RE: .BNP Members Leak. (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid



Message


Aneirin -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 6:37:51 AM)

As I see it, the BNP respond to the people who feel they are not heard by the other political parties, maybe the homeless and hopeless, those that would like to see this country shook up to enable themselves a better outlook on life.

To remember the tradition labour party is no more, they seem not interested in the poor any more unless they can score political points by saying they are  listening to them and there grudgingly chucking a morsel or two off the table of politics.

What does interest with the BNP, is how they bring things to the attention of the main parties, parties whom take onboard an issue or two, as they see the sense of it and the public feeling attatched. Perhaps this is all the BNP will ever be, a political party wake up call.

Just to remember, racism exists everwhere, one does not have to be a BNP member to be racist, racists can hide in the most unusual places, they may for the sake of their employment say one thing, adopt the party line, but their private views and as has been shown in this case, their secret affiliations might be something very different.

But one thing I never got to grips with was, how is it nationalist has come to be likened to racist ?

Forgive me if I am wrong, but are there not ethnic minorities in this country who have been here a generation or two and love this country and all it stands for, they could be called nationalist, but by being nationalist, are they then racist  or is it ethnic minority nationalists can't be racists ?




NorthernGent -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 6:52:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

As I see it, the BNP respond to the people who feel they are not heard by the other political parties



Surely that's the case for all political parties; for example, I do not vote for the Conservative Party because I'm confident they do not represent my interests or reflect my view of the best interests of this country.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

But one thing I never got to grips with was, how is it nationalist has come to be likened to racist ?



The leader of the BNP was caught red-handed describing Islam as a "wicked and evil" religion. Now, you could argue over the semantics of whether or not Islam is a race, but it's quite clear that they have an agenda that amounts to discrimination.

As implied, support for the BNP amounts to much more than disillusionment with the main political parties.




Aneirin -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 7:11:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

As I see it, the BNP respond to the people who feel they are not heard by the other political parties



Surely that's the case for all political parties; for example, I do not vote for the Conservative Party because I'm confident they do not represent my interests or reflect my view of the best interests of this country.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

But one thing I never got to grips with was, how is it nationalist has come to be likened to racist ?



The leader of the BNP was caught red-handed describing Islam as a "wicked and evil" religion. Now, you could argue over the semantics of whether or not Islam is a race, but it's quite clear that they have an agenda that amounts to discrimination.

As implied, support for the BNP amounts to much more than disillusionment with the main political parties.


The leader of the BNP is not alone in saying this, religious leaders in the past have said the same.




NorthernGent -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 7:22:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

As I see it, the BNP respond to the people who feel they are not heard by the other political parties



Surely that's the case for all political parties; for example, I do not vote for the Conservative Party because I'm confident they do not represent my interests or reflect my view of the best interests of this country.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

But one thing I never got to grips with was, how is it nationalist has come to be likened to racist ?



The leader of the BNP was caught red-handed describing Islam as a "wicked and evil" religion. Now, you could argue over the semantics of whether or not Islam is a race, but it's quite clear that they have an agenda that amounts to discrimination.

As implied, support for the BNP amounts to much more than disillusionment with the main political parties.


The leader of the BNP is not alone in saying this, religious leaders in the past have said the same.



The post I replied to was concerned with political allegiance to the BNP. Are there any other political parties that are on record as stating: "Islam is a wicked and evil religion"?

We are discussing the underlying cause for allegiance to the BNP. What marks them out as different to say the Labour Party or the Conservative Party? Disillusionment with those two parties doesn't wash; I'd give people more credit than turning to the BNP on the back of being disillusioned with the democratic process. 




LadyEllen -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 7:40:34 AM)

The questions youre asking were discussed on page 4 NG; do try to keep up!

E




RealityLicks -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 8:48:09 AM)

General reply -

I am still waiting to see hard evidence from a reputable source that white "indigenous" people are being discriminated against for social housing or any public service.  Anecdotes prove nothing; everybody has a story.  If you attach credence to the BNP's line, you should be able to back it up with independent research.  Merely trotting out tabloid scare stories is nothing more than pub talk and a modern democratic society can't build policy on pub talk.  Provide links to hard facts, then we can talk.

