RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (Full Version)

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mistoferin -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 8:11:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: missturbation quote: CreativeDominantWhile I DID share some of my inner thoughts, I am aware that I did not defend softness" position. I also feel that, while I disagreed with her, I disagreed in a direct but non-posturing manner...as did many others. Interesting that you would choose to put yourself in the category that postured and behaved like children. I personally didn't have you in the category, i know you better than that. Huh? Just because he didn't defend her while sharing his opinion that means he postured and behaved like a child?

DesFIP -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 8:25:56 AM)
I think my major problem with the op is the way she challenges everyone. It reads as though she believes that she is the only one who is truly honest with herself and everyone else lives in an ivory tower. That's a slam to everyone else on the board. It is posturing when she implies that she is capable of brutal honesty and no one else is. She's gotten a lot of negative responses simply because of the fact that she put herself up in opposition to everyone else. Had she written it in a more positive, less accusatory manner she would not have gotten slammed in return. Personally, whenever someone uses the term brutal honesty what I think of is that they are planning to be unnecessarily hurtful and claim that it is honesty in order not to called to account for being hurtful. I see no reason why the op couldn't have been written otherwise. Such as 'I've been doing a lot of thinking and changing since my last relationship ended and these are some things that I now know'. Doing it in such a way wouldn't have been as challenging and probably would have garnered her equal honesty in response instead of people responding to her aggressive attitude with aggression of their own.

missturbation -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 8:49:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin quote: ORIGINAL: missturbation quote: CreativeDominantWhile I DID share some of my inner thoughts, I am aware that I did not defend softness" position. I also feel that, while I disagreed with her, I disagreed in a direct but non-posturing manner...as did many others. Interesting that you would choose to put yourself in the category that postured and behaved like children. I personally didn't have you in the category, i know you better than that. Huh? Just because he didn't defend her while sharing his opinion that means he postured and behaved like a child? Read what you have quoted from me again. Where did i say he was in that category? I said he had put himself in that category. I as i said but shall repeat again had him in a different category.

mistoferin -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 8:54:10 AM)
What was it that he said that gave you the impression that he was choosing to put himself in that category because I just didn't see it?

missturbation -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:05:24 AM)
quote: While I DID share some of my inner thoughts, I am aware that I did not defend softness" position. I also feel that, while I disagreed with her, I disagreed in a direct but non-posturing manner...as did many others. Just because we disagree with her viewpoint, it doesn't suddenly make OUR honesty and perspective and thoughts posturing...does it? Nor does it make us wrong. He actually puts himself in every category to a certain degree. His constant referrals to posturing though to me appear like he thinks i put him in this category. Now yes you may not see it, read it like that but thats just life. At the end of the day many have read softs original op as snobbish, immature, posturing etc etc when i KNOW pretty much that a lot of what she said was ironic and a poking of fun at herself, noone else. I also know who i saw as being insulting, posturing etc and i posted about it. Unfortunately as i said those who it was not directed at chose to take it as a personal insult.

MadRabbit -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:12:25 AM)
Aww, yes! Genius! Creating a vague statement, insulting an unnamed general group of people in this thread, leaving those of us to read it, who can possibly draw similarities between our posts and your depiction, to guess as to whether or not it was directed at us, so that when we step forward and post to clear up any miscommunication or differences, you can brilliantly expose us as the real perpetrators via the evidence of self incrimination! All those who have exposed "alcoholics" via the evidence of "denial" would be proud.

mistoferin -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:14:03 AM)
I still don't see it....but then again, as I said before, I am not coming at this from the same perspective as you so I can view it without any real emotion because I am not "attached" to soft by friendship in the same way as you. Her original post may have indeed been poking fun at herself....and you being her friend have a window to view that through that the rest of us are not privy to. To many who have read it that don't have the benefit of that window, her OP did read as aggressive, snobbish, immature and posturing. As you can not see that angle from your perspective, you will just have to take their word that their opinion of how it sounded to them is equally honest from their angle.

