RE: pro submissives

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IvyMorgan -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 6:51:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit Man, I don't even like standing over someone with a flogger for free, much less paying someone so I can stand over them with a flogger! I never really got the whole issue with people capitalizing on their bodies. I capitalize on my intelligence all the time. There is nothing I love more than cooking a dinner for someone I have an intimate connection with and that free service has a very powerful emotional expression and value attached to it. Now all the other assholes in the world I charge money to cook for and that monetary value replaces the emotional one, but I have yet to have yet to have anyone take offense to that. But with that said, I am one of those people who feels they are "above" paying for any kind of professional sexual service, because when it comes to my sexuality, if there isn't intimacy and a connection there, I get bored really really quick. I guess, when I worked, I saw myself getting different things from different interactions that were different from emotional fuzzy feelings. I get emotional fuzzy feelings when I'm in a relationship, when I'm with someone I care about and not in a relationship etc. I got all sorts of different "good" feelings from working, aside from the monetry benefit. I'm a teacher at heart. I've spent many years in a government teaching programme, and still do voluntary teaching work for a handful of universities. I like sharing knowledge and skills. I like making other people happy (so that applies to both sides of the flogger now :P), I like watching people so relaxed and content, it brings out the maternal in me, and now that sounds weird. In short, I got something other than money, out of every scenario in which I worked. And when I stopped getting something other than money out of it, I stopped doing it, and went back to selling myself through temp agencies and working in accounts departments. The hours are better, the money isn't. But, I have free time to go get my "emotional fuzzy feelings" that I missed out on when working. It's about balance, and fufilling different areas of yourself and meeting the different needs you have over time. I worked until I didn't want to work anymore, and then I kept turning down offers until the offers stopped coming. Simple as, really. And, weirdly, yes, I think I was the only working "sub" (as in "does more than spanking") in my city, though there were a couple of pro-spankees. We must be a rare breed...

mistoferin -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 6:58:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Briena So when you are no longer in a relationship with a Dom are you no longer submissive? Do you stop being who you are? Is a woman who says she is submissive lying if shes not in a relationship? Of course you can still be a submissive. Just like as auto mechanic is still an auto mechanic when they are sitting in church. Who you are doesn't change. quote: What about people who play in dungeons or parties? What about people who are just dating others? Playing the field, as some might call it. Are they not submissive because they are not in a relationship with the Dom/me who is playing with them? It is all the same thing, in a relationship or not. There is a large difference between the words submissive and submission. Just because one is submissive does not mean they are in submission. I spent nearly 5 years single between my last relationship and the one I am in. While I was still a submissive I was in submission to no one. Yes, during that time I played and played heavily in many dungeons with a couple of trusted dominant friends. There was ZERO submission in it and I was simply bottoming. I don't submit in a casual encounter. quote: They are submitting to the will of the other person, doing their bidding. No, they aren't. They are saying you can do this, this and this but you can't do this, this or this. What they are doing is on their terms. That is not submission. quote: So than if that is how you feel did you not have any type of BDSM sessions with your Dom before you got so commited? Did you never have any type of session outside of a serious relationship? Refer back to what I wrote above. BDSM sessions and play do not equate to submission. quote: In your way of thinking, so it seems (not trying to tell you how you think, just how it appears), if you are not in this committed type of relationship you should not play at all. Again, please show me where in this post, or anywhere on these boards for that matter, that I have expressed such a ridiculous thing. It would seem that some of you are under the impression that I don't understand my own opinions. That I haven't thought them out....or maybe I'm just not smart enough to understand. Really folks...I'm ok with my opinions....really.

RedMagic1 -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 8:57:08 AM)
Well, I'll step up and say it. Erin, you are making no sense. Every single scene -- and every single relationship -- is a process of negotiation where people on both sides say "you can do this and you can't do that." Submission has absolutely nothing to do with that. If you have found a Dom whose desires and limits complement your own -- so you don't say "no" too often any more -- then congratulations. However, that, too, has almost nothing to do with submission, but instead is almost entirely a result of mutual trust... and mutual submission to a common relationship. I don't have to point anywhere beyond your post immediately above mine to demonstrate contradiction and logical fallacy. I could continue. I won't, because it would just be mean. However, I think a little more willingness to believe that you don't know everything would serve you well.

