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RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/15/2009 5:56:55 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
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quote:

To both s and d types do you feel weighed down by experience, crave new experiences, or are you proud to have experience? How useful is past experience? Are there experiences which you are proud of and experiences which you are not?

I notoriously suck at relationships!! I get more and more weighed down, bogged down by each and every single failure i go through.
I crave new experiences all the time, new scenes, new torture - yummy. The one thing that i really crave for though is a relationship that works and is fulfilling and nourishing and everything it should be.
I'm proud to have experience in BDSM activities etc but i'm not proud to have experience in failing at relationships.
Past experience should be extremely useful and i think for most probably is. Me however i manage to convince myself that history can't repeat itself because i learnt from last time. Or that this time is different because although the similar / same pattern / action is there there's also x,y,z that makes up for it.
Truthfully i wish i could just erase all my past experience when it comes to relationships and just start afresh. Look at things through new eyes, not be so jaded, so battle scarred, so weary of mistakes, errors and letting them happen.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 41

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 12:45:37 AM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

You are the common denominator in all of your relationships. If you don't like the outcome then you have to step back and really look at the choices you're making. I've been there, done that. You have nothing to lose by trying a different approach. Try picking a different type of person. You may just find that you can get those thrills that you seek and have all of the fulfilling aspects of a healthy relationship.

edited to add....as for experience. I had lots of experience with light bondage and a few ass swats and face taps. I wasn't a masochist so I never looked for a sadist. None of that did me any good because he is wonderfully sadistic and takes great pleasure in hitting me. Each relationship is unique and will build on bits and pieces of prior experience. And some parts will be completely new territory. All my experience in bondage didn't help me at all in learning how to deal with receiving pain.

< Message edited by Aileen1968 -- 2/16/2009 12:49:34 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 42

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 3:51:21 AM

StrangerThan

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I'll probably be one of the few who says it depends. A good part of what it depends on is something KatyLied nailed in one phrase.

"unless it is stemming from some sort of inability to sustain long term relationships"

I wrote on another thread recently something about being a transition in transition. I've had enough transitory phases and experiences when it comes to relationships. I reached a point several years ago when I decided that if that was all I was going to get, I really wasn't interest. Experience can also bring its own form of baggage - something I am quite well aware of on a personal level. So yes, to a degree, it depends. But it's only part of the equation. The rest of that equation is the person.

There's no glib one-liner that will answer this. To some it will matter. To others it will not. Decide what you need first, not what someone else needs.

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 43

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 5:20:46 AM

chezzy71

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Joined: 4/19/2008
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All i know is at the end of the day regardless of how many experiences i have had or Mistress for that matter...i wish to be loved and wanted and i am sure the same holds true for Mistress.No drama,no games..just affection at its highest level.

(in reply to StrangerThan)

Post #: 44

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 5:44:18 AM

CatdeMedici

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Joined: 10/20/2008
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There is a great song from Auntie Mame, that says: " Open a new window, open a new door, travel a new highway thats never been travelled beforem before you find you're a dull fellow, stuck in the same spot..."

Well you get the idea----we all make bad decisions, make mistakes,--I think AIleen was the one that said in a string of broken relationships there is one common denominator--you. I saw that after marriage number 3 23+years ago, I didn't want a relationship, not yet.. I had too much to accomplish, too much to do and I really like living alone---despite what society , the press, stats and My friends said and felt--it was and has ben right for Me. Society puts this pressure on us:

You HAVE to have a mate, if you don't your asexual or a closet something

You HAVE to have two parents or you will grow up and be warped

You HAVE to own a house, have this, have that

You HAVE to be this or that

I say THAT'S CRAP. I've been a very successful business woman, raised an outstanding UM who was a donor pregnancy and I've been very very happy--alone--by choice. It is only now that I have done the many things I wanted that I am ready to take in another because I want to keep going and not because of any other reason.

Ladies, it is ok to be alone, it is ok if you don't find a mate, it is ok if when you do you've accomplished things in your life and you're ready. You are not defined by a mate--you are defined by you. However, you need to accept that you define you, you need to figure out what that definition is and you need to be true to that definition.

