RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?"

RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (Full Version)

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MsDDom -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 9:19:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tavane but I'm wondering if mistresses exist who actually find a fraction of the pleasure from that type of arrangement as the slave; or if it's far more common for mistresses to inflict pain, punishment, extreme humiliation, etc, so they can achieve their pleasure, and find that the idea of having an "ordinary" slave to be pretty boring and not something they are interested in. Since I'm so submissive, I can't imagine getting pleasure out of having a slave, even though the lifestyle benefits are huge, and wonder if mistresses exist who do find adequate pleasure in that. Tavane whatever that sub/slave is presenting to the Mistress, she will either say yea or nay to it. there r, i am sure, a variety of needs a Mistress desires to have fulfilled...even the tasks u listed. not every Mistress is how u stated in ur post just like not every sub is like u. the situation will definitely dictate who is for Who.

sintyl -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 9:25:40 PM)
Doms like that do exist. But sometimes, fate has a cruel twist. [:D]

Nikitaa -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 9:37:45 PM)
Is okay with me but I would need boyfriend or extra submissive for my other kink hobbies.

undergroundsea -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 9:39:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tavane This is pretty rare stuff. I don't know of a single night club you can go to anywhere, and find this subculture, and dominant women, so that you ccould meet them face to face, and have some fun, and get to know them, just like regular relationships form. Club FEM and local BDSM groups might provide such opportunities. I sense the matter about feminine appearance is fairly important to you. What message do you think is most important to take away about this point? Cheers, Sea

Andalusite -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 9:42:32 PM)
Well, I would find that kind of relationship pretty unsatisfying, especially with a heavy emphasis on feminization/cross-dressing. I don't mind a little bit of occasional play in that area, but wouldn't want it all the time.

Tavane -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 10:12:51 PM)
Ohio has a ClubFem, and Cincinnati has some stuff, but that's far from me. I live almost in Michigan. I don't expect to find much acceptance of my feminine desires. Women nearly always like masculine men, just as I like feminine women. I wasn't feminine around my girlfirends, since I knew they didn't want to see that. I do wish I had explored and accepted my submission with my long term girlfriend, since she was so domineering anyway, but I hated it about myself. I always did what she told me, but not becasue I was submissive. I just didn't want her to get mad. But when it came to important things, I did as I pleased. Perhaps I was subconsciously scared of what would happen if I agreed to become her slave. I pretty much was anyway. LOL. She was unusual, since she wanted to have sex constantly. I never had a girlfriend like her. On our first date we went back to her apartment, and kissed once, and she got out a blanket, laid it on the floor, and started undressing me. I'd like to have sex by myself in the morning, to get rid of sexual tensions, and that would make her mad, since I wasn't as fully charged when I went to her house after work. When we lived together, I'd often wake up to find she was having sex with me. We dated for 15 years, and I never heard of a woman who loved sex as much as she did. She'd just tell her daughter not to come in the bedroom, and we'd have sex. We had as much sex as a young man is capable of. It was great, except for her complaining when I couldnt have sex often enough, since guys do have limitations on how much sex they can have, and she was aware of mine, and exhausted me for many years. I think twice a day is enough sex, generally but she didn't. With all that sex, I was blurting out submissive fantasies a great deal, and she'd get irked that I'd never follow through on it, but I was ashamed of them, and could be kind of a jerk after sex, because I was so embarrassed by them. With her, I could have gone without the TG stuff, but I just couldn't accept it in myself. She dominated me anyway, so I suppose I should have just submitted to her, and gotten pleasure from it, but I hated it about myself. It was just so strange to me, to have those desires. I couldn't deal with it. I was certain I was about the only guy in the world like that. The TG desires were bad enough, but I had TG friends in Michigan and Ohio, so I didn't feel so bad about those, but knew she didn't like them.

