Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Who Should Pay??


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> RE: Who Should Pay?? Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 4:44:28 PM   
Wickad


Posts: 428
Joined: 3/12/2005
Status: offline 		(fast reply)

Hmmm,

I generally lothe to go into details about my personal life but ... it seems in this case it is somewhat relevant.

I am a Dominant woman (for those new to this site - lol) and my life partner is a Dominant man.  We live a pretty vanilla sorta life.  We are both looking to express our Dominance/Sadism/etc with other folks and thus have an open play relationship.

Shortly after we got together I injured my back.  I am still not sure what is the real problem (it's been about 5 yrs) but my latest group of Dr's assure me that something will be done.  I'm on a waiting list for physio.  Maybe surgery will follow if the surgeon ever gets back to us.  Because of this, and other lifetime medical issues that are not as important to this conversation, I am unable to work full time.  I used to work part-time and collect a disability pension but we changed provinces almost 2 yrs ago and our new province does not provide such a pension.

What does this have to do with 'Who pays?' 

In our relationship, because of the above reasons, he pays.  He pays for everything.  Everything is in his name (another long story).  We do not have a joint account (same long story).  I stay home and try to make myself useful.  I 'freakin' hate it.  It is a constant source of contention between us.  Even though he would never 'not give' me money, he sometimes wants to know what I'm using it for.  ... and I have to ask for it.  The very act of my 'suplicating' myself so that I could go get my hair cut drives me around the bend.  His wanting to know 'why' I need $20, though a reasonable question, also drives me around the bend.

For reasons I choose not to disclose here, this is the way our life has to be for the next little while.  The imbalance in power that exists because of the imbalance in incomes pervades every part of our life.  I find myself feeling out of control, even though I am doing everything possible to regain my health and thus autonomy.  I do not feel sexual and thus our sex life has suffered.  On some strange level it seems that is the only place I have any control left so I use it against both of us in an attempt to feel the power I've lost.  Hell, sometimes I say 'No' even when I'm horny as hell.  Yes, yes, it makes no sense.  I know! 

All in all the point I'm trying to make is that money does make a difference.  Who pays makes a difference.  Money (no matter how we rail against it) is power. 

Wickad

(in reply to Venatrix)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 4:50:01 PM   
Venatrix


Posts: 2238
Joined: 11/28/2007
Status: offline 		And that is exactly why I would never wind up in a relationship with a dominant man.  I need a relationship based on the assumption that I have a preponderant amount of the control.  I can quite truthfully say that, in all the years I was married, and ours wasn't a kinky relationship, that I never felt that I wasn't in control because he worked and I didn't.  I simply handed him the AmEx bill at the end of the month and that was that, no questions asked.  So, money might be power in some relationships, but not in others.  Hmmm.  I must have been a financial domme and never even realised it .

(in reply to Wickad)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 6:07:49 PM   
HunterS


Posts: 553
Joined: 10/21/2008
Status: offline
quote:


That's a real question, by the way.  I really am interested to hear how you justify a guest coming over, partaking of hospitality and not thanking the host/ess.  If it isn't excusable in vanilla life, it shouldn't be excusable in kinky life.


My point was that courtesy/gratitude is a two way street.
That he might take a more pro-active role in both preparation and clean up does not seem an unreasonable request.  To thank you for your time and expertese should of course be responded to in kind..."you were a very cooperative victim and  the new areas we explored attest to.....blah blah blah. 
This thing that we do is not like buying a book on football and learning how to play the game....it is individual for each of us and that any of us actually "hook up" defies the odds and speaks volumes about the people who suceed in spite of the obstacles we face.

H.

< Message edited by HunterS -- 10/31/2008 7:05:12 PM >

(in reply to Venatrix)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 6:20:00 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline 		This thing that we do is not like buying a book on football and learning how to play the game....it is individual for each of us and that any of us actually "hook up" defies the odds and speaks volumes about the people who suceed in spite of the obsticals we face.
 
I don't know, H.  I must admit to having a strong feeling that I've over-theorised a lot of matters recently.  This "who should pay" question is a case in point, for me, at least.  I have a feeling that in a lot of cases, people will meet, pick up the signals from each other, and just work out a mutually satisfactory conclusion with very little friction.  Perhaps without even very many words.



_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to HunterS)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 7:02:12 PM   
Venatrix


Posts: 2238
Joined: 11/28/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HunterS

quote:


That's a real question, by the way.  I really am interested to hear how you justify a guest coming over, partaking of hospitality and not thanking the host/ess.  If it isn't excusable in vanilla life, it shouldn't be excusable in kinky life.


My point was that courtesy/gratitude is a two way street.
That he might take a more pro-active role in both preparation and clean up does not seem an unreasonable request.  To thank you for your time and expertese should of course be responded to in kind..."you were a very cooperative victim and  the new areas we explored attest to.....blah blah blah. 
This thing that we do is not like buying a book on football and learning how to play the game....it is individual for each of us and that any of us actually "hook up" defies the odds and speaks volumes about the people who suceed in spite of the obsticals we face.

