RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (Full Version)

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LadyPact -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 12:32:51 PM)

Actually, if I do take a wand to Geoff, he'll be the youngest person that I've 'played' with in a long time.



MadameMarque -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 12:48:21 PM)

Oh, MoGa!  That's how to do it!  I love hearing your story.
 
Truthfully, though others' opinions don't get in my way directly, still, I've had concerns about a younger partner dealing with the reactions of those close to them.  An older woman is never a family's and friends' idea of the right choice.
 
Obviously, you're full of joy and love, so all that remains is for me to wish you perfect healing and great good fortune.
 



LadyHibiscus -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 12:53:22 PM)

This has been interesting!

Turning 40 was the best, for me---at last, I felt like a real grownup!  Of course, I don't look my age, so that helps, too.  [:)]  Boijen, I about snorted my coffee at your remark about MsK "aging well".  Um, yeah, yeah she is. 

Turning down young men has nothing to do with choosing someone "appropriate" in society's view.  I like who I like.  I enjoy the company of young people, I am happy to PLAY with them, and sure, I might take one into service.   The chances of my taking him as a life partner are slim to none.   To my friends who are with younger men, I say HUZZAH!  Why would I judge someone's happiness by my own PREFERENCES?

I don't think I am shooting myself in the foot by knowing what I like, and what works for me.  I have a whole list of criteria for a mate, and age is only one thing on the list! 



ShaktiSama -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 1:59:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I don't think I am shooting myself in the foot by knowing what I like, and what works for me.  I have a whole list of criteria for a mate, and age is only one thing on the list! 


*shrug* If you honestly think your criteria are working, that's fine. You and I may be operating with very different ideas of what the word "working" means. What I've noticed from at least a few of the women who have strong biases against mismatching age is that your criteria actually DON'T seem to be working; I hear a lot more complaints than success stories.

Personal opinion based on personal experience is this: criteria which are NOT based on REAL character issues are always pretty self-destructive. Life is hard enough, the universe will already put more than enough obstacles in the way of happiness--why in the WORLD would I want to add to them by judging someone unworthy of love in advance of meeting him/her, because of some superficial trait over which he/she has absolutely no control?

When it comes to younger men? I do not dehumanize them--OR younger women, for that matter. I recognize that my age can create some distance between us, but it's nothing that can't be overcome by an open mind and a willing heart; it certainly is much less than the differences people overcome when partners from different countries or races get together, and I've found far greater gulfs between me and men my own age or older than I have experienced with Aidan.

I do not view younger people as inferiors or a non-persons because of their age; a lot of times they are actually better informed and braver than I am due to their more modern life experiences--this is certainly what I have discovered from my few private exchanges with Boijen. And in any case, it was never an agenda on my part to seek younger men out, treat them as meat, or hunt them down like a beast of prey. I'm not the sort of woman who refers to a twenty-year-old as "veal"; I simply gave younger men the same chances I would any other man--one of them passed every test far better than any man twice his age has done, and now he wears my collar.

It's really as simple as that. Perhaps there is some sort of woman who deserves the negative stereotype of the "cougar", but I have never met one. I don't have to pretend to be anyone I am not, desperately deny my age, slather on make-up or get a lot of surgery to be in a relationship with any man; I'm not interested in men who need me to pretend to be 20--whether those men are 18 or 48, quite honestly. And I don't particularly consider myself a predator who specializes in younger men; I'm just not a bigot who slams the door in someone's face for a superficial reason.

Also, in many respects I'm simply a realist. The older I get, the younger the majority of available men are going to be, and I have no intention of crippling myself with bizarre "rules" and self-imposed limitations. I'm aware that society has all sorts of hobbles and chains they would like me to wear in my 40's, to drag me down and limit my potential in every possible way--I see no more reason to obey their dictates now than I did when I was 19.



Lockit -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 2:36:53 PM)

I don't see one domina who wants an older man judging anyone who wants a younger man, however it seems those who don't want a man they could have given birth to in a romantic relationship may just be.  There was a post that asked us how we felt and we responded.  Because we put some age limitation on who we are involved with does not mean we are biased, it could only mean that in our lives as they are, a relationship is determined by what we have going on and what we want.  If I can't see myself in a relationship with a younger man doesn't mean I am limiting anyone or even myself.

