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RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/8/2008 8:13:55 PM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

If I'm only here for the forums, which I am, why does that mean I shouldn't have listed my age as 99 when I was new? Yes the delete button would work for those 100+ emails, but changing my age meant I didn't get them. Anyone who's ever been to a dating site knows what that means. The HNG who just send out form letters to every new female? I don't care about them.

Am I lying to all the Nigerians by using the mail filters to not get their emails? Gee, I'm a liar and a fake. So sue me.

It doesn't make a person a fake but it is a lie - in my book anyway. It's one of those white lies that everybody tells because they don't want to deal with saying their friend's ass looks fat/that they like the present they got/that really, Grandpa, your story was riveting/don't want to deal with hundreds of e-mails.

The bottom line, as I'm seeing it, is that if you can't handle deleting e-mails and so deliberately misrepresent yourself to avoid them, you really don't have room to wonder if other people are ready for BDSM when they are being honest about their situation. If e-mails trouble you so badly, take the profile down and you won't have to deal with any.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 12/8/2008 8:14:29 PM >

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 121

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/8/2008 10:29:49 PM

missbehaeven

Posts: 41
Joined: 1/25/2007
Status: offline

~general response~
I, myself, don't feel the need to share details of my private intimate life.
Similarly, I don't feel the need to know about such of my family and friends.
In my mind that's why it's private.

Also I'm not sure that my being out about my lifestyle choices would necessarily change anyone's opinions.
Ideally rather than everyone needing to be open and upfront about their choices, people would self examine why they feel strongly negative about a certain, gender, race, sexuality, lifestyle choice, religion etc, and none of these would be hot topics.
I also have attended a few munches and from some of the table talk, there were very specific incidences of family court viewing interest in alternative lifestyle very negatively, so I know there are legal considerations for being discreet.
I think it's a personal choice whether or not to reveal any lifestyle choices, and there is no right or wrong decision.

Happy holidays, all, miss

(in reply to trealeon)

Post #: 122

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 3:18:28 AM

gypsygrl

Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline

A couple of thoughts. Some of what we do as citizens of the United States (my appologies to folks from other countries) is private because its protected by our constitutional rights to privacy. Alot of what we do isn't protected. Its only been recently that matters relvolving around sexuality have been protected. Not everything's protected. This is a legal question and not a question of discretion, taste, style, personality or any other subjective characteristic.

This is an old argument and all the usual sides have been represented. Some 'get it' that the personal is political and some choices, particularly those revolving around sexuality and relationship style, for legal reasons, aren't private choices. They've already been made public matters by virtue of the fact that they can used in custody battles, etc...  Do people ask, "what will my ex think?" when they buy a car?  When they buy shoes? Those are private choices and can't be used against anyone. Certain behavior--even though its personal and conducted behind closed doors--is illegal and grounds for losing one's job. Certain behavior--even though its private and conducted behind closed doors--can be used in a custody battle. This bavior--given that its NOT protected by our constitutional right to privacy IS, legally, considered a public issue. Its not for any of us as individuals to decide whats private and whats public. Thats for the courts to decide. And the lawyers and the legislature. Hell, we don't even get to decide what sex is.

Many who posted on this thread are ok with the way things are.  These people are very comfortable with it. As near as I can figure, the community in general is comfortable with it.  People are content with keeping things the way they are and hoping that their boss doesn't catch them or their ex's lawyer doesn't catch them.   Because if they do get caught, they fear that they'll be in some kind of trouble. And, they're ok with that. Cause, like, ya know, its fucking personal.   Crap.

I couldn't do something if I thought it was going to cause me trouble. I have too much anxiety for that and it strikes me as being dysfunctional. I have way too much pride and self-respect to be made to sneak around (Of course, if my sir got off on sneaking around, I might...) There are some things that I do that are illegal but I do them openly, as a matter of civil disobedience and not a matter of sneaking around. If I get pulled into court because of this stuff (my ex has made some threats and I called his bluff so he backed off) I'm prepared to defend myself and my actions because I'm not ashamed of what I do. Of course there's things I do in the bedroom and no one needs to know about these things. But, thats because I'm shy and not an exhibitionist (Some people aren't shy and are exhibitionists, and thats ok!!!) rather than because I'm afraid of losing custody or my job.

