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RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 11:22:28 AM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		And my point stands,murder by firearm is technically not a misuse of said weapon...in point of fact it is the purpose for which the weapon was manufactured to wit to maim and kill.
Now when pencils are manufactured to specifications which lend themselves to mahem...it is a little silly to throw them into this discussion
BTW I in no way took your post personal,though I thought it silly....I didn't assume you meant I was silly.Likewise I intend no personal attack either with my reply.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to Anarrus)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 11:35:15 AM   
PanthersMom


Posts: 2215
Joined: 11/26/2007
From: Cleveland Ohio
Status: offline 		guess i better get busy getting my gun and my ccw.  my dad was a cop for 32 years in this city.  we've often had discussions about how gun control laws don't work.  law abiding citizens aren't the problem, it's the criminals who are the problem.  the ones who assume that little old lady down the block can't defend herself so they're going to go threaten her with a .38 and rob her blind.  oh how their families whine and cry, how dare that person whip out a gun of their own and kill their boy, how dare they be a law abiding citizen defending themselves and their home with a licensed gun!   the way i was raised, gun control is hitting what you aim at.
PM

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I miss my ex, but my aim is improving!




(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 11:40:17 AM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: PanthersMom

guess i better get busy getting my gun and my ccw.  my dad was a cop for 32 years in this city.  we've often had discussions about how gun control laws don't work.  law abiding citizens aren't the problem, it's the criminals who are the problem.  the ones who assume that little old lady down the block can't defend herself so they're going to go threaten her with a .38 and rob her blind.  oh how their families whine and cry, how dare that person whip out a gun of their own and kill their boy, how dare they be a law abiding citizen defending themselves and their home with a licensed gun!   the way i was raised, gun control is hitting what you aim at.
PM
And somehow the link between the manufacture of all these weapons obstensibly for the legal market....finding their way into unsavory hands ...is completely missed.What good does New Yorks stringent gun laws do the citizens of New York when easily legaly bought guns find their way up the i-95 corridor to the streets of New York.What recourse do the citizens of New York have...don't bother answering this..I can here it now, Arm themselves LOL.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to PanthersMom)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 11:45:06 AM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

"The Justice Department has refused to let the F.B.I. check its records to determine whether any of the 1,200 people detained after the Sept. 11 attacks had bought guns, F.B.I. and Justice Department officials say.

The department made the decision in October after the F.B.I. asked to examine the records it maintains on background checks to see if any detainees had purchased guns in the United States.

Mindy Tucker, a spokeswoman for the Justice Department, said the request was rejected after several senior officials decided that the law creating the background check system did not permit the use of the records to investigate individuals.
Ms. Tucker did not elaborate on the decision, but it is in keeping with Attorney General John Ashcroft's strong support of gun rights and his longstanding opposition to the government's use of background check records. In 1998, as a senator from Missouri, Mr. Ashcroft voted for an amendment to the Brady gun-control law to destroy such records immediately after checking the background of a prospective gun buyer. That amendment was defeated."

Nuff said.

Don`t you want to know if terrorists are armed?

I do.

Ms. Tucker was correct on the law.
As far as armed terrorists, I fail to see any possible point.
If you're somehow suggesting that
1. They had guns (on the planes) but didn't use them    OR
2. Putting further burdens on the gun rights of Americans would somehow have prevented them from getting guns (that they didn't use, if they had them)...
well, either point is, to use your word, goofy.
I just want to find them and kill them, armed or not.

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 11:51:50 AM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Well subrob the counter argument to that from those on the left would be the easy availability of guns insures that there will allways be a supply of weapons available to the unsavory facets of our society.
And any effort designed to curtail that flow is worth any slight inconvenience to the law abiding facet of our society...in other words the segment that should be most interested in keeping guns out of the hands of criminals.


Has it worked for drugs? Or alcohol? All bans have done is made law makers feel good, waste a helluva lot of money, and made criminals of otherwise upstanding citizens... Aren't our prisons crowded enough? Why do you want gun owners to go to prison, because you and I both know, the government has zero chance of removing guns from society, and the current owners will be the next "victimless crime" criminals in jail.


As a tangential addendum, subrob, the dumbest anti-2nd Amendment argument I think I have ever heard is the "We have to get guns out of the hands of drug dealers" bravo sierra. Whenever I hear it I ask, "Given that guns receive some degree or other from the 2nd Amendment, and that 'drugs' not only have no such protection but are inddeed already illegal, why do you think it would be easier to 'get rid of' the guns than the drugs"?

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 2:06:31 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

And somehow the link between the manufacture of all these weapons obstensibly for the legal market....finding their way into unsavory hands ...is completely missed.What good does New Yorks stringent gun laws do the citizens of New York when easily legaly bought guns find their way up the i-95 corridor to the streets of New York.What recourse do the citizens of New York have.
 
That argues a need to control whole world, of course, always a fond dream for the megalomaniacally inclined. But until you get rid of human beings altogether, there will always be guns and booze and whatever the fuck else you use as an excuse for why other people should be forced to be like you.
 
K.
 
 

< Message edited by Kirata -- 3/13/2009 2:12:30 PM >

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 2:22:41 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Never said they should be like me Kirata....I'll simply settle for them not possessing automatic weapons.Is that asking too much?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 2:46:09 PM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Never said they should be like me Kirata....I'll simply settle for them not possessing automatic weapons.Is that asking too much?


Automatic weapons are already illegal for 99% of legal gun owners. It takes a special license and a lot of money for a private citizen to buy an automatic weapon. Banning them won't do a damn thing, because some bent quartermaster is going to steal them, and sell them illegally on the black market anyway...Why is this so hard to understand?