I have had younger men.  I know what it is like.  My youngest was 24 when I was 42.  Not every young man is like the one's some of the domina's have that they are happy with.  They are rare.  I few years ago I had a relationship with a 32 year old man who was amazing, but he wanted all in life that I had had when I was younger and it was best to call things off.

I know what suits me best and although I am not living with someone and don't talk a lot about certain things, I don't consider myself any less successful than someone who might be living with someone.  I want an older man... maybe not as old as me... maybe older... I care not about that.  I just want someone that fits my life and from my own experience, I feel an older man suits me better.

To each their own.  But becasue of choice, I don't think we should be judged.



ShaktiSama -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 2:49:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit
Because we put some age limitation on who we are involved with does not mean we are biased...


Actually, that's one of the definitions of the word "biased". My point is that an age limitation is very much like a height limitation or a race limitation; a man cannot do anything to change his physical age, no matter how spotless his character.

quote:

Not every young man is like the one's some of the domina's have that they are happy with.  They are rare. 


My point is that ALL men who make a woman happy in a relationship are rare. Shooting down a large percentage of the population in advance of meeting them is by definition a massive reduction of the odds of happiness.

There are plenty of very young men who do not and will never want children. There are also older men who already have or still want to have children. Age is not necessarily a perfect indicator of interest in reproduction.

quote:

To each their own.  But becasue of choice, I don't think we should be judged.


Sure. But have you noticed that there's not a "special", deeply insulting stereotype associated with women who choose to become romantically involved with older men--no matter how much older the man is?

Doesn't this ever make you think about who sets these standards, and why?



Lockit -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 3:15:42 PM)

I don't let stereotypes bother me.  I consider them stupid, even though I sometimes may have one lingering around in my self.  I see people as people and for who they are.  I am not biased per person, but in general, believe what is best for me is an older man.  I have thought long and hard over it since I was in my early thirties and married a man seven years younger than I.  Since I had two male wives in my twenties, I have dealt with sterotypes.

You see, what limit's me is my illness and how other's want a different type of life than I can live.  I happen to think an older man just may be more suitable and understanding of my limitations.  It isn't bias... it is experience I am deciding that on.  Could another younger man, other than those I was with handle it?  Maybe... maybe not.. just as with an older man and him not being able to handle it.  Many cannot.  That narrows things down a whole lot.  But... an older man does understand more readily those daily aches and pains.. some from hard work and some from sports and some from age.  I simply don't have the stamina to match a younger man.

When I am in pain, I do not wish to explain certain things a younger man hasn't experienced.  It's not being lazy... just that I can find a man that already knows a lot of what I know and there is less explainging to do and with what I have going on, it is best that way.  I will never forget buying a house with my ex husband who had never done so before or how I have to explain a lot of things and I just don't want the hassle of it now.

I am not biased about a person...  Maybe biased in what I want in my life in some way, but that still is a choice based on experience and what is going on.  But even if I am biased somehow, don't really see it that way as I have nothing against younger men... I am not limiting myself.  I have what I want in my life for the most part... if that changes, I doubt my choices will change.  I like what I like... and want what I want.




ShaktiSama -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 4:09:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

You see, what limit's me is my illness and how other's want a different type of life than I can live.  I happen to think an older man just may be more suitable and understanding of my limitations.


I understand what you're saying. I am not particularly interested in having my life dominated by a man of any age. If I want or don't want more children, if I have to be able to travel frequently or settle in one place for a long time, etc., I need to have the final say and I need a man who builds his life around my wants and needs--not vice versa.



Lockit -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 4:15:27 PM)

LOL... I have final say... but I do want whoever is with me happy and I give too.  Not just anyone would be happy with a partner that has to live my way... so I want one who can and will be happy.  That works for me.  It isn't my way or the highway... but my life isn't dictated by anyone but my health and me.  The man has to fit my life, but I would like him happily fitting my life.



LadyHibiscus -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 5:13:29 PM)

Thank you, Lockit!  As a person with chronic illnesses looking ahead to years of caregiving, I am glad that someone sees what I am seeing!