ShaktiSama -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 10:29:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tavane I am very submissive, but not into pain or bondage, or licking boots, etc. I just want to be a slave, and do everything for my mistress, including all household stuff, laundry, cooking, etc; and her nails and/or hair if hse wishes, and to be totally dependent on her financially, and to obey her always. It would be exciting to be restrained, but I'd be so attuned to obeying her that I'd not deserve any punishment. My question is, what is in this for the mistress, in terms of pleasure? Being served, especially by someone with a gift for service, is a great pleasure. Honestly, I think that the men and women who have a genuine talent for this sort of thing are seldom praised sufficiently for the way they stand above the rest. It's not just about obeying, it's about doing what is needed promptly, doing it well, and having the ability for form an intuitive service bond with your dominant--not everyone can do that. A submissive who can is a true treasure.

Tavane -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 10:47:25 PM)
I'm glad that some mistresses enjoy this kind of thing. I do believe in learning what she wants, and doing it without being told, as a natural way of life, from the moment she has me wake her up in the morning, until the time she goes to bed. Most people do have routines, and a mistress will have hers, in addition to specific things she wants occasionally. What thoes routines are, only she will know, and she might change them, as time goes by. I don't have interest in punishment; rather in making her happy.

AAkasha -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/9/2009 11:16:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tavane I'm glad that some mistresses enjoy this kind of thing. I do believe in learning what she wants, and doing it without being told, as a natural way of life, from the moment she has me wake her up in the morning, until the time she goes to bed. Most people do have routines, and a mistress will have hers, in addition to specific things she wants occasionally. What thoes routines are, only she will know, and she might change them, as time goes by. I don't have interest in punishment; rather in making her happy. I still sometimes have a hard time getting my head around what this would "look like." I don't have a domestic bone in my body - never have, never will. I don't cook, clean, do laundry, iron or do dishes, vacuum or shop at the grocery store. I haven't done any of those things for 8 years or so. In some ways that makes me VERY reliant on my "houseboy"/husband/best friend/slut/slave." He does not work (except for now, during an experiment of sorts, he's been working part time - sometimes nearly full time, and I consider it a failed experiment, to be honest, and one thank god that is ending soon) except to make sure every single detail in my life is handled so that I can focus on the one thing I do well: make money and run a business. I'm a self employed chronic workaholic who also needs a full time "life assistant" (call it an executive assistant, because that's what he does) - so he's also a full time employee in my business when he isn't cooking, cleaning and running errands. Oh, and I am on a wonderfully crazy eating regimen I started 13 months ago: I eat 5 small meals a day instead of 3, and all of them are prepared for me. Yikes! You can see he is busy. But there is VERY little of this sort of dress up, pampering, prettied-up kind of "loving service" which always SOUNDS like that from the outside. On the inside,we're running a household like a BUSINESS, because that's what it takes to keep it all going. I don't have kids, but if I did, I imagine it'd be even more intense. Busy couples in vanilla land often have to schedule time for sex; it's no wonder the idea of a full time "houseboy" with an S&M dynamic isn't TOO realistic. There's too much work involved in being a couple, lovers, best friends FIRST, then comes the domestics, the mundanes, the chores, then under it all, for us, is a heavy current of S&M with me in charge - period. I can't feasibly imagine how I could create and control a dynamic that added the necessary nurturing that it sounds like you would need, or that most service subs need. The affirmation, the affection, the outfits, the structure. My sub structures my life by being my "worldly assistant" - and the reason he is SO valuable is that it is 100% motivated and driven by him - he's the ultimate self starter, because he needs no direction. He observes a task, masters it, implements it, and never has to be told twice. Thinking three steps ahead of me is what allows this household to run the way it does, and with that in mind, I have very little nurturing to do on that level - and that's good, because I couldn't handle that on top of a full time job. Different couples have different arrangements so I'm not saying it's impossible. But when things like manicures or pedicures and footrubs become nourishment for my sub's soul, that's when I think we'd run into trouble. Because for the sake of intimacy and efficiency combined, I'm much more effectively pampered if he makes my salon appointment by checking my calendar and slotting it in, drives me to it, runs his other errands, picks me up, and then runs my phone call/messages down the list with me as he drives me to my next client meeting. Busy people don't have time to structure warm-fuzzies in the form of bdsm service - so if it's a flavor I can see it being realistic, but if it's a foundation I can see it as a recipe for disappointment. I have my sexual needs (more on that later) that are very demanding and high; he prefers his intimacy that way too, and not from the service in our relationship. That's just a necessary evil. However, he's better at domestic stuff than I am - no two ways about that. His "nourishment" comes from the other aspects of the relationship that are working, my overall wellbeing and happiness and the autonomy he is given as well as his sense of accomplishment when he keeps my life in order. He does not need affirmation much, thank god, because I don't usually have time to appreciate him nearly enough; when it comes to massages and footrubs and other things, I actually prefer sadism, cruelty and rough sex, on my terms, to feed my dominance. His rewards in this area come from the intensity of power exchange on my terms. I guess where I get tripped up is the idea that "service submission" does not require anything from the femdom. It does. And defining what that is, so that the service sub doesn't feel used and under appreciated, is key. I can't nurture a man if I feel like he's sucking the life out of me with a sense of neediness -- I need a man who serves me and the entire function of his service is it's own reward, and I can reward him in completely different ways through our sexuality, romance and friendship. If the service had to be the cornerstone of our relationship, even though is role is service, I think it would self destruct. And if he had to adjust all his service stuff to accommodate fetishes (like dressing or being commanded) nothing would ever get done. I am not sure how other couples do that. I sure would like to know! I do think, though, that above everything else, the relationship you seek must start from a place of romantic intimacy on some level or at least the capacity to be best friends (ie, roommates with frills) - because I can't imagine co-habitating in such an intense fashion being feasible without someone who is on best friend or soul mate level. Maybe I am not thinking outside the box enough though. Akasha

