RE: What life is worth

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: What life is worth

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: What life is worth

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 5 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 6:53:48 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

The flip side of the coin is that if the utilities don't have a way to enforce payment, if they're made to give their product away then they will go broke, and no one will have benefit of its use.

If we're going to cast about for a scapegoat why not hang those who protest every time a utility tries to break ground on a new power plant or other resource of any kind, thereby sending utility and energy rates sky high.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

i agree, MissMorrigan. But it seems SilverWulf feels a persons situation should not be an issue at all...just terminate their service and let them fend for themselves. How sad.

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to sirsholly)

Post #: 21

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 6:58:32 AM

MissMorrigan

Posts: 2309
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline

I don't see a suggestion of the supply companies giving their services away, they usually get their money at the end of the day, whether it's via taking legal action or exercising patience in either waiting for people to pay up (if they're having mobility issues) or for a deceased's estate to be settled - in the latter, much longer.

_____________________________

The Tooth Fairy who teaches kids to sell body parts for money.

A free society is a society where it is safe to find one's self unpopular and where history has shown that exceptions are not that exceptional.

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 22

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 6:58:43 AM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
Status: offline

What happened was medieval, shameful. Do you think that provisions should be made that would prevent this kind of thing from occurring again?

_____________________________

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 23

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:01:20 AM

sirsholly

Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
Status: offline

quote:

The flip side of the coin is that if the utilities don't have a way to enforce payment, if they're made to give their product away then they will go broke, and no one will have benefit of its use.

i think those who take the utility companies for a ride are few and far between. Most want to pay their debts.

_____________________________

PICKED UPON
TECHNO-DOLT
MEMBER OF THE SUBBIE MAFIA
GRACEFULLY CHALLENGED :::::splat:::::
BOOT WHORE
VAA/S FAN

GIVES GOOD HEART (Lushy)

CREATOR OF MAYHEM (practice)

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 24

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:01:40 AM

SassySarijane

Posts: 1558
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: KC Area Missouri
Status: offline

I find it very sad and upsetting that this happened but am not really surprised it did. Companies are out for the bottom line plain and simple and a lot of the rates they charge for things show that clearly. Do I think everyone should get a free ride? No I do not, but as other posters have said, the situations of those not paying should be investigated first before disconnecting service. If they are just after a free ride for winter, cut them off and make them pay to have it back on, but if there are plausible extenuating circumstances, then work with them.

I have been in circumstances where I could not pay the amount charged and made partial payments, as much as I could afford, yet still had my service disconnected because I could pay no more until I got paid the next month. There are circumstances that are beyond people's control at times in their lives and it should be investigated and taken into account when they do not pay or do not pay the full amount.

By the same token, the person should do all they can to let the utility company know of their circumstances and try to work out something, and yes, even for this there are a few exceptions as to those who don't/can't, but still, effort needs to be made on both sides.

_____________________________

Sarah2
Deviant Mind
Wild Side Readers
LPTnB

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 25

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:02:53 AM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline

quote:

I find the old timers death repugnant. Even here in arkansas, they can not shut power off in the winter months (at least thats my understanding). Granted there are people who will take advantage, but if situations can be proven to be dire, then for hells sake, cut people some slack. If you're just a dirtbag, then come spring, pay up sucker. They need to investigate this old mans death and charge the parties responsible for his death.

Yeah, that's the policy here in Arkansas. It hardly ever gets that cold here; you'd think Bay City, Michigan would have something similar in place. I remember when the hurricane came through here and knocked all the power out last year. An old lady down the street from my parent's house was on a dialysis machine. Entergy (our electricty provider) came out and hooked up a generator for her; that is there policy. Any utility company that would shut off the power to an elderly shut-in shouldn't be allowed to provide that service.

(in reply to rexrgisformidoni)

Post #: 26

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:07:47 AM

MissMorrigan

Posts: 2309
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline

Provided they were aware that the person in question is elderly and unable to attend to their own affairs in the immediate. It could well be that they weren't in possession of such info but with such freedom of personal data in the US, I'd be surprised if they didn't know.

_____________________________

The Tooth Fairy who teaches kids to sell body parts for money.

A free society is a society where it is safe to find one's self unpopular and where history has shown that exceptions are not that exceptional.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Post #: 27

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:09:04 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SilverWulf

<fr>

In many places that I've lived the power and gas companies have been prohibited from terminating service during the winter months. Ok, I can see the point.. people literally freezing to death in their own homes is never a good thing.

On the other hand are the scumbags who took advantage of it and would stop paying their utilities as soon as the magic date passed, and then work out payment arrangements to get through the summer months only to do it again the next winter.

IMO, if you don't pay your utility bill your service should be terminated no matter what time of year it is. Letting people get away with not paying is like saying 'come rob the utility company, we can't do anything about it and you will get away scot free!'

I just want to check and make sure I know where you're coming from so I know how seriously to take any future posts of yours that I read. What you're saying is that the 90-year old man referenced in the OP had it coming.

OK, got it. Thanks.

_____________________________

Panda, panda, burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?

(in reply to SilverWulf)

Post #: 28

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:10:41 AM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
Status: offline

Panda? You went from blue to damned. I'm not sure I like this

.

