RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (Full Version)

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scottjk -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 12:56:11 PM)

I've been reading all this (and subsequent and odd modifications or deletions of posts), and I do have an opinion to offer.

Over the years, visiting various sites involving kink lifestyle, the discussion of safety has often come up. I'm not the most eloquent writer, and I can't say I'm a perfect observer, but in discussing safety issues the phrase, "It only needs to happen once!" seems to come up almost all the time. There have been many people that throw a flag on that kind of thinking, trying to bring reason into the discussion but I've seen them shouted down by quite eloquent (and abusive) writers that seem to thrive of fear, doubt and uncertainty. Sure we can point out statistics all day long, and often do. The sad thing about statistics is that you can make them into what you want, rather than seeing it for what it is. Allow me to demonstrate.

  • Coin toss
    • The chances for one side or the other to come face up is one chance in two. That means that if you toss the coin one hundred times, there's a good chance it will come up heads fifty times, and tails fifty times.

  • Dice roll
    • The chances of rolling a two on a six-sided dice is one chance in six. That means if you roll the dice one hundred times, there's a good chance that you'll roll a two sixteen times.

  • Cards
    • The chances of pulling an ace of spades out of a deck of cards is one chance in fifty-two. That means if you try one hundred times, there's a good chance that you'll pull the ace of spades twice.

Do you see where I'm going with this? Statistics demonstrate the probable chances of an event happening during certain conditions that exists. The media just loves this stuff, because they're betting you're too ignorant to understand statistics. Let's look at auto accidents and fatalities. Let's say that of all auto accidents, 1,000 for instance, there are 200 deaths. So, what does that mean? 20% of those accidents were lethal? What were the factors that caused those accidents? Intoxication? Distractions? Weather conditions? How many cars involved? Two? Three? Seven? Of those involved, how many were trucks? Tractor-trailers? All of a sudden, those numbers don't mean very much, do they? That's why the media loves statistics. It can be news, when it really isn't. It's the same for those that write reports to continue funding for research. They massage the numbers so that they LOOK like what they need them to look like without actually lying. Also, let's face it, unless it's a human interest story, blood always sells in the media. Insurance companies love statistics too, so they can justify their premiums, and even better, they don't have to explain the numbers, just report them in a certain way.

Now we come to safety. Everything we do in life, even in front of the computer is riddled with some form of danger. How? Think about it. For every activity you do, ask yourself, "How can I be hurt doing this?", then ask yourself, "Why do I do it if I could get hurt some how." You'll often tell yourself that the benefits you receive from doing what you do outweighs the danger of being harmed.

So, here's my point after all this: It's acceptable to be safety minded, as long as you keep the benefits in mind! In what we do, there are far more stories of safe meetings than there are of unsafe meetings. If you feel you must avoid risks, remember what it will cost you in benefits.





candystripper -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 1:16:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OttersSwim

Candy, while I agree with you that we should not check our smarts and common sense at the door when dealing with new people and situations, I am wondering what caused this sudden "shouting down a well"?  Hoping all is well with you.


Hey, sweetie.  I forget that not everyone uses the same slang as I. 'Shouting down a well' is a slang term for talking to the folks who volunteer to be deaf, dumb and blind -- the willfuly ignornant.
 
My bad.
 
candystripper  [sm=pole.gif]




SteelofUtah -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 1:23:49 PM)

scottjk,

that was very well thought out and interesting post, I believe that I will be useing this analogy for quite some time to come.

Thank you for that.

Yes the truth of the matter is some people thrive on FEAR. As long as they can give themselves a valid reason NOT to do something they just won't. Then there are those who believe it is thier job to save the world from making mistakes and so they manufacture horror stories.

Prime Example HALLOWEEN...... Utah for the most part now does Trunk-or-Treat where businesses try to sell stuff to mom and dad while children are taught it is okay to take candy from strangers out of the trunks of cars (Yeah really good thinking) SO anyway the reason we do this is because Psychopaths are putting Razor Blades in Candy.