MissAnimus -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 5:52:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tavane It would be nice to move to live with a woman as her slave, and get a feminine job such as a legal secretary, (supervised by women, of course), but I'm getting pretty old. You forgot to add nurse or school teacher. [:'(] [:'(] [:'(]

OttersSwim -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 6:30:58 AM)
So a positive experience post about this. My Lady recently reconnected with a submissive trans-man. He drove an hour and a half and spent 3 hours cleaning and organizing her closet. She did not have to dress him, he dressed himself. Supervision was minimal, conversation was good. He did a fabulous job. [:)] He received nothing for his service, but if they do it again, they will likely trade out for sensation play as he is a masochist.

sensura -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 6:53:49 AM)
From what Ive read, I really dont see any desire for the bdsm lifestyle. Im thinking you are looking more for a vanilla women who you can pamper. I read that you think vanilla women do not desire the kind of affection and attention that you would like to give. However, there are many out there that would love that. There is a difference in being a naturally submissive person and a submissive in this lifestyle. You mention that you would not like to be whipped or punished, however that is a part of this lifestyle and what a sub desires if not done to be abusive. Some want and crave pain and some want the fine line. Also the sexual part of this lifestyle is a must, its the foundation. I really think you are a naturally submissive person who enjoys pampering your lady and needing a vanilla relationship which involves sub qualitys but not an actual bdsm sub lifestyle. Good luck in your search. Im sure you would make someone a great partner.