The only public body to commission research into the problem is the EHRC, led by our old mate Trevor Phillips (not the House of Lords).  The resulting paper showed that far from being put to the head of the queue, immigrants were usually in over-crowded housing of such poor quality that it had been rejected by the people ahead of them on the housing list.  For those who don't have family members working in social housing, as I do, housing lists are very strictly monitored and candidates are awarded points, then housed by computerised systems which by statute cannot include ethnic information - that information is kept separately until the next (properly qualified) candidate comes up.  We're talking huge bureaucracies where candidates are given a number and no-one can allocate properties individually, making the kind of discrimination regularly touted as fact virtually impossible.

The reason the main political parties have been slow to act on immigration is widely known: they are very often the only people who will work the worst jobs.  Without them, the economy would collapse and we'd have no scrumptious strawberries at jolly old Wimbledon.  It's the same story in most industrialised nations of course, but the UK has benefitted from a prolonged boom, thus attracting more immigrants.  This is unmanageable because we have sold all the social housing and only recently begun to build the stock up again.  Having bought our council houses and become middle class, we also want teh benefits of the lowest tax regime possible.  Well, if you spend your money on a massive plasma TV instead of chipping in for a hospital bed or a school desk, the political parties are all quite venal enough to let you have your way if you'll just put an "X" by their name.

The BNP are not champions of the British working class.  If you really want a de-racialised debate on immigration, you won't get one from a racist party.  If you simply don't care whether the debate becomes racist just so long as immigration is halted, you are every bit as sick as the racist and while I wouldn't out you on the internet, I'll shed no tears if someone else does.

For those who take this post or any of my other posts as personal attacks on them, I'd suggest you read again.  If you still feel aggrieved it's because you wish to and are able to generate what you desire without my input.  I need add nothing more to that process except to wish you enjoyment and good health.

Now, anyone up for a spot of Morris dancing?


Edit:  http://www.jrf.org.uk/knowledge/findings/housing/2151.asp
Edit2: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7071612.stm




RCdc -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 9:12:26 AM)

RL, I really not sure if you are getting this at all?  Those scare stories are what feed the BNP.  The perception of someone who is caused distress feed the BNP.  You should get by now that when people feel rejected, they fall hook line and siner for those that come along and blame something else instead of making them look at themselves and what they do and who they vote for.
 
Anything but accepting the responsibility.
 
the.dark.




meatcleaver -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 10:01:03 AM)

I told you were you can obtain the report. I'm in Germany, you are in Britain (I assume). You only have to go to your MP's practice to get it. If you are in London, that will be a walk away.




Politesub53 -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 10:06:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RealityLicks

General reply -

I am still waiting to see hard evidence from a reputable source that white "indigenous" people are being discriminated against for social housing or any public service. 


While I fully agree with your post, I can see how the perception of favouritism on housing comes about. Since Immigrants are by definition homeless, on arrival, then they get higher points on housing lists. This may make it seem that they are being favoured by local councils. Single immigrants would be, like every other single person, lower down the list. You are also right to point out that many immigrants take places that locals wont accept. Part of the reason for this would be local knowledge of the housing estates. There is an estate here where I would perfer to sleep in my car than live there.

quote:

The reason the main political parties have been slow to act on immigration is widely known: they are very often the only people who will work the worst jobs.  Without them, the economy would collapse and we'd have no scrumptious strawberries at jolly old Wimbledon. 


With regards to the above, my opinion is that Brown cynically used immigrants as cheap labour, to help keep inflation down.




Aneirin -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 11:56:07 AM)

Housing lists and the points system, when I was living in that beautiful city made famous most recently by the Inspector Morse dramas, the points system was reorganised twice, lots of people that knew they were near the top of the list after years of waiting suddenly found themselves further down the list. It seemed they no longer had the required points to be higher up the list. When applying for council property areas, you get given a map with all the areas marked and a questionaire as to what you require and where. You had a number of choices, at the time we had four areas in which we could choose to live. Obviously certain areas through local knowledge we avoided like the plague.

When the points system changed, we had to reapply for an area, but this time we were only given two choices, the iffy areas, a case of take it or leave it. Leave it and you are off the list so we took it with the belief that no matter what happens outside, we shut the door behind us and it stays outside. Well, it was an estate, an estate full of crime and feral kids. I had a beautiful fully restored VW camper, over the space of five years it was trashed by them outside, I would have been happier if they had burned it, but no such luck, it was a dented, scratched trimless wreck by the time it got sold and it got sold after I was mugged and the thief took the keys. Every single lock was screwdrivered, they would break in turn it over and leave, time and time again. That estate totally demoralised me,  but the worst aspect was the gunfire and the seemingly permanent police helicopter over the estate, it's night sun  turning night into day, I came to fear going home after work and was armed, going out at night, forget it.