candystripper -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 9:13:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx being a pro subbie,wondered what others though about the service we offer?? and weather or not you would visit a pro sub..really interested in comments...thanks (god i am letting myself in for it now!!) I'm confused. If I wanted to be a 'pro submissive' wouldn't I wear short shorts and stand on streetcorners, asking men if they 'wanted to party?' candystripper [sm=pole.gif]

Briena -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 1:13:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RedMagic1 Well, I'll step up and say it. Erin, you are making no sense. Every single scene -- and every single relationship -- is a process of negotiation where people on both sides say "you can do this and you can't do that." Submission has absolutely nothing to do with that. If you have found a Dom whose desires and limits complement your own -- so you don't say "no" too often any more -- then congratulations. However, that, too, has almost nothing to do with submission, but instead is almost entirely a result of mutual trust... and mutual submission to a common relationship. I don't have to point anywhere beyond your post immediately above mine to demonstrate contradiction and logical fallacy. I could continue. I won't, because it would just be mean. However, I think a little more willingness to believe that you don't know everything would serve you well. That was exactly my point. I was not saying this "In your way of thinking, so it seems (not trying to tell you how you think, just how it appears), if you are not in this committed type of relationship you should not play at all." was Erins opinion, I was stating that it SEEMS thats what she meant. That is what is being read by everyone else, or by me anyways, I cannot say everyone else. Everything in this lifestyle is a negotiation. Everything in any relationship is a negotiation. Just in these ones more. If I met a Dom who liked to shit on his subs I would tell him NO, but I am ok with this or that. Thats a negotiation. I am setting my limits just as a Pro anything would, just as anyone in this lifestyle would. We all have limits to what we allow. I have never done anything that I did not want to do in this life because I state up front what I expect. Every time I have ever played with anyone other than my husband I have submitted to his control. I have my limits just as everyone else does. If what he was doing to me is not one of my limits than we continue on. That is submission, I am under his control until the scene is over. Of course I have every right to stop a scene, JUST AS YOU DO, but would I say that you do not submit to your Dom? No. I submit to the Doms I play with during a scene. I state what I will not allow up front and then we move on. Am I not submitting to him because I have limits? Sorry, I dont like to be shit on, I will never be shit on, so if Im not submitting because I refuse to be shit on, TOO BAD! See, it just makes no sense. Everyone has limits to the things that they will do. Does that mean that they are not submitting every time they play? No, it does not.

Briena -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 1:15:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: candystripper quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx being a pro subbie,wondered what others though about the service we offer?? and weather or not you would visit a pro sub..really interested in comments...thanks (god i am letting myself in for it now!!) I'm confused. If I wanted to be a 'pro submissive' wouldn't I wear short shorts and stand on streetcorners, asking men if they 'wanted to party?' candystripper [sm=pole.gif] Wow, that was hateful...

azropedntied -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 1:20:15 PM)
I am confused i never did exchanges with men ,stood on any corners ,Never wore short shorts ,sorry your whole Pro view is incorrect as posted ! quote: ORIGINAL: candystripper quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx being a pro subbie,wondered what others though about the service we offer?? and weather or not you would visit a pro sub..really interested in comments...thanks (god i am letting myself in for it now!!) I'm confused. If I wanted to be a 'pro submissive' wouldn't I wear short shorts and stand on streetcorners, asking men if they 'wanted to party?' candystripper [sm=pole.gif]

IvyMorgan -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 2:16:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: candystripper quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx being a pro subbie,wondered what others though about the service we offer?? and weather or not you would visit a pro sub..really interested in comments...thanks (god i am letting myself in for it now!!) I'm confused. If I wanted to be a 'pro submissive' wouldn't I wear short shorts and stand on streetcorners, asking men if they 'wanted to party?' candystripper [sm=pole.gif] Skirts are much better for access. Though, ideally, a one piece sundress that can be removed and donned in about 30 seconds.

candystripper -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 2:49:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Briena quote: ORIGINAL: candystripper quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx being a pro subbie,wondered what others though about the service we offer?? and weather or not you would visit a pro sub..really interested in comments...thanks (god i am letting myself in for it now!!) I'm confused. If I wanted to be a 'pro submissive' wouldn't I wear short shorts and stand on streetcorners, asking men if they 'wanted to party?' candystripper [sm=pole.gif] Wow, that was hateful... Briena, it was not meant to be hateful. I've known and respected many women 'in the life'. Within bounds, they'll do as asked -- for a fee. Seems to me, implied by the term 'pro' is the notion of cash for services. Thus, my question. Please forgive me if I seemed harsh; it wasn't my intention. candystripper [sm=pole.gif]