Tavane -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 7:32:02 AM)
To Akasha: People vary infinitely, and it appears you don't enjoy pampering from your slave, and/or perhaps he doesn't enjoy it. I do think many women find it a bit too feminine for someone they enjoy as a man. Obviously as a matter of time, it would be much faster to have your slave do your nails/hair than to go to a salon, but going to a salon itself is very enjoyable for many women, especially if you have friends there, and everyone needs some time away from the person they live with. I'd help my girlfriend frost her hair, not as a submissive thing, but just because she wanted me to, and I can remember her yelling at me when I'd pull her hair through these holes in this cap, if I pulled too hard on her hair. Once she had some left, and put some on my hair, and we both liked it, and for years thereafter I would have my hair lightened at a beauty school, so I know what it's like to sit in a salon while a girl works on your hair for a while, and then to sit under a dryer, and then have her comb it out and stuff, and I loved it. A few times the students actually asked me if I wanted them to curl it, and naturally I did, but said no. We all have somewhat irrational limits. Obviously a guy who looks like a girl, and goes in every two months or so to have his hair lightened, likes being girly, but it was hard for me to go that final step in a place full of students and clients, and to have it curled, though I did have my hair washed and set in rollers twice at a different beauty school, and it was incredibly exciting. (And also very submissive, since you are "under her control" as soon as she starts washing your hair, and she is feminizing you, and there is nothing you can do about it). It was just too embarrassing, so I only did it a couple of times. In a normal 40 hours per week working situation, I would think most mistresses would have plenty of time for pampering, and so would the slave. I would think he'd be finished with the after dinner dishes by 7:00 or so, even if she wanted really nice meals every night, and if she enjoys watching TV and reading, he can pamper her for hours; so I think it's a matter of most women not really enjoying that from a slave, and would prefer that such things be done for them by women, rather than the slave that she prefers as a masculine male. As I said, I don't think many mistresses would be interested in the type of slave I'd enjoy being. It's too feminine for them, regardless of how you are dressed, but as a slave, I regard that stuff as the best stuff, since you are touching and bonding and talking, in a very submissive scenario. I love tactile stimulation, and fell in love with one girl friend while we'd give each other back rubs while watching TV and listening to music and talking. I can't get enough ot it, either giving it or getting it, and could happily spend each evening doing my mistress's nails, her hair, and massaging her feet and legs or whatever for hours. If she wanted to engage in her own kinks, that would be up to her, so long as I could deal with them. I know it sounds boring, but the pleasure is irresistible, and I'd much rather be pampering her for hours each evening while we talked and/or watched TV, than just to talk/watch TV. It's not fatiguing work. It's pure pleasure, but I think too feminine for most women, who also enjoy the conversation and other aspects of salons. You seem very busy, but most people do work 40 hour jobs, and have several hours in the evening to relax. Major housecleaning and laundry can be done on weekends. MissAnimus: I don't regard schoolteacher as feminine, and many male nurses exist, but hairdressers and secretaries are still very feminine jobs. Being an attorney, I'd be a great legal secretary for some female attorney. I sometimes think that if I had grown up in this era, with support groups and places like this, I would have become a hairdresser or a secretary, knowing I could be in a feminine job, working with and subordinate to women all day long, for the rest of my life, and if I was a hairdresser, doing their hair. That was just unheard of when I was young, but I would have been very happy from the intrinsic submissive and feminine pleasure I'd receive from that type of occupation, and would have loved becoming superb in my job, to please the women. When you are young, you don't realize this is going to rule your life forever, and I thought I was the only person in the world who had such desires. I fought everything> My mother wished I was a girl, and would often tell me what a pretty girl I'd be, and sometimes would try to get me interested in girl things, but I rebelled against that, especially since I knew I wanted to be a girl so badly, and was afraid of it.