But as I did this year I called the poice department and then looked up online For the entire state of Utah in the last 5 years there has only been ONE case of Tampered Candy and it was not Poisoned or Razorbladed some Asshole was putting PORN in Candy Bar Wrappers. Dumbass

But ever year you hear about all the horrors of kids trick-or-treating and so fear becomes the motivator.

If you never live you will never learn.

Steel




stef -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 1:25:02 PM)

She didn't ask you to define the term, she asked what caused you to have this epiphany.

~stef




CarrieO -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 1:33:09 PM)

I'm curious to know your reason for posting this.
 
I've learned to accept the fact that not everyone has common sense or knows how to use it.  This is the internet and we really have no idea who we're talking to at first (or sometimes even after a first meeting) and the opportunity for being taken advantage of is there. But guess what...its everywhere. 
 
While I'm sure your intentions were good with this post....it, in my opinion, smacks as patronizing.  There will always be those that are "willfuly ignorant" but like telling a young un "don't touch that hot stove", some won't learn until they get burned. If you're too emotionally/mentally immature to be involved in bdsm or D/s, then burn you will.
 
The majority of those that post here understand that. My saying..."Live with the consequences of your choice and learn" affects every decision I make. Fear can hold you back, in your place, your comfort zone...to the point that you trust no one and are afraid to even open your front door. Or...you can face it, understand it, accept it (with a huge dose of common sense) and LIVE! 
 




candystripper -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 1:43:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: antipode

quote:

play party in someone’s home, whom you do not know, is NOT a safe thing to do


Duh. For as long as you can walk out, that would be safe. Taking your argument to its extremes, one should never meet new people, and hang out with them. For the young 'uns, this is how they learn, for the older folk, this may provide an acceptable level of excitement. Yes, there are risks, but then you get on an airplane with 300 other people, and if one of them is going to blow it up, you picked the wrong crowd.

What brought this on? I see, over the years, that the vast majority of folks at these sites are quite cautious, and mitigate their risk.



Most of the time I've spent dating off the 'net has been spent on CM.  Once upon a time, I had a mentor, a wonderful Dom who read all my email and who's 'permission' I needed before I met someone.  Despite his best efforts, believe me when I say, I have had more'n my share of weird-azz experiences.
 
It is not true *for me* that I need to meet a group of folks I don't know in order to express my sexuality.  It is not true for me -- and IMO, it is not true for anyone -- that I'd always be safe among a group of people I don't know, in some private home someplace around Cleveland.
 
Back in the day, I used to hitchhike a lot.  Everyone did.  I remember a few close calls.  But nothing like this story:
 
 The College Co-ed Who HitchHiked and Was Made a Real Slave
 
My point, Antipode, is that you *always* need to use your *street smarts*, but never more-so than when meeting up with strangers who've expressed a curiosity or interest in your sexuality.  If not, how else would *you* know when it's no longer safe to stay in someone's home?
 
I'm NOT saying we should never meet one another.  Just that we should try not to meet the seriously deranged, LOL.
 
Peace out.
 
candystripper  [sm=pole.gif]




candystripper -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 1:53:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

While certainly it's not a good idea to advocate unrestrained and untempered interaction with Internet people, I don't think listing worst case scenario incidents that make up a single digit percentage presents a level-headed and down to earth viewpoint of the dangers of misabused trust in the D/S world.




MadRabbit, I used serial killers as an example of a kind of risk we need to manage because so many movies etc. revolve around them.  However, I have no desire even to be seriously squorked out, never mind murdered, by anyone.
 
I meet someone after I have gained a *sense* of them.  Only then.  We all mange risk in different ways; folks have different risk/benefit thresholds. 
 
However, 'extreme dating' is not wise for any of us. I do not *get* why the men here seem to believe they are always going to be safe -- women commit crimes against persons too, yanno.
 
candystripper  [sm=pole.gif]
 
 




candystripper -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 2:07:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fragilepieces

  If you read Ann Rule and other crime novels AND the news, you must also be well aware that husbands kill wives and vice versa,  'friends' kill other 'friends', neighbors kill neighbors, students kill classmates, employees kill co-workers---the fact is one is just as likely to be threatened, hurt or killed by someone they already know.   