As for the argument about who thinks they're better than who and who's judging who...What the does that have to do with anything?   Why would the op's judgements matter to anyone? Or, by extension, my own judgement because I could have easily written the op as I've felt the same way many times. If people were comfortable (for lack of a better word) they wouldn't care that they were being judged. Its not even a bad thing to be uncomfortable 'cause it means you care.

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

(in reply to CatdeMedici)

Post #: 123

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 3:54:40 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
The bottom line, as I'm seeing it, is that if you can't handle deleting e-mails and so deliberately misrepresent yourself to avoid them, you really don't have room to wonder if other people are ready for BDSM when they are being honest about their situation. If e-mails trouble you so badly, take the profile down and you won't have to deal with any.

You're assuming that someone realizes when new that they can still be here without a profile. I didn't.

This site works a lot differently than the other forums I've hung out at during the years. I've never known another site where you can be profileless and still post.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to AquaticSub)

Post #: 124

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 7:04:52 AM

abuddingdom

Posts: 158
Joined: 3/8/2007
Status: offline

DesFIP is correct. I came onboard CM in late May (my 2nd time aboard) & didn't have a profile until late Aug.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 125

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 7:13:09 AM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

Many who posted on this thread are ok with the way things are. These people are very comfortable with it. As near as I can figure, the community in general is comfortable with it. People are content with keeping things the way they are and hoping that their boss doesn't catch them or their ex's lawyer doesn't catch them. Because if they do get caught, they fear that they'll be in some kind of trouble. And, they're ok with that. Cause, like, ya know, its fucking personal. Crap.

Things could be completely, wonderfully accepted in this world and I still wouldn't be "out". It just happens to be extremely sexual and private for me. I don't share that with anyone in my life, family or friends. I have no desire to know that my friend Fred shoved a plug up Eileen's ass and then pissed on her. Seriously. If someone is out in the open...well then that's great for them. But just because I choose not to be doesn't make me any less real, a fake or a liar than those who do. It just makes me more comfortable to be more private in a part of my life that I view as personal for distinctive personal reasons.

_____________________________

(in reply to gypsygrl)

Post #: 126

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 7:27:57 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

Exactly.

AND, another reality is that most people are not activists. They will not kick up a fuss about anything, especially if it is something controversial or potentially problematic for them to do so, UNTIL......it has affected them personally. While that may not be the pretty, fuzzy, feel good we would like, however it is a fact.

Just look at the people that have become activists in the public eye. Most of them did so ONLY after the issue became personal with them, usually through a tragedy in their life.

Sorry, but the whole idea of it being our duty, just isn't going to fly.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 127

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 7:44:11 AM

Bella1965

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/12/2006
From: NYC
Status: offline

G'morning all:

(Fast Reply)

IMNSHO only; if you feel the need to be discreet, what else are you hiding? I'm completely out to my family (which consists of my mother), my friends; old and new, and I have the luxury of being out at work as I'm in employed in civil service. I don't tack posters or banners at my base, but if someone asks me a pointed question, I answer it forthrightly. My co-workers even mock threaten each other by saying, "You do it or SHE will spank you!". Which never fails to get a chuckle from me.

I understand everyone has different comfort levels but I've always felt that if you need to have a portion of your life hidden away, what else are you ashamed of? Hence why I don't deal romantically with anyone that sees this as their dirty little secret. My friends in the lifestyle may do as they wish, but I require that whomever I become involved with be as open as I am. That's not to say I flaunt my dominance in front of my boyfriend's family. To do so would be tacky. I have tugged his goatee down to my face to give him a kiss. The happy grin on his face showed his comfort to his folks. Subtle things are permissible without being overboard.

I'm not saying people should parade down the street everyday of their lives in full leather regalia (unless you like that sort of thing), but be comfortable in your skin. Don't stash your leanings in the closet at home to only be brought out in the dark. I so get a kick out of seeing BDSM being integrated into mainstream society. I've seen riding crops on sale in Victoria's Secret. How cute.

BDSM is being more widely accepted everywhere, everyday. Why not take advantage of this and live your life openly?

Stay safe, play nice, & share your toys w/ others...

