RE: why all the cheating?

RE: why all the cheating? (Full Version)

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LadyPact -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/8/2007 11:06:59 PM)
Forgive Me for not reading the whole thread. Perhaps My sentiments were already written. In My history here, I have been a great advocate in the difference between cheating and deception. There is a vast difference. What many would call cheating, is actually an agreement between two parties in a relationship. It isn't always the sexual act that is considered the cheating. Instead, it is the lying, deception, and sneaking that causes the harm. This is the very unrealistic truth about the term "open marriage". An open marriage/relationship is just that. It is a situation where the parties agree that non-monogomous activities will occur, but the participants will be HONEST about it. They find that it is more disloyal to be untruthful with one another, rather than some random physical act. In many cases where this becomes a difficulty in a relationship, quite often it is expressed that a person can handle that their SO had sex with another person. What bothers them nore is the fact that their SO looked them in the eyes and LIED about it. For many, that is the greater betrayal.. Humans are, afterall, animals with certain desires. In some cases, that primal urge can be understood, but deceipt can not. No other species lies to their partner in order to get their rocks off. (Correct Me if you know of the scientific study that contradicts this.) In many definitions of the word, "cheating" is not especially about sex, but almost always about some form of deception. It is more about a lack of honesty, or outright dishonesty, that damages the relationship.

subinside -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 2:53:22 AM)
No, spanklette. We were moving for Him.

meatcleaver -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 3:50:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sweetieboop I was just curious about why there are so many people that are cheating and lying to their Doms/subs. Human nature? People have been cheating since the beginning of time and they aren't going to stop now and it isn't restricted to any one culture, it is a cross cultural phenomena, even in cultures where cheating could cost an adulterer their life, such is the strength of instinct. Now I have to go for lunch with a female friend who happens to be married and is a muslim.[:-]

cloudboy -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 9:28:47 AM)
You don't have to tell your wife the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God. No marriage—no civil union, no domestic partnership, no semiregular hookup—would survive long if each partner made a full confession of the previous day's minor betrayals at breakfast. --Dan Savage -------- You've got two choices: you can be married and bored or single and lonely. --Chris Rock

LaTigresse -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 9:34:43 AM)
Is it me or does the US seem to really be more obsessive about this issue than those in other countries?

CreativeDominant -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 11:19:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong Is it really cheating if romance is not involved? Well...according to MY counselor at the time of my separation...if your partner views what you are doing with others as cheating...and if you hide it for any reason (even if you tell yourself that the only reason you are hiding it is because "he/she just doesn't get it")...then it is.

Mercnbeth -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 11:47:52 AM)
quote: Is it me or does the US seem to really be more obsessive about this issue than those in other countries? LaTigresse, I think it has a lot to do with our Puritan heritage. Similar to our attitude about nudity, drinking, and even the 'age of consent'. Like it or not, Puritans were a big contributing factor in that still is pervasive in our laws and consequentially in many peoples beliefs. Even those who consider themselves agnostic or atheist may have a subconscious consideration of fundamental Puritanism. All that considered; my "anti-cheating" stance is more closely attributed to a position of FULL disclosure. It comes from the belief that 'Trust' is a key cornerstone for any relationship, but especially relationship involving BDSM activities. (Yes - I believe MORE trust is needed in BDSM versus 'vanilla'.) Even the most casual encounter requires trust. Those playing casually with 'safe-words' must trust the other person to react to them. Coming from a foundation of concealment and secrecy regarding a spouse or significant other must generate some doubt - shouldn't it?

domiguy -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 11:52:27 AM)
Why do folks resurrect old threads?...Why not start a new one? quote: MissOchistic don't give a crap what my husband does as long as i don't find out. if he's doing something that keeps him happy, keeps him off the edge, and i don't ever have to be bothered about it, hell, works for me. Why would you care at all...Since he beats you and you want a divorce?....You might not be alright in the noggin'.

