Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely?


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4 5   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 6:28:25 PM   
MissSepphora1


Posts: 669
Joined: 1/11/2008
Status: offline 		I have had a raging war within my own mind for several days *weeks* about this subject.
I am not a feminist by any means.  I believe women should be treated better than men - not necessarily better pay, but more polite, open doors, don't swear or behave badly in front of me, that sort of thing.
I am an independant woman, taking care of a family alone for the past 10 years or so.  I wouldn't say I've chosen to be alone, but more or less that is how life has gone for me.  I have been told I'm attractive, blonde, blue eyes, big boobs, petite, long real fingernails, and before I got all my hair cut off it was long and blonde: the whole nine yards.  I am what you believe society is striving to show as attractive.
And yet I have been alone.  And yet some women who claim to be feminist couldn't see themselves without a man. 
Perhaps I'm just ranting here, and not being very coherent.  But I can't understand some women.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 6:39:29 PM   
xBullx


Posts: 4206
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline 		Equality is an illusion for the politically correct contingent.  Don’t confuse yourself with superficiality. Live true to your personal nature and when you discover internal honesty you won’t even consider such foolish endeavors such as you have here.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to rednicky)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 8:02:34 PM   
TheShrew


Posts: 519
Joined: 2/15/2009
From: The state I live in? Confusion.
Status: offline 		 
.. *deletes her rambling contribution*..

< Message edited by TheShrew -- 2/15/2009 8:35:48 PM >

(in reply to rednicky)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 8:18:43 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

Thanks for the ideas. It is certainly worth to think through. Of course, I am skeptical. Just reading the synopsis makes me to suspect that professor Buss tries to explain too much based on mating strategies. Just a suspicion, I need to read it first.



Sorry if I came across as abrupt.  I was (and still am) very much into understanding people, cultural, politics and civilizations. 

When I was studying for my undergrad degree, like many students I was very interested in psychology and sociology (even got a degree in sociology), but found many of the theories little more than bunkum when I ran them through my "finely honed bullshit detector".

Evolutionary psychology only started gaining adherents and becoming a major branch of science after I got my undergraduate degree (1982), and I've not had the time to spend massive amounts of time reading and studying.

But my BS detector doesn't sing nearly so loud in my head as I read about it as other theories of human behavior often do.  As a science, it doesn't pretend to "have all the answers", just a general theory that gives a framework in which to form the questions in a manner that can be investigated.

In the Buss book, he leaves several questions unanswered due to lack of verifiable information and research. Since that book was originally written over 10 years ago, there has been more research and advancement, and other authors have additional insights that are valuable.

One of the biggest problems with EP is that it doesn't always agree with many "political acceptable" theories. The EP theories of rape, for example, when expressed to the general public will likely get you in a bit of hot water (I have an ebook copy of Thornhills 2001 "The Natural History of Rape" that you are welcome to, if you'll give me an email addy).

When it comes to answering questions such as the OPs, there are many well meaning and comforting answers that do not really shed that much light on why the sexes are different, and why we do what we do.  But if someone is really interested, then EP is probably the most likely to give accurate answers.

Even if we don't wish to accept them.

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 8:48:33 PM   
MissSepphora1


Posts: 669
Joined: 1/11/2008
Status: offline 		Wow... I followed your link and you know, at my age I didn't think I could be shocked by much.
But for someone to pay money to read that crap, and actually believe it?
I don't want to hijack the thread, but I really hope you don't believe those theories.

I'm going to edit this to add just this thought:
Then I supposed we should sterilize every rapist.  That would take care of his biological need to impregnate.  Solves our problem.

< Message edited by MissSepphora1 -- 2/15/2009 8:51:48 PM >

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 8:53:03 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

Wow... I followed your link and you know, at my age I didn't think I could be shocked by much.
But for someone to pay money to read that crap, and actually believe it?
I don't want to hijack the thread, but I really hope you don't believe those theories.



Specifically what "theories", and what shocks you and why?

(This is likely some of that "hot water" I mentioned in my last post, methinks.)

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MissSepphora1)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 9:05:27 PM   
MissSepphora1


Posts: 669
Joined: 1/11/2008
Status: offline 		I will only say, being female gives a certain advantage over the perspective and reasoning behind rape.
Rape as a reproductive tool makes no sense, considering men rape other men, especially in a prison setting.  Men rape young boys more often as pedophiles than men rape young girls. 
Also, the alpha male in the animal kingdom - apes and dogs - will also force sex on other males.  Does that have anything to do with reproduction?
This theory is just, for lack of a techincal term, loony.

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 9:21:09 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
I'm glad that a few minutes reading of some of the Amazon reviews have made you an expert on Thornhill's book.

Science is just so easy when we don't have to actually, ya know ... read the research and theories.