  As for assuming that no one is safe---I'd rather follow my gut than to baricade myself inside for the rest of my life than assume if I interact with people I might die.


I can *tell* when someone's about to *go off*.  In a bar we used to hang out in, back in the day, one night a fight broke out among a bunch of patrons.  All men, I think, though I'm not sure.  I swear to you I could actually smell the fight before it started.
 
Me & my friends had a tough time wending our way through the crowd and leaving.  I was the one who insisted.  Most of us were women, and it is not safe for a chick to hang around when a riot breaks out.
 
There's no reason for me to mistrust my friends -- whether they are 'into D/s' or not. I cannot make a new friend unless I meet them face to face.  However, in real life, far too many folks I've *met* off the 'net have had a HUGE squork factor.
 
I've been fortunate -- I've never been harmed, not really.  However, I don't go looking to get my azz handed to me, LOL.  I get into enough confrontations as it is, ROFLMAO.
 
candystripper  [sm=pole.gif]
 
I once told an Episcopalian Bishop I didn't care if Jesus Christ Jr. signed the financials, he was STILL gonna have to put the elderly folks' money in escrow.  LOL.  You cannot *assume* that anyone is safe by dint of their position on the landsacpe...but you can trust those whom you've come to know and respect. 




candystripper -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 2:11:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

~ Fast Reply ~
 
The myth is tha ANYONE should be trusted before they earn it. D/s just provides a rationalized excuse for those who enjoy, and brag about, being a victim; on sites like CM.


Merc, not all of us were 'into D/s' before the advent of the 'net.  F**k all, I've done stuff like face-f**king all my adult life -- just didn't know it had a name, LMAO.
 
candystripper  [sm=pole.gif]




monywildcat -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 2:40:41 PM)

Eep, candystripper has been moderated.  Why does this happen?  Just curious on that...

As for me, I am perfectly safe.  I'm not crazy.  Now who wants to hand over all their worldly possessions and uproot their life for me?  Don't forget your credit cards!  I won't hurt you...trust me.  *takes off ornery hat*

But seriously, the "if you don't live, you won't learn" caught my eye.  Thanks, Steel, I will use this phrase at every opportunity.  I don't allow fear to run how I do things, sure I use common sense but I don't have the mentality that every person I meet is out to get me.  God gave me pretty good instincts, and I use them.  And we still go trick or treating in the neighborhood every year.  The candy has been deemed safe, and will be noshed on until Christmas. 




CarrieO -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 3:14:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper
 
I'm NOT saying we should never meet one another.  Just that we should try not to meet the seriously deranged, LOL.
 


Here I thought that was the goal of most adults....to avoid the deranged.  Of course deranged is relative.
 
 Now, will someone please pass me a piece of candy.




CalifChick -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 3:17:54 PM)

Hey... since candy hasn't answered a direct question I've asked in... ohhh... months, can someone else ask my question from earlier in this thread?


ApparentlyBlockedCali




Mercnbeth -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 3:23:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

Hey... since candy hasn't answered a direct question I've asked in... ohhh... months, can someone else ask my question from earlier in this thread?
Apparently Blocked
Cali


Oh hell Cali, I'm still trying to figure out what the hell she meant by her response to me but I'll try...

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

I see so many posts about men meeting women they know not at all, sometimes inviting such a woman to come live in their homes.

We must not be reading the same posts... where are these "so many" posts you speak of?
Cali




CarrieO -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 3:30:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

Hey... since candy hasn't answered a direct question I've asked in... ohhh... months, can someone else ask my question from earlier in this thread?


ApparentlyBlockedCali



Hi Cali...