WhiplashSmile2 -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:15:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: colouredin I cant help but think sometimes the drama takes over, I actually thought this was a really good OP and its a shame its turned into a he said she said thing it almost belitles the initial concept which I thought was a good one. I also agree with the irony that was mentioned a few pages back there is posturing on here in various forms and guises. Yeah, but it's bit like TNT "More Drama, All the time" or whatever the slogan is. Posturing can be fun it's kind of like fighting for who is in line before who. Kinda like watching Food fights happening during high school lunch time. Just we have submissive Cheese Sticks and Domly Corn Dogs in the volley going on here. The kind of Drama that makes nipples hard and dicks stand on end. OK, now that everybody is all worked up, can we do away with the clothes and get down to some business now. hahahaha

missturbation -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:21:23 AM)
Shit, you caught me! Get a grip sweetheart. It really isn't my problem if you CHOSE to believe my comments were aimed at you. I never said those who had questioned me on my statement were guilty of anything. In fact i have stated over and over i didn't see CD in such a light. I didn't state that about you as yeah i had issues with some of the stuff you said. However when i posted my original comments you were not even in my mind. Ego much! Get over yourself. My comments since the discussion i had with you were not made with you in mind. I have not exposed you as anything as far as i am concerned except maybe a little paranoid!

missturbation -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:29:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin I still don't see it....but then again, as I said before, I am not coming at this from the same perspective as you so I can view it without any real emotion because I am not "attached" to soft by friendship in the same way as you. Her original post may have indeed been poking fun at herself....and you being her friend have a window to view that through that the rest of us are not privy to. To many who have read it that don't have the benefit of that window, her OP did read as aggressive, snobbish, immature and posturing. As you can not see that angle from your perspective, you will just have to take their word that their opinion of how it sounded to them is equally honest from their angle. I totally agree. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of a person based on their knowledge of that person. I don't see what many have seen here when i read the opening post of this thread and you don't see what i have seen in other posters comments. I usually don't comment on insults that fly around here because i don't know if they are justified or not. However in this case i know they are not, i know soft in real life as you say and most of what has been said is way off base. Soft and i are the first to tell each other when we are being arses or out of line so believe me the comments which have been justified i would stay well away from. I just think it is a huge shame that was had the essence of being a really good thread was destroyed by insulting comments. Oh and yes before anyone says it i am just as guilty of derailing this thread as the next person.

colouredin -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:41:22 AM)
When posting on a public internet forum you do so with the expectation that most people dont know you, also if you are a member of the human race you know that differant people see things differantly, if people were personally attacking softness then she should ignore it anyways knowing that those people dont know her and are not her friends, if people disagreed with the post claimed that the post was immature that isnt a personal attack thats a view on the post itself something which we have to expect to be attacked every now and again either due to a differance of opinon or simple ignorance. Standing up for someone simply because you know them isnt a convincing argument really and doesnt have much basis on the OP. The op was well written and really funny and true that should be enough of an argument rather than bringing other crap into it.

missturbation -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:48:12 AM)
Yawnz but ok i'll respond. quote: When posting on a public internet forum you do so with the expectation that most people dont know you, also if you are a member of the human race you know that differant people see things differantly, Agreed. It's a good thing, it means we can debate the differences of opinion, view etc. quote: Standing up for someone simply because you know them isnt a convincing argument really and doesnt have much basis on the OP. Not on the central theme of coming down from your ivory tower no it doesn't. On the views of softness as a person i think it does. quote: The op was well written and really funny and true that should be enough of an argument rather than bringing other crap into it. Agreed, however i won't stand by and watch a friend of mine be insulted where those insults are not justified.