I'm not sure why this is such a big deal for you, Shakti.  I don't share a whole lot of my life here on the boards, but I have very sound reasons for wanting what I want.   If some youngster comes up and says You betcha, Hib, I'll take care of you AND be understanding when your sick parents mean that you can't do XYZ, AND understand when your illness slows you down, AND be a really great pain guy and be able to follow along with the stuff you like... welll, sure, I'll give him a shot!    I will also be really understanding when he gets past 35 and realizes that gosh, he wanted to breed after all...

In the meantime, I am not interested in someone who didn't get their news from Huntly & Brinkley, or remember USING carbon paper, or listening to AM radio.   Sure, I am looking forward to the Watchmen movie.  Sure, I like learning new things, and can l33t with the best of them.  I still want someone who has MY cultural touchstones, who has had some of my life experience, and shoot, life experience, period!   

And since you asked, I really do look askance at the middle aged and older men wanting to scoop up the young women.  (didn't they used to be called "golddiggers"?  the young women, I mean! [:D])   You know what?  Who cares!   



MoGa -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 5:33:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadameMarque

Oh, MoGa!  That's how to do it!  I love hearing your story.
 
Truthfully, though others' opinions don't get in my way directly, still, I've had concerns about a younger partner dealing with the reactions of those close to them.  An older woman is never a family's and friends' idea of the right choice.
 
Obviously, you're full of joy and love, so all that remains is for me to wish you perfect healing and great good fortune.
 


Thank you! Actually, I am not his parent's right choice, obviously. But they love him and want him to be happy. That is what matters most to them. He is adult and they recognize that his choices are his own.
 
Hugs!



Lockit -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 6:10:38 PM)

LOL... well I do have to admit... It sure would be hard explaining to my brain damaged adult son why my lover has the same amount of candle's on his birthday cake as he does!  My other's would be saying... go mom, go! and laughing all the way... but C would be a lil bit confused! lol  He finger shakes and laughs at me enough as it is!



TexasMaam -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 6:43:52 PM)

I can't stand to work with younger men, let alone session one! 

Wait 'till you're pushing 50, gf, even the 35-40 year olds will begin to 'feel' like they're morons when you engage them in conversation.

Today a man less than 45 years doesn't appeal to Me on any level.

If he can't hold a conversation with Me I don't want him at the end of a paddle or a whip.  ....After the session, I'd get really tired of keeping him gagged all the time.

; )

All the best,

TM

ps:  having 'said' all this, I just had to come back with a post script. 

I remember attending a bondage special interest group (sig) get together where there were several young pups around begging for attention.  There were six or seven uncollared young men, all in their 20's. 

There was an older, more mature Domme there, just about my age, so I guess she was 46 or 48 or so.  One of the little puppies was in service to Her.  She had him collared, and leashed, a thin, wiry little wisp of a boy, clothed in white jockey briefs...nothing else... and Lord Bless My Two Shoes I Swear to Goodness....that boy's cock had to be about 13 inches long and 2 and a half to three inches circumference.  It was totally erect inside his little shorts, absolutely pushing that 'envelope'.  He was sooo excited it kept popping out of the fly. Every time he crawled to follow her, his angry pecker would pop out and she'd whip him for it.  How we laughed!  The more we laughed, the more she spanked and then petted him, the more excited he got.  He finally just came all over himself and curled up in a ball at her feet, embarrassed and just about the sweetest sight I ever saw.  She laughed and sent him out of the room to wash up and put on his jeans.  When he returned, he kept serving Her and waiting on Her with blind devotion.  He was completely fascinated with Her, and Her alone.  He never laid eyes on the buxom 20 to 35 year old Dommes in the room, he only looked at Her, or at the floor, waiting on her, curling up at her feet, and, miracle of miracles, keeping completely quiet.  Now there was a one in a million 'baby' boy that I might have taken home and kept.

....hell, the 53 yr old 'boy' I took to the sig that night kept following after the hostess all evening.  I should have left that slut there.

Maybe there's a little 'cougar' in all of us!

; )

TM



aidan -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 7:03:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus
Sure, I am looking forward to the Watchmen movie.


Actually, Watchmen is more of a cultural touchstone for people in their 30s and 40s and 50s.

Just saying.



HeavansKeeper -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 7:25:08 PM)

<QR>

AAkasha, I blame Disney. The western culture has stomped "Old rich guy, subservient pretty young starlet" into your head for so long the tread marks still show. This is why your reasonable (logical) breakdown of right and wrong is stymied by an unshakable, insupportable, niggling feeling of "...but it's wrong!! >.<!"