_____________________________

(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)

Post #: 29

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:13:32 AM

Lynnxz

Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

The flip side of the coin is that if the utilities don't have a way to enforce payment, if they're made to give their product away then they will go broke, and no one will have benefit of its use.

i think those who take the utility companies for a ride are few and far between. Most want to pay their debts.

Are you kidding? People will try to mooch whatever they can, not saying the old man did, but there's a good reason the companies are so jaded towards people who owe.

_____________________________

HBIC

(in reply to sirsholly)

Post #: 30

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:14:29 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

There are many who would take full advantage, but yes - of course there should be safeguards in place. In most places there are, here it's called the Public Utilities Commission. They have a lot of power, too, and all you have to do is call them and any grievance is handled promptly.

But here's a question for you. Why isn't it criminal for restaurants and grocery stores to neglect to give away free food. Why don't sporting goods stores have to hand out free sleeping bags to anyone who asks?

And where was this guy's family... where was his church, or his social worker. Why aren't they equally to blame with the utility, assuming the gentleman who died had no part in it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

What happened was medieval, shameful. Do you think that provisions should be made that would prevent this kind of thing from occurring again?

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 31

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:15:27 AM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
The flip side of the coin is that if the utilities don't have a way to enforce payment, if they're made to give their product away then they will go broke, and no one will have benefit of its use.

Let's think outside the box here. The issue is obvious - the guy did not have the money to pay his bill. So who should pay it?

1. The man himself. He should have, didn't, and froze.
2. The utility. If they did, then as Sanity said, they're being forced by the government to give away their product. That's technically known as a "taking" and scares a LOT of people whenever the idea of the government depriving entities of their income.
3. The government itself. A program to cover costs. The problem is that we the taxpayers would end up paying for a $4 mil program that disbursed $400K in benefits.

There is no good answer. But the idea of the government forcing a company to forego revenue scares me.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 32

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:16:57 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

That's exactly why socialism doesn't work, right there.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Are you kidding? People will try to mooch whatever they can, not saying the old man did, but there's a good reason the companies are so jaded towards people who owe.

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to Lynnxz)

Post #: 33

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:17:42 AM

rexrgisformidoni

Posts: 578
Joined: 9/20/2008
Status: offline

Thanks for clarifying, I wasn't sure if that was the case. Plus Entergy seems to be a decent company overall.

_____________________________

when all you have is a hammer, everything begins to look like nails

“I am the punishment of God...If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you.”

Genghis Khan

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Post #: 34

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:18:14 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

There probably was a program.

There is in most states. Here, one program we have is called project share.

quote:

3. The government itself. A program to cover costs. The problem is that we the taxpayers would end up paying for a $4 mil program that disbursed $400K in benefits.

< Message edited by Sanity -- 1/27/2009 7:24:23 AM >

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 35

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:23:31 AM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

And where was this guy's family... where was his church, or his social worker. Why aren't they equally to blame with the utility, assuming the gentleman who died had no part in it.

I don't believe he had any children, and his wife died year ago. At his age, few people have any family left...

It's interesting that after the dismantling of much of society and of social solidarity by a brutal, ruthless capitalism, and rampant individualism, we should hear that we should rely upon neighbours and families and friends. You know very well that the 1950s are long gone, Sanity.

_____________________________

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 36

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:25:10 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

Welfare dismantled families, kitten.

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 37

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:26:25 AM

sirsholly

Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

The flip side of the coin is that if the utilities don't have a way to enforce payment, if they're made to give their product away then they will go broke, and no one will have benefit of its use.

i think those who take the utility companies for a ride are few and far between. Most want to pay their debts.

Are you kidding? People will try to mooch whatever they can, not saying the old man did, but there's a good reason the companies are so jaded towards people who owe.

nope...not kidding. There are always going to be those who want something for nothing, but the average person? I don't think so.

_____________________________

PICKED UPON
TECHNO-DOLT
MEMBER OF THE SUBBIE MAFIA
GRACEFULLY CHALLENGED :::::splat:::::
BOOT WHORE
VAA/S FAN

GIVES GOOD HEART (Lushy)

CREATOR OF MAYHEM (practice)

(in reply to Lynnxz)

Post #: 38

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:26:57 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

Welfare and feminism.

"Brutal capitalism" has been feeding the family unit practically since time began.

< Message edited by Sanity -- 1/27/2009 7:28:50 AM >

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 39

RE: What life is worth - 1/27/2009 7:32:02 AM

subtee

Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline

~FR

The issue for me is obvious as well. Do we want to be a country and a people that will allow some of us--in this case an elderly man--to die in order that the relatively few who would otherwise take advantage aren't able to?

We don't know his situation, we have to make assumptions.

Either he could pay and didn't, or he couldn't pay. What do you choose to assume?

If he couldn't pay (for whatever reason, for example, he simply didn't have the money or he was challenged with senility), should he have been cut off?

If he could pay and didn't, does that justify his death? (Again, we have to assume: he was a miser, he hated the utility company, he loved to scam...)

If he could pay and didn't, how is society benefitted by cutting off his power--not letting him get away with it?

Since we have to make assumptions or else contact every citizen personally when they fall behind, which way should our assumptions fall?

_____________________________

Don't believe everything you think...

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 40

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 5 next > >>

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: What life is worth

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 5 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.094