I did find this one but it's from '07:   http://www.collarchat.com/m_1104068/mpage_2/key_inviting%252Cstrangers%252Chome/tm.htm#1127720

A fun read nonetheless.  Now, as to my candy...I like snickers!




oceanwynds -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 4:53:25 PM)

I trust that anything can happen. I use to live my life on the edge for safety.  In my teens and early 20's I hitchhiked a lot. Back then i was 5'3" and wore and was under 100 lbs. I always had an air to me that told people to 'not f..with me' I also was good at thinking fast and a couple times I had too. Strangers never been a problem for me. People who I thought i knew where a problem for me. People who I put trust in showed trust was not a factor there. Some really nasty things happen to me by those I knew, but also taught me that trust will not ever be given out so easily again.
Now in my 50's I live a little more careful, but still take risks. As far as trust it will take a long time before a person can win my trust. It works for me.

oceanwynds




kiwisub12 -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 5:05:31 PM)

I wasn't aware that there was a section of the bdsm cm community that thought that everyone on cm , or in the lifestyle, could be trusted. I would have thought the prevalence of threads about safety calls would have dispelled any myth about trustworthiness.  So i don't understand the  thread.




mc1234 -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 5:09:30 PM)

Neither do I, kiwisub12 ... sigh ... and I've given up trying.  It kinda feels good.  

Now, due to all this chat about candy, I'm jonesing for a KitKat bar .. off to raid the kids' Halloween sacks (on the off chance there's something left there that's edible amongst the wrappers lol)




candystripper -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 5:34:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwynds

I trust that anything can happen. I use to live my life on the edge for safety.  In my teens and early 20's I hitchhiked a lot. Back then i was 5'3" and wore and was under 100 lbs. I always had an air to me that told people to 'not f..with me' I also was good at thinking fast and a couple times I had too. Strangers never been a problem for me. People who I thought i knew where a problem for me. People who I put trust in showed trust was not a factor there. Some really nasty things happen to me by those I knew, but also taught me that trust will not ever be given out so easily again.
Now in my 50's I live a little more careful, but still take risks. As far as trust it will take a long time before a person can win my trust. It works for me.

oceanwynds


I learned early on that an aggressor will often move on if the selected target doesn't just 'roll over and take it'.  I myself have used my switchblade about three times, if you don't count the occasions when I just threatened someone with it.
 
Yes, life is risk.  The trick is to select a rick/reward level that works for you, and then to be aware of what's happening around you.  If your body tells you it's experiencing FEAR -- not anxiety, not shyness -- FEAR -- then haul azz.
 
I used to do battered women's defense work.  This is very dangerous stuff for any lawyer, but especially a chick lawyer.  I did not want such sensitive materials in the law office where I worked, so I used my home address.  Dim bulb.  Of course, eventually a batterer showed up at my door.
 
It's not something I'm willing to do anymore.  Cleveland is too big to have a relationship with Court Security and Police.  In the absence of that layer of protection, I'm not willing to risk it.  The risk has grown to be too high.
 
I am bumfuddled by the men on here who believe that because they are Doms meeting submissive fems, they'll always be okay.  A Dom friend of mine flies around the country, gets a hotel room and invites a woman he's never met before up to his room.  I just shudder at what he's doing.
 
*Sigh*
 
I have read other posts by SteelofUtah, and I know he's a sensible man and that he has taught his wife how to protect herself if'n he's not there. While I have mixed feelings about 'self defense courses' for women, I don't think the 'clue phone' has rung for everyone yet.  Some woman, and some men, young and old, rush in where angels fear to tread.  I know I did, at first.
 
I fail to see what is wrong with challenging the mytholgy that folks into D/s are 'safer'.  You guys who've been on these boards awihle know perfectly well, many such posts have been made. 
 
candystripper  [sm=pole.gif]
 
P.S.  I have some folks in the habit of annoying me on block, like anyone else.  I don't do it till I form the opinion they have nothing to say which I wish to hear.




Coupleofwhats -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 6:08:27 PM)

That's one myth I'd never heard of...




MarcEsadrian -> RE: The Myth That All Folks Into D/s Can Be Trusted (11/12/2008 6:44:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

It's a myth that such a myth exists.



Hear, hear. From my observations, many people have a mild superstition about D/s enthusiasts, having gleaned what they know about D/s from movies and cable programs, or idiotic web sites designed solely for shock value.

I have heard it said relationships with D/s elements are somehow superior to traditional relationships. Again, such generalizations reveal the truth of but one thing only, and that is the capacity of the human being for ignorance.







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