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MissSepphora1)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 9:23:44 PM   
MissSepphora1


Posts: 669
Joined: 1/11/2008
Status: offline 		Okay, so the book does, or doesn't state that rape is about reproduction?

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 9:38:57 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

Okay, so the book does, or doesn't state that rape is about reproduction?


Check your cmail.

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MissSepphora1)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 10:13:19 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Shit Firm,the rest of us are waiting for an answer too......does this book state rape is about reproduction.
The natural imperative of a species to reproduce?
What the fuck ever happened to dinner and a movie?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 10:18:14 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		Mike,

The book and it's concepts deserve more than a post, or even it's own thread.

I'm not as interested in getting into a discussion about some of the theories of rape in accordance with EP as much as I am in EP as a whole.

The book is not my work, and I'm sure that many will disagree or wish to argue many of the author's points.  Which is fine by me.  It's the discussion along the way that makes the journey worthwhile.

If you are really interested, send me an email

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 10:39:03 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Firm,you have c-mail

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 10:43:31 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Evolutionary psychology only started gaining adherents and becoming a major branch of science after I got my undergraduate degree (1982),

Am I correct to assume that Evolutionary Psychology has more to do with evolution of "social memory" than the evolution in terms of genetics?  

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/15/2009 11:51:36 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

quote:

Evolutionary psychology only started gaining adherents and becoming a major branch of science after I got my undergraduate degree (1982),

Am I correct to assume that Evolutionary Psychology has more to do with evolution of "social memory" than the evolution in terms of genetics?  


No.  It has little or nothing to do with "social memory".

Not even sure what "social memory" even is. 

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/16/2009 12:16:04 AM   
FullfigRIMAAM1


Posts: 1160
Joined: 11/20/2008
Status: offline
quote:

Why is it that, regardless of the surroundings, women as a whole, seem to follow men blindly? Especially when there are more women than men ANYWAY!
I work in a majority women field, but if the surrounding men approach us disrespectfully, we make it so uncomfortable for him, that he either changes his ways, or becomes bitter and separated from the masses.    The women I work with, with few exceptions, do not follow any man blindly.     M

_____________________________

The place to improve the world is first in one's own heart and head and hands.-Robert M. Persig

Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence Erich Fromm

(in reply to rednicky)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/16/2009 1:55:11 AM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

No. It has little or nothing to do with "social memory".

I was thinking under social memory as accumulation of knowlege and understanding (evolution of the information sphere in general). In terms of genetic evolution I am used of thinking that genetic traits propagate through offspring. It seems to me in human race preffered mate (traditionally women prefer strong, rich, smart) selection does not lead to more than average (rather less) offspring. For example poor and uneducated in average have more children than educated and rich. So leaving more copies of genes or even healthier children is not any more the purpose of selecting a mate. It is rather trivial though and obviously noticed.

(in reply to FullfigRIMAAM1)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/16/2009 4:06:02 AM   
MissSepphora1


Posts: 669
Joined: 1/11/2008
Status: offline 		Above the rich and educated, the truly desired females in this society, models, actresses, singers, rarely have more than one or two children.  And most wait until after normal reproductive age to have them.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/16/2009 8:04:16 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		MissS,

Evolutionary theory isn't quite as simplistic as many believe, nor is it as straight forward as x = y.

Sometimes there are "artifacts" within an organism that are left over or purely accidental by-products of other changes, that may have little or no value for an organism under it's present environment.

Under a different environment, at a later time, such traits can become highly successful or deadly to an individual organism or species.

But probably the most important change of view that might be helpful to you is the concept advanced by Dawkins in "The Selfish Gene" which posits that individual members of a species aren't actually trying to reproduce themselves, as much as they are really just "survival machines" with the goal of maximizing the population of their genes. (wiki link). 

Dawkins also posited the social "meme" concept in this work, which has been pretty much discredited in the 30 or so years since he wrote his book, but it's a concept that has found wide use politically and socially since then.

My goal here are to point you towards works that are better at explaining and will give you a more detailed background in evolutionary theory. 

Spend some time reading, and perhaps we can discuss things on a different level.

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MissSepphora1)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? - 2/16/2009 8:11:24 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

Above the rich and educated, the truly desired females in this society, models, actresses, singers, rarely have more than one or two children.  And most wait until after normal reproductive age to have them.


Which is why the education and liberation of women may be an anti-survival trait which may not continue.

Cultures which allow and encourage such a "waste" (genetically speaking) may be sowing the seeds of their own destruction.

Western culture itself may be a failed evolutionary "experiment", considering that the more free, educated and non-religious a nation is, generally the lower the birth rate.  Time will tell.

Firm

< Message edited by FirmhandKY -- 2/16/2009 8:12:33 AM >

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MissSepphora1)
Profile   Post #: 60
Page:   <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4 5   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: Are women 'really' equal to men? Truely? Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4 5   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094