H.



And had the man in question bothered to show good manners, I would have responded in kind.  As it stands, my response is to ignore the emails that I get from him asking if he can see me.

(in reply to HunterS)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 7:10:31 PM   
HunterS


Posts: 553
Joined: 10/21/2008
Status: offline
quote:


And had the man in question bothered to show good manners, I would have responded in kind.  As it stands, my response is to ignore the emails that I get from him asking if he can see me.


I think that is a reasonable and prudent course to follow.  It is probably too late to aquaint him with his shortcommings.

H.

(in reply to Venatrix)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 7:17:17 PM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Money can be power in a sense that we all need money, but any man and I do mean any man that thinks my dominance comes or goes with money and is determined by money, isn't a man in my life.  I wouldn't care if it made me homeless because I had no money and was dependent upon him for some reason.  I will not be treated like I am less for any other reason than I might be less and money has nothing to do with that.

I pay, they pay... no one gains a damn thing in my opinion and no one is owed anything.  Anyone determining how they feel or what they do by money... isn't someone I would have anything in common with.  Just by the way they look at things.

I have been ill and broken and broke!  I have had one try to treat me badly because I lost my income and I supported the son of a ..... and made more money than he did to start with... he didn't last long and I did make myself homeless.  Nothing worse than being hurt and broke and having some attitude from someone.  If he doesn't care enough to support in a crisis... he isn't worth much.  I would never bail on someone in a crisis.  I shouldn't be bailed on either.

As for who pays... aren't relationships hard enough... why do we need extra baggage?  If it is an issue... what is it the young folks say... see ya, wouldn't want to be ya...

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!


(in reply to Venatrix)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 10/31/2008 7:20:16 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline 		What Lockit said.

_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to Venatrix)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 12:07:38 AM   
FullfigRIMaam


Posts: 718
Joined: 6/21/2007
Status: offline
quote:

For reasons I choose not to disclose here, this is the way our life has to be for the next little while.  The imbalance in power that exists because of the imbalance in incomes pervades every part of our life.  I find myself feeling out of control, even though I am doing everything possible to regain my health and thus autonomy.  I do not feel sexual and thus our sex life has suffered.  On some strange level it seems that is the only place I have any control left so I use it against both of us in an attempt to feel the power I've lost.  Hell, sometimes I say 'No' even when I'm horny as hell.  Yes, yes, it makes no sense.  I know! 

All in all the point I'm trying to make is that money does make a difference.  Who pays makes a difference.  Money (no matter how we rail against it) is power. 

Wickad
I'm sorry about this situation of yours.   I know that I don't tend to want to have sex with a partner I resent, but I suppose if I were going to stay in a situation, I would learn to live with it, and at the very least, have sex when I'm horny.  Besides, it's my experience that men tend to be in better moods and more generous when you  are bad in bed.
I would hope not to end up in this situation only because I like a generous man from the start.  Don't get me wrong, I don't require that someone have any money, but I expect him to do his best and be generous with what he has, even if it's just attention.
I would never humiliate someone because he has less money, and I would expect no less than full support if I'm in financial straits.  Having to explain to my lover why I need $20 as long as he knows I don't do drugs, would be unacceptable to me...  I can however only say this because I've never been in your situation, so please, take that with a grain of salt.    M

_____________________________

"touching was and still is and will always be the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni
"Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence." Erich Fromm

(in reply to Wickad)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 8:59:45 AM   
Venatrix


Posts: 2238
Joined: 11/28/2007
Status: offline 		Good points, M.  In all honesty, I'm attracted to professional men, and they typically have adequate resources, so money tends not to be much of an issue one way or the other.  I would NEVER be with someone I didn't like simply because he had money, but it's unlikely I'd date someone who made a career of working at McDonald's.  I'm also used to men I'm in a committed relationship with voluntarily sharing their resources, because they know me well enough that I would never abuse the trust.  If I had to go cap-in-hand for $20 for lunch, I'd rather live alone and support myself, which is exactly what I'm doing right now.

(in reply to FullfigRIMaam)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 9:15:51 AM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		The thing is that when you are injured or ill, you cannot simply go out and support yourself and may be dependent upon someone else, especially if you are married because other resources may not be avilable to you.  I can understand that money might be tight and someone might be stressed about money and ask where the money is going, but in general you would know if the asking was coming from a resentful or controlling place.  If it is, that relationship will be worn down to the nubs and all respect will be forefit as the ill or injured loses respect and love for the person in resentment for being treated poorly.

I find it interesting how many forget the vow's they took when crisis is at hand and one is weak... and wonder what happened to honor and eithics.