IvyMorgan -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 3:04:19 PM)
See, Candy, I think the problem is, you seemed to be likening pro-subs to prostitutes. Which is not wholly accurate, and, to me, mildly offensive. Whilst I have "sold" myself, I would never have thought to stand on a street corner (and thus break the law) to do so. If your attention is not to be harsh, perhaps you can word you comments a little differently in future. I mean, what were you intending to be? And just cos you know many women "in the life" doesn't give you a get out of jail free card on being offensive. I've lost track of the number of times I've heard, "I'm not homophobic, I have loads of gay friends!"

Briena -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 4:03:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: IvyMorgan See, Candy, I think the problem is, you seemed to be likening pro-subs to prostitutes. Which is not wholly accurate, and, to me, mildly offensive. Whilst I have "sold" myself, I would never have thought to stand on a street corner (and thus break the law) to do so. If your attention is not to be harsh, perhaps you can word you comments a little differently in future. I mean, what were you intending to be? And just cos you know many women "in the life" doesn't give you a get out of jail free card on being offensive. I've lost track of the number of times I've heard, "I'm not homophobic, I have loads of gay friends!" Took the words right out of my mouth... GET OUT OF MY HEAD YOU! :D

IvyMorgan -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 4:20:42 PM)
But, But, But.... it's so much fun in here!

Briena -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 4:28:19 PM)
Ugh... Ok but only for a little bit longer, then I want my thoughts back mmmkay! :D

Lynnxz -> RE: pro submissives (9/7/2008 7:02:13 PM)
quote: Briena, it was not meant to be hateful. I've known and respected many women 'in the life'. Within bounds, they'll do as asked -- for a fee. Seems to me, implied by the term 'pro' is the notion of cash for services. Thus, my question. Please forgive me if I seemed harsh; it wasn't my intention. Again with the "I'm just sayin!!" attitude. (s'ok, you aren't the first in the thread) If you don't like what we do, and you think all pro subs are hookers, well just come out and say it! [:D] I'll respect someone who just lays their opinions out there, and doesn't have to hide behind little snarky comments. Personally, I'd never have sex with a client. -and I've terminated sessions when the guys started whining about it. Also... I checked my closet, I don't seem to have a pair of short-shorts, and I've found that websites are much better advertising than streetcorners.

CreativeDominant -> RE: pro submissives (9/8/2008 2:36:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx ok..the advantage would be for those who want a sub,no strings no ties(it does happen) ..and you seem to think you know me and how i conduct myself in a session...strange..you have obviopusly decided wht i do ,without even asking me..how could you possibly know how i feel or think or interact with a client?? psycic are we?? Those who want a submissive with no strings and no ties do not want a submissive, they want a bottom able to ACT submissive for an agreed-upon length of time. An extremely-limited-service submissive whose time constraints means that the domination that is occurring is that which fits within the parameters of the paid-for submissive whose submission is of the "yes Sir/Ma'am" or "no Sir/Ma'am" variety. No...I don't know you. But I can infer from what I have heard pro Dommes state and from what I have heard Lynxx state...and since you brought it up, let me try to get to know you and ask some questions regarding what happens in a session. If ordered by the paying dominant, will you commit sexual acts with him/her? If ordered by the paying dominant, will you go past the time paid for because your "inner submission" that you feel for this particular client just overwhelms you? Will you address the paying dominant as "Sir/Ma'am" or "Daddy/Mommy" or "Master/Mistress" if they insist or will your inner submission take over and you will explain to the paying client that such a term goes past your limits? As to what you think and feel, no I do not have any way of knowing what you think. But, if you will bother to take the time to read closely, I stated NOTHING about the way you think or feel towards any particular client. Again, I could speculate about what you feel in general but that would end up sounding cynical. As others have noted, one of the things that signifies D/s is the connection that occurs...whether it is a deep, romantic one or even just one in which either submission or domination are compelled by the other person that we are interacting with. What compels your submission...or paid-for bottoming with paid-for submissive undertones to be more accurate...is, at the edge of the smoke and mirrors, money. I think use of the term Dominant and Submissive is a marketing tool, as has been noted. When I see the term, I tend to put other words in there..."Professional (bottom/top who can portray themselves in a manner similar to a real-life) Dominant/Submissive"