GoodLittleBitch -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 12:11:21 PM)
If you are in a committed relationship with a person. It is cheating. It's simple enough of a thing to grasp. If the person you are with, thinks you only want them, and that is not the case, it is a lie, or a lack of admission of the truth, which is pretty much the exact same thing. You're just not lying to their face, you're lying to the back of their head. There is no reason for adults to admit they are cheating. I've been cheating for two yrs, more now. I know I am cheating. Shit happens. If you cannot admit to yourself that you are cheating, weither it be for a good reason or not. You are not only lying to the person you are suppose to be committed to, you are lying to yourself, and that is never a good thing. Weither or not you are honest with the person that is with you, you must always be honest and true to yourself. If you are being true to yourself and your emotions, by cheating, I applaud you. Shit happens. Bottom line, you have to be happy. You should be your first priority. Even if kids are involved. If you are not taken care of.. who is going to take care of the little ones? Hope this was helpful to someone. -GLB

ICGsteve -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 2:24:18 PM)
I have not read all of the thread. People lie and cheat because they are not strong enough of self, of an individual, to take a stand for themselves. A person who claims to be a Dom who lies and cheats is a weak person (Person being one individual among many). They may or may not be good at doing some dom'y things but at the core they are rotten or not formed. Subs should take this into consideration when thinking about attaching themselves to these types. A sub who is like this on the other hand may be just fine. This person will need a lot of extra attention, but then some Dom's and Masters thrive on challenge.

subinside -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 6:41:00 PM)
Thank You ICGsteve.. it's so easy to blame oneself when your partner cheats.. you weren't enough, or didn't give enough, or didn't behave the right way...

RavenMuse -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 6:53:43 PM)
Some of us care a great deal and I can't actualy post My full feelings about those who indulge in cheating on the person they are supposed to have made a commitment to as doing so would break the rules of this here lil' sandbox we are playing in and cause Modkin11 to begin frothing at the mouth, so just use your imagination and you'll probably not be too far out g Not something My lil' gal will even need worry about and I trust in the fact that I'll never have to worry on that score either.

KeirasSecret -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 7:08:07 PM)
A little off topic: I have been considering this for a while, though I will not claim to have considered every possibility, it seems to me; there is a “right” time to do anything, even something that is considered “bad”. I believe the equation of figuring out when doing a “bad” thing is “right” has to do with considering intent with results and maybe a dash of motive. If after doing this, you can honestly say the action served the greater good of the innocent involved; then it was the right thing to do. Just my thoughts. edited to add: for the record I have not cheated Be well,

RavenMuse -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 7:22:53 PM)
For the record cheating is NEVER the right thing to do and for once I am not just stating it as simply opinion... I will piss people off because I believe it is genericaly correct.

ICGsteve -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 7:43:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RavenMuse For the record cheating is NEVER the right thing to do and for once I am not just stating it as simply opinion... I will piss people off because I believe it is genericaly correct. What if you are aware that you are a submissive, you can't bring yourself to tell your wife that you are (or you do and she can not or will not meet your needs) so you are dieing a little inside each day. Do you A) do nothing until you are strong enough of self to deal with the wife or leave her B) let yourself continue to die emotionally and spiritually, or C) cheat? Are you sure C is the wrong answer for everyone? Maybe if you have another choice that I have not thought of (very possible) but from what I see cheating can be fully justified. The one thing this person certainly can not do is ignore who they are or make their submissive needs go away. It has to be dealt with, and maybe cheating to get the needs met while preserving the relationship is the best choice. Understanding that someone is weak is not at all the same thing is being judgmental about this reality. When I see a weak person who lies and cheats I wish they were stronger, but they are who they are. I will use my awareness to make decisions about what I am going to do, but I do not look down on them because I have flaws of my own. Hopefully in life we at some point learn to take people as they are to some extent, with the hope that they will return the favor.