Bella

_____________________________

Life shouldn't be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly shouting..."Wow! What a ride!

(in reply to abuddingdom)

Post #: 128

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 8:01:26 AM

SassySarijane

Posts: 1558
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: KC Area Missouri
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bella1965

G'morning all:

(Fast Reply)

IMNSHO only; if you feel the need to be discreet, what else are you hiding?

I understand everyone has different comfort levels but I've always felt that if you need to have a portion of your life hidden away, what else are you ashamed of? Hence why I don't deal romantically with anyone that sees this as their dirty little secret.

Stay safe, play nice, & share your toys w/ others...

Bella

Why would choosing who you do and do not tell certain things in your life mean that you were ashamed? Why does being discreet mean you're hiding something? Certain areas of my life don't need to be public knowledge. I'm definitely not ashamed, I just don't see that everyone needs to know all my private business.

Is someone ashamed if they choose not to let everyone know their bank balance or phone number or address or dress size? I don't see choosing who I tell or don't tell about my interest in bdsm to be any different than that. Not everyone needs to know everything about everyone. It's just that simple for me.

I have friends who are very out about being into bdsm and other things and I have friends who keep that part of their life private from most. One isn't any better or worse than the other. It's personal preference. I don't think any better or worse of someone for their choice in that.

_____________________________

Sarah2
Deviant Mind
Wild Side Readers
LPTnB

(in reply to Bella1965)

Post #: 129

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 8:11:34 AM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

My answer is simple: I don't want my vanillas to know about my private life because they wouldn't understand it, and I don't feel I owe them an explanation. The people I'm prepared to explain things to--well, they already know.

quote:

ORIGINAL: CatdeMedici

What really annoys Me are adults who in the first five sentences say: " No one must know as I have a XXX job" OR" My friends and family must never know".

Last time I looked except for the exceptional few---I haven't seen people being dragged into holiday family dinner naked and at the end of a leash. I haven't seen BDSM as a section on a job app to complete experience. And most times in public, and D/s activity or relationships are so subtle, the casual observer would never guess--We all have things at stake here, but if you are so worried, why the hell are you here?

(in reply to CatdeMedici)

Post #: 130

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 8:37:52 AM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
The bottom line, as I'm seeing it, is that if you can't handle deleting e-mails and so deliberately misrepresent yourself to avoid them, you really don't have room to wonder if other people are ready for BDSM when they are being honest about their situation. If e-mails trouble you so badly, take the profile down and you won't have to deal with any.

You're assuming that someone realizes when new that they can still be here without a profile. I didn't.

This site works a lot differently than the other forums I've hung out at during the years. I've never known another site where you can be profileless and still post.

I dunno, the "Hide Profile" was right there on the top in really big letters when I went edit my profile to see how hard it was to miss. Most, if not all, dating sites I've belonged to (and the other side really is) had an option to hide one's profile.

Either way, if someone is going to present the idea that people aren't ready to be on a BDSM website when they aren't willing to be out about it, perhaps they aren't ready for the website if deleting those e-mails is such a problem. I've been on here single (well - singlish but that's complicated, lol), I got the deluge. It was annoying but it wasn't something so terrible that I felt the need to misrepresent myself. I read 'em, laughed at 'em and deleted 'em in my own sweet time. If other people do - that's fine. But I don't think they have a leg to stand on when it comes to questioning if other people are ready to be on this site.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 12/9/2008 8:41:22 AM >

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 131

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 8:40:16 AM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bella1965

Hence why I don't deal romantically with anyone that sees this as their dirty little secret

Just to point out, from someone who very much puts their life out there - there is a world of difference between wanting to keep one's life private and regarding something as a dirty little secret.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to Bella1965)

Post #: 132

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 8:48:24 AM

beargonewild

Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bella1965

IMNSHO only; if you feel the need to be discreet, what else are you hiding? I'm completely out to my family (which consists of my mother), my friends; old and new, and I have the luxury of being out at work as I'm in employed in civil service. I don't tack posters or banners at my base, but if someone asks me a pointed question, I answer it forthrightly. My co-workers even mock threaten each other by saying, "You do it or SHE will spank you!". Which never fails to get a chuckle from me.