This is an instance of moral vs. ethical imperatives. Ethics say "Everyone consents, everyone enjoys it, it doesn't hard anyone, what's the problem?" Morals say "It's wrong for a woman to desire younger men. It's unnatural!"

Personally, I have a thing for older women. I'm in my early 20's and my pet is close to your age. While there are a handful of young, mature people, I find it hard to find them. There's nothing wrong with liking the eager, young, buffed, toned flesh and/or mind. Men in their 40's oggle over 20-something strumpets like they were official bikini inspectors.

Also, I'd like to drop my opinion in the hat about the word "cougar." To me, a cougar is not a bitchy vile old harlot. I consider a cougar to be a woman who is well versed and grounded in the truths of this world - sexuality included. The sort of woman who understands the importance of a career, compromises, fetishes..

Comparing my life to yours, the older woman has a different D/s orientation, but the principle is the same. What drew me to pet (and women of her age group) is being judged for my fetishes by ditzy college coeds. The "seen it all" sphere in which a woman with 10-20 more years dealing with sex and life makes communication much easier. I've said it many times before. The more ideal match is older women/young men and older men/younger women. Financial support is more balanced, at least 1/2 the party has decent experience, the sexual trends:
(of course these are the stereotypes)
Young women not 100% in tune with their body, need financial support to explore facets of this world.
Young men having eagerness(*cough lackstamina cough*), need financial support.
Older women knowing their body(can get off with less proficient mates). Can mentor younger people in life/love. Financial balance.
Older men have more stamina, knowledge of women and what they want, financial balance.

The point here is to show you that society is bjorked. Don't take the path less traveled or the path more traveled. Take whatever path you WANT to take.



LovingMistress45 -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 7:47:06 PM)

I hadn't really heard the word cougar in this context before. I turned 45 in January.  When I was younger I always tended to date/play with older men. When I was 32 I was involved with 48 y/o malesub, I didn't think anything about the age difference. Now, I find that I am more attracted to younger men and it feels weird.  I am considering a 28 y/o male sub and  I think a lot about the age difference.  I also find I seem to attract younger men, that they are the ones that respond to me. So in that since I am not a cougar, I am not hunting a young guy. My son is 21 and that may be some of why it feels strange. 

I will say that I have decided not to rule someone out because of age, but they have to mature enough to keep my interest out of scene, if they are going to be anything more than a play toy.  When I was 35 I had summer fling with a 22 y/o malesub.  However, he was a very immature 22 y/o and I knew that going into. But it was a fun summer for us both and he got a chance to learn a lot. And it was nice distraction for me, but I knew it was not going to be more than fling.

I also don't really think being attracted to someone based on a quality or feature is biased.  We all have preferences. I don't think someone that is attracted to blonds is biased it is just their preference. So someone that wants an older man doesn't mean they are biased against young men.  I am a BBW I don't take it personal if someone is not attracted to that. Some men are very attracted to it, for some it doesn't matter and for others they just aren't attracted. Now if someone decides something about me as a person based solely on my weight that is a bias.

By the way MoGa Geoff is a real cutie.



ShaktiSama -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 7:56:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Thank you, Lockit!  As a person with chronic illnesses looking ahead to years of caregiving, I am glad that someone sees what I am seeing!

I'm not sure why this is such a big deal for you, Shakti. 


A number of reasons, some of which should be quite obvious. If I was a woman with a black male submissive in my life, and a group of my peers were having such a very bigoted, trashy little conversation about how they could never dominate a black man because blah blah racist assholes blah--? Then yeah, I would be a pretty shitty person if I didn't say something, and respond very negatively.

I don't like the belittling and insulting tone that this thread began with, quite frankly. And even without the ugly tone of some of the posts, it's been demonstrated in the course of this thread that certain reasoning about the vices of younger men is...to put it as politely as possible...faulty at best.

MoGa has been kind enough to share her personal experience with us, for example. She sounds as if she has her own health issues to deal with these days. She doesn't use those issues as an excuse for discriminating against younger men. In fact, she seems to have been very happy with a younger submissive, who is well aware of her health issues and adores and serves her anyway.