Tavane -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 7:53:05 AM)
To Sensura: I think it's too much for vanilla women, who tend to be submissive themselves. They want an equal relationship, and a masculine partner. This is a very feminine role, regardless of how you dress. Even dominant women don't seem to find it appealing, and I think one major reason is that they regard it as too feminine. They want to dominate a "man", not appease a male's own submissive feminine desires. I do sometimes thing that my long term girlfriend might have accepted it (absent the female dressing), since she was so domineering, and would remark that I never followed through with what I had talked about during sex, but I refused to let that happen, and frankly don't think she'd have enjoyed the pampering, finding it too feminine. She'd undoubtedly have loved me doing the housework, cooking, and laundry, though, and was always angry when I'd go home. She always wanted me to sleep at her house, but she went to bed early, and once we'd had sex, I went home, since I stayed up late, and could play music and not worry about waking her or her daughter up. If I'd agreed to be her slave, she'd have married me, and kept me at home constantly, unless I was out with her. She didn't like all the time I spent with my friends. We were engaged, but I just couldn't give up my "free" life, and had this place existed then, I certainly would have asked her if I could be her slave, and my life probably would have been totally different. We broke up about 12 years ago, and sometimes I think I should have dinner with her and mention it, but though we are friends, I almsot never see her, and don't think she is interested in my anymore, though I always get birthday and Chrismas cards from her and her daughter.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 8:11:57 AM)
Tavane, you THINK vanilla women are like this or that Dommes are too far away... Well, most vanilla women will not be threatened by you, yes they will NOT want you as a partner, but to be honest, sitting around and complaining also won't get you a partner. I talked to a vanilla friend and asked her what she would think about a feminine guy, dressed up as a woman, doing her ironing and giving her pedicures, she said she would love it, she would want to get to know the person first to make sure she's not inviting an axe murderer or a psychopath into her house but she said she can't see anything wrong with it. Why not put an ad in your local paper, "CD will do your ironing and will give you a pedicure. Service available ONLY for women..." See how many takers you get, if it goes all wrong and nobody answers, all you have lost is the price of an ad, which will hardly cost the world.

AAkasha -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 8:30:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze Tavane, you THINK vanilla women are like this or that Dommes are too far away... Well, most vanilla women will not be threatened by you, yes they will NOT want you as a partner, but to be honest, sitting around and complaining also won't get you a partner. I talked to a vanilla friend and asked her what she would think about a feminine guy, dressed up as a woman, doing her ironing and giving her pedicures, she said she would love it, she would want to get to know the person first to make sure she's not inviting an axe murderer or a psychopath into her house but she said she can't see anything wrong with it. Why not put an ad in your local paper, "CD will do your ironing and will give you a pedicure. Service available ONLY for women..." See how many takers you get, if it goes all wrong and nobody answers, all you have lost is the price of an ad, which will hardly cost the world. I think the OP has had an opportunity to explore this in relationships that were already in place, and it didn't work out; what I keep coming back to is wondering if the roadblock isn't in finding the opportunity for service but finding a situation where the OP can "relate" to the woman in a manner that is very specific. It can be a subtle but totally underlying foundation for a relationship. The OP keeps coming back to "women want a man who is masculine" etc etc....I am in a service-relationship with my man and he is not masculine, macho or any kind of a guy who I need to 'take care of me' in a manly way - but he is also not doting, clingy etc. This ideal of how women "were supposed to be" in the 50s or whatever - the feminine, sweet, etc (I have a hard time verbalizing it) to me it seems like the OP has eroticized an ideal and a dynamic that just might not be practical because it requires window dressing (emotionally). If a woman is busy enough, demanding enough, tough enough, self supporting enough, she's not necessarily going to have the time or patience to create a setting or "feel" around a service relationship. If the OP was not able to make this work in a scenario with a girlfriend (who obviously cared) by being a proactive submissive, doing all those things without asking/needing the window dressing in return, how is it going to work in a relationship with no foundation? There's a disconnect somewhere. And to the other point made by the OP -- I don't work 40 hours a week. I don't think any self supporting person works those few hours and has enough money to survive. And I don't have down time in the quantity you speak of - I travel a lot, I have a ton of social engagements between family and friends, etc. But it all comes back to priorities I guess. My priorities to recharge my batteries are to go to a hockey game where I have season tickets, not stay home and read a magazine and get a leg massage. You need a woman who has priorities in column B. But I think even women who enjoy being pampered don't want it in such high doses - they want girl time (with their female friends), shopping time (sometimes alone), hobbies, etc. and not just getting foot rubs etc. I get plenty of sensual, sexual nurturing from my man but it's to please me, not to please him - if that makes sense. I make sure his needs are filled -- after mine. Akasha