I understand everyone has different comfort levels but I've always felt that if you need to have a portion of your life hidden away, what else are you ashamed of? Hence why I don't deal romantically with anyone that sees this as their dirty little secret. My friends in the lifestyle may do as they wish, but I require that whomever I become involved with be as open as I am. That's not to say I flaunt my dominance in front of my boyfriend's family. To do so would be tacky. I have tugged his goatee down to my face to give him a kiss. The happy grin on his face showed his comfort to his folks. Subtle things are permissible without being overboard.

Bella

The point many are saying is that they are not hiding a portion of their lives, they are using a level of discretion which they want regarding their personal loves. It is exactly the same situation of you not making it known to everyone the details of your sex life.

Surprising enough, even people like myself who is very open about my orientation and I am open about my kink yet I use a measure of discretion in both areas. I am not hiding, I simply know that you or Sari or parents or friends do not need to know how I have sex or how many times I had been loaned out to another to be used.

The point is each one of us has our own level of comfortability regarding how open or closed we want to be about our kink. If you want others to accept and respect our choice to be very open then we too must accept and respect the people who want to keep that part of their lives more private.

_____________________________

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Promiscuous boy you already know
That I’m all yours what you waiting for?

Resident MANWHORE ~1000 Bear pts~

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(in reply to Bella1965)

Post #: 133

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 8:50:22 AM

mc1234

Posts: 683
Joined: 10/4/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bella1965

G'm
I understand everyone has different comfort levels but I've always felt that if you need to have a portion of your life hidden away, what else are you ashamed of? Hence why I don't deal romantically with anyone that sees this as their dirty little secret.

I dunno .. if I was vanilla, I still wouldn't be talking to anyone about what sexual positions I preferred or what I enjoyed doing in the bedroom. It's my business, and I prefer to keep it that way.

(in reply to Bella1965)

Post #: 134

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 9:07:33 AM

silkenfire

Posts: 130
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline

Regarding the issue of "Friends and Family cannot know" etc...

I have seen plenty of people that would never be "acceptable" to my friends/family/coworkers... there's something to be said for saying "I want you to be my life's companion, but you must be able to fit in, in vanilla situations." I could find someone that would give me amazing sexual experiences that I wouldn't want to stay with because they would not be able to share all the other parts of my life with me.

In that respect I think it's quite reasonable to stress the fact. Some people are completely out in their whole circle, and some people want it behind closed doors only.

(in reply to mc1234)

Post #: 135

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 12:49:00 PM

pdv99

Posts: 140
Joined: 3/13/2007
From: UK
Status: offline

I think we each have to find our own way on this one, and respect some people's needs to exercise varying degrees of discretion depending on individual circumstances.

In some jobs it wouldn't matter a damn if I was completely out about my sexual tastes. In most families your folks might be shocked at first, but quickly get used to the idea. But whilst, for example, it's probably fine to be out about your tastes if you work in fashion, or the media, or are a building worker or mechanic, it's probably wise to be more cautious about your predilections if you are applying for jobs working with children! After all, you wouldn't want some (non-consenting) minor to be influenced by awareness of your pastime.
As for my family - well, I've been in vanilla and D/s relationships, and never felt it important to discuss the sexual nature of any of them with my family. I'm sure some of them have made a few guesses about some of the relationships, but if I was to come out and ask them which were which I'd bet my bottom dollar they got some wrong. For me, it's important not to hurt someone without consent, and coming out and telling them stuff about my private life without good cause would simply be inflicting unneccessary distress, because they'd probably fear for my immortal soul, and it would be no kindness to argue I simply don't have one.

Last word: Until the wider public have more knowledge and a deeper understanding about D/s, there'll be situations where being open about it could have adverse effects on soome people's lives. Unfortunately, the way the law is changing in January in the UK, it will make it harder to be open, once posession of D/s images is criminalised to be on a par with child pornography. Effectively, members of our community will increasingly be seen as on a par with child abusers.

(in reply to silkenfire)

Post #: 136

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 1:14:23 PM

SassySarijane

Posts: 1558
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: KC Area Missouri
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: beargonewild

The point many are saying is that they are not hiding a portion of their lives, they are using a level of discretion which they want regarding their personal loves. It is exactly the same situation of you not making it known to everyone the details of your sex life.