I don't discuss the details of my own personal situation much, LadyH, but YOU should be well aware that my mother has serious physical handicaps and mental health issues. Further more, we share a home; my 20-year-old submissive deals with this every day and does so every bit as well as many older men would--considerably better than most. Moreover, he had every chance to make up his mind about this relationship with full knowledge beforehand of my situation.

If reality had anything to do with it, in other words, this conversation would be over. But that's the problem with prejudices--people will continue to defend them LONG after they've been proven to have no basis in reality.

I really don't give a damn who y'all choose to sleep with, or to dominate. If you're only ATTRACTED to older men, physically--groovy. Personal attraction is just personal attraction--it's not about character. But I can seriously do without the "reasons" that people use to justify their personal tastes, many of which have really ugly implications if you actually hold them up to the light. I can also seriously do without the weird ego trips that older people inflict on younger people on these forums and in this community, for no other reason than because they're older.

The majority of what I am hearing here is that younger people are morally inferior to older people and that they are not worth loving or dominating because they are not real people.

Seriously--"squashing a bug"? "Morons"? "Unable to hold a conversation"? Give me a fucking break. Where the hell do people get off saying crap like this? Getting over 30 is NOT an antidote to stupid, selfish, OR dull. In fact, getting older just makes all three of those things exponentially worse.

Anyway. Given my personal experiences and my personal relationships? Sorry, Hib, but I would be an asshole of Biblical proportion if I did not talk back to this nonsense, and call it what it is: ugly, bigoted, and nine different shades of DUMB. My submissive has earned that much from me; I'm not going to let him twist in the wind while people basically call him worthless, stupid and weak in a public forum. He wouldn't allow anyone to talk about me that way, I see no reason that I shouldn't have his back as well.



LadyPact -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 8:21:11 PM)

Take it down a notch, Shatki.  You know that none of us here would intentionally insult what's yours.  Or boijen for that matter, or Geoff, or any of the exceptional people in the age group who have graced these forums.

With that said, you do have to realize that for what it is.  Some of them *are* the exceptions.  Not everyone is going to hold up to that high of a level.  I don't consider any of the folks that I've mentioned in the paragraph above to be the 'average' person in that age range.  I'd probably embarrass the hell out of any of them if I sat here and raved about what I think of them (from what I know) as individuals.  They've all proven themselves smart, charming (when they want to be), mature, and dedicated to the relationships that they are in.  Not everyone in that age range can come close to what we've seen right here on the boards in spite of the times their age has worked against them.  Hell, a lot of submissives twice and more their age can't compare.

You have to realize that the other end of the spectrum exists as well.  Honestly, how many other submissives Aidan's age has proven to be as good of a submissive for you?  Out of the countless number out there, how many have really measured up in any sort of comparison?

I have nothing against you defending your position, your preference, or your sub.  I'm just saying that along with the cream of the crop, the bottom of the barrel and all those in the middle exist as well.





LadyHibiscus -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 8:33:49 PM)

Please let me know when I said that young folks were boring, stupid, or otherwise full of fail?  I said repeatedly that older men are my PREFERENCE.  I also PREFER those not into cuckoldry or feminization.    Would I bash anyone for wanting a young sissy cuck, or any iteration of those?  I would not, and never have---I just don't want one for MYSELF.   Just as I don't want a young man, and do not seek them out. 

I would not dream of dissing Aidan, and while I have my [8|] moments with Geoff, I know him for the pearl he is.    Neither one of them would be a good choice for ME.  That's all I'm saying here. 

My former slave turned SIXTY this year.  For me, a FORTY year old is a younger man.  That's how I roll. 

And, what Lady Pact said. 




ShaktiSama -> RE: Confessions of a femdom cougar (2/26/2009 9:20:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

You have to realize that the other end of the spectrum exists as well.  Honestly, how many other submissives Aidan's age has proven to be as good of a submissive for you?  Out of the countless number out there, how many have really measured up in any sort of comparison?

I have nothing against you defending your position, your preference, or your sub.  I'm just saying that along with the cream of the crop, the bottom of the barrel and all those in the middle exist as well.





The long and the short of it is that I don't see any relationship between being exceptional and age--or being a dullard and age. One of the most tiresome experiences I've had with a submissive in my life was the 48-year-old I dated before I collared Aidan.

Same is true of a lot of other superficial features that people really can't control, and which can be construed as positive or negative depending on whether you choose to have an open mind.



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