KeirasSecret -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 7:53:28 PM)
I respect your opinion. Being an “innocent” in more then one situation of cheating; my father cheated on my mother and both fathers of my UM’s cheated on me, I have my own. Since the results of all three situations proved to be more beneficial to the innocent involved; UM’s and myself, I believe it was right. When my father told my mother, (he was going to leave), it made my mother take a real good look at herself and the road things were going down, and for a while life was actually pleasant. She was a real tyrant back then. ;) As for the other examples, I won’t go into details but will say the situations weren’t good, especially for me. I would have stayed with it though, my internal drive to dedicate myself to such commitments is somewhat “do or die”, and I believe I would have stayed just short of that. I should probably mention my timing is off just a little. I am not with them because they cheated. I am glad I am not with them. Is there a better way? Most likely, but it doesn’t always present itself. Also I would add: It has become apparent to me that the “cheaters” were being “cheated” themselves; intentionally or otherwise. Be well,

RavenMuse -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 7:58:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ICGsteve What if .... What if ANYTHING... you either find a way to do things HONESTLY inside the relationship terms or get the hell out so you can do what you need to do without cheating. There is no excuse for cowardice and duplicity. Anyone who will lie to their primary partner CAN'T be trusted by anyone else either and TRUST is a cornerstone of D/s

KeirasSecret -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 8:09:51 PM)
What if ANYTHING... you either find a way to do things HONESTLY inside the relationship terms or get the hell out so you can do what you need to do without cheating. There is no excuse for cowardice and duplicity. I suppose my father could have left. It might have left us without a house and I might have finished growing up with not only a mother was miserable, but in a situation similar to what I struggle through now with my UM’s because their fathers did leave. Anyone who will lie to their primary partner CAN'T be trusted by anyone else either and TRUST is a cornerstone of D/s The words of my brother, when I proved to be less then ecstatic he still chose to be friends with the ex after he cheated on his little sister, come to mind: “Just because he cheated doesn’t make him a good friend; it just means he sucks as a boyfriend/husband. I trust my ex to take the UM’s. I wouldn’t trust him with my van, because I know what they mean to him. Be well,

clover -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 8:24:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ICGsteve What if you are aware that you are a submissive, you can't bring yourself to tell your wife that you are (or you do and she can not or will not meet your needs) so you are dieing a little inside each day. Do you A) do nothing until you are strong enough of self to deal with the wife or leave her B) let yourself continue to die emotionally and spiritually, or C) cheat? Or D) tell your wife that you are going to go outside the marriage to get your needs met. That way, she is at least informed and can make the decision to either stay and put up with it or end the marriage. I don't consider a person who chooses D to be a cheater. Barring very rare circumstances, choices A & D are the only honorable ones. As is often the case in life, the right choices are typically the hardest to make. But I don't believe that makes it okay to take the easy way out and become a cheater at the cost of personal integrity. I don't think less of past cheaters who can say "I fucked up". I respect people who are honest enough with themselves to admit mistakes and learn from them. But it's hard to respect ones who try to justify it and pretend it wasn't even wrong.

ICGsteve -> RE: why all the cheating? (5/9/2007 8:26:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RavenMuse What if ANYTHING... you either find a way to do things HONESTLY inside the relationship terms or get the hell out so you can do what you need to do without cheating. There is no excuse for cowardice and duplicity. Anyone who will lie to their primary partner CAN'T be trusted by anyone else either and TRUST is a cornerstone of D/s A great many people can't manage to be honest with themselves, so everyone be honest with others ain't going to happen. Making such a demand is just short of cruel. Besides deception has always been and will always be part of the human condition, and has benefits (see the thread I started on "seduction" to see what I mean). That we shall all be honest with others is a social construct so out of touch with reality that it is nonsense. "and TRUST is a cornerstone of D/s" Don't get me started on the flaws and weaknesses of BDSM doctrine and theory.

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