Who knows, I might see My life end with no relationship, but it won't end without Me having made an impact--regardless.

_____________________________

I am the Cat, holder of the whip and chair.

"Let's see-whips, dips, chains, chips, yep sounds like a party to Me!"

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 45

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 6:27:51 AM

oceanwynds

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Joined: 8/24/2006
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Prinsexx
I personally do not have experience on being a second hand sub. I can speak from experience of others in relation to vanilla relationships. My best friend had a lot of bad marriages, and felt that after her 3rd divorce no one would want her. I told her she has a lot of qualities that are good to offer, and knows now what does not work. She is on her 4th marriage and it is still blooming in wonders.

I was hubby's 3rd wife and he came in with a lot of experience and knew what didnt work and we had created success. He was my 2nd marriage, and i lived with 5 people prior to him, and except him all were disasters. I take responsibility for seeking men in drama and needing to be abusive to me. I take responsibility that i didnt care for myself and sought these types of behaviors. i changed that around though and had my success. Now i working with it with Sir.

As i said i dont have the BDSM experience to call on, but in reality no one is used, 2nd hand since each releationship offers new opportunites to grow and be aware of our own self sabateur.

blessings and best of luck to you
oceanwynds

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 46

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 7:11:31 AM

StrangerThan

Posts: 1515
Joined: 4/25/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CatdeMedici

You HAVE to have a mate, if you don't your asexual or a closet something

You HAVE to have two parents or you will grow up and be warped

You HAVE to own a house, have this, have that

You HAVE to be this or that

I say THAT'S CRAP.

It most definitely is crap. There are way too many people in this world who look outside themselves to find a reason to be happy. Kinksters are no more immune to that simple fact than any vanilla person ever born. If its not material things, it is some golden grail of domly or subly enlightenment, something folks feel like they must possess, must know, must experience in order to validate themselves to other people.

It is bullshit. I don't know how many times in the past couple of decades I've had someone say to me or say about someone else "I can make you/him happy." Its one of the bigger loads of crap romantic and relationship fuzzery has ever foisted upon the general notion of such things.

To the OP. Experience alone isn't what makes or breaks a person. It can be if you're riding that wave of new and newer sensations and expect someone else to simply provide it for you. Most everyone I know or have ever known who practices any form of BDSM is a sensation slut to a degree. Not only are we, we damned well revel in it.

That alone however, for most, doesn't make a life. Learning to enjoy yourself, like yourself goes a lot further down that road towards happiness and good relationships than anything else. Does experience matter? Yes, it can - not only to other people, but just as much to yourself. If you're accustomed to the whip, breath play, needles, being loaned and exchanged, then are you expecting the same from the next one along the line? Cause if you are, your experience is not the limiting factor in their eyes. It is in your own.

Everyone I've ever met in life has experiences they were not proud of. Most I've met have things they still want to experience. I never cared much about a person's past in terms of what they'd done or hadn't. What I cared about was the person and sometimes the baggage they brought with them. The reason I cared about that baggage was because for a good while, I carried some of my own that made it difficult for me and for anyone else. For that reason, I quit for a while. Just said fuck it, I'm going to spend the time to figure out what it is about me that took me down all those roads and still left me unsatisfied at the end of them. By the end of it, I looked at things in a different light, that being that even if we whipped, fucked, spent 4 or 5 hours of every single day involved in some type of BDSM activity it still left 19 hours of the day that I had to like the person in order to just tolerate them. So when a woman came to me as a submissive first and a person second, what she was really offering was the 4 - 5 hours of the day rather than the 19.

I'll take the 19 first, and spend the 4-5 discovering the submissive side to her with the idea of, if I'm going to be with someone, it would someone I could enjoy regardless of what we did. Cause ya know, life holds a lot more aspects to it than dominance and submission. One can be dominant without ever having a submissive. One can be submissive without ever having a dominant. Just because they finally come together doesn't and shouldn't mean the rest of life goes on hold. I want those aspects and experiences just as much.