Tavane -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 8:35:01 AM)
Women vary infinitely, but I'd only be interested in a partner, so we could be at least good friends. I'm not interested in going to a woman's house and doing her laundry or nails while I know she's laughing at me, however silently, and I am very secretive about it. Even close friends can't keep secrets. I didn't go to a ClufFem convention because you had to use your real name on reservations. Both my long term girlfriends told at least one other person about my TG desires, and I'm confident my ex-girlfriend has told her daughter everything about me, but I love her daughter, so that's okay. However, when you tell somebody something very unusual, you might as well broadcast it to the world. That's the reality of life. Every person has at least one close friend/spouse/etc that they simply can't resist telling, swearing that person of course to keep it a secret, and that person has at least one such friend to confide in, and on and on. The reality is that you can't actually trust people who love you, so people who don't could care less about your privacy. My brother lost his job once and had to live with me, so I told him about my TG desires, swearing him not to tell. The first thing he did was to tell his girlfriend, later his wife. I didn't like her and she didn't like me, and I'm sure her whole family and all their friends get lots of laughs about it. I was so angry, and he said "Oh, she won't tell." Right. That's the last time I ever told him anything about my life, and whenever he'd mention anything about it, I'd just move on to another topic. I never forgave him for that. My best friend said that he had a hard time not telling his wife. That's one reason I never mentioned submissive desires to these people, but I have no doubt that my ex-girlfirend's daughter knows all about those, as well as the TG stuff. People who like/love you know they shouldn't tell anyone, but they just can't resist it.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 8:42:03 AM)
Well, I don't do house work, I simply lack the ability, when I am trying to do anything else but cooking (a hobby) it ends up worse than before, my cleaning efforts are legendary - they look like a bomb hit the place, I can't imagine I'm the only woman on the planet who rather has a career than be a home maker, some women actually might simply enjoy help with their cleaning, cooking, ironing and enjoy a pedicure. You and I might not be typical. I spend quite a bit on pedicures, now somebody who enjoys giving me a pedicure and does a great job, possibly with a flexible schedule that suits my schedule much better than the salon, I'd love that. The think is the OP has a desire and wants those kinks fulfilled, chances that it will happen in a relationship are fairly slim, but people who are not in relationships aren't all living chaste, are they? So I see nothing wrong in such an exchange being based on a friendship instead of a kinky relationship. It simply seem to be more effective to do something about your needs than sit and complain that you aren't getting them fulfilled - unless of course one has a fetish for complaining.

OttersSwim -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 8:45:26 AM)
Why do you care what others think of you? What you are is not wrong or bad or perverted...it is nothing to feel shame about. This is not about trust, it is about self-acceptance, IMO. You only get one chance to be you. If you can be comfortable in your own skin, then who knows who or what you are becomes largely irrelevant. You are not a secret to be kept and hidden away.

Tavane -> RE: Do many dominants truly enjoy "service submissives?" (2/10/2009 8:49:03 AM)
To Akasha: People vary infinitely. You can't judge a person in today's context when all of this happened more than 20 years ago. I would have explored it very differently if I'd had these net resources back then. Every relationship needs a balance, and it would be up to the mistress what that balance was, but obviously I need to be happy in a relationship, or I'm going to leave it. I was happy with my girlfriend in our relationship. I refused to explore submitting to her totally, but back then, I think you can understand why. Although the relationship is about pleasing the mistress, the only reason the slave pleases the mistress is because he's happy. If the dynamics of the relationship make him unhappy, he won't be her slave much longer. The slave always has an equal say as to whether or not the relationship will continue. Ideally, you wind up in a relationship where she controls all the money, property, etc, so it's difficult to leave. That in itself is very exciting, but I'd not get into that scenario unless I found we were very happy for a long period, and in the final analysis, you can always leave and move on with your life, even in that scenario. Compatibility is always the main thing, and attraction, affection, and happiness. There is no formula for this, since people vary infinitely. I never did expect to find what I want, but might find some of what I want. You never know.

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