quote:

ORIGINAL: SlayerZ

Domestic Abuse = not consensual

BDSM = consensual

Can I break down a complex argument down to a few words, or what.

: p

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

having experienced both i can honestly say, from my perspective that trust and respect are the big issues.

a bdsm relationship has to be based on trust and respect, without it the dynamic would falter.

an abusive relationship does not value trust - often the abuser abuses because they have issues with trust and respect. 

a Dominant is generally a person who values and respects their submissive partner.  considers their actions before making them, is in control of themselves and the situation they are in

an abuser is never in control, of themselves or their relationship - all that they ever achieve is increased self-loathing and malignant hostility.  the very fact that they are not in control makes every day an unknown quantity with the ever present threat of unwarranted, unprovoked attack.  the worst abuser i ever had never drank and his attacks came out of the blue, i never knew from one day to the next what would trigger him or why. 

both abuser and Dominant are control freaks but they come from different angles.  an abuser controls by losing control - it is a destructive, pointless, terrifying ordeal.  a Dominant controls through working with their submissives psyche for the soul purpose of effecting willing cooperation and to strengthen the bond.  it is a positive, affirming, settling catharsis.

i believe that many abused women have found refuge in a bdsm relationship because they are with someone who respects and values them.  the 'violence' is controlled and used to cement the bond between D and s.  even in punishment or discipline the premis behind the act is to move the relationship on and strengthen the core understanding that the D is in control and the s must accept that or move on.  abuse is mindless and has no positive outcome ever for abuser or abusee - it is just a miserable spirralling nightmare.

in every D/s bdsm based relationship i have had there has always been cause and effect, clear ground rules, parameters and consequences.  if i do A i get B.  and never ever, not once have i feared for my life.  in every abusive relationship ive had i never knew from one day to the next how to be, fault was found regardless if that was the mood they were in. consequences were varied and invariably groundless and in one relationship i feared for my life more often than not.

ive noticed time and again how some D's genuinely worry over whether what they do is borderline abuse or outright abuse.  and i want to tell you, stop worrying about it. really! 

there is a difference, a big difference, the comparison is in how very different they are.

quote:

ORIGINAL: onlyme32111


I myself aren't a huge fan of taking a weak person and making them weaker for my gain but first hand I know a master who beats women to satisfy his own hatred for them. He beats submissive women because he hates them for being weak and for being accepting of the "consensual beating". They disgust him for having issues and being weak and willing to get treated like shit. From what I see and what he says the submissive women have no clue what they are consenting to is to being beat up by someone who secretly despises them. Not knocking anyone for their kink but that's pretty f'd up. My opinion is if it feels like there's an ounce of hate in the dom, get the fuck out and don't expect a good relationship here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

quote:

ORIGINAL: onlyme32111


I myself aren't a huge fan of taking a weak person and making them weaker for my gain but first hand I know a master who beats women to satisfy his own hatred for them. He beats submissive women because he hates them for being weak and for being accepting of the "consensual beating". They disgust him for having issues and being weak and willing to get treated like shit. From what I see and what he says the submissive women have no clue what they are consenting to is to being beat up by someone who secretly despises them. Not knocking anyone for their kink but that's pretty f'd up. My opinion is if it feels like there's an ounce of hate in the dom, get the fuck out and don't expect a good relationship here.

... im supposing that people like this went from one abusing relationship to another.  now he has found a plethora of unwitting victims under the guise of Dominant he can fuel his abusive needs without any risk of the police knocking on his door. 

i took some excellent advice from someone once, cant remember when, that if you get talking to a guy who has major issues with his mother, bitches about his ex's and has no successful relationship with a female atall, you should avoid them like the plague.

interestingly enough, when i applied this generalisation to the 3 abusers in my life, it turned out to be very accurate.

i have met guys whove had issues with their mothers and little bells began to ring, but they were incredibly generous about their past lovers and turned out ok.  maybe its a litmus test we should try to apply.

and fizzgig, thanks - x

quote:

ORIGINAL: onlyme32111


I myself aren't a huge fan of taking a weak person and making them weaker for my gain but first hand I know a master who beats women to satisfy his own hatred for them. He beats submissive women because he hates them for being weak and for being accepting of the "consensual beating". They disgust him for having issues and being weak and willing to get treated like shit. From what I see and what he says the submissive women have no clue what they are consenting to is to being beat up by someone who secretly despises them. Not knocking anyone for their kink but that's pretty f'd up. My opinion is if it feels like there's an ounce of hate in the dom, get the fuck out and don't expect a good relationship here.