(in reply to CatdeMedici)

Post #: 47

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 7:33:30 AM

eyesopened

Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
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Weighed down? Bogged down? By my experience?
Hell, I'm 55 years old and should I ever feel badly about having experience, in BDSM or any other aspect in life, well then I would be feeling bad about being ME. I am happy about being me. I am thrilled to have had the experiences I have, and I'm thrilled at the prospect of there being more and more things to experience in the future.

Look there are people who want to build a house from the foundation up. There are people who want to buy a new home already built. There are people who see the value in buying a house with an existing owner, where the landscaping is already in and maturing, where the settling has already taken place. The new owner can easily make certain modifications to make it more "theirs" And then there are some who love the challenge of a "fixer-upper" and specifically look for properties with huge potential with just a little work and tlc.

What nobody wants, is a property where the foundation is cracked, the timbers full of termites, dry-rot or mold.

Take care of what you have control over and let go of that which you don't.

_____________________________

Proudly owned by InkedMaster. He is the one i obey, serve, honor and love.

No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 48

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 8:20:57 AM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
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quote:

we all make bad decisions, make mistakes,--I think AIleen was the one that said in a string of broken relationships there is one common denominator--you

Very true, however this common denominator thing always bugs me a little. Yep we should be looking at ourselves and the mistakes we make and trying not to repeat them. Problem is though sometimes although you have learnt a lesson a wolf in sheeps clothing comes along and you end up repeating a mistake because you were fooled by the exterior. Now the common denominator there to me is a wolf in sheeps clothing, something that most people may not spot straight away. This its always your own fault attitude kind of pisses me off.

quote:

You HAVE to have a mate, if you don't your asexual or a closet something
I say THAT'S CRAP. I've been a very successful business woman, raised an outstanding UM who was a donor pregnancy and I've been very very happy--alone--by choice. It is only now that I have done the many things I wanted that I am ready to take in another because I want to keep going and not because of any other reason.

I'm very pleased to hear your life and the way you chose to live it has been successful for you. I too am a business woman, i too have an outstanding UM biologically and two that are not biological. I haven't finished doing everything i want to do by a long shot.
Over the past two years i have had little interest in being with someone but if someone came along that sparked my interest i did not turn my back. I guess i kind of wanted it all versus your not wanting it all.

quote:

Ladies, it is ok to be alone, it is ok if you don't find a mate, it is ok if when you do you've accomplished things in your life and you're ready. You are not defined by a mate--you are defined by you. However, you need to accept that you define you, you need to figure out what that definition is and you need to be true to that definition.

Who knows, I might see My life end with no relationship, but it won't end without Me having made an impact--regardless.

I'll skip dwelling on how condescending this sounds too much. Congratulations on having it so all together and passing on your wisdom to us who haven't reached a higher state of being like you.

I'm actually perfectly aware of everything you say in this last paragraph and am pretty sure that prinsexx is too. Failures and mistakes aside at least i can say i opened my heart to people and didn't hide away behind a sea of i need to be successful in my own right first.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to CatdeMedici)

Post #: 49

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 8:29:23 AM

thetammyjo

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Personally I think that experiences are always important since they play a huge part in defining who we are. Even if you try to deny them, they always are there affecting your life. Ignoring them only makes your decisions uninformed and less likely to be healthy and helpful.

Same for valuing a potential partner's experiences.

I think where having a lot of experiences might be a negative is for those who are less secure in their own abilities and beliefs. That you might know something they don't challenges them and they aren't ready yet for that challenge for whatever reason.

Another potential negative is if your experiences start to create a solid framework from which you find you cannot break your expectations. For example let's say that you had an excellent relationship for some time that ended for no negative reasons and now you find you can't venture outside the parameters that were set in that previous dynamic. You can find others who are close to the original but your inability to break free from the past prevents you from fully experiencing things now. That happens on the top and bottom side of the equation both.

So, in short, Prinsexx, I think experiences in terms of finding partners and assessing partner can be either a good or a bad thing.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 50

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 9:42:34 AM

camille65

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Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Austin Texas
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After a certain age is reached, unless one has lived in a cave and isolated from humanity... experience happens.

