Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (Full Version)

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MadRabbit -> Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:04:13 PM)

A poll conducted by AP-Yahoo suggested that Obama's support would be 6% higher if it wasn't for white racism. I have been hearing quite a lot about this in the mainstream news, with protest and outrage in response to this horrible racism.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/mitchell/2008/09/apyahoo_news_poll_uncovers_whi.html

Don't get me wrong. I think it's pretty shitty that any candidate will lose support or votes solely because of the color of his skin. In fact, I hate it so much that I feel the need to expose the flip side of this issue as depicted in the Houston Chronicle, but not given much light or exposure in mainstream media.

"You have your story backwards!!!" wrote reader Barry Cottrell of Montgomery. "Over 90 percent of blacks are voting Obama mainly because he is black."
 
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/falkenberg/6056712.html

The Houston Chronicle speculates that 90 percent of black people are voting for Obama because he is black. This means that 90 percent of black people are not voting for McCain because he is white.

Now if you ask me, I would think that 90 percent, assuming this statistic is accurate, of a minority not voting for someone because of race would be a more outrageous issue then 6 percent of a majority not voting for someone because of race.

What do you think is worse?

A black president losing an election because he is black?

or

A black president winning an election because he is black?




Musicmystery -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:07:34 PM)

Or, is it worse that people believe whatever a commentator seeking listeners claims is truth, with no real data?




lronitulstahp -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:10:47 PM)

[sm=sucks.jpg]...nice post MM



MadRabbit -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:11:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Or, is it worse that people believe whatever a commentator seeking listeners claims is truth, with no real data?


quote:


Now if you ask me, I would think that 90 percent, assuming this statistic is accurate, of a minority not voting for someone because of race would be a more outrageous issue then 6 percent of a majority not voting for someone because of race.


I agree which is why I included that highlighted statement right there.

I would even say it's about as bad as people not fully reading posts before making their flippant comments.

However, unfortanely, this was the only article I could find that provided some basis for the point of my post.

For some crazy reason that I can't figure, nobody really seemed to care too much to ask whether or not black people were voting because of racism in comparison to asking whether white people were voting because of racism.

Edited to Add : But if you can provide the AP Yahoo Poll that focused on the issue of minority voters dening votes for John McCain based off of race, I would really appreciate it because I would love to have some solid data so people don't have to listen to solely commentators.



corysub -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:17:26 PM)

It's not racism when 90% of blacks are voting for Obama.  The blacks in this country have been bought and paid for by the democrats and that's just a fact of life.  I'm surprised it's not 95%!

Obama has enough negatives in his biography just really being vetted after two years of campaigning to suggest he is not qualified for the job.
It's going to be an interesting 21 days or whatever until the people get into the booth and vote.  That's the only poll that counts.

For example, Obama is quoted on the Keith Obermann show as saying his involvement with ACORN was 13 years ago....but he fails to mention that his campaign paid $800,000 to ACORN to support their voter registration programs.  Now Obama is blaming those poor street people that were given a cigarette or a few dollars to give a signature...and backpeddling from ACORN. 

I'm sorry, but I can agree to disagree with you all on political views...but find it diffiuclt to discuss views with people who are either stupid or too ideological in their point of view to conduct a constructive arguement.  Listing committees...gimme a break.. you should be able to do better than that!  Tell us what the hell this guy DID on these commitees..or just sit quietly in the corner and listen and learn from the big boys.  You offer nothing!....just as Obama offers nothing..but rhetoric.



TNstepsout -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:19:23 PM)

African Americans make up about 12% of the total population, so if 90% vote for Obama because he is black, you have 1% of the population voting for him.  Whites make up about 68% of the population, so if 6% won't vote for Obama because he is black, that is 4% of the population who won't vote for him because he is black. That's still 3 to 1. Besides, the quote states they are voting for him "mainly because he's black" is that a fact or an inference?



Musicmystery -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:22:31 PM)

Here's one today from NPR

Questioning the Bradley Effect




MadRabbit -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:22:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub

It's not racism when 90% of blacks are voting for Obama.  The blacks in this country have been bought and paid for by the democrats and that's just a fact of life.  I'm surprised it's not 95%!

Obama has enough negatives in his biography just really being vetted after two years of campaigning to suggest he is not qualified for the job.
It's going to be an interesting 21 days or whatever until the people get into the booth and vote.  That's the only poll that counts.

For example, Obama is quoted on the Keith Obermann show as saying his involvement with ACORN was 13 years ago....but he fails to mention that his campaign paid $800,000 to ACORN to support their voter registration programs.  Now Obama is blaming those poor street people that were given a cigarette or a few dollars to give a signature...and backpeddling from ACORN. 

I'm sorry, but I can agree to disagree with you all on political views...but find it diffiuclt to discuss views with people who are either stupid or too ideological in their point of view to conduct a constructive arguement.  Listing committees...gimme a break.. you should be able to do better than that!  Tell us what the hell this guy DID on these commitees..or just sit quietly in the corner and listen and learn from the big boys.  You offer nothing!....just as Obama offers nothing..but rhetoric.


What the fuck does that have to do with anything?

Okay...look....this isn't meant to start a political war. These are valid questions.

Is breaking the racial lines and getting a black president into office worth being done on the back of racism?

Can we really say that racial lines have broken if it is true that it was his skin color that won him the votes as opposed to his character, qualifications, and viewpoints on his issue?