RCdc -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 9:59:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin I still don't see it....but then again, as I said before, I am not coming at this from the same perspective as you so I can view it without any real emotion because I am not "attached" to soft by friendship in the same way as you. Her original post may have indeed been poking fun at herself....and you being her friend have a window to view that through that the rest of us are not privy to. To many who have read it that don't have the benefit of that window, her OP did read as aggressive, snobbish, immature and posturing. As you can not see that angle from your perspective, you will just have to take their word that their opinion of how it sounded to them is equally honest from their angle. Hey erin(and everyone else) I really don't believe that this has anything to do with friendships, but rather a cultural difference. All the people who have read the post - the majority that are not british, didn't get the humour and irony that only the english do - and at that those north of the boarder do really well. So those 'many' that see it as insert here are many only because the states are in the majority here on CM. Now, you know me erin - I don't back people up because they are my 'friends' but because I agree with a concept. I just urge people to realise that what may be seen as posturing, or belittling or snobbish or aggressive etc - just remember that there is a huge cultural difference here. It's generalisations sure, but those from the states do have a harder time laughing at themselves than the brits - which we do fucking rock at. It's generalistic - but it is true to an extent. Don't look at this thread as an attempt to come across as better. In fact, it's completely the opposite. the.dark.

softness -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 10:11:19 AM)
Right ... chill it people. I was not making a personal attack on anyone/ the universe of BDSM ... I was making a point about people being honest with themselves. I can be/am honest with myself .. (I can be honest and say that sometimes I should know better than to write using sarcasm, or irony and should avoid using my usual fairly flippant humour - its not always spotted by Non-EU residents) I genuinely wondered whether other people were in the habit of being this honest with themselves, even when that honesty admits to uncomfortable truths and less than pearly white motivation, and posed that as a question to the boards. Those of you who are pointing out all of my faults. You are of course welcome to your opinion and I will take all such criticism to heart in the manner that I always do when kind and constructive advice is offered to me on these boards. I would also ask, did you actually answer my question - childish, immature, defensive and posturing as it was? Tthis is of course a rhetorical question .. as I rather hoping this monsterour shambles of a thread will die now as any positive posting or discussion has been lost in a swamp of squabbles. What has preceeded is a bun fight of titanic proportions.

DesFIP -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 12:08:17 PM)
If it was meant as sarcasm/humor, then it didn't translate. I find humor almost never does translate that well to a text only medium. Which is why emoticons are such a useful tool.

IvyMorgan -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 2:15:49 PM)
I'm glad I'm not the only one who can't pull off sarcasm. But, really, I don't normally create this much mess. props to Soft

colouredin -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 2:17:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP If it was meant as sarcasm/humor, then it didn't translate. I find humor almost never does translate that well to a text only medium. Which is why emoticons are such a useful tool. I thought it translated really well and Sir was full on laughing when he read it, so it must translate to some and not others

CookieSlave -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 4:14:20 PM)
What a mess. Part of the problem for me was that in reading the OP it came off, to me, as self-centered. I mean this in the sense that I would've received it better if it were on a personal journal, but on a public post it sounds too me-my-I which, I suspect, is why people are hearing attitude that may or may not be there. I do get the purpose though, really, I just think it got lost in the shuffle. I tend to be quite introspective - I toss things around, analyze me, figure out what makes me tick and why, and how to fix or change this or that, or make something better or different. So, yeah, in response to the OP I am very honest with myself, but that doesn't mean I'm apt to spell it all out for anyone else. I figure, I am who I am and I feel like I'm constantly in flux, and you either deal with me or you don't. Something like that... --cs

OneMoreWaste -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 5:13:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark I really don't believe that this has anything to do with friendships, but rather a cultural difference. All the people who have read the post - the majority that are not british, didn't get the humour and irony that only the english do - and at that those north of the boarder do really well. Ah, so now we have someone in the Ivory Tower of England claiming that us stoopid 'mericuns cannot follow the One True Way of humour and irony! (I've lost track of all the bickering and relevant quotes, but I'd give 2 to 1 odds that whatever is being referred to as "irony" is not, in fact, irony, but either coincidence, hypocrisy, or case-in-point).

OneMoreWaste -> RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods (10/13/2008 5:15:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP Personally, whenever someone uses the term brutal honesty what I think of is that they are planning to be unnecessarily hurtful and claim that it is honesty in order not to called to account for being hurtful. Isn't it odd how often "brutal honesty" gets mistaken for lack of tact, lack of consideration, and/or lack of manners? Downright sad, I tells ya' [&o]

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