I do not understand your view, why you translate having lived life as being second hand. Do you expect yourself or anyone at your age (please, I am not saying that you are 'old' by any stretch of the imagination, simply that you are not sixteen) to be virginal?

It seems as if you have a warped expectation of yourself, as long as you hold onto that I don't think you can find contentment within yourself.

Every one gains experience simply through being alive (unless that cave thingie is involved...).

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 51

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 9:51:05 AM

oceanwynds

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Joined: 8/24/2006
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quote:

Ladies, it is ok to be alone, it is ok if you don't find a mate, it is ok if when you do you've accomplished things in your life and you're ready. You are not defined by a mate--you are defined by you. However, you need to accept that you define you, you need to figure out what that definition is and you need to be true to that definition

How true of a statement, CatdeMedici
Thank you for the reminder and sharing this with so many.

blessings
oceanwynds

(in reply to CatdeMedici)

Post #: 52

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 9:53:46 AM

subangi

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I love your "house" philosophy. Thank you.

(in reply to eyesopened)

Post #: 53

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 10:24:14 AM

velvetears

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i think there are two aspects to consider - The one part wants to form a lasting bond with someone and the other wants or craves to experience more and more in a bdsm experience. If you project your craving to someone, especially in the framework that you put it in this post, than that is how they are going to interpret you and they will more then likely be that kind of person as well - hence the kind of relationship where experience and pushing limits is more the focus than discovering who you are inside and forming a lasting relationship with uniqueness and qualities outside of bdsm but includes bdsm as only one aspect of it.

It comes across to me as if you are saying you feel used and washed up by your experiences and and this has tainted how you see potential relationships - you don't want to fall into the same trap and go through the same negative experiences. my suggestion would be to step away from it all for some time to gain persepctive and refresh your soul, gain inner strength. Self denial can build strength and make you see yourself in a new light. As others have said you have had a few relationships that you put your passions into and in a short time they have dissolved leaving you hurt and bewildered, your not allowing yourself enough time to process the experiences so that you go to the next relationship stronger. Its like a boxer who when he gets knocked down gets right up and starts swinging again - he's dizzy and seeing double from the impact so how can he effectively fight his opponent.

You want to be in a passionate relationship where your cherished and experiencing tittilating new thinkgs that thrill you - quite normal. Whats not so normal is allowing that to overtake your life and become the focus of your life.

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Religion is for people who are scared of hell, Spirituality is for people who have been there

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 54

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 10:52:17 AM

oceanwynds

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Subangi
I remember Jonathan Livingston Seagul. Richard Bach's book Illusions is my bible and The Little Prince is a major classic that I read in the 70's. You got great taste in books:)

blessings
oceanwynds

(in reply to subangi)

Post #: 55

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 11:09:44 AM

VeryNastyDom

Posts: 403
Joined: 9/23/2006
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We have all had good experiences and bad ones in this life (and everything else we do in the vanilla world). I shake off the bad ones, learn from the experience if it was something I could have prevented or improved, and move on.

That leaves me with a bunch of wonderful memories of all the good experiences and the wonderful people I have encountered along the way. I would not trade those memories for anything, and each of those encounters has left me richer then when I started. Am I worth less because I am a "previously used" Dom or more valuable because I know how to build a relationship?

(in reply to oceanwynds)

Post #: 56

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 11:11:28 AM

MistresseLotus

Posts: 443
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From: (aka LotusSong)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

To both s and d types do you feel weighed down by experience, crave new experiences, or are you proud to have experience? How useful is past experience? Are there experiences which you are proud of and experiences which you are not?

The only times I have regretted something because someone said "oh you should experience that!" is when I thought it through beforehand..evaluated it as not necessary for me to do.. but did it anyway "just to see".

It's best described by "I thought I was wrong..but I was mistaken". Not everything has to be experienced to be understood. JMO

_____________________________

I leave it to the 20-somethings to do the "open-minded, total unconditional acceptance thing" for it's how THEY learn that all the things others older than they have deemed BS, are in fact BS. What a waste of a decade.