If this is the reason for Obama's victory, has our country really taken a step forward or a step backward by a political battle that was fueled and based off race?




Musicmystery -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:24:08 PM)

Yes, cory is off on whatever.

But you are begging the question.



corysub -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:24:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TNstepsout

African Americans make up about 12% of the total population, so if 90% vote for Obama because he is black, you have 1% of the population voting for him.  Whites make up about 68% of the population, so if 6% won't vote for Obama because he is black, that is 4% of the population who won't vote for him because he is black. That's still 3 to 1. Besides, the quote states they are voting for him "mainly because he's black" is that a fact or an inference?



You have to be careful on your numbers.  It's not the percentage of population that matters, it's the percentage of the "number of people of any group that actually vote"!   A great percentage of the American voting age population does not vote..unfortunately.  However, if 90%  of black voters vote for Obama..(probably low), that would mean that 90% of those that were black voted for Obama..it has nothing to do with the census of blacks in the country.
It could very well mean that i'ts only 20%, 30% or 50% of total elegible black voters.



rexrgisformidoni -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:25:55 PM)

Everything here is a damn political war. 



MadRabbit -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:26:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TNstepsout

African Americans make up about 12% of the total population, so if 90% vote for Obama because he is black, you have 1% of the population voting for him.  Whites make up about 68% of the population, so if 6% won't vote for Obama because he is black, that is 4% of the population who won't vote for him because he is black. That's still 3 to 1. Besides, the quote states they are voting for him "mainly because he's black" is that a fact or an inference?



quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Here's one today from NPR

Questioning the Bradley Effect



All right, well thats cool.

Those are good points and I appreciate them.




Lucylastic -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:26:51 PM)

For me, its the same as hillary supporters  voting for her because she is a woman. Its never happened in the US before, its new, people want to stand behind the  candidate they can identify with on a personal level and that they think will be considerate for their cause.
And Palin will get a lot of votes just because she is a woman and lose many for the same reason.
I said many months ago that Dems if they lose this election is because of the black man/white woman ticket.  The racism and sexism is tooo rampant to be the same if it was two "good old white boys" on each ticket". Now we have Biden instead of Hillary, but Palin is on the other side, so there are still the Isms.

The haters are hatin...... racism & sexism works both ways




camille65 -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:28:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni

Everything here is a damn political war. 


Only with certain people.
Though I agree that it gets tiresome, there are some posters that I just skip over (til after the election anyway).



slvemike4u -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:30:31 PM)

Even assuming all the numbers are true and even if we are to ignore TNstepsout numbers(thanks for doing the math TN) do you really think blacks voting en mass for the first african american candidate to be in position for this country's highest office is earth shattering...Whites have been voting for a white candidate since the birth of the republic...we sort of take it for granted don't we?



rexrgisformidoni -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:35:26 PM)

I ask a young african american woman at the gas pump why she was voting for obama.
her response? "because he's black" I ask if she knew any of his positions or voting records.
I got told to shut up and that I was just a fucking white boy trying to pull "them" down.
how charming. and how shitty for our "republic"



MadRabbit -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:36:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Even assuming all the numbers are true and even if we are to ignore TNstepsout numbers(thanks for doing the math TN) do you really think blacks voting en mass for the first african american candidate to be in position for this country's highest office is earth shattering...Whites have been voting for a white candidate since the birth of the republic...we sort of take it for granted don't we?


Here we see the flawed logic you used in the "Palin Monkey" thread.

It's ok because black people do it.

It's ok because white people have done it over time.

Sorry if I find the thought of "breaching the racial barrier" with racism to be a little bit disturbing.

But hey...it's ok to be racist if it's against white people, right?




slvemike4u -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:46:20 PM)

Okay first off if we are going to discuss false logic we should start with what you are putting forth....identifying and voting for a member of ones own race is not racism...and never has been.Greeks voting in large numbers for Dukakis was not racism it was national identification...now if an Irishmen had declined to vote for Dukakis because he was Greek...that is racism.A black man voting for Obama solely on the color of his skin can be accused of identifying with Obama and celebrating him as one of his own....but it fails the test for racism,and the fact you can't see that is part of your problem,but you just keep looking for boogie men to blame your problems on.....



lronitulstahp -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:47:15 PM)

quote:

The blacks in this country have been bought and paid for by the democrats and that's just a fact of life.  I'm surprised it's not 95%!

  Are blacks still being bought and paid for????  Well i'll be damned!!!![sm=jaw.gif]

Actually, policy in most cases, has determined why a large percentage of Black people vote Democrat.  But just for argument's sake, as a black person who hasn't always voted Democrat, and has never been registered as a Democrat, i'm amazed by your grasp on what it's like being a Black person in America...amazing!!!! 

There seems to be some sort of "tone" that suggests that Black people are like uninformed sheep with no grasp on the social clime or matters of this country; as if some Carpetbagger reformists still fill out our ballots as we sing spirituals on the porches of our rundown shacks....  There have been some advances you know.  Please give people a little more credit, eh? 


~black, and red, white, and blue






dcnovice -> RE: Obama Wins Because of Racism?! (10/14/2008 5:53:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni

I ask a young african american woman at the gas pump why she was voting for obama.
her response? "because he's black" I ask if she knew any of his positions or voting records.
I got told to shut up and that I was just a fucking white boy trying to pull "them" down.
how charming. and how shitty for our "republic"



I'd be a bit wary of taking a single stranger as a spokesperson for millions of people.



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