quote:

So the question becomes: is a man who habitually brings pain to a woman more likely or less likely to engage in spousal abuse?

quote:

ORIGINAL: SensibleSam

So the question becomes: is a man who habitually brings pain to a woman more likely or less likely to engage in spousal abuse?  It could be that a BDSM Dom has become desensitized to striking a woman and is therefore more likely to escalate from and erotic beating to "beating up" the woman. Or it could be that BDSM men because they have experience with beating women are less likely to blow up and put her in the hospital. Or finally it could be that there is no connection whatsoever.

quote:

ORIGINAL: onlyme32111

I myself aren't a huge fan of taking a weak person and making them weaker for my gain but first hand I know a master who beats women to satisfy his own hatred for them. He beats submissive women because he hates them for being weak and for being accepting of the "consensual beating". They disgust him for having issues and being weak and willing to get treated like shit. From what I see and what he says the submissive women have no clue what they are consenting to is to being beat up by someone who secretly despises them. Not knocking anyone for their kink but that's pretty f'd up. My opinion is if it feels like there's an ounce of hate in the dom, get the fuck out and don't expect a good relationship here.

quote:

i took some excellent advice from someone once, cant remember when, that if you get talking to a guy who has major issues with his mother, bitches about his ex's and has no successful relationship with a female atall, you should avoid them like the plague.

quote:

ORIGINAL: hellosmoooo

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

quote:

ORIGINAL: onlyme32111


I myself aren't a huge fan of taking a weak person and making them weaker for my gain but first hand I know a master who beats women to satisfy his own hatred for them. He beats submissive women because he hates them for being weak and for being accepting of the "consensual beating". They disgust him for having issues and being weak and willing to get treated like shit. From what I see and what he says the submissive women have no clue what they are consenting to is to being beat up by someone who secretly despises them. Not knocking anyone for their kink but that's pretty f'd up. My opinion is if it feels like there's an ounce of hate in the dom, get the fuck out and don't expect a good relationship here.

... im supposing that people like this went from one abusing relationship to another.  now he has found a plethora of unwitting victims under the guise of Dominant he can fuel his abusive needs without any risk of the police knocking on his door. 

i took some excellent advice from someone once, cant remember when, that if you get talking to a guy who has major issues with his mother, bitches about his ex's and has no successful relationship with a female atall, you should avoid them like the plague.

interestingly enough, when i applied this generalisation to the 3 abusers in my life, it turned out to be very accurate.

i have met guys whove had issues with their mothers and little bells began to ring, but they were incredibly generous about their past lovers and turned out ok.  maybe its a litmus test we should try to apply.

and fizzgig, thanks - x

If we can just clear something up about an abuser being out of control. Personally I think it will all boil down to the person. My abuser was very much controlled in his abuse and manipulation of me. The typical profile of an abuser is a person who is a controlling person. Where there is control, there is abuse. If you are married to a man who is an abuser, it is more like a father/daughter relationship rather than a relationship of equality and respect. Nothing will kill love and passion faster in a relationship then being married to someone who insists on being "one-up" or being in the father role. Who wants to go to bed with their father. Abuse is about power and control. Just my two cents.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SensibleSam


A BDSM Dominant man is one who spanks, canes or whips a woman for pleasure. He is likely to also enjoy slapping her and any number of other practices that cause pain.

A wife beater is a man who on occassion beats up his wife or female companion usually while in a drunken rage.

There are many difference between a BDSM beating and a wife abuse beating. First of all the woman (submissive) in a BDSM beating consents to it and enjoys it while the victim of spousal abuse doesn't. In BDSM the woman often ends up with welts on her bottom whereas in abuse she has often been punched in the face.

So the question becomes: is a man who habitually brings pain to a woman more likely or less likely to engage in spousal abuse?  It could be that a BDSM Dom has become desensitized to striking a woman and is therefore more likely to escalate from and erotic beating to "beating up" the woman. Or it could be that BDSM men because they have experience with beating women are less likely to blow up and put her in the hospital. Or finally it could be that there is no connection whatsoever.