam, one of whom was a POW and suffers every day. He NEVER uses that as an excuse for anything. So who the hell does this wind bag think he is?

Sorry...got off on a lil rampage there.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 151
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:37:56 PM   
xXLithiumXx


Posts: 723
Joined: 9/2/2008
From: Hell, Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

i believe that the American people are worried about our future in this war.  having a leader that has actually fought in a war is important to alot of people including me!  i want our troops home now, but i want them home safe and victorious if that is possible.  i respect McCain for his service in Vietnam and i respect our troops fighting in iraq, even though i truly believe we should not have put our troops in harms way then or now! 



McCain wants to keep them there. It will make him more money.

Obama wants them home.

I kind of feel there is a similarity between Iraq and Nam, though, I should most likely do some more research before tossing that (and myself) to the wolves by saying it out loud. But honestly, those two countries have been fighting since the beginning of time, and will continue to do so even if we get them straight for a while, once we leave they will be right back at it.

(in reply to bestbabync)
Profile   Post #: 152
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:38:33 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

I always found it interesting that Bill Gates is against lowering estate taxes.


He can afford to be.

(in reply to thornhappy)
Profile   Post #: 153
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:39:30 PM   
xXLithiumXx


Posts: 723
Joined: 9/2/2008
From: Hell, Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife


Since when is any tax fair?

The question is, if you eliminate the estate tax, or even follow McCain's proposal, where do you make up the lost tax revenue?


How about the option of cutting spending?  When did the concept get flipped that the money belongs to Congress and not to you and me?

Edited to fix the quotes... as some folks delete one too many sets of tags.


A long time ago, and, as much as I would like, it is not likely to change.  Cutting spending is the idea, but the money McCain claims to be able to cut by limiting pork-barrel spending does not come anywhere close to the amount he has proposed in tax cuts.  As far as I can tell, he's counting on the same failed supply-side theories that gave us record deficits under Reagan and Bush Jr., not to mention the massive increases in federal debt. 


Thats another thing as well. McCain was a big Regan supporter, and was big on the theories that Regan followed.  So...here again...is McCain running his own show, or is he just tossing out old ideas to get into the piggy bank yet again?

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 154
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:41:38 PM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
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And as for using his time as a POW as a way to get votes that has to be the single most deplorable thing I can think of. I have two uncles who were in Nam, one of whom was a POW and suffers every day. He NEVER uses that as an excuse for anything. So who the hell does this wind bag think he is?

McCain tells of his time as a POW to show his commitment to his country, just like Obama uses his "community organizer" time to show his commitment.  John McCain was a soldier & a POW in vietnam just like your uncles.  There history, courage and accomplishments does entitle them to alot!  all veterans and POW's deserve the utmost respect, even John McCain.




_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to xXLithiumXx)
Profile   Post #: 155
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:43:46 PM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline
Obama quoted Reagan

McCain actually worked with Reagan

hmmmmm?

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to xXLithiumXx)
Profile   Post #: 156
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:43:49 PM   
xXLithiumXx


Posts: 723
Joined: 9/2/2008
From: Hell, Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

hmmmmm?

osama bin laden
obama biden

that rhymes!!!



Closest I can come up with is.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APx2YJ-_jos



i cannot stop laughing!!!!


Leave it to Ted Kennedy's pickled brain to make that screw up.

Shouldnt he be driving a girl off a bridge some where instead of making public statements?

(in reply to bestbabync)
Profile   Post #: 157
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:47:35 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
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This Thread is going a litlle astray, that's OK, it happens but back to the point.

The man that gets elected President in November IS going to have a majority of the white vote. That will be a given and I doubt you could find one honest person in the Obama inner circle that would disagree.

So, the question is can a man named Barrak Hussian Obama get more white people to vote for him, then will vote for man named John Sidney McCain III?

Not in 2008 he can't.

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 158
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:48:48 PM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
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that was mean, he has brain cancer!  i am totally not a fan of Ted Kennedy!  but that was mean!

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to xXLithiumXx)
Profile   Post #: 159
RE: Why Obama cannot win in 2008 - 9/4/2008 7:49:48 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

This Thread is going a litlle astray, that's OK, it happens but back to the point.

The man that gets elected President in November IS going to have a majority of the white vote. That will be a given and I doubt you could find one honest person in the Obama inner circle that would disagree.

So, the question is can a man named Barrak Hussian Obama get more white people to vote for him, then will vote for man named John Sidney McCain III?

Not in 2008 he can't.


....so you're suggesting that the majority of white people in the US are racist? If i did that you'd jump down my throat.......

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 160
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