On being offered the flat, the proviso was if we turned it down, that's it, we had to find our own accomodation. So, it would seem all of us stand likely to get the shit end of the stick when it comes to social housing.

Oh, in that city, if you were single, especially a single male, forget it, though you are entitled to social housing, you won't get it. Worse still if you were fit and healthy, being that carried no points and I do know of people who feigned illnesses, bad back etc to get housing points.

I pity any of any race that has to live in those conditions and worse, what was rows and new estates of house proud people who formed a friendly community has degenerated into a seething mess where everyone distrusts everyone else. Often it is everyone lives in fear, in fear of what may happen next, that is no way to live for anyone. Now, I avoid social housing like the plague, given my experience, I do not wish to go there again.

Perhaps there is something else, ever notice how council housing estates always seem to have the highest numbers of ill people living there, perhaps there is a reason for it.




piratecommander -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (11/21/2008 7:45:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin


Forgive me if I am wrong, but are there not ethnic minorities in this country who have been here a generation or two and love this country and all it stands for, they could be called nationalist, but by being nationalist, are they then racist  or is it ethnic minority nationalists can't be racists ?



Do Celts count as an ethnic minority ?(except to the BNP vermin) , having been here a generation or several and loving these lands.They could be called nationalists (except for the fact that the Celtic culture is inherantly tribal).If The Celts get "ethnic minority" status , what will the Romans (the ones that didn't run away), the Saxons (who wrecked the landscape) and the Normans (who gave the world Franglais) be wanting ?

A "British" Passport perhaps ?

Next thing you know , I'll be getting a kicking by the vermin for being "English" (thats another thread)

Pirate

(Aneirin..........does it makes me a racist for having a less than vague knowlege of 10,000 [ref: Darias] years of heritage which makes the Romans ,Saxons and Normans look like very late gatecrashers who have spoiled a great heritage by inventing rules and writing them down and making a big fuss about how good their rules are and then pissing off everyone...including their own .. by enforcing them)




MadAxeman -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 6:39:26 AM)

RealityLicks wants this thread revisited so he can explain his remarks, so here it is.




RealityLicks -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 6:54:43 AM)

Where's the post that you need explaining to you again?




LadyEllen -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:03:35 AM)

Oh come on now!

In this thread alone you all but called Aneirin a liar, Meatcleaver a dissembler, MadAxeman a BNP enabler..... and I havent checked but probably some others got the rough end of your indignation at the subject matter too

E




MadAxeman -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:04:36 AM)

Try the whole of the thread.
The previous page has you floundering quite badly.
You don't actually understand the English at all.




RealityLicks -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:12:56 AM)

All but?  "All but" in your eyes.

That's your interpretation, not mine.  Rather than assuming someone has ill intent behind their comments, I'd suggest you question them for clarification.  I stand by all I have stated here and I'm beginning to resent the implication that your misreading of my intentions counts for more than what is actually written. 

Do you really think that if I wanted to call someone a racist, a liar, or a (gasp) dissembler, that I would not simply do so?  I have done just that on this board and no doubt will do so again.  The fact that I have not done so here indicates that that is not my opinion.  If I'm an authority on nothing else, I'm the sole authority of that.

Next!




MadAxeman -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:22:50 AM)

Other's eyes too.




RealityLicks -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:25:31 AM)

Until you highlight what you had such problems with, I'm not bothering with you.  Sort your act out.




Raechard -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:33:27 AM)


What I don't understand about this whole incident is: if there is a law stating BNP members can't be employed in these services, which there is. Why then can't there be a law that states these fascist parties should pass on their list of members to these employers so that those individuals can be dealt with in a private rather than through lynch mob mentality. I'm surprised how big the BNP has got, I remember when it's HQ was a tiny corner bookshop in a London suburb and we had thousands of protestors marching on it. It's a sad reflection of our society they've grown rather than shrank in numbers since this time, I think we give them far too much publicity.




NorthernGent -> RE: .BNP Members Leak. (12/7/2008 7:35:47 AM)

General reply.....

I believe there is a loophole in the law that allows private details to be accessible to the public, where this information has been made public on a previous occasion.

I can't see why BNP membership is in the public interest.

In fact, this whole episode is doing them a favour; they are largely irrelevant and generally viewed as a pack of oddballs and social misfits. This type of behaviour has afforded the BNP publicity of which the organisation can only dream.




Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy
0.046875