When stuck dependent upon a situation or person who is treating you poorly... you need to secure yourself and get informed.  Because quite often one or the other won't last long in this type of relationship and things will escalate and if one is smart, they are ready.  There are things one can do.  What bothered me is how many would not prepare thinking it would never happen to them and then a year later holding their hand and trying to undo the mess we now had, now that it was too late to do much at all.  Now, that was devistation!

If someone is willing to rob you of digity in an hour of need, they will rob you of far more, for your person has been disrespected in a sense and that means more than anything else.  If they can kick you when you are down... you expect them to lift you in some way?  lol  I wouldn't want to watch a movie with such a person and far less would be willing to kiss their lips after they asked me to kiss their ass!

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!


(in reply to Venatrix)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 11:35:00 AM   
beeble


Posts: 799
Joined: 5/25/2005
From: UK
Status: offline 		*sigh*  Perhaps the people who feel that it's the man's job to pay should consider that, traditionally, this was the case because it was the woman's job to stay at home all day doing housework.  It was the man's job to pay because the woman had no money.  It's frankly unreasonable for anyone who can afford to pay for him or herself to expect the other person to always pay.

If the sub wants to pay as a gift to his Mistress, go ahead.  If the Domme wants to pay as part of her being in charge, go ahead.  If she buys all the kinky toys and fetish clothes and he pays for all the meals out, fair enough.  But to make out that the guy has some sort of moral obligation to pay for dinner is just old-fashioned, obnoxious sexism.

(in reply to Lockit)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 12:04:35 PM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: beeble

*sigh*  Perhaps the people who feel that it's the man's job to pay should consider that, traditionally, this was the case because it was the woman's job to stay at home all day doing housework.  It was the man's job to pay because the woman had no money.  It's frankly unreasonable for anyone who can afford to pay for him or herself to expect the other person to always pay.

If the sub wants to pay as a gift to his Mistress, go ahead.  If the Domme wants to pay as part of her being in charge, go ahead.  If she buys all the kinky toys and fetish clothes and he pays for all the meals out, fair enough.  But to make out that the guy has some sort of moral obligation to pay for dinner is just old-fashioned, obnoxious sexism.



Nice... very well said!

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!


(in reply to beeble)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 1:10:28 PM   
Venatrix


Posts: 2238
Joined: 11/28/2007
Status: offline 		Yes, absolutely that makes sense.  My ex-husband came home to a clean house and a home-made gourmet meal every day.  The division of labour worked well for us, because I enjoy being at home, which I think of as my sanctuary, and I love to cook.  He loved to be a doctor.  So, until other things intervened in our lives, we were quite happy with the arrangement.

(in reply to beeble)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 4:00:08 PM   
FullfigRIMaam


Posts: 718
Joined: 6/21/2007
Status: offline
quote:

It's frankly unreasonable for anyone who can afford to pay for him or herself to expect the other person to always pay.
You are right beeble, it is unreasonable and yet, if he has the resources and can afford it, I still expect him to pay.   I'll pay for other things that I enjoy seeing on him usually, but not dinner or drinks, unless I'm taking him out for his birthday.

quote:

But to make out that the guy has some sort of moral obligation to pay for dinner is just old-fashioned, obnoxious sexism.
I don't think it's his moral obligation at all.  It's just one way for a man to show he will do what he needs to do to be with me.   As has been stated elsewhere, it is a choice that perhaps means I'm not compatible with men who want fair and equal treatment, and a sacrifice I'm willing to make.   M

_____________________________

"touching was and still is and will always be the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni
"Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence." Erich Fromm

(in reply to beeble)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/1/2008 4:03:53 PM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline
quote:

I was raised to believe that if a gentlemen took a lady out that it was his responsibility to pickup the tab.


I was raised to believe that, too, and I don't believe it has changed. What I believe is that, who ever asks, is the 'host', and pays. This is how I operate with friends, as well. When eating out with a friend that I enjoy lunch or such with regularly, I expect us to take turns paying, with the one paying chosing where we go.

I do not expect a man to ask me out, chose the resteraunt, which I may not even care for, and expect me to pay for my own bill. It may be true that men ask more for first dates - but i've never been shy about asking, and if it progresses, then there should be a balance in who is paying this time that works out, until such time as you are close enough to budget together, rather you actually mesh money or not, and make such decisions based on what works financially for your household.

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote

(in reply to dragon2760)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/3/2008 4:12:45 PM   
Wickad


Posts: 428
Joined: 3/12/2005
Status: offline 		Greetings,

I feel that somewhere along the way I may have misrepresented my situation.  For this I am very sorry.

I never meant to imply that my partner holds money (and control of that money) over my head.  He has never denied me anything.