littlesarbonn -> RE: pro submissives (9/8/2008 2:58:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xxxxpinkxxxx "Being" submissive is wanting to or being willing to submit to orders or wishes of another. Showing an inclination in this way. An overriding desire to be pleasing. Willingly submitting without resistance to authority. Being subservient or servile. Enjoying erotic activities in feeling powerlessness or under the control of another. I guess this is what actually confuses me about pro submission. Before I continue, let me preface this by stating that I have very little interactive experience with professional submissives in their sessions, although I have been in environments where pro submissives have been quite prevalent (having lived in houses of domination that also cater to the female sub/male dominant crowd as well). I have zero problem with people doing whatever they do, so this post is NOT a criticism in any way. It's more a clarification search. The line "enjoying erotic activities in feeling powerlessness or under the control of another" is very much a great need for a lot of submissives, including myself. While I am known as a service submissive, there's no doubt that at the same time an intimacy between my Mistress and I is somewhat necessary or I might as well just serve some random stranger. I know that when I was involved in paying for professional sessions with a pro dominant woman, there was usually a LOT of direct contact intimacy, even if it was not intercourse or anything blatantly illegal. I'm curious about how such close proximity of intimacy becomes possible when dealing with a client who is the one who is in charge and there's little way to make sure that he doesn't go too far in such intimate matters. An example, there were times when I was with a pro dominant where she may have gone a bit further than was probably allowable because we had built a bond between us over numerous sessions, and to me it was wonderful. At the same time, it usually wasn't my choice about whether or not to stop it, not that I ever would have. But when you have a male dominant who is getting very intimate with you, you're tied up, and things are getting really heated, what actually stops things from gettinig out of control? Or maybe I just don't understand how the interaction actually works between male client/female submissive professionals. Does the question make any sense? I mean, I'm not a dominant, nor do I play one on television, but the question has always lingered in the back of my mind.

mistoferin -> RE: pro submissives (9/8/2008 5:19:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant As others have noted, one of the things that signifies D/s is the connection that occurs...whether it is a deep, romantic one or even just one in which either submission or domination are compelled by the other person that we are interacting with. What compels your submission...or paid-for bottoming with paid-for submissive undertones to be more accurate...is, at the edge of the smoke and mirrors, money. Exactly.

IvyMorgan -> RE: pro submissives (9/8/2008 6:23:56 PM)
quote: But when you have a male dominant who is getting very intimate with you, you're tied up, and things are getting really heated, what actually stops things from gettinig out of control? The six foot six ect Met police officer on the other side of the thin MDF door? And my classically trained vocal chords, obviously. But, yes, part of why it stopped being fun, and why I quit, was this type of "client" and the fact that my six foot ex police officer stopped managing the place I worked, and I didn't have the same level of trust in the new guy.

azropedntied -> RE: pro submissives (9/8/2008 6:56:39 PM)
Lynn > please inform me the moment those shorty shorts arrive , i know they will look HOT on you , OR you can always just wear jeans and i could make some daisy dukes wink [;)] Again i so find it funny that bdsm Pro's get a comparison to hookers shakes head ..

Lynnxz -> RE: pro submissives (9/8/2008 7:38:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: azropedntied Lynn > please inform me the moment those shorty shorts arrive , i know they will look HOT on you , OR you can always just wear jeans and i could make some daisy dukes wink [;)] Again i so find it funny that bdsm Pro's get a comparison to hookers shakes head .. Haha, I give up, ok fine, I'm a straight up crack whore. Gimmie 5$ and take your pants off hunny! Since I am a crack whore, OBVIOUSLY ever session I go to I lie there in disintrest, picking my nails and texting my pimp about my next john. I am incapable of emotions, in or out of a relationship! I only fake at submission 'cause I get that extra 10$ tip for wearing the collar, and squirming when they spank me with the tiny rubber flogger. My boyfriend/dom/whatever he is, is OBVIOUSLY not a dominant man, as all of you o-so-worldly people have figured out. He's just my pimp daddy, and I take my money to him every night or he beats me with a extention cord! If I'm a good girl and make over 37$ a night, he gives me my little baggy of crack. Good call everyone!

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