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 2:54:39 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

You don't have to register a vehicle (or obtain a drivers license) if you don't drive it off your property. And you don't have to register it with the Federal government, or obtain a federal drivers license, even if you do. This bill has nothing to do with simple licensing or gun safety. It's about the government compiling an inventory of who has what, where.

A reasonable person might care to inquire why they want to know.
 
K.


How many people have vehicles other than purely recreational vehicles that are never off their property?

For the record, I don't agree with this this bill or any bill that seeks such government intrusion.

My only point was we accept intrusions daily as a matter of fact but somehow when it comes to guns we get ourselves all worked up while ignoring all the other government restrictions on our daily lives.

< Message edited by rulemylife -- 3/13/2009 2:58:22 PM >

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/13/2009 2:57:47 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Never said they should be like me Kirata....I'll simply settle for them not possessing automatic weapons.Is that asking too much?


Automatic weapons are already illegal for 99% of legal gun owners. It takes a special license and a lot of money for a private citizen to buy an automatic weapon. Banning them won't do a damn thing, because some bent quartermaster is going to steal them, and sell them illegally on the black market anyway...Why is this so hard to understand?

Follow that logic to its natural conclusion SubRob and lets do away with most of the laws currently on the books

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 12:28:20 AM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

And my point stands,murder by firearm is technically not a misuse of said weapon...in point of fact it is the purpose for which the weapon was manufactured to wit to maim and kill.

You really need to practice thinking a little faster than you type. First you say murder is not misuse of a firearm because it is the purpose for which it is manufactured; then you contradict yourself and claim ("to wit") that the purpose for which is manufactured is to main and kill. Well duhh, what precisely is the connection there? Every instance of inflicting harm or death by firearm is murder? Hell, leave out maiming; every instance of inflicting death by firearm is murder? Yeah right. Good luck selling that idea.
 
Furthermore, excluding hunting, target, and special mission models, the most popular offerings from firearms manufacturers are those designed for self-defense carry, which in practical terms translates to stopping power. That's a whole different problem from "main and kill". If they just wanted to produce a weapon designed to maim, a pistol that fired razor-shot would do a lovely job. If killing was all that mattered, one that fired a hot .17 cartridge with frangible bullets would be perfect, even at considerable distance against people with, unh, especially thick skulls.
 
But in reality (you've heard of that) they're not interested in designing "specialty" weapons for maiming and killing. They're interested in designing weapons that will stop, fast, somebody bent on mayhem or murder. Get it now?
 
K.
 

< Message edited by Kirata -- 3/14/2009 12:44:55 AM >

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 10:51:49 AM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		And in your reality "stop" equals kill,murder and maiming.Please split hairs with someone else...euphemisms are cool aren't they.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 10:59:34 AM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Just for kicks Kirata,being as you started this thread......would you care to share with us your thoughts on the possibility that this bill as it stands ever becomes law.Or is this just another "there coming for our guns" chicken little thread?


_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 1:17:24 PM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

And in your reality "stop" equals kill,murder and maiming.Please split hairs with someone else...euphemisms are cool aren't they.


When a life-threatening situation- home invasion, armed rape, whatever- occurs, when your life expectancy is measured in seconds, slvmike4u, the police are only minutes away. Perhaps you'd rather have a self-defense for yourself and your family that is designed for "slow".

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 1:18:10 PM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u
Follow that logic to its natural conclusion SubRob and lets do away with most of the laws currently on the books


In the capital punishment argument, your side argues that it's better for 100 guilty people go free rather than killing 1 innocent, but on this topic, you argue, it's better to deny EVERYONE the right to own a gun, rather than dealing with the one guilty criminal who gets a gun illegally. I swear your side is illogical to me

Can you show me any kind of statistic that shows criminals are using fully automatic weapons to commit murders? As long as there are nations with defense interests, there are going to be people looking to build the bigger, badder more efficient killing machines.

Wishing to ban machine guns is like wishing that your fairy godmother turns you into a Princess to go to the ball every night.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 1:24:13 PM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline 		subrob, I used to have an FFL and a "reloaders license", and was a pretty active NRA cert instructor.
If there has ever been a violent felony committed by the legal owner of a class 3 weapon it is within the last ten years or so.
For informed people it really is a non-issue.

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 1:48:15 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		My "side" is illogical?On the one hand your side claims 99% of gun owners don't want ,need or possess assault weapons.And yet any move to enact federal legislation is met with nothing less than predictions of a coming apocalypse....whose side is illogical?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 1:54:36 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

And in your reality "stop" equals kill,murder and maiming.Please split hairs with someone else...euphemisms are cool aren't they.

No they aren't, and that isn't one. There's no "equals" there. You are just making things up and thumping the podium. Apparently you didn't take me seriously when I cautioned you about this tendency to type faster than you think. Lots of people have been stopped by a gunshot and lived to face trial with all limbs attached.
 
K.
 

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 2:01:12 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

And in your reality "stop" equals kill,murder and maiming.Please split hairs with someone else...euphemisms are cool aren't they.

No they aren't, and that isn't one. There's no "equals" there. You are just making things up and thumping the podium. Apparently you didn't take me seriously when I cautioned you about this tendency to type faster than you think. Lots of people have been stopped by a gunshot and lived to face trial with all limbs attached.
 
K.
 
How true Kirata...of course no where near the number who have been "stopped" by gunshot whose families than got to sit thru the ensuing murder trial
If I am having a problem taking you seriously,don't blame me...go back and check your post's the trouble lies within.

< Message edited by slvemike4u -- 3/14/2009 2:02:04 PM >

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Federal Firearms Licensing Act - 3/14/2009 2:03:50 PM   
ModeratorEleven


Posts: 2007
Joined: 8/14/2005
Status: offline 		Folks, chill out.

XI


_____________________________

This mod goes to eleven.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 80
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