The problem I have (and it is my problem) is that I have no direct control over our finances and thus feel that I have no control over my life.  I have no income.  I have no spending money to speak of.  I have no access to the account that has all the money unless I specifically ask (and he has never denied me access).  I am used to making my own money.  I am used to finding something I want or need, doing the mental math as to affordability, and then acting on that decision.  This is not how things work any more and I rail at the loss of that control.

My partner is a very average guy.  It doesn't usually (though it has on occassion) occur to him that I might need spending money as I rarely go anywhere without him.  He doesn't understand that when I need a hair cut it is humiliating for me to have to ask him for the money to go and get one.  He just sees it in a very practical light and doesn't really recognize all the underlying, assumptive, historically connotative stuff that goes with it.

The point I was trying to make overall was that money does make a difference.  I have heard many women on this board, and in real life, talk about how it would not bother them if their partner worked and they stayed home.  I believe (rightly or wrongly??) that if your partner works and you don't, yet you retain control of the bank accounts and finances, that this type of D/s dynamic could work.  However, if you stay home and your partner works and has full control over the finances, no matter how generous or giving he is ... I feel that it will effect how you see yourself and your Dominant nature.  Prior to my injury I would never have believed this as I always saw myself as "I am who I am - money or not" but I have come to realize with this situation that money, and control of money, is very important.

Of course you are free to disagree and your experiences may be different.

Wickad

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/3/2008 7:19:30 PM   
HunterS


Posts: 553
Joined: 10/21/2008
Status: offline 		Perhaps you should suggest to your husband (in the same terms you have stated here) that you should have a checking account or a credit card in your name for those times you need money and he is not convenient.
Should he die you would be hard pressed to reconstruct your credit from when you were working.  So having active accounts now while you are not working is just common sense economics.  No you are not a child in need of an "allowence"  you are an adult partner in a marriage...equal partner.
 
Hunter

(in reply to Wickad)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/3/2008 10:12:10 PM   
Wickad


Posts: 428
Joined: 3/12/2005
Status: offline 		HunterS,

Thank you for your thoughts.  Due to circumstances this is not possible at this time. 

Sometimes people have to do things they don't particularly like in order to get to a better place.  I know this rationally but ... it is a hard pill to swallow.  I was not trying to come off as bitching about my situation.  I know the pros and cons of the way my life is currently organized and I accept them.  I was only trying to use my lose of autonomy as an example of how money (or lack of money) effects how I feel about myself and my dominance.

Wickad

(in reply to HunterS)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Who Should Pay?? - 11/3/2008 11:37:29 PM   
MissAllyKat


Posts: 7
Joined: 9/2/2008
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		I have read a few blogs and posts on here where male subs have lamented about being taken advantage of. I would never want someone to feel I was taking advantage of their generous or chivalrous nature. I personally love being taken care of, being spoiled with dinners out, and being spoiled with special treats purchased solely on my behalf. I am not a food snob, and I am just as happy with a steak from Logan's or Outback or Publix/Kroger's as I would be from Morton's or Ruth Chris (which are way overpriced IMHO).

Despite all that, I would never want someone to continuously pay for things if it were going to cause them problems financially, especially when there are children involved. Kudos for having your priorities in order dragon. So many people can't seem to figure that out.

As a former child of a single dad (my mom passed away when I was 8), I know exactly how it feels to not be able to participate in things at school or go to the movies/skate rink/etc. with friends, because dad says he doesn't have the money. I was repeatedly told I couldn't have 5 or 10 dollars for the weekend. I didn't even receive an allowance despite having to do more than my fair share of the housework, which is probably why I stopped doing it in my teens. Yet my dad was one to go on trips to Mexico and cruises several times a year. Not to mention all the times I was shoved off onto my grandmother or pressed to go stay the night with friends so he could bring a woman back to the house. (oops I didn't mean for this to turn into a daddy rant)

On the other side of the fence, I would be quite annoyed with a sub who thought I should pay every time for the both of us. I have no desire to be anybody's sugar mama.  I also would have an issue with someone who was cheap and pinched pennies to the extreme. Being frugal is a positive quality, using coupons and trying to save money when possible shows responsibility. There is a line there that is hard to define, but I think that a prudent person would know where it lies.

I guess what is most important to me is that my sub would not feel that he is being taken advantage of. A quiet evening...well not so quiet given my sadistic streak *evil grins*...with pizza or a simple homemade dinner can be just as wonderful as going out. I actually don't mind cooking, I even enjoy it, as long as the sub does the clean-up. As the saying goes "No man was ever shot while doing dishes" but he might get a good caning afterward. *giggles sadistically*

on a side note I am not a female supremacist and I enjoy doing domestic stuff but it is so nice when you don't have to.




_____________________________

tootles,

Miss Ally Kat

____________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea." ~Robert Heinlein

(in reply to dragon2760)
Profile   Post #: 100
Page:   <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> RE: Who Should Pay?? Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094