Surprising enough, even people like myself who is very open about my orientation and I am open about my kink yet I use a measure of discretion in both areas. I am not hiding, I simply know that you or Sari or parents or friends do not need to know how I have sex or how many times I had been loaned out to another to be used.

The point is each one of us has our own level of comfortability regarding how open or closed we want to be about our kink. If you want others to accept and respect our choice to be very open then we too must accept and respect the people who want to keep that part of their lives more private.

Bravo Bear. You put it so very well.

*Is still shaking head over the whole if you're not out and open about everything to people then you're ashamed and/or hiding.*

_____________________________

Sarah2
Deviant Mind
Wild Side Readers
LPTnB

(in reply to beargonewild)

Post #: 137

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 1:14:36 PM

manxcat

Posts: 673
Joined: 10/3/2008
Status: offline

quote: Unfortunately, the way the law is changing in January in the UK, it will make it harder to be open, once posession of D/s images is criminalised to be on a par with child pornography. Effectively, members of our community will increasingly be seen as on a par with child abusers.

Now that really sucks and is on a par with how many people in the U.S. view gay educators - as potential perps in child porn, etc.

It is sad that what adults wish to do with one another is subject to laws and lawmaker who want to remove their rights. Another sad but true fact is that in some states oral sex is still illegal. I remember reading in Playboy, over 25 years ago, about a couple, whose child and a friend looked into the parents bedroom window. The friend told their parents, who went to the police. The parents were tried and jailed. That this can still happen even in vanilla relationships says something about keeping ones preferences private.

manxy

_____________________________

The television, that insidious beast, that Medusa which freezes a
billion people to stone every night, staring fixedly,
that Siren which called and sang and promised so much and gave, after all, so little.
Ray Bradbury

(in reply to pdv99)

Post #: 138

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 1:27:31 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

CatdeMedici, I can completely relate to your first post in this thread because I find myself thinking this a lot.

Privacy is one matter but being afraid that anyone might find out, as you worded it in your first post, goes to a deeper level of paranoia and i suspect a sense of insecurity about being into BDSM. It is difficult to shake social stigma about non-reproductive sex anyway so the further you go from that the harder it can be to become completely comfortable with your own sexuality or alternative personalities.

Yeah, they might be out to get you but honestly, if they are, they will find a way to get you, kinky or not. Hiding it only gives them something they can think you are ashamed about and thus a tool to use against you.

One can be out and not be in people's faces. In fact, it's pretty easy because it's just being yourself and being focused on what is important at any given time. Unless you work in a sex related field, I doubt that BDSM is relevant to your job but that doesn't mean you refuse to go to a munch for fear your boss or co-worker might see you. After all, why were they in that venue? And why would they assume you weren't there for the same reason?

< Message edited by thetammyjo -- 12/9/2008 1:32:41 PM >

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(in reply to CatdeMedici)

Post #: 139

RE: My Friends and Family Can Never Find Out - 12/9/2008 2:17:26 PM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bella1965

G'morning all:

(Fast Reply)

IMNSHO only; if you feel the need to be discreet, what else are you hiding? I'm completely out to my family (which consists of my mother), my friends; old and new, and I have the luxury of being out at work as I'm in employed in civil service. I don't tack posters or banners at my base, but if someone asks me a pointed question, I answer it forthrightly. My co-workers even mock threaten each other by saying, "You do it or SHE will spank you!". Which never fails to get a chuckle from me.

I understand everyone has different comfort levels but I've always felt that if you need to have a portion of your life hidden away, what else are you ashamed of?

Bella

What I am discreet about and what I'm not is entirely down to circumstances and consideration.

I'm not at ALL ashamed of anything I get up to, bdsm wise or any other wise. Being discreet has nothing to do with *hiding* things and a LOT to do with having a sense of consideration for other people's feelings , my own privacy and self preservation.

Taking advantage of 'bdsm being more widely acceptable' is a little naive. The fact that it's a bit more publically aired doesn't mean that people's personal encounters, lives, jobs are going to see it in the same light.

agirl

(in reply to Bella1965)

Post #: 140

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