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 57

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 11:29:32 AM

CatdeMedici

Posts: 2257
Joined: 10/20/2008
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<ouch>

I can assure not one word of what I wrote was in any way meant to be condescending, arrogant or speaking as if from above.

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I am the Cat, holder of the whip and chair.

"Let's see-whips, dips, chains, chips, yep sounds like a party to Me!"

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 58

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 12:10:46 PM

Maxwell67

Posts: 435
Joined: 6/29/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx
My question is:
To both s and d types do you feel weighed down by experience, crave new experiences, or are you proud to have experience?

Sometimes, yes, I feel weighed down. It happens when nothing feels new and lasts until something new happens. Of course I crave new experiences. Doesn't everyone?

Well, I suppose that there are some people who are so driven by fear that the thought of anything new drives them back under their rock, but such people are in need of serious help because change never stops. There is no such thing as 'the good old days'. Not really. It is just a longing for your past ignorance. Well you have to give that up. There is not a way to get that back short of brain damage (and that most definitely does not fall under the SSC umbrella).

I take pride in accomplishments, not experience. Experience happens whether I work for it or not. That would be like taking pride in breathing.

quote:

How useful is past experience?

Useful? It is essential. It is us. We are everything we have experienced. But, Prinsexx, I have read enough of your other posts to know that should come as no surprise to you. Experience is why we are here. It is the one thing the universe absolutely requires of us as anyone who has studied physics can tell you. Even the passive act of observing an action has an effect on its outcome so, that being the case, it follows that the universe needs to be experienced to operate.

quote:

Are there experiences which you are proud of and experiences which you are not?

What is it you are after in asking this queston? A simple yes or no does not tell you anything useful. Do you want a list? A set of categories of experiences to be proud of and experiences to be ashamed of? Rather I suppose the word should be choices or actions, not experiences, but you get the idea. There is no way to answer even those, however, in a way that will do you any good right now.

I suspect that what you are really talking about is intensity. The intensity of some types of experiences can fade when repeated and leave you feeling empty, bored, and thinking "Well, I have already done this.. give me something new." Sometimes all it takes to make it fresh again is a tiny change in place, time, or, as it seems is most often the case for people who are seeking to fill that void, a change of partner.

The thing to remember is that these are shared experiences, though, and the intensity comes from the sharing. These things we do, despite the common conception that they are for the D-types pleasure, are really for all participants. If it is not shared, then why do them at all? I do not put in the time to work out a scene purely to fulfill my own fantasy, but to share it with another and hopefully to fulfill theirs as well.

Conversely, it cannot all be about intensity. We need some resting points along the way to process what has been experienced or else it will simply overload and exhaust us.

There needs to be a rhythm to it. I believe the real secret is in finding that rhythm and a partner that can match it, or at least compliment it. If you can do that, I am thinking you will not find a need to look further.

< Message edited by Maxwell67 -- 2/16/2009 12:14:28 PM >

_____________________________

Use your head can't you use your head? You're on Earth! There's no cure for that! - Samuel Beckett (Endgame)

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 59

RE: 2nd hand sub - 2/16/2009 3:22:00 PM

Prinsexx

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

quote:

To both s and d types do you feel weighed down by experience, crave new experiences, or are you proud to have experience? How useful is past experience? Are there experiences which you are proud of and experiences which you are not?

I notoriously suck at relationships!! I get more and more weighed down, bogged down by each and every single failure i go through.
I crave new experiences all the time, new scenes, new torture - yummy. The one thing that i really crave for though is a relationship that works and is fulfilling and nourishing and everything it should be.

Miss t
I am of the frame of mind at the moment that I got to make radical changes. So when I hear you say that the one thing you really crave is a relationship that works and is fulfilling and nourishing well my immediate response was (based an an accumulation of experiences) that bdsm and fulfillment and nourishment are mutually exclusive. One is comfortable and secure and (eeks) vanilla, the other is risky and torturous... either physically or emotionally or both. Wished the conclusion hadn't popped